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A49441 A treatise of the nature of a minister in all its offices to which is annexed an answer to Doctor Forbes concerning the necessity of bishops to ordain, which is an answer to a question, proposed in these late unhappy times, to the author, What is a minister? Lucy, William, 1594-1677. 1670 (1670) Wing L3455; ESTC R11702 218,889 312

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Communion to confirm and strengthen them in all godlinesse and righteousnesse Now it is possible that a Soul after he is Converted and studious himself may persevere in Godlinesse and improve no doubt of it without hearing more Sermons but by Study and Contemplation as in the Times of persecution multitudes do and in those places where they are persecuted yet their Obedience to Church-discipline and the Canons of Ecclesiastical Government such as concern such persons are necess●ry yea because many administer Sacraments who cannot have the oportunity of Preaching the●efore things may be necessary then and there and more necessary than the other as likewise in the Case of dying men not the Doctor and Disputer in the mysteries of Divinity nor their Lay Elder whose duty they make it to visit the sick and not to authorize to preach are the welcome men but he that can bring the Seals of Gods Covenants by Absolution by the Communion is necessary Consider again Such a Church as many there have been which is furnished with learned Pre●chers abundantly in such a Time a man with discretion of ruling may be most acceptable and his endeavours applyed that way will be more gratefull and better to Gods Church than his preaching where is no need and as the use of these things is in differing places and occasions most necessary so the Application of men to them supposing all these belonging to every Officer in their several sit occasions deserves Double honour although they do neglect that which is most excellent It is the most excellent endowment for a man to be a Scholar and learned ●nd ●he greatest excellency mans soul is capable of yet he is an honest man 〈◊〉 deserves honour that applyes himself to Husbandry and a Con●cientious Manage of a Trade although he neglect the ●est a man is not bound to be best but to be good to rule well not best to labour in the Word not to be most excellent yea in such Cases it is better for such a man to apply himself to ruling than preaching that being more needfull And again that ●ord to neglect the better which is inserted in his Major is ●oo h●rsh to be applyed upon s●ch occasions for that is better for one which is not for another at one time in one place which is not at another in another where there is pre●chi●g abundant and many such as abound in Divine Eloquence there prudence of ruling is more necessary the best Preachers are not alw●yes the wisest men Again where the Abilities of a man are more sitted to the one than to the other there he ought principally to apply his Endeavour so that if his ●bilities in ruling 〈◊〉 g●●●ter he ought to apply himself to that 〈◊〉 and ●or force himself to that which his Disposition is not so fit for Again as I said to dying men who can feed their Souls with that Store of Doctrine which they had stored themselves with before but lack the Seals of Gods Covenants these are most necessary but I wonder what a Lay Elder should do with them who must neither Preach nor apply Gods Seals to any Again we may observe out of the Text that it is not said Doth not preach the negative is not there yes he will object because it is opposed to those that labour in the Word It is true but there is a difference betwixt those who do not labour in the Word and those who do not Preach Labouring as I have shewed signifies one industriously doing it spending his main source and bent to it Now they who finding their Abilities and the necessities of the Times and places in which they Converse requiring Ruling from them rather than Preaching do not bend their Endeavours to preaching but to ruling and yet may sometimes preach likewise as St. Paul who was the most glorious preacher in the World yet took sometimes from preaching to bestow upon ruling so may they likewise who give their labour and endeavour to ruling well take off some time from it and give it to preaching and yet not be 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 men labouring in the Word SECT XII Another Argument answered SO then to his Argument having layd these premisses thus Expounded I answer That labouring in the Word is not absolutely greater to all persons at all times in all places at all occasions If he urge the Text that because there is especial Honour due to these Labourers therefore their Labour deserved it I answer in the dayes of St. Paul at the planting of the Gospel it was most necessary but since not in such places where it is planted 2ly I deny that upon such occasions as I have said it is his duty who finds great abilities in himself for ruling to labour in the Word but to labour in th●t by which he may do most good which is ruling If he Object that to Convert Souls is the best Work which is the proper Effect of Preaching I answer yet when men are Converted keeping them in Ecclesiastical Discipline is more beneficial And again although it be the best Work for him that is excellently Gifted yet it is not for him who hath greater Abilities for others and lesse for it and therefore although he may be more excellent who as St. Paul himself did can rule well and labour in the Word likewise yet he may well deserve double honour who rules well and more seldom preacheth but if he can do both have this word especially added to his double honour SECT XIII Another Argument answered BUT Pag. 14. he hath another of the same the same Argument framed another way with this phrase or thus I may reason If the Apostle in this Text doth not speak only of Elders Preachers then he speaks of Elders no Preachers But the first is true what the first is I know not for there is no second it being but one Proposition He speaks in the place of some Elders which are no Preachers which is thus proved If he speak only of Preachers then there were some Preachers who preached not at all but there be no Preachers who preach not at all The second part is past denyal The Consequence is proved If these Elders who are most worthy of double honour are said but to labour in the Word Then they who are accounted but worthy of c. did not labour in the Word but c. I have put down his Argument verbatim word for word that the whole force of it may appear as well as the weaknesse shall be manifest And I answer in a word It is one thing not to labour in the Word and another not to preach it all To labour as I have said and shewed out of the Word is to do it industriously with his chief endeavour and might which doth not imply that he doth it not at all yea rather that he doth it and that he cannot rule well if not preach at all but not with his might and main I will
Service without Compulsion and since he was to leave the World himself he took Order with his Servants to Act as if he were present and Negotiate the great Work of Salvation of Souls by a Delegate power from him Therefore in the 16th of St. Mark v. 14. you may observe that he appeared to the Eleven that is to the Eleven Apostles for one of them Judas had apostatized and had hanged himself and in the 15th verse he gave them Commission Go ye into all the World and preach the Gospel to every Creàture that is to every Creature that is Capable of it c. there was their Commission The same Story is thought by many to be a little more fully described by St. John Chap. 20. 21. after he had appeared to them as before he said Peace be unto you as my Father sent me so send I you and then he breathed on them the Holy Ghost Mark this phrase As my Father sent me It is a particular phrase not used elsewhere and therefore intimates some extraordinary matter God had sent many men before but never any besides Christ with the fulnesse of Authority as it is described Mat. 28. 18. All power is given me in Heaven and Earth All power was never given to any before I send you therefore with all power as my Father sent me So the power then of Giving powers to others which was never given before but to my self and therefore in that place of St. Matthew before cited in the last verse too I am with you to the end of the World with you teaching baptizing giving Orders to others for that is mightily enforced out of the word Sicut as my Father sent me and indeed else he could not be with them in their persons to the end of the World but in their Succession by which means he might well be said to be with them to the Worlds end Having now touched upon these places I will Collect this here was in the 28 of Matthew vers 19. Baptism Instituted Matter and Form In the Name of the Father of the Son and of the Holy Ghost which we read not prescribed before we see the Officers appointed these Eleven in their personal bodies or succession wee see their Diocesse enlarged preach to all Nations and as preaching so baptizing as large they go together we see the Subjects of their Sermons enlarged before Christs Death When they had to do with the Jews only it was the Kingdom of God is at hand Now it is to observe all things that I have commanded you So that then we see first before our Saviours Death two sorts of Officers Apostles Disples their Office at the first limited to preaching and that to the Israelites that they did baptize we are assured but not in what Form nor by what Commission untill after our Saviours Death then we have seen the Holy Communion Instituted just before his Death in Matter and Form and Commissioners appointed to Celebrate it to wit the Apostles we see after his Death a full and Absolute Commission granted to these persons to whom the Communion was committed to do all things Baptise preach celebrate forgive Sins to choose and send forth others and for ought I can collect in this Story the whole Ministerial power invested in them But because something may be objected against this which hath been delivered which I take to be the foundation of what shall follow I will clear those objections which seem most troublesom to me and so proceed to shew how the Apostles managed this Stewardship committed to them SECT II. Whether the power of preaching was given only to the Apostles FIrst It may be questioned whether the power of preaching was given to the Apostles and them only To understand this we must look back and remember that the Seventy likewise were sent but that was to the Israelites only their Commission extended no farther before our Saviours Death and after his Death we find no Commission given but to the Apostles and what Authority they or any else could have to preach the Gospel it must be from them let no man trouble this or any other part of my discourse with that frivolous Objection which is often intruded into these Controversies We read not that these or these men that these Presbyters received new Commissions from the Apostles and yet find them preaching for Answer once for many other times in which it may be needfull it was impossible that the Acts or Epistles could keep a Register of all that were ordained by the Apostles or Bishops in their Age it is enough for us to know that all power for these things was given to the Apostles and we may reasonably think that of these 70. which were chosen by our Saviour such as proved worthy should be Commissioned by the Apostles and such as were unworthy as some were should be suspended ab Officio but for these particular Registers and how and when each man was is not apparent nor to be expected Well then now it seems the Apostles had all the power of preaching none others being sent in this Embassy to the World but themselves But could none else preach not gifted men Consider these men never any so Extraordinarily gifted as these were yet see as I observed they preached not without an outward Calling by Christ nor then untill he sent them Again it is observable that by his outward Word he directed their Doctrine to the Jews that they should preach the Kingdom of God was at hand and to the Gentiles Mat. 28. 20. Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have Commanded you So then Christ had given them Command before what they should preach I do not find no not in these yet any inspired Sermon but upon Direction and although these men had no doubt the most immediate Call that ever any had and the most extraordinary Gifts in the most extraordinary way yet for to enable them for their preaching they had Conversation with Christ which doth the most resemble the most Industrious life of Studious Scholars which in Books Converse with God as possibly a thing can do so that in that time in the time of our Saviours Life and untill his Ascention we can find no place for inward Calling without an outward nor an outward execution without means to enable them for this great Ministry of preaching but throughout a most Methodical Course SECT III. Whether these and these only were Commissioned for Baptism THE next thing to be looked upon is Whether these and these onely had the power of baptizing No doubt we may say of this that they had the Duty only none other obliged to either but they and when I have named the Duty I think I may justly adde the 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 The right and Authority will go along for it seems to be a branch and a main one of that Great Commission Mat. 28. and without doubt a great piece of the Power of
reason that they should and why should others do it Yes much differen●● one Sermon of the Apostles and prayer of theirs is of greater power and force with God than twenty others they out of Duty must travell through the whole world they cannot attend the Care of the poor in a particular City the others though being Evangelists may upon particular Occasions be called off from their place yet they shall return again and overview their Charge the people therefore when they could not have their particular eyes over that blessed work took those that were next them in that dubious time to take Care of the poor and these men could not therefore be chosen to an Inferiour Constant Office such as they feign their Deacons to be because ●hey were men of higher Employment and greater Concernment in the Church but were chosen for that Occasion how long I know not to attend that Duty SECT X. Another Argument for the former Conclusion A Fourth reason may be drawn from the Design which Mr. Hooker takes for this Office which is such as would make any Nation tremble to think upon an Erection of the greatest Tyranny which ever was exercised in any Commonwealth you shall find it described in the 36 37 pages where before For first he is Treasurer this may be without exception Secondly he must addresse himself to receive what is brought into the Treasury but mark not what is but what ought to be brought into the Treasury to be committed to his Trust for this briefly I will set down his sense purpose he must inform himself by advice and counsel from the body what every mans Free-will Offerings should be this upshot results out of his Discourses that only Free-will Offerings should be accepted yet because the maintenance of Church and poor must not be arbitrary they must understand mens Estates as well as they can if they be negligent admonish them then if they stirr not go to Christs Discipline tell the Church and so upon contempt of that to Eccleliastical Censure To this purpose he cites two places Deut. 16. 10. and Levit. 22. 18 19. In both which places if he had transcribed the words without further trouble there could have no more appeared but that men should bring their Free-will Offerings and then do this or this but the Sin lay upon him who was to bring it in he was not to be compelled to it nor do they perhaps they will say but I will reply Ecclesiastical Censure of putting out of the Church making a man an Heathen is the greatest Compulsion in the World and as they order it upon the Consultation and Advice of the Deacon it will arise to be upon the Imagination of the Deacon and instead of his Judgement perhaps oftentimes unlesse they be better than those the Apostles used before this election the partial Affection of the Deacon which would betray Souls to a most unhappy and arbitrary Government for Religion for Estates SECT XI The opposing Arguments answered UPon these reasons I am perswaded that the Office of a Deacon was not established in that of Acts 6. to be as a rule for all Churches but only these 〈…〉 of and Authorized in this great 〈…〉 that di●y in the Church at that time and thus I have disproved those Answers which Mr. Hooker seems to frame to my reasons his Arguments for confirmation of his Cause I shall undertake in a more proper place presently yet least men may think I introduce a new Opinion into the world know that this was the Opinion of St. Chrysostom and Oecumenius Estius in 4 Sent. dist 24. Sect. 18. observes as much and for Oecumenius throws him out with Cujus Authoritas non ita magni est momenti For St. Chrysostom it is in his 14 Homily upon the Acts about the middle he saith it is so obscure that it may be suspected of Corruption I answer it is very clear and no man will corrupt a Father without a design which cannot appear in this what it should be but rather than yield he will charge the rest of his Doctrine because saith he he affirms non fuisse Episcopos tunc in Ecclesia when Acts 1. it is said let another take his Bishoprick To this I reply that he saith not there were no Bishops but Apostolos solos only the Apostles and this is true nor Presbyter neither yet as will appear hereafter But now it may be enquired Was there no such Office as that of a Deacon proper to the Church SECT XII Whether there be such an Office as a Deacon proper to the Church YEs without question in the 1 of Tim. 3. 8. St. Panl describes at large the Qualifications of such a man who must be chosen to that Office I shall need no proof of it because all consent to this Conclusion but if a man should enquire when and where he was Ordained I must answer I know not nor do I find any Register of it in the New Testament nor amongst any learned men any Consent the greatest is upon that place in the 6. of the Acts which seems to me to be built upon weak grounds the Church of Rome in general makes all their seven Orde● to be erected at the Institution of the Communion by our Saviour but I leave that imagination as of no moment since there is no word in Scripture which seems to countenance it and I will passe from this Question to the other What his Office was to do CHAP. VI. What is the Office of a Deacon THE Office what it was receives the greatest Illustration from his Name which signifies a Minister a Servant to the Ecclesiastical Officers Bishops or Presbyters so that as when a man is known to be a Minister or Servant to another he is by that made apparent to do such things as Conduce to the assistance of him who is his Superiour or Prelate in his Office so do these in respect of their Superiours Bishops and Presbyters I do not find one word in Scripture setting down what their Office was we can therefore have no knowledge of it but from the History of the Church from which we receive that their Office was to Baptize to assist at the Communion with delivering the Cup and sometimes the Body but not to Consecrate so likewise to assist in the Divine Service some other things we find various according to the Customs of Churches but all these are subordinate and ministerial Offices likewise they had power to preach upon particular occasions and licenses given to wit by that Order they had a qualification to receive a License these things I can particularly give an Account to be the sense of the Ancient Church if any man require it but am loath also to lose Time about it only I will now undertake Mr. Hooker SECT II. Mr. Hookers opinion concerning a Deacon examined HE therefore Part 2. Chap. 1. falsly printed for Chap. 2. page 33. in his third Acception of his
Office and the Latines St. Ambrose c. with one Consent suppose it an Office Here is a difference and the Arguments of no moment that are brought of one side or the other nor much material for the Doctrine is true of the least Elder there is Capitis reverentia Cani some Civility to be paid to Gray hairs such men should not so easily be accused or if they be Accusations not so easily entertained as those are made against others but I have writ this to shew that this word Elder is not alwayes taken for an Officer no not in this Epistle in this Chapter yet here I doubt not but it is taken for an Ecclesiastical Officer both because of the word rule as likewise labour in the word but whether two Officers or one will be questioned SECT V. That Elder here signifies but one Office FIrst no man can shew any where in the New Testament any usage of this word but either for a meer Senior in Age or this one Presbyter which is the Ecclesiastical Officer and besides this place they themselves will Confess that no strong Argument can be produced it were hard then if there were nothing else that this word here should enforce it Again this word Elder is used but once which hath influence upon both these Actions of ruling and labouring which were not proper in Speech if they were two Offices without some Term of Distinction for it would be more rightly and significantly put an Elder that ruleth and an Elder that laboureth but this word Elder being named but once it should seem to enforce but one Office with diverse Actions for there are but two sorts of Elders as I find either that Lay Elder which is an Elder by Age or an Ecclesiastical Elder who is described how he should be qualifyed either in the 3d. Chapter of this Epistle or the first of Titus but the first sort are not pretended to here nor the second as they pretend some other word then must afford it not this word Elder SECT VI. What Ruling well imports THe next is rule well that is certainly Govern his flock Committed to him now this word will imply no distinction from the other Presbyter by their own Consent this is a part of that other teaching Elder he is a Ruler too and if a Ruler then no doubt if a good teacher he rules well or else as may happen out he may be a good Teacher and a weak Ruler and again a good Ruler and a weak Teacher So that if Ruling do not make a distinction in the Office ruling well doth not for Offices are not distinguished by the diligence or qualities of their Officers the men that use them but their Officers the men that use them by their Offices there are good and bad in every Office and so in the Ministry but his goodnesse or badnesse in Execution of his Office makes a Man a good or bad Officer but not of another kind of Office By this phrase then that ruleth well cannot be understood any thing which can enforce a new Office I will therefore remove to the 3d. phrase labour in the Word and Doctrine SECT VII What is Labouring in the Word AND certainly this phrase yields no matter for an Argument against the unity of this Office for he nor they cannot deny but that both these are joyned in one that the same man who is a Labourer in the Word is a Ruler but let us observe that this word Labour signifies an industrious and painfull doing that he labours for so that it is more than an ordinary prosecuting his undertaking Now both these phrases being affirmed of that one word Elder they cannot signifie diverse Officers but diverse performances in that Office that one man is more carefull in Ruling another in Teaching the one rules well the other labours well SECT VIII What Double honour signifies WE will passe to the 4th Double honour that is by all understood to be a double proportion or much larger maintenance than that of Widows I will not trouble it therefore but considering that it is but once used though in two places applyed as double honour to Rulers well and much rather to Labourers it being the same word and sense in both and in both applyed distinctly where distinctly put and implyedly where implyedly put as the same word ●lder is expresly or implicitely delivered that therefore cannot enforce a Difference if it be any where it must be in especially SECT IX The force of the word Especially BUT neither doth that do it for that addes but an Encrease of the Debt when majus minus non variant speciem it is due to one but rather there is a greater Obligation to the other not another due or if there were another Debt yet that would not prove another kind of Office but more obliging Acts of that Officer It is then as if we should speak of Shepherds that Shepherd deserves his wages who takes care of his flock even he that shall fold them at night carefully and let them out in the morning and do many Shepherdly duties but when there are diverse Shepherds belonging to the same flock he shall best or chiefly deserve it who having Cunning to do it shall industriously and with great labour of his own cure their Diseases and heal them and both these may be Shepherds and deserve their wages but especially the latter and yet not distinct Offices and the first sort may grow up to the latters abilities and then as well deserve as he or as we may say of a Privy Counsellor he hath a two-fold relation to the Subject and to the King he deserves his honor well that rules well but especially he that adviseth his King well yet these are not two Offices but two dutyes of the same Office and as we have seen distinct Abilities have shewn themselves in these diverse Effects This is the sense of the Text there are two duties in these Elders to rule to labour in the Word and Doctrine they that rule well and do that piece well are worthy of double honour but especially they that labour in the Word and Doctrine their flock ought to have a more particular Care of them thus the Text being explained as appears to me clearly the next thing to do will be to vindicate it from such Arguments which seem to be deduced out of this Text for that Imaginary Office which is so much boasted of to be already with great ●vidence confirmed by it SECT X. The Arguments answered MR. Hooker where before Part 1. Chap. 2. p. 13. thus layes his Foundation the words carry a distribution 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 neither of which are in the Text but 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but I let passe these things as mistakes in him though a most supine negligence And this saith he Tractatur Collatione imparium à Majoribus All this I can grant but the Imparity must be in the Execution of the
a Presbyter and see what peculiar Interest he hath in it distinct from other men First then without Question such a preaching as is Occasional by private Conference or in publike Assemblies when in publick Opportunity is offered to manifest the Glory of God or Convert or Confirm by Conference any soul to or in the Christian Religion or Godlinesse of living which indeed is a great part of Christianity when upon occasions of Discourse or otherwise Opportunities shall be granted to any man he may if he have abilities so Conferre as to perswade men to a newnesse of life and this is preaching in its latitude it is preaching the Gospel of Christ and each man that hath abilities ought to do it but each man is not bound to have abilities a private mans strength is chiefly discerned in holding fast the Word of Truth that so he be not carryed away with the wind of Doctrine he hath other Offices which are his Duties and in which he ought to expend his Studies and Endeavours but to have abilities or to endeavour to have some Abilities for this purpose is the Duty and Office of a Presbyter It is the Duty of the Shepherd to take care of his Masters sheep but it is a comely Charity in every Servant though he be not the Shepherd when he finds his Masters sheep run astray or ready to starve to throw them a lock of Hay or call them back to the fold Nay it is his Duty out of Charity though not out of Office but to take upon him the Office when he is not Authorized to it would be Intrusion and it would bring a great Confusion into the Church as it would into a great Family where every man or every man that would might take upon him the Manage of any Office he would St. Paul therefore saith of such How shall he preach unlesse he be sent that is how shall he take upon him the Office of doing it unlesse he be authorized for it let us then Consider who is authorized SECT XVIII Who is authorized to Preach THat this Authority must be joyned to every Presbyter that hath power to administer the Sacraments preaching must be taken in a large sense for reading Homilies for reading the Scriptures in known languages for it is not possible to find men of Abilities to do the other in such a Nation as ours is and yet it is necessary that they should have these Sacraments because by them men receive the Covenants of God concerning their Souls which to teach and incourage us to is the chief Duty of preaching and this is done I am perswaded more securely by the other way projected before but then if we will have men preach nothing but what they make themselves there had need be a mighty ability for a Weekly Preacher to do that and such indeed as cannot be expected from every Presbyter that may be fit for the other and therefore that way of penning their own Sermons is not nor can be exacted from every Presbyter And to preach Sermons not penned although upon urgency there hath been or may be such a Thing yet it is nothing but laziness and supine negligence and undervaluing of that great Work by those to do it Constantly and not worthy the thought of Christians But whether Presbyters alone may do this is a Question started in this Age but was disputed long since by learned men and how determined I will set down with mine observations upon it The Story is thus Origen a man most eminent for learning of any man in that Age both for humanity and Divinity and indeed such as may not only be accounted so for that Age in which he lived but deserved to be placed in the first rank of Scholars both of his own or any other Age when he lived at Cesarea by Authority given him from the Bishops of Palestine interpreted the Scriptures publikely in the Church when he was not a Presbyter nor that we know of had received any degree in Ecclesiastick Office Demetrius the Bishop of Alexandria who envyed the deserved glory of Origen and that honour which rather as a debt was paid to than given him for his Excellency in Preaching inveighs bitterly against him and having little else to be offended with him for saith it was an unheard●of thing that a Layman should preach and writes to the Bishops of Palestine about it They patronage that excellent Work of their own and gave him Instance in three or four that they knew of and no doubt say they there were more which had been licensed by Bishops to do so and did preach even before them I could have wished that the dispute had been larger set down that so the Arguments from Scripture or reason might have been set down for our Instruction but for defence of him who it is pity did not write his own Apology If any man object St. Pauls How can he preach unlesse he be sent I shall answer he was sent and by that power that had Authority to send that was the Bishops in that Province in which he lived who had authority to delegate as Apostles of which I shall treat hereafter by our Saviours Charter As my Father sent me so send I you to send others not with a plenipotency but as they saw expedient with divided powers to baptize and no more to administer the Sacraments and no more and why not preach and no more this way of preaching penning and contriving Orations to the people requires great abilities inherent acquired by mighty industry and pains and when men are found so Gifted and enabled although they think themselves not worthy to take a Pastoral Charge upon them or to administer the Sacraments yet when they find abilities for this and their Bishop think fit why should they not preach but not without the Bishop he is the Supream Pastor he may if he find an Inferiour fit for that place give him Authority to feed or fold or drive his Flock and no more and he that is authorized by the Supream Pastor may do it and others who without his leave undertake to do it are Intruders but he being so authorized doth it orderly lawfully thus did Origen who had he lived in our Age could have discoursed much more powerfully to this Theam and I can guesse that this may satisfie most of that which many in our Age object concerning their Gifts If they are Gifted let their Gifts be examined and if he the Bishop find them to be such as can enable them for such a Work let them be licensed otherwise not CHAP. XIX His Argument answered I Have been over tedious in this Discourse Here you may discern the vanity of his Argument from that Text if preaching be taken in that late sense as I have expounded it I deny that there are any Presbyters which are not Teachers If Preachers be taken in this strict sense for such as preach Studied Orations I say that there are many
Presbyters under that general name of Presbyters as Writs are sent out ●o summon the Barons of the Kingdom to Parliaments by which word was understood both Earls and Dukes although by the Name and Notion called the house of Lords So Bishops were called along being Presbyters under that name they are all called both from Ephesus and the Adjacent Parts though that be put down only and then St. Paul gave them all their Charge to look to their Several Duties and execute their several Commissions which they had before received which is all that these words can enforce although this is reasonable yet methinks this is more probable that they were all or for the most part but bare Presbyters for in the first Age of the Church when the Conversion of men to Christ was new and there were but few Christians few Presbyters were necessary and then much sewer Bishops especially the Apostles living and Episcopizing one of them enough for Twenty of us and therefore one Bishop for a great Nation as Titus for Creet where were an hundred Cities was sufficient but Religion increasing in the hearts of men more Presbyters are necessary and they increasing there must be a greater necessity likewise of Bishops but that any of these should be such as we call Bishops to have power over other Presbyters and to give them orders is no way apparent This therefore proves nothing for their parity But he addes that the word Bishop is never used in the New Testament but the Actions therein required belong to any Presbyter He excepts the Case of Judas Acts 1. 20. For my part it is not material how the word is used but what I labour for is that there is such a Thing as the word Bishop now used doth signifie and that the more he or any other Trouble themselves against it it will appear the more clearly as hitherto it doth I will proceed therefore with him page 25. He frameth his Second reason thus SECT X. His Second Argument answered IF they be distinct the Bishop is Superiour but he cannot be superiour every Superiour Order hath superiour Acts and honours belonging thereunto above the Inferiour but Bishops have neither above those that are Presbyters for if labouring in the Word and Doctrine be an Act above ruling and is most worthy of Double honour then the Act and honour of a Presbyter is above the Act and honour of a Bishop for they only assume the Acts of rule but give the Presbyters leave to labour in the Word and Doctrine I have at large discoursed what labouring in the Word and Doctrine is I will not repeat now but begin with his last For they only assume c. which is the foundation upon which this whole discourse is built and I answer that the Bishops do not only assume the Acts of rule but esteem it their duty to labour in the Word And if Mr. Hooker would without prejudice Consider even of that kind of labouring which he and his Sort understand it Pulpit-preaching the World never yielded more fruitfull Industries than those of our Bishops whose Works live to bear witnesse for them being dead and therefore I conceive this to be an Argument of spleen rather than reason and for the second Clause of this foundation that they give the Presbyter leave to labour in the Word they do much more for they Episcopize over them and look to them and by Authority over them make them do it encourage them who do and punish those who do not If men have misdemeaned themselves in their Office no doubt but Twenty Presbyters have done so for one Bishop but yet neither the one nor the other are lesse Jure Divino for that Judas his Office was good he was an ill Officer Nicholas his Office was good he an ill Officer this chose by the Apostles that by Christ himself thus Offices are not disparaged by the Officers But Consider further that although labouring in the Word with the people may be a more Excellent Work than governing or ruling the people as it is more excellent to perswade than to compell men to vertuous Actions They are but half vertues that are forced yet governing Presbyters which is a proper act of Bishops is more excellent than labouring in the Word to the people by how much the Extent of the benefit is more General It produceth the Good of a Diocesse as that of a ●arish But once again although I had thought enough had been said to that Text 1 Tim. 5. 17. Let the Elders that rule well be accounted worthy of Double honour but especially they who labour in the Word and Doctrine yet I will adde somewhat for illustration Suppose this speech were turned from the Church to the Army and a man should say thus Let the Elders the Officers of the Army who govern or rule well their Regiments or the Army be worthy of double honour but especially they who labour and toyl in the heat of the battel could any man Collect from hence that it were a better Act to labour in the Act of fighting than to steer and direct the fighting No sure it is an Act becomming a private Officer and concerns a few but the other who rules well hath the whole fortune of the day the fate of a whole Kingdom sometimes depending on him yet if he can and do upon desperate occasions thrust himself into great hazard he hath an especialty of this Double honour due to him and yet it would not befit him to hazard the day which depends on his providence by neglecting direction to thrust himself into perpetual dangers These Bishops are the Generals of this Spiritual Militia they are to direct and oversee their Diocesse to encourage to command Inferiour Officers to their Duties when they do this well they are worthy of double honour but if when great occasions shall require they act themselves what at other Times they command and take care that others shall do it likewise they have an Especialty of Double honour due to them which is the full Sense of that Text Elders which rule well have a double honour because they have a double excellency both do their own and make others do their duty but if they who have abilities do rule well and labour too then especially much more is that honour due SECT XI His Third Argument answered I Come now to examine his Third Argument which I am sorry to read for it is so full of illogical deductions as methinks it should not be possible for any man to think he could perswade by them It is thus framed If they differ from Presbyters Jure Divino then there are some Ministers by Divine Authority necessary for the gathering of the Church and perfecting the body of Christ besides that of the Presbyter for if the Church can be perfected without these there is no need of these I will stay here a while This Consequence is not good for Ministers may be
he shews here which way we are made members of it that is Christs body to wit being baptized by the same Spirit into Christ the Spirit which enlivens us makes Baptism effectual to the incorporating a man into the body of Christ For what else can that phrase be into the body as a work of Baptism but into the body of Christ his Church Well then Baptism is the Act the relict of Baptism as before is the Thing which makes us members and parts of this body Consider then next Gal. 3. 26 27. Ye are all the Children of God by faith in Christ Jesus for as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Here you see phrases wonderfully expressing the same thing As God is considered in Oeconomicks so he is a father so by Baptism we are adopted the children of God as Christ is the head of the body so we are baptized into him and engrassed as the Spirit speaks elsewhere into the body Suppose Christ to be an holy Garment with which the Crimes and Sins of his Servants are hid by Baptism you cloath your selves with his righteousnesse and you put on Christ under whom your unrighteousnesse shall be hid and your sins covered or else as others expresse it Matters put on a form c. But then if you will adde the last verse If ye be Christ ye are Abrahams seed heirs of the promise you may see these 3. things Children Members Heirs most heavenly united in the second Answer of our Catechism In my Baptism wherein I was made a Member of Christ a Child of God and an Inheritor of the kingdom of Heaven which three in expresse Terms are put down ●y St. Paul and what necessary Thing and Essential as he calls it of another Covenant can adde to a further union than this matters not much Well then it is proved that Baptism doth constitute a Member Now I will examine how this may be justified against his Objection which consists only of Instances against this and no proof of them An Excommunicate man saith he hath no Membership He that renounceth the fellowship of the Church or when a Church is utterly dissolved there is no Church-Membership CHAP. XII His Instances Examined and Confuted The Dissolution of a Church doth not destroy Membership I Will take all these apart and discourse the Evidence of them and begin with the last of which I may justly say posito quolibet sequitur quidlibet Let it be granted that the Church should be dissolved and torn to pieces that being the entire body of Christ Christ could have no body and then there would be no Members but it is impossible the Gates and powers of Hell shall never have power to dissolve it the winds shall bluster and the rain fall but not have force to beat down the City of the living God It shall be in persecution and suffer many miseries but the darknesse shall not be able to comprehend or suppresse the light of it it is true one of their poor particular Congregations may be and hath been shaken and sc●ttered and their Union dissolved because it is wrought by man and mans hand guards it but it shall never be so with Christs body it shall be a pillar a strong support of all truth yea the ground and foundation in which Truth is inherent and by which Truths are supported that instance therefore falls of its self the foundation is cast down and then the Castle hangs only in the Air. SECT II. How Excommunication doth extirpate Baptisme I Apply my self then to the first Instance of an Excommunicated man in which case I would have wished he had brought some reasons to have proved they were not of the Church but he not doing it I will undertake the question against such Opposition as I can find elsewhere The Question is whether an Excommunicate man be a visible member of Christs visible Church I put the Terms as strict as I can because I will avoid all future Cavilling and I answer affirmatively he is he brings no proof to the contrary So we are upon even Terms if I should say no more only the difference will be in the Authority of the Speaker in which I think he will prevail and therefore I will examine it by reason and as well as I can satisfie the Objections made by some Jesuites against it To understand this Consider that any part continues so long a member of its body as it is united to it and so long it is united to it as it can receive influence from the head and be active and operative in its proper works by the fountains and originals of those motions assisted any way by any outward applications or inward medicines the members of a mans body as it haps out in some Palsies may be utterly unactive so that they cannot stirre or move no not feel or be sensible of any hurt and yet these parts remain members of the body still and it may be by Physicians directions be restored to former vivacity and be quickened by spirits as before coming from the same fountain and this is a Sign it is a member still of this body That which is a member of another body canot by any Act be made a member of this nor that which is an entire body of it self so that when physick can restore a member though it appear to our Senses never so dead yet it is still a member Again Consider for the other Term of distinction That if a baptized man though excommunicate be a member by his Baptism he is likewise a visible member by the same Baptism for Baptism is a visible sign of the Effect it produceth and is as visible in the Excommunicated man as in him that Communicates Thirdly Consider that many parts of the body are by obstructions hindred from that influence of blood and spirits which would enable them to do their duties which yet that obstruction removed hold the same Commerce and Society with giving and receiving mutual correspondence in their several offices again with both head and members These things premised as I think apparent Truth I now addresse my self to the businesse SECT III. Bellarmines Arguments answered THere is a great Dispute betwixt Cardinal Bellarmine and others Whether an Excommunicated person be a member of the Church I must oppose Bellarmine for although the Conclusion seems the same in Thomas Hooker and him yet Hooker offers at no reason for it Bellarmine doth lib. 3. de Ecclesia militante Cap. 6. And he saith Excommunicated persons are not in the Church his first Argument is drawn from Mat. 18. 17. If he will not hear the Church let him be as an heathen c. This saith he is understood of Excommunication I yield But saith he Heathens are not of the Church I grant that likewise but do adde neither doth the Text say they are Heathens no more than Publicans but resembling as Sicut being in that like
his Major now let us examine his Minor In nostrâ tamen Ecclesia reformata Scotanica id haberi nondum potuit propter Ecclesiasticam pa●pertatem bonis Ecclesiasticis laicorum hominum sacrilegio dir●ptis The force of this Argument runs thus Although Deacons be a divine ordinance yet the Scots by reason of their poverty are not able to maintaine such an Officer and there is the like reason for Bishops in such places where the supream authority will not allow them so that necessity may excuse men even where the divine Laws requires any thing I must confess that invincible necessity excuseth many Acts but it will lie upon the Souls of these Churches who live without Bishops to answer at the last day to Allmighty God and make it good before him that their Omission is such but the difference betwixt Bishops and Deacons is exceeding great I do not find any one place so much as directing that Deacons should be in every particular Church in many there is no need of them where a small congregation of twenty or a hundred may well be os●iciated in the meanest duty by a Presbiter onely but in Cathedral Churches where are many little offices for which perhaps we cannot find Presbiters so fit or that it is not fit that we should take them from their greater imployments to bestow their time upon those lesser duties in such cases there is a necessity for those lesser offices to be used but if they shall think their Deacons to be ordained for that imployment mentioned in the sixth of the Acts to minister to the poor I may say that such an imployment can hardly complain of necessity by sacriledge since that out of the collection for the poor he may be allowed a stipend competent for such an office but then to consider that which he would have to paralel a Bishop where is any such a small congregation as I have before specified all things may well be regulated by a Presbiter and he alone supply all the duties belonging to the Salvation of Souls But if there should be many such congregations or that Presbiter who did govern there die in that Government it is necessary for him or them to seek out some Bishop to authorize him or them for this duty The upshot of all this is that Deacons are not instituted as necessary for all lesser Congregations that Bishops are authorized to give Orders to dispose of such affairs as are usefull or necessary to the Government of little or great Congregations but especially in the latter where are usually more and more dangerous exorbitancies That which follows in that page is onely a Discourse but no Proof and so I passe to 161. page where he labours to prove that the Presbitery as he calls it or Company of Presbiters gathered together may give Orders thus CHAP 8. An Argument drawn from Scripture answered APostolus Paulus manuum impositionem per quam ordinatus est Timotheus modo vocat impositionem manuum s●arum 2. Tim. 1. 6. Modo impositionem manuum Presbiterii 1. Tim. 4. 14. Idest concessus Presbiterorum sic enim in Novo testamento passim et apud antiquissimos Scriptores Ecclesiasticos The effect of which is that St. Paul in those two places termes the giving Orders to Timothy in one place the laying on of his hands and in another the Laying on the hands of the Presbitery which saith he was the Company or Colledge of Presbiters as that word is often used in the New Testament and amongst the most antient Ecclesiastical Writers I have expounded these two places already and though he say Presbitery is often used for a Colledge or Concessus of Presbiters I have shewed it is no where so used in Scripture and for the most ancient Ecclesiastical Writers I would have been glad to have Read where I should seek them for remember them I do not I will trouble the Reader no further with this Argument it would be but a Repetition CHAP. 9. An Argument drawn from Saint Hierome answered HE comes next to the formerly examined place of St. Hierome and Evagrinus but he puts it down more truly than Thomas Hooker doth and after adds one phrase which the New-England-man left out which is Sicut exercitus imperatorem faciaet quibus verbis non abscurè indicat Presbiteros Alexandrinos initio ordinasse sibi Episcopum by which words as an Army makes an Emperour he doth not obscurely intimate that they did ordain their Bishops Thus Forbes if instead of Ordain he had said Elect I should not have been offended but to take upon them the power to ordain was too much unless they had the Armies to maintain their Act by force as they did The Souldiers upon the death of the Emperour proclaim and cry up commonly their General to be the Emperour and make it good with their sword but would Doctor Forbes or Hierom think that they did ordain or make him Emperour or rather according to their power elect it was often seen even in the age about St. Hierom that two or three Armies in their several places chose so many Emperours And it is not impossible that the Presbiters in Alexandria might have the Election of their Bishop as in most places but the Consecration of him was by others and mark this place of St. Hierom the phrase he useth is Presbiteri not Presbiterium which he calls the antient Language howsoever there is nothing in these words which can instance a Consecration from Presbiters no not in the Simile of an Army unless a Rebellious Election might pass for a Consecration I think I need not speak no more to that at this time but if there be any further need I foresee that the answering other Arguments will further illustrate this business CHAP. X. An Answer to the Argument drawn from the Consecration of Pelagius the first Pope of that name in which is discussed the Story of his Consecration as likewise that no Argument can be drawn from that Act That Popes Consecrations and Elections have been erronious HE proceeds page 162. Pellagium hujus nominis primum Romanum Episcopum ordinarunt duo Episcopi unus Presbiter Ostiensis nomine Andreas qui tanquam Episcopus munus illud ordinationis obivit dum non invenientur tres Episcopi qui secundum Canones Pelagium ordinarent The summe is that this Pope when there could not be three Bishop● got which according to Canons should joyn together in the ordination of a Bishop there being no more to be found they took in a Presbiter to officiate with them and therefore he thinks Presbiters may ordain for answer let no man think that I will undertake to defend the Consecrations of Rome it is a task too hard for me to manage or I think any other and materially no doubt but this was irregular yet it may be excused and perhaps justified by what I shall say take therefore the Story of these times SECT I. Where is the Story of