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A70039 Apokrypta apokalypta velata quædam revelata : some certain, hidden, or vailed spiritual verities revealed : upon occasion of various very prying and critical queries concerning God, the devil, and man, as to his body, soul, and spirit, Heaven, Hell, Judgement &c : propounded to George Fox, John Perrot, Samuel Fisher : and after that (with a complaint for want of, and stricter urgency for an answer) re-propounded to Edward Burroughs : by two persons, choosing to notifie themselves to us no other way then by these two unwonted (if not self-assumed) titles, viz. Livinus Theodorus, and Sabina Neriah : which truths (as there inspired by the spirit of God) are here expired in love to the souls of men / from ... Samuel Fisher. Fisher, Samuel, 1605-1665.; Fox, George, 1624-1691.; J. P. (John Perrot), d. 1671? 1661 (1661) Wing F1047; ESTC R31513 23,491 32

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And what is that honor and glory which the Kings of the Earth must bring into it And in what manner must they perform it Also how and when shall they that are saved be made inhabitants of it Answ What need ye Query this of us if either ye heeded the Light in you which manifests all things in their proper seasons to such as wait in it or if ye had wel heeded that very Scripture either out of which your Query seems to be fetcht and founded Where ye may as wel read what that City is that hath no need of the Sun to shine in it as that it hath at all no need thereof where it 's evidenced to be those Saints of God that follow the Lamb who is their Light the new Jerusalem which is above the mother of all the free-born Children of God which is as a Bride adorned for her Husband with whom the Tabernacle of the Lord is and with whom he dwels and as for the scituation of it is it not expresly said as in the Vision it was seen that it comes down from God out of heaven therefore 't is a state here on earth else also the Kings of the Nations could not be said to bring the glory of their Nations into it i. e. to serve it with their glory for it is to come to pass that the Kingdom and nation that will not serve thee saith the Lord Isa 60. 12. shall perish yea that nation shall utterly be destroyed Whose glory that they are said to bring into it or to serve it with or minister to it withal is not any of those unlawful or sinful lusts pleasures or licentious liberties wherein they glory as in their shame for as in maximâ libertate est minima licentia so it 's said That no unclean thing shall in any wise enter thereinto neither any thing that desileth or worketh abomination or maketh a lie but their gain and substance which the Lord himself saith he will consecrate to the God of the whole earth and to the service of his truth as they before in their blind minds consecrated it to the service of their Lord God the Pope and the setting up of his trashy Traditions For the Lamb who is the Light of his holy ones who are this City is worthy to receive power and riches and wisdom and strength and honour and glory and blessing and all created things for for his sake they are and were created Rev. 5. and for those that are with him on mount Syon who are called and chosen and faithful who are his Priests and Ministers non nomine tantùm tenus not in name onely as the Popes and the Worlds Idol-shepherds are but reapse indeed and in truth who as the Lord saith Isa 6. 6. shall eat the Riches of the gentiles and in their glory boast themselves improving the excellencies of the outward Creation in wiser ways and to much better uses and ends than such Drones as the Popes Divines who have devoured the good of all Lands under a meer pretence of serving Christ in the service of their own lusts and bellies And whereas ye ask When shall those that be saved be made the Inhabitants of it I answer So soon as ever they are saved from the sin which is that alone that slayes the soul and seperates it from its part and portion there For blessed are they that do his Commandments they have right to the Tree of Life and to enter in through the gates into the City without the which are the Dogs who draw back from the truth and lick up their old Vomit who for all their dreaming that they eat and drink in the day while the Lord's Visitation passeth over them shall yet wander to and fro for meat and grud ge that they can never be satisfied and at evening when they awake and see the Sun is set upon them they shall return and grin like a dog and go round about the City but never enter to have any share in it being clambered up above the Door which is the Light Query 13. What are the Chains in which the Angels who kept not their first estate are reserved under darkness unto the Judgement of the great Day And where is the place of their confinement And what is the great Day and the Judgement We pray you plainly demonstrate Answ The Chains which the Angels who kept not their first estate are reserved in are the same under which men who kept not their first estate are also reserved under darkness unto the Judgement of the great Day that is the darkness it self into which they are both gone forth from the Light which was That habitation they both left in which they were created to stand as 't is said the wicked are captivated in the cords of their own sins and snared in the works of their own hands viz. in the deceitful counsels of their own hearts in their own corruptions under the bondage of which the whole Creation groans and travels in pain together to be delivered out of which Bonds and Chains and Fetters Snares and sore Captivity there is no deliverance for men who are all to come to judgement but in Christ who opens the Prison-doors by that Spirit by which he went and preached to the Spirits which were in prison in the Dungeon of Egyptian darkness of old in the days of Noah wherein they remain reserved unto Wrath and Judgment which from the Lord must first come upon them as assuredly as ever they sinned and as unavoidably as travel on a Woman with Child which she cannot possibly escape and the place of their confinement is where-ever the said rebellions spirits are a place not of an outward local consideration for although every spirit is in loco definitivé and determined to his Hic nunc excepting God onely who cannot be so yet a spirit cannot be said to be in loco circumscriptivè And as for the Great Day and the Judgement thereof It is the Light of the Lord for the Light he called Day and the Darkness he called Night and the Judgement that the said Light layeth to the Line and to the Plummet in every Creature that hates and rebels against the Light which ministers condemnation on the Transgressor and reveals from God nothing but Vengeance Tribulation Wrath and Anguish Perplexity and Disappointment Wo Cursing and vexation of spirit on every evil spirit and on every soul of man that is found in evil doing the Eternal Judgement of which day of the Lord is over all the Oaks of Bashan and Cedars of Lebanon and pleasant Pictures and fenced Towers and high Walls and all mans glory and pomp which Hell now opens her mouth wide to receive over every one and every thing that is high and lifted up and there can be no declining the Judgement of it so but that to versifie to you back again in your own way of Latine Rime wherein ye conclude your Queries and I my Answer you must expect and know That Quod sibi quisque serit praesentis tempore Vitae Hoc sibi messis erit cum dicitur Ito Venite To all your Queries above answered you subjoin thes● two Verses Non pudor est quaeri quae nescis sivé doceri Qui SCIT Laudatur qui NESCIT vituperatur To which I return and so conclude as follows Non pudor est quaeri nec quaerere at usque teneri Quaerendo atque queri est pudor nescire doceri Qui fructu crescit SCIT quamvis plurima nescit Is quod SCIT nescit qui tantum lumine crescit Qui bene SCITque alitur SCIT ut sit gregibus Altor Qui malé non aliter quam ut se SCIRE hoc SCIAT Alter Haud qui SITque Satur facit at qui quod SCIT amatur Is sibi quod datur per quemque opus hoc operatur Qui SCIT Salvatur SIT at ut SCIT ut SCIT agatur Qui SIT laud atur qui NE SIT vituper atur Dixi. D omini ei S amuel ervus P iscator astor No shame to Ask nor be Ask't but to weary Free Answerers out with Queryings and to Query The same o're o're and o're again concerning Truths which they are ever taught yet never learning He who knows little yet bears fruit knows much No knowers know that they do know save such Such Thrive such know that they may be as Mothers Some know but to be known to know by others No knower but the doer of what 's known Is lov'd who works what 's given him as his own Who knows is sav'd this I must needs acknowledge Yet let him BE and acted be by 's knowledge Who Is what 's by him known's of worth and prais'd Who Is not so 's worth nought despis'd disprais'd S. F. What to themselves All Men Sow now be 't Good or No That must each man Reap Then When Christ shall say Come Go. FINIS Page 9. line 28. for differently read indifferently * Viz. Robert Wilson who together with my self was then and is still imprisoned in Westminster Gatehouse where and from whence also this present Answer was written and given forth 1 Thess 5. 23. * Therefore is Hell called by Christ Matth. 5. 29 30. and by Iames Iam 3 6. in Greek 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ex 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vallis Hinnom quae alias 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Topheth dicitu ter 7 31 Isa 30 33 * Mal. 1. 4.
those many truths which he never minds nor means that they shall have so much influence upon his heart or dominion over him in his life as to order him rightly according thereunto in either the one or the other Whereupon we could very well excuse our selves as to the Lord if we should answer you no otherwise then by answering you not a word And for my own part though it is not at all offensive to me if it never prove so to your selves yet as delightful as ye take it to be to us to be presented with your Queries wherein ye shew your own delight to be in minding things too high for you or for any but such whose dwelling hath been long in the deep before ye are truly come to be well acquainted with the first Principles of the Oracles of God within your selves I take as little delight in as I do offence at your own or any ones presentments of this kind it being altogether as endless as it 's easeless and well-nigh as useless for us as it 's utterly reasonless for you or any to engage us to it or expect it from us that we who howbeit ye who come but sometimes to our Meetings as ye say have seldom heard us have so abundantly opened the truth in those very points concerning God and man as to his Body Soul and Spirit Heaven Hell the holy City the Day of the Lord and the Eternal Judgement and so long directed people to that true Light which onely gives the knowledge of all these very things ye enquire after and this not onely by our verbal discourses but also in our Books which are extant in all places to the publike view of all persons should condescend to exercise our selves stil in writing the same o're and o're again to gratifie every two or three single persons in private in order to the feeding of every airy fancy which would fain furnish it self for windy discourse thereof with notions and comprehensions of those weighty Truths of God which it's fitter for wise men to wait in silence on the Lord for the feeling the Truth of within themselves in that Light out of which they can never be known then in a flood of words to stand questioning and replying one to another about them and which though it 's very pertinent and also necessary yet it 's not more pertinent nor necessary for every one to know then it 's necessary for every one that would know them in truth to know them by the manifestation of the Spirit of Truth which leads into all Truth within himself there being no Dispensation nor Administration either below or beyond that of the Spirit in man and the inspiration of the Almighty that gives that Wisdom and Understanding whereby onely they and all soul saving Truths can be discerned So that it may be truly said of Christ the true Light who in measure enlightneth every man as in order to the knowledge of God a man's self and all other matters y● query about Si Christum nescis nihil est si catera noscis Si Christum noscis nihil est si ●aetera nescis Ye have Moses and the Prophets within viz. this written spoken manifested in you Quod tibi ne vis fieri alteri ne feceris and Retro Whatever ye would that men should do unto you do ye even so to them This saith Christ is the Law or Moses and the Prophets but if ye will not be admonished nor perswaded by Moses and the Prophets neither will ye be perswaded by such of us who were once dead in sin with you but are now risen to life by the power of God which is his Light and in the same sent to speak unto you from the dead And as for your owning or disowning of us to any such as before you shall oppose us it 's little to us if ye own us to be of the truth unless ye come together with us into union with it for we know whether ye confess to or deny us that we are of God that the World lieth in that wickedness that cuts off from him and that we are 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 such as hold forth that infallible everlasting Truth of God which hath very amply revealed to us of its secrets which Truth needs no man at all to plead for it for it pleads both for it self and for its Children much less such as seem to side with it without in words yet indeed resist the power of it in themselves If ye be so wise as to submit to the teachings of it ye shall be wise to yourselves to the salvation of your souls but if you sleight or scorn it so as to seek or seem to be above it ye alone must bear it in the judgement of it To conclude though as one of this worlds fools may ask much more then many a wise man in Christ may think fit to answer to so one that is a fool for Christ may answer much more truth then many of the wise men of this world may think fit to acknowledge to be satisfactory yet that ye may not think I say that ye may not think we forbear to Reply upon the account of any such difficulty or depth in your Questions as transcends the capacity of those ye dealwith whom ye deem for all your owning them as above others not a little inferior to your selves and that like the sluggard who is wiser in his own eyes then seven men that can render a reason ye may not grow more prudent then pudent as many are apt to do in their own conceits so as to judge them altogether unanswerable if your Questions lye unanswered altogether in at least some more hopes of your conviction and conversion by us then fear of your contradiction or confutation of us I return to your following Queries as hereafter follows Query 1. WHat is God really in himself without any definition And in what did he dwell and manifest himself before the foundation of the Heavens and the Earth was laid Answer 1. God as he is really in himself is beyond all definition of ours at all being not determined to his Hic Hunc as all created beings are being as to time and place nec definitivé nec circumscriptivé in either but if speaking by way of such description as those have made of him who have seen and known him may de facto as de jure it ought to do amount to the satisfaction of your prying minds which would fain be intruding into things which ye have not seen I answer God whatever more he is that 's nothing to us quae supra nos nihil ad nos the secret things of himself are onely to himself whose mind in all things absolutely who hath known But things reveal'd onely to us to speak of and to our Children is really in himself whatever he hath at any time in and by his Son revealed himself to be in and to his