saye it is examined and tryed by the Scriptures And the Scriptures them selues where they are so obscure that neither by cōmon sense knowledge of the original tongue Grammer Rhetorike Logike storye nor any other humane knowledge nor iudgement of any writers olde or new the certaine vnderstanding can be found out they are either expounded by conference of other plainer textes of Scripture according to the analogie of faith or els they remaine stil in obscuritie vntill it shall please God to reueile a more cleere knowledge of thē But none so like the familie of loue as you Papists are which reiect councels fathers interpretation of the most auncient Catholike Church yea manifest Scripture it self except it be agreable to the iudgement of your P. M. Pontifex Max. the Pope as those familiar diuels submit all things to the sentence authoritie of their H. N. Shame you nothing therefore to quote Whitaker pag. 17. 120. as though he affirmed that we our selues will be iudges both of Councels Fathers whether they expound the Scriptures well or no because he writeth percase that we ought to examine al mens writings by the word of god Doth the Apostle make euery man iudge of all thinges when he willeth euery man to examine all things and to hold that which is good If any youth vpon confidence of his wit or knowledge presume too much in diuine matters we count it rashnesse But that any youth among vs vpon confidence of his spirit will saucily controwle all the fathers cōsenting togither against his fantasie except it be some Schismatike or Heretike that is cast out from amongest vs I doe vtterly denye neither are you able to proue it of any that is allowed among vs. MART. 15. Wherevpon it riseth that one of them defendeth this as very wel said of Luther That he esteemed not the worth of a rushe a thousande Augustines Cyprians Churches against him selfe And an other very finely figuratiuely as he thought against the holy Doctor Martyr S. Cyprian affirming that the Church of Rome can not erre in faith saith thus Pardon me Cyprian I woulde gladly beleue thee but that beleeuing thee I should not beleeue the Gospell This is that which S. Augustine saith of the like men dulcissimè vanos esse non peritos sed perituros nec tam disertos in errore quà m desertos à veritate And I thinke verily that not onely we but the wiser men among them selues smile at such eloquence or pitie it saying this or the like most truly Prodierunt oratores noui stulti adolescentuli FVLK 15. Why shoulde you not at your pleasure vpon your false assumption generall inferre one or two slaunders particular M. Whitaker defendeth that it was well said of Luther That he esteemed not the worth of a rush a thousand Augustines Cyprians Churches against himselfe Woulde God that euery Papist would reade his owne words in the place by you quoted that he might see your impudent forgerie For I hope there is no Christian that will imagine that either Luther would so speake or any man of honestie defend him so speaking For Luther was not so senselesse to oppose his owne person but the truth of his cause grounded vpon the holy Scriptures not only against one thousand of men holding the contrary but euen against tenne thousand of Angels if they should oppose them selues against the truth of God But I am too blame to deale so much in M. Whitakers cause who ere it be long will displaye the falshoode of Gregorie Martin in a Latine writing to his great ignominie The next cauil is vpon M. Rainoldes words in his preface to his sixe positions disputed vpon at Oxford where against Cyprian affirming that the Church of Rome can not erre in faith he sayth Pardon me Cyprian I would gladly beleeue thee but that in beleeuing thee I shoulde not beleeue the Gospel These wordes you confesse that he spake figuratiuely and finely as he thought but that he vsed the figures of Ironve and concession you will not acknowledge but all other men may easily see For first he no where graunteth that S. Cyprian affirmeth that the Churche of Rome can not erie in fayth But immediatly before the wordes by you translated after he had proued out of the eleuēth to the Romans that the particular Church of Rome may be cut of as well as the Church of the Israelites which were the naturall braunches he asketh the question Quid Cypriano secus est visum What And did it seeme otherwise to Cyprian Pardon me Cyprian c. His meaning is plaine that Cyprian thought not otherwise than S. Paule hath written or if he did it was lawfull to dissent from Cyprian As a litle after he sayth Quare si Romanam Ecclesiam errare non posse c. Wherefore if Cyprian thought that the Church of Rome could not erre in that point by the sentence of the Papistes he him selfe is to be condemned of errour for diuerse Papistes whome he nameth confesse that euery particular Church may erre and Verratus one of them affirmeth that the Church of Rome is a particular Church which the rest can not deny And in deede that which Cyprian writeth is about certaine runneagate Heretikes that flying out of the Church of Carthage sought to be receiued of the particular Church of Rome All this while here is no graunt that Cyprian affirmeth that the Church of Rome cannot erre in faith And if Cyprian had so affirmed contrary to the scripture it might haue bene iustly replied vnto him which S. Augustine saith when he was pressed with his authoritie Contra Crescon lib. 2. cap. 31. Nos nullam Cypriano facimus iniuriam We do Cyprian no wrong when we distinguish any writings of his from the Canonical authoritie of the diuine Scriptures And in truth the wordes which M. Rainolds before cited out of S. Cyprian lib. 1. ep 3. ad Cornel. are spoken of no matter of faith but in a matter of discipline Neither doth Cyprian say that the Church of Rome can not erre in faith but that those Heretikes which brought letters from schismatikes profane persons did not consider that they are Romans whose faith is praised by the cōmendation or preaching of the Apostle to whom perfidia falshood or false dealing can haue none accesse Meaning that the Romans so long as they cōtinue in that faith which was praised by the Apostle cā not ioyne with Heretikes and Schismatikes that are cast out of other Catholike Churches For that he could not meane that the Pope or Church of Rome cannot erre in faith as the Papistes affirme it is manifest for that in a question of religion he dissented both from the Bishop and Church of Rome as all learned men knowe he did which he would neuer haue done if he had beleeued they could not erre And that his meaning was not that the Bishop of Rome could not erre in matters of
confession of any grosse faulte herein cōmitted except you will count it a grosse fault in S. Luke to vse the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 without any scrupulositie for all three as the translator doth the worde congregation and you in two significations the worde assemblye Neither can your heathenish and barbarous burning of the holy Scriptures so translated nor your blasphemie in calling it the deuils worde be excused for any fault in translation which you haue discouered as yet or euer shall be able to descrye That stinking cauill of leauing out of the Bible this worde Church altogither being both foolish and false I haue aunswered more than once alreadye It is not left out altogither that in contents of bookes and chapiters and in notes of explication of this worde congregation is set downe Neither could there be any purpose against the Catholike Churche of Christe in them that translated and taught the Creede in English professing to beleeue the holy Catholike Church As for our hatred of the malignant Antichristian Church of Rome we neuer dissembled the matter so that wee were afrayed openly to professe it what neede had wee then after suche a fantasticall manner as is fondly imagined to insinuate it MART. 5. But my Maisters if you would confesse the former faults and corruptions neuer so plainely is that inough to iustifie your corrupt dealing in the holy Scriptures Is it not an horrible fault so wilfully to falsifie and corrupt the worde of God written by the inspiration of the holy Ghost May you abuse the people for certaine yeares with false translations and afterward say Loe we haue amended it in our later translations Then might the Heretike Beza be excused for translating in steede of Christes soule in hell his carcas in the graue And because some friend told him of that corruption he corrected it in the later editions he shoulde neuerthelesse in your iudgement be counted a right honest man No be ye sure the discrete Reader can not be so abused but he will easily see that there is a great difference in mending some ouersights which may escape the best men in your grosse false translations who at the first falsifie of a prepensed malice and afterwardes alter it for verie shame Howbeit to say the truth in the chiefest principal place that concerneth the Churches perpetuitie stability you haue not yet altered the former translation but it remaineth as before and is at this day red in your Churches thus Vpon this Rocke I will build my congregation Can it be without some hereticall subtiltie that in this place specially and I thinke only you chaunge not the worde congregation into Church Giue vs a reason and discharge your credit FVLK 5. You are very hardly in very deede maliciously bent against vs that you will accept no confession of faults escaped neuer so plainly made As for corrupt dealing in the holy Scriptures and falsifying of the word of god you are not able no not if you would burst your selfe for malice to conuict vs. And therefore looke for no confession of any such wickednes whereof our conscience is cleare before God and doth not accuse vs. As for Bezaes correction of his formen translation Act. 2. v. 27. if your dogged stomach will not accept he shall notwithstanding with all godly learned men be accoūted as he deserueth for one who hath more profited the Church of God with his sincere translation and learned annotations than all the popish Seminaries and Seminarists shall be able to hinder it iangle of grosse false translations as long as you will But the chiefest principall place that concerneth the Churches perpetuitie is not yet reformed to your minde For in the Bible 1577. we reade still Math. 16. vpon this rocke I will build my congregation If Christ haue a perpetuall congregation builded vpon the foundation of the Prophets and Apostles him selfe being the corner stone his Church is in no daunger euer to decay Yet you aske whether it can be without some hereticall subtiltie that in this place specially and as you thinke onely the word congregation is not chaunged into Church It is an homely but a true prouerbe the good wife would neuer haue sought her daughter in the ouen had she not bene there first her selfe You are so full of hereticall subtilties and traiterous deuises that you dreame of them in other mens doinges whatsoeuer commeth into your handes yea where you your selfe can haue no probable imagination what to suspect And therefore we must giue you a reason in discharge of our credit For my part I knowe not with what speciall reason the translator was moued but I can giue you my probable coniecture that he thought it all one as in deede it is to say my congregation or my Church For what is Christes congregation but his Church or what is Christes Church but his congregation And yet to put you out of all feare the Geneua translation hath the worde Church that you make so great account of as though it were not an indifferent word to the true Church of true Christians and the false Church of malignant Heretikes being vsurped first to signifie the congregation of Christians by a Metonymie of the place containing for the people contained For the etymologie thereof is from the Greeke word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which was vsed of Christians for the place of their holy meetings signifying the Lordes house therefore in the northren which is the more auncient English speech is called by contraction Kyrke more neare to the sound of the Greeke word MART. 6. What shal I say of Beza whom the English Bibles also follow translating actiuely that Greeke word which in common vse and by S. Chrysostoms and the Greeke doctors exposition is a plaine passiue to signifie as in his annotations is cleare that Christ may be without his Church that is a head without a body The words be these in the heretical translation He gaue him to be the heade ouer all thinges to the Church which Church is his body the fulnes of him that filleth all in all S. Chrysostom saith Beza he might haue said all the Greeke Latine auncient fathers taketh it passiuely in this sense that Christ is filled all in all because all faithfull men as members the whole Church as the bodie cōcurre to the fulnes accomplishment of Christ the head But this saith he seemeth vnto me a forced interpretation Why so Beza FVLK 6. That Beza translateth the participle 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 actiuely it is plaine both in the text of his translation in his annotations But that he doth it to signifie that Christ may be without his Church that is a head without a body it is a shameles slaūder His words vpon which you weaue this cobweb are these Omninò autem hoc addidit Apostolus vt sciamus Christum per se non indigere hoc supplemento vt
be able to deny where you may if you be disposed to sport your selfe vse your figuratiue comparison of white blacke chaulke cheese but you shall sooner of white make blacke of chaulke cheese than you can possibly auoide the cleare light of those textes which was seene euen of your owne vulgar Latine interpretours MART. 5. Where we can not but maruell why they are affraide to translate the words plainly in this place of his soule being in Hell Whereas in the Creede they admit the words and interprete them that by suffering Hell paines vpon the Crosse so he descended into Hell and no otherwise Why did they not here also keepe the words for the credit of their translation and afterwarde if they woulde needes giue them that glose for maintenaunce of their heresie This mysterie we know not and woulde gladly learne it of the Puritane Caluinistes whose Englishe translation perhaps this is For the grosser Caluinistes being not so pure and precise in following Caluine as the Puritans be that haue well deserued that name aboue their fellowes they in their other Englishe Bibles haue in this place discharged them selues of false translation saying plainely Thou shalt not leaue my soule in Hell But in what sense they say so it is very hard to gesse and perhaps them selues can not tell yet what to make of it as appeareth by M. Whitakers answer to F. Campion And he is nowe called a Bishop among them and proceeded Doctor in Oxford that could not obtaine his grace to proceede Doctor in Cambridge because he preached Christes descending into hell and the Puritans in their second admonition to the Parliament pag. 43. cry out against the politike Caluinists for that in the Creede of the Apostles made in English meeter and song openly in their Churches in these wordes His spirite did after this descend into the lower partes to them that long in darkenesse were the true light of their hartes they fauour his descending into Hell very much and so consequently may thereby build Limbus Patrum and Purgatorie And the Puritans in their second replie against M. Whitgifts defense pag. 7. reprehend one of their chiefest Caluinisticall martyrs for affirming as they terme it a grosse descending of our Sauiour Christ into Hell Thus the Puritans confesse plainly their hereticall doctrine against Christes descending into Hell FVLK 5. By confessing in our Creede that Christ descended into hell you might knowe but that you had rather be ignorant that you might maruell still that we purposed not in translating this place to denye that article as you falsely slaunder vs but because this place might seeme vnto the ignorant to confirme the errour of Christes descending into Limbus patrum as it doth not if it be rightly vnderstoode it was thought good of some translatours that seeing this verse must haue the same sense in the Greeke Sermon of Peter that it hath in the Hebrewe Psalme of Dauid and the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vsed by the Euangelist in steede of the Hebrewe worde Sheol may beare to signifie a graue as the Hebrew worde doth moste vsually by translating it the graue to shewe that this verse in Greeke maketh no more for that errour of descending into Limbus than the same doth in Hebrewe As for your distinction of grosse Caluinistes and Puritans it may be packed vppe among the rest of your quarrells and slaunders What Maister Whitaker hath written in his aunswer to Frier Campion he is able to explane vnto you him selfe if you doe not vnderstand him That the Bishoppe of Saint Asaph did once fauour your errour in some parte and for that was misliked of the Vniuersitie of Cambridge it is as true as that afterward reforming his iudgement at Oxford where he proceeded he was also incorpored Doctor at Cambridge The Englishe meeter vppon the Creede except it be drawen to an allegorie in my iudgement can not be defended which iudgement I declared openly at Paules crosse foureteene or fiueteene yeares agoe Maister Latimers errour of Christ suffering torments in hell after his death is iustly reprehended by whome soeuer it be By all which I knowe not what may be rightly gathered but that we flatter not one another in errours but if any among vs be deceiued of what account or credite soeuer he be we spare not to reproue his errour preferring Gods truth before all worldly and priuate respects of friendship countenaunce credite and whatsoeuer MART. 6. The truth is howsoeuer the politike Caluinists speake or write in this point more plausibly and couertly to the people and more agreeably to the article of our faith than either Caluine or their earnest brethren the Puritans doe which write and speake as fantastically and madly as they thinke yet neither doe they beleeue this Article of the Apostles Creede or interpret it as the Catholike Church and auncient holy fathers alwayes haue done neither can it stand with their newe profession so to doe or with their English translations in other places It can not stand with their profession for then it would followe that the Patriarches and other iust men of the olde Testament were in some third place of rest called Abrahams bosome or Limbus Patrum till our Sauiour Christ descended thither and deliuered them from thence which they deny in their doctrine though they sing it in their meeters Neither can it stand with their English translations because in other places where the holy Scriptures euidently speake of such a place calling it Hell because that was a common name for euery place and state of soules departed in the olde Testament till our Sauiour Christ by his Resurrection and Ascension had opened heauen there for Hell they translate Graue FVLK 6. The truth is howsoeuer you slaunder vs with odious names of schisme and diuerse interpretations we al agree in the faith of that article and in the true sense and meaning thereof As also we consent against your errours of Limbus patrum or any descending of Christ into that fantasticall place As for Abrahams bosome we account it no place of descent or going downe but of ascending euen the same that our Sauiour Christ vpon the crosse called Paradise Luc. 23. saying to the penitent theefe this daye thou shalt be with me in Paradise which of Saint Paule is called the thirde heauen 2. Cor. 12. saying that he was taken vp into the thirde heauen whether in the bodye or out of the bodye he knewe not but he was taken vp into Paradise and there heard wordes that could not be vttered which it is not lawefull for a man to speake And that Abrahams Bosome is a place farre distant from hell that onely text where it is named Luc. 16. doth euidently declare First the Aungels carry the soule of Lazarus into Abrahams bosome he might as well haue sayde Hell if he had meant Hell But Aungels vse not to goe downe into Hell Secondly it is a place of comfort
Christ as I haue shewed before MART. 43. Well let vs goe forwarde in their owne daunce You allowe at the least the Iewes Canonicall bookes of the olde Testament that is all that are extant in the Hebrewe Bible and all of the newe Testament without exception Yea that we doe In these bookes then will you be tried by the vulgar auncient Latine Bible onely vsed in all the West Church aboue a thousandyeares No. Will you be tried by the Greeke Bible of the Septuaginta interpreters so renowmed and authorised in our Sauiours owne speaches in the Euangelistes and Apostles writings in the whole Greeke Church euermore No How then will you be tried They answere Only by the Hebrue Bible that now is and as now it is pointed with vowels Will you so and do you thinke that only the true authenticall Hebrue which the holy Ghost did first put into the pennes of those sacred writers We do thinke it say they and esteeme it the only authenticall and true Scripture of the old Testament FVLK 43. Where so many of your owne Popish writers do accuse your vulgar Latine text of innumerable corruptions what reason is there that we should follow that translation onely especially seeing God hath giuen vs knowledge of the tongues that we may resort to the fountaines them selues as S. Augustine exhorteth As for the Greeke translation of the Septuaginta from which your owne vulgar Latine varieth although we reuerence it for the antiquitie and vse it for interpretation of some obscure places in the Hebrew why should you require vs to be tried thereby which will not be tried by it your selues If I were as captious as you are with Iohn Keltrige about the Greeke Bible of the Septuaginta Interpreters I might make sporte with you as you doe with him but I acknowledge your Synâ—cdoche that you meane the olde Testament onely whereas the word Bible is commonly taken for both But to the purpose we acknowledge the text of the olde Testament â—n Hebrew and Chaldee for in the Chaldee tongue were some partes of it written as it is now printed with vowels to be the onely fountaine out of which we muste draw the pure truth of the Scriptures for the olde Testament adioyning herewith the testimonie of the Mazzoreth where any diuersitie of pointes letters or wordes is noted to haue bene in sundry auncient copies to discerne that which is proper to the whole context from that which by errour of the writers or printers hath bene brought into any copie olde or newe MATT. 44. We aske them againe what say you then to that place of the Psalme where in the Hebrue it is thus As a lion my handes and my feete for that which in truth should be thus They digged or pearced my hands and my feete being an euident prophecie of Christes nailing to the crosse There in deede say they we followe not the Hebrue but the Greeke text Sometime then you follow the Greeke and not the Hebrue onely And what if the same Greeke text make for the Catholikes as in these places for example I haue inclined my hart to keepe thy iustifications for reward and Redeeme thy sins with almes might we not obtaine here the like fauour at your handes for the Greeke texte specially when the Hebrue doth not disagree No say they nor in no other place where the Greeke is neuer so plaine if the Hebrue worde at the least may be any otherwise interpreted drawen to an other significatioÌ„ FVLK 44. We say to you first that you haue falsely pointed the Hebrue word in the margeÌ„t for all the printed bookes that euer I haue seene as Bomberge both in folio and quarto Stephanus Basil Plantine Arias Montanus CoÌ„plutensis al place Camets vnder Caph where you make Patach But perhaps your Hebrue is most out of MuÌ„sters Dictionarie where it is pointed as you make it But for answere to your question we say that their is a double testimonie of the Mazzorites to proue that in the most auncient and best corrected copies the Hebrue was Caru they haue digged or pearced this is testified not onely by our translators but also by Ioannes Isaac your owne Rabbin against Lindanus a prelate of yours And this the auctors of the Complutense edition doe acknowledge for thus they haue pointed it Caru where is nothing but the redundans of Aleph whiche is vnderstood in euery Camets differing from the vsuall reading and declining of the Verbe Carah that signifieth to pearce or digge Againe where it is redde otherwise if it be rightly pointed as it is in Arias Montanus Caari it cannot signifie Sicut leo as a lion as both the Mazzorites do teach and Iohannes Isaac a Grammarian out of theÌ„ by the points the note ouer iod doth plainly demonstrate For what should shureâ—h sound in iod or if you would contend it should be Daghes to what purpose should it be in iod if the worde should signifie as a lion Therefore howsoeuer this varietie of copies came either by negligence of some writers or by corruption of the Iewes wee haue sufficient warrant for the auncient and true reading whiche the Greeke translator did followe whiche also was in S. Hieromes copie otherwise hee woulde not haue translated out of the Hebrue Fixerunt they haue pearced Therefore Rabbi Ioseph which made the Chaldeâ— Paraphrase vpon the Psalter laboured to expresse both the copies as well that which hath plainely they haue pearced as that whiche hath it corruptly as though it spake of a Lion and yet can not rightly be so translated because the points are imperfect euen for that reading Therefore he hath saide Nikethin Heich Cheariah They haue indented and pearced like a lion my handes and my feete as it is in the Venice print of Daniel Bomberg although Arias Montanus in his Bible haue no more but Nachethin which he traslateth biting my handes and my feete I haue played the foole to vtter these matters in the mother tongue to ignorant men that can make no triall of them but you haue not only giuen me example but also enforced me with your vnsoluble question as you thought by one word somewhat out of frame to ouerthrow the whole Hebrue text But you are to be pardoned for that you follow your M. Lindanus herein who hath nothing else in effect to quarrel against the Hebrue text but this therfore he repeteth it in many places to make greater shew of it as you doe In other places where the Hebrue worde hath diuerse significations who shall forbid vs to chuse that which is most agreeable to the circumstance of the text and to the analogie or rule of faith MART. 45. We replie againe and say vnto them why Is not the credit of those Septuaginta interpreters who them selues were Iewes and best learned in their owne tongue and as S. Augustine often and other auncient fathers say were inspired with the holy Ghost in translating the
you so malitious an enimie vnto him hauing spent all your inuention to seeke holes in his translation can finde nothing but such childish cauils as when they be discouered men will maruaile that you were not ashamed to moue them MART. 56. But after this generall vewe of their wilfull purpose and heretical intention let vs examine their false translations more particularly and argue the case with them more at large and presse them to answere whether in their conscience it be so or no as hitherto is saide and that by seuerall chapters of such CONTROVERSIES as their corruptions concerne and first of all without further curiositie whence to begin in cases so indifferent of TRADITIONS FVLK 56. The more particularly you examine our translations the freer I hope they shall be found from falsehoode wilfull corruption And the more at large you argue the case and presse vs to answere the more you shall make the case to appeare worse on your side and the truth clearer on our parte And as God is witnesse of our conscience and sinceritie in setting forth his word without adulteration or corruptiō so I appeale to the consciences of al indifferent readers whether hitherto you haue gotten any aduantage against vs in this whole chapter which yet you professe to be the abridgement and summe of your whole treatise CHAP. II. Hereticall translation of holy Scripture against Apostolicall TRADITIONS Martin THis is a matter of such importance that if they shoulde graunt any traditions of the Apostles and not pretende the written worde onely they know that by such traditions mentioned in all antiquitie their religion were wholy defaced and ouerthrowen For remedie whereof and for the defacing of all such traditions they bend their translations against them in this wonderfull maner Wheresoeuer the holy Scripture speaketh against certaine traditions of the Iewes partly friuolous partly repugnant to the law of God there all the English translations follow the Greeke exactly neuer omitting this word tradition Contrariwise wheresoeuer the holy Scripture speaketh in the commendation of Traditions to wit such traditions a◠the Apostles deliuered to the Church there all their sayd translations agree not to followe the Greeke which is still the selfe same word but for traditions they translate ordinaunces or instructions Why so and to what purpose we appeale to the worme of their conscience which continually accuseth them of an hereticall meaning whether by vrging the word traditions wheresoeuer they are discommended and by suppressing the word wheresoeuer they are commended their purpose and intent be not to signifie to the Reader that all traditions are naught and none good all reproueable none allowable Fulke TRaditions in deede is a matter of such importance as if you may be allowed whatsoeuer you will thrust vpon vs vnder the name of vnwritten traditions the written worde of God shall serue to no purpose at all For first as you plainly professe the holy Scripture shall not be accounted sufficient to teach all truth necessary to saluation that the man of God may be perfect prepared to all good works Secondly with the Valentinian heretikes you accuse the Scriptures of vncertaine vnderstāding without your traditions vnder pretense of which you wil bring in what you list though it be neuer so contrary to the holy Scriptures plaine wordes by colour of interpretatiō as you do the worshipping of images many other like heresies As for the mention that is made of Apostolicall traditions in diuerse of the auncient fathers some of thē are such as you your selues obserue not not for the tenth part of those that you obserue can you bring any testimony out of the ancient fathers as is proued sufficiently by so many propositiōs as were set downe by the Bishoppe of Sarisburie M. Iewel whereof you can bring no proofe for any one to haue bene taught within 600. yeres after Christ. Now concerning the traditions of the Apostles what they were who can be a better witnesse vnto vs than Ignatius the disciple of the Apostles of whom Eusebius writeth that when he was led towardes Rome where he suffred martyrdom he earnestly exhorted the Churches by which he passed to continue in the faith and against all heresies which euen then began to bud vp he charged thē to retaine fast the traditiō of the Apostles which by that time he protested to be committed to writing for by that time were al the books of the new Testament written The words of Eusebius concerning this matter are li. 3. c. 35. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 And he exhorted thē straitly to kepe the tradition of the Apostles which testifying that it was now for assurance cōmitted to writing he thought necessary to be plainly taught Against this tradition of the Apostles which for certaintie assurance is contained in their holy vndoubted writings we say nothing but striue altogither for it But because the word traditions is by you Papistes taken to signifie a doctrine secretely deliuered by worde of mouth without authority of the holy Scriptures we do willingly auoide the word in our translations where the simple might be deceiued to think that the holy ghost did euer cōmēd any such to the church which he would not haue to be committed to writing in the holy Scriptures in steede of that word so commōly taken although it doth not necessarily signifie any such matters we doe vse such wordes as do truly expresse the Apostles meaning the Greke word doth also signifie Therfore we vse the words of ordināces or instructiōs or institutiōs or the doctrine deliuered all which being of one sense the Greeke word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doeth signifie and the same doth tradition signifie if it be rightly vnderstoode but seing it hath bene commonly taken and is vrged of the Papistes to signifie only a doctrine deliuered beside the word of God written in such places where the holy Ghost vseth the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in that sense we translate by that worde tradition where he vseth it for such doctrine as is groūded vpon the holy Scriptures our translatours haue auoyded it not of any hereticall meaning that all 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 traditions are naught but that all such as haue not the holy Scripture to testifie of them and to warrant them are euill and to be auoyded of all true Christians which can not without blasphemie acknowledge any imperfection in the holy Scriptures of God which are able to make a man wise vnto saluation if they shoulde thinke any doctrine necessarie to saluation not to be cōtained therein MART. 2. For example Matt. 15. Thus they translate Why do thy disciples transgresse the TRADITION of the Elders And againe Why do you also transgresse the commaundement of God by your TRADITION And againe Thus haue you made the commaundement of God of no effect by your TRADITION Here I warrant you all the bels sound tradition and the word is neuer omitted
and it is very well and honesty translated for so the Greeke worde doth properly signifie But nowe on the other side concerning good traditions let vs see their dealing The Apostle by the selfe same worde both in Greeke and Latine sayth thus Therefore brethren stand and hold fast the TRADITIONS which you haue learned either by worde or by our Epistle And againe Withdraw your selues from euerie brother walking inordinately and not according to the TRADITION which they haue receiued of vs. And againe according to the Greeke which they professe to folow I praise you brethren that in all things you are mindefull of me and as I haue deliuered vnto you you keepe my TRADITIONS FVLK 2. No maruell though you can not abide the bels sounding against mans traditions which sound must nedes pearce your coÌ„science more than it offendeth your eares seeing you know that many of those things which you defend vnder the name of traditions against the holy scriptures haue not God for their auctor which forbiddeth to be worshipped in such sorte but man or rather Sathan which hath inspired such things vnto meÌ„ thereby to dishonor God and to discredite his holy and most certaine written worde Yet you say it is well and honestly translated God knoweth how faine you would there were no such text extaÌ„t in the Gospel against your superstition and will worshipping But now let vs see our craftie dealing as you compte it against good traditions In the first text 2. Thessal 2. v. 15. You may see your vnderstanding of traditions quite ouerthrowen For the Apostle speaketh of such traditions as were deliuered to them partly by preaching partly by his Epistle Therfore tradition doth not signifie a doctrine deliuered by worde of mouth onely But yet you will say it signifieth here a doctrine deliuered by word of mouth also which is not written How proue you that because all that the Apostle preached was not conteyned in his Epistles to the Thessalonians therefore was it no where written in the Scriptures what the tradition was in the second text 2. Thess. 3. v. 6. is expressed by and by after that he which will not labour must not eate Was this doctrine neuer written before when God commaundeth euery man to labour in his vocation As for the third place 1. Cor. 11. 2. your owne vulgar Latine translater both teacheth vs how to translate it and also dischargeth our translation of heresie and corruption for he calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in that place praecepta precepts or instructions or commauÌ„dements or ordinances I see no great difference in these wordes By which his translation he sheweth that in the other places 2. Thes. 2. 3. He meaneth the same thing by traditiones traditions that we doe by ordinances or instructions and might as well haue vsed the word praecepta in those two places as he did in this one if it had pleased him MART. 3. Here we see plaine mention of S. Paules traditions and consequently of Apostolicall traditions yea and traditions by worde of mouth deliuered to the saide Churches without writing or Scripture In all whiche places looke gentle reader and seeke all their English translations and thou shalt not once finde the worde tradition but in steede thereof ordinances instructions preachings institutions and any worde else rather than tradition In so much that Beza their maister translateth it traditam doctrinam the doctrine deliuered putting the singular number for the plural adding doctrine of his owne So framing the text of holy Scripture according to his false commentarie or rather putting his commentarie in the text making it the text of Scripture Who would thinke their malice and partialitie against traditions were so great that they should all agree with one consent so duely and exactly in these and these places to conceale the worde which in other places do so gladly vse it the Greeke worde being all one in all the saide places FVLK 3. There is no question but the Apostles by word of mouth that is by preaching teaching deliuered the doctrine of the Gospel to the Churches but that they preached taught or deliuered any doctrine as necesarie to saluation which they proued not out of the holy Scriptures and which is not contained in the new TestameÌ„t or the old this is not yet proued neither euer can it be proued Such matters of ceremonies order discipline which are mutable no man denies but they might did deliuer but yet in them nothing but agreeable to the generall rules set downe in the Scripture But in all these places the word tradition can not once be founde Yet M. Fulke saith it is fouÌ„d Yea doth where saith he so You answere pag. 153 against D. Saunders Rocke Therfore if he giue not an instaunce let him giue him selfe the lie But he that chargeth Fulke to say it is found lieth the more For so he saith not read the place who wil. He speaketh against Saunder who affirmed that the very name of tradition vsed in the better part can not be suffered to be in the Englishe Bible as though there were some decree of the Synode or Act of Parliament against it and sayth it may be and is suffered in that sense which the holy Ghost vseth it but not to bring prayer for the deade or any thing contrarie to the Scripture vnder the name of traditions Apostolike By which wordes I meane that there is no prohibition or edict to the contrarie but if any man will vse the worde tradition in translation of the Bible he is permitted so to doe I doe not affirme it is so founde But as if I shoulde say The Papistes in Englande are suffered to liue as becommeth good subiectes I affirme not that they are or shall be founde so to liue But to omit this foolishe quarrell Beza our Maister is sayed to haue translated 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the doctrine deliuered putting the singular number for the plurall and adding doctrine of his owne What an hainous matter here is the word doctrine is a collectiue comprehending many precepts or traditions and in the next chapiter the Apostle vseth the same word in the singular number Againe the 1. Thes. 4. v. 2. he calleth the same 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 precepts or documents which worde signifieth the same that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 witnes your vulgar latin traÌ„slator which giues one word for both praecepta 1. Cor. 11. 1. Thes. 4. And that the word doctrine is added to the text it is a fonde cauil for the word doctrine is coÌ„tained in 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth a deliuerie but whereof â—f not of doctrine Our Sauiour Christ also Math. 15. v. 9. by the testimony of Esay reproueth the traditioÌ„ of the Pharisees teaching the doctrines precepts of meÌ„ which testimonye of Esay could take no hold of theÌ„ if traditioÌ„s were not doctrines precepts So that in this traÌ„slatioÌ„ of
Ex. 32. in Ieroboams calues in the brasen serpent the wiser sort of the Gentils and Papists pretend to do in worshipping their images then it is a sinne against the second cōmaundement Thou shalt make to thy selfe no grauen images Thou shalt not fall downe to them nor worship thē By similitude therfore of thē that trusted in images as their gods so honored thē which were not able to helpe them the Apostle calleth the couetous man a worshipper of images couetousnes worshipping of images not properly but because their monie is to thē the same occasion of departing from God that the images was to the worshipper of thē So if we will speake vnproperly as the Apostle saith their belly is their God we may say it is their idoll or their image which they worship as God not that the belly or any such thing is God or an idol or an image properly but that it is so termed for that to such vile creatures is giuen that diuine honor which is due to God but by worshippers of idols and images is giuen to idols or images I confesse the vse of the English tongue in these speaches is rather to call thē idols than images and to extend the name idol which is alwaies taken in the euill parte to that which the word image can not so aptly signifie yet in trueth of the thing there is no difference betwene idol and image worshipping of idols and worshipping of images whether you speake of such as be idols images so properly called or of such as be onely by similitude figuratiuely so named If any of our Superintendēts be such as you speake of I wish them amended or else remoued For my parte I know none to be suche although I wish to the best encrease of Gods grace to despise the world to be more earnest in setting foorth Gods glorie As for the great difference you speake of betwixt S. Paules wordes and our translation I see none as yet MART. 3. Will you see more yet to this purpose In the English Bible printed the yeare 1562. you reade thus Howe agreeth the Temple of God with images Can we be ignorant of Satans cogitations herein that it was translated of purpose to delude the simple people to make them beleue that the Apostle speaketh against sacred images in the Churches which were then in plucking downe in Englande when this your translation was first published in print Whereas in very truth you know that the Apostle here partely interpreteth him selfe to speake of men as of Gods temples wherein he dwelleth partely alludeth to Salomons Temple which did very well agree with images for it had the Cherubins which were the representations of Angels the figures of oxen to beare up the lauatory but with idols it could not agree and therefore the Apostles words are these How agreeth the Temple of God with idols FVLK 3. We had neede to see more before we be conuicted of corruption for hitherto we haue seene nothing but a folish cauill groūded vpon the cōmon vse of the word idol in English in which speach it is takē only for vnlawful images although in the Greeke it signifieth as generally as Imago in Latin by Tully him selfe is vsed for the same But in the English Bible printed 1562. we read thus 2. Cor. 6. How agreeth the tēple of God with images Here you can not be ignorant of Satans cogitatiōs that it was translated of purpose to make the simple people beleue that the Apostle speaketh against sacred images in churches which were then in plucking downe in Englande when this translation was first published in print You are so cunning in Satans cogitations that he hath inspired into you a manifest vntrueth for this text was so translated printed nere 30. yeres before 1562. in King Henrie the eightes time when images were not in plucking downe And when it was printed againe 1562. which was the fifth yere of her Maiesties reigne God be thāked there was no neede to plucke downe images out of churches which were pluckt downe in the first and secōd yeres of her reigne Wherfore that purpose is vainly imagined of you for the trāslaters purpose was the same that the Apostles to shew that the religion of God hath nothing to do with images made by mans deuise to honor them as gods or to honor God by them And where you say that the Apostle alludeth to Salomons temple which did well agree with images but not with idols I answere you Salomons tēple did not agree with images made by the deuise of man to honour God by them or in thē For the Cherubins were not of mans deuise but of Gods commaundemēt the oxen to hold vp the lauatory the pomegranats other ornaments were not for any vse of religion to worship God in them or by them but for vse garnishing of the house appointed by God in his law and by direction of his spirit in Salomon For the commaundement Thou shalt not make to thy selfe is no restraint vnto God but vnto men of their owne braine or priuate intent to make images to serue in religion Therefore the Apostle speaking of suche images as were forbidden by Gods lawe is not otherwise to be vnderstoode and no more is our translation MART. 4. When Moises by Gods appointment erected a brasen serpent and commaunded the people that were stung with serpents to behold it thereby they were healed this was an image only and as an image was it erected kept vsed by Gods commaundement But when it grew to be an idol saith S. Augustine that is when the people began to adore it as God then king Ezechias brake it in peeces to the great cōmendation of his piety godly zeale So when the children of Israel in the absence of Moises made a caife said These are thy Gods ô Israel that brought thee out of Aegipt was it but an image which they made was that so hainous a matter that God would so haue punished them as he did No they made it an idol also saying These are thy gods ô Israel And therfore the Apostle saith to the Corinthians Be not idolaters as some of them Which also you translate most falsely Be not worshippers of images as some of them FVLK 4. The brasen serpent first and last was an image holy when it was commaunded by God to bee made as a sacrament of our redemption by Christ lawfull when it was reserued onely for memorie of that excellent miracle vnlawefull cursed and abhominable when it was worshipped and therefore iustly broken in peeces by the godly king Ezechias You cite Augustine as it pleaseth you to followe your owne context Quem sanè serpentem propter facti memoriam reseruatum cum posteà populus errans tanquam idolum colere cepisset Ezechias c. Which serpent truly being reserued for the
signification but a true and general vnderstanding of the word which is vsed of the Euangelist for other washings than the Sacrament of Baptisme and so you are inforced to translate it Marc. 7. MART. 2. Now then to come to our purpose such are the absurde translations of the English Bibles and altogither like vnto these Namely when they translate congregation for Churche Elder for Priest Image for Idol dissension for schisme Generall for Catholike secrete for Sacrament ouer-seer for Bishop messenger for Angel embassadour for Apostle minister for Deacon and such like to what other end be these deceitfull translations but to conceale and obscure the name of the Church and dignities thereof mentioned in the holy Scriptures to dissemble the worde schisme as they do also Heresie and Heretike for feare of disgracing their schismes and Heresies to say of Matrimonie neither Sacrament which is the Latin nor mysterie which is the Greeke but to goe as farre as they can possibly from the common vsuall and Ecclesiastical wordes saying This is a great secrete in fauour of their heresie that Matrimonie is no Sacrament FVLK 2. Absurde traÌ„slations of the English Bibles you say are congregation for Churche Elder for Priest Image for Idoll and such like The word Church being ambiguously taken of the people for the place of assembly the assembly it selfe it was as lawful for vs to cal congregation as for you to call it assembly Actes 7. This worde Priest commonly taken for a sacrificer and the same that Sacerdos and so by you translated there was good occasion to vse the worde Elder for which you vse Senior or auncient in your translation which is a name of auctoritie as ouerseer is of diligeÌ„ce minister of seruice pastor of feeding all which names set foorth a true Bishop Pastor and Elder and if you will needes haue it of a true Prieste Of Image for Idoll is sayde inough in the nexte Chapiter before Schisme I knowe not how English men should vnderstand except it were englished by dissension diuision rending or some such like Of general for Catholike we shal speake anon Secrete for Sacrament we vse because wee would retaine the ecclesiasticall vse of this worde Sacrament which is to signifie the seales of Gods promises and not confounde it with euery holy or vnholy secrete thing The Greeke worde mysterie which you would enioyne vs to vse was in the time of the firste translation more vnknowen than that wee could well haue vsed it except wee would haue followed your veine in vanitie and noueltie of termes Praepuâ—e neophyte gratis depositum c. or else made generall and common the proper vse of this Ecclesiasticall terme Sacrament to euery mysterie and called the Sacrament of preaching of publishing the Gospel to the Gentils of the seuen starres as you do and yet in the Sacrament of the whore of Babylon you leaue it and call it mysterie Apoc. 17. v. 7. as you shoulde be enforced to doe if you would translate the old Testament out of Latine Dan. 2. diuerse times except you would call Nabuchadonosors dreame a Sacrament and Dan 4. where the king sayth that to Daniell no secrete is impossible meaning vnknowen or not vnderstood you would say no Sacrament Tob. 12. you would translate Sacramentum regis abscondere bonum est It is a good thing to hide the kings Sacrament where you should say secrete and where the English phrase would hardly beare you to say the kings mysterie Of the other termes in the places by you quoted it shal be sufficient to speake But I haue rendred reasonable causes of these termes hitherto so that no maÌ„ but madde with malice would thinke we conceale the name of Church dignities therof in hatred of them or do dissemble the names of schisme heresie in fauour of those abhominations which are as wel set forth to their detestatioÌ„ in the terms of dissention and sectes as for the name Sacrament we find not in the Greeke but mysterium we traÌ„slate a secrete or a mysterie as the worde signifieth which nothing fauoureth the pretended Sacrament of Matrimonie MART. 3. S. Paul saith as plaine as he can speake I beseech you brethren that you all say one thing and that there be no schismes among you They translate for schismes dissentions which may be in profane and worldly things as well as in matters of religion But schismes are those that diuide the vnitie of the Church whereof they know them selues guilty S. Paule saith as plainely as is possible A man that is an Heretike auoide after the first and second admonition They translated in their Bible of the yeare 1562 A man that is an author of Sectes And where the Greeke is Heresie reckened among damnable sinnes they say Sectes fauouring that name for their owne sakes and dissembling it as though the holy Scriptures spake not against Heresie or Heretikes Schisme or Schismatikes FVLK 3. S. Paule in deede speaketh plainely in Greeke but if you speake English say schismes fortie thousand of the people in England will sweare they vnderstande you not But schismes you say are those that deuide the vnitie of the Churche dissentions may be in prophane and worldly things Verily all schismes deuide not the Church for they were not al the Church of whom it is sayde in S. Iohn 9. There was a schisme among them for I thinke the best of the Pharisees were scarse good members of the Churche Againe where S. Paule doth say least there should bee a schisme in the bodie 1. Cor. 12. He speaketh of the natural bodie whervnto he compareth the Churche S. Paule also sayth as plainely as he canne speake in Greeke 1. Cor. 11. v. 18. I heare that there be schismes among you yet your vulgar Latine translatour is bolde to saye Scissuras cuttings or rendings where you are bold to goe from your Latine texte and call them schismes And for explicating the Greeke name of heresie by sectes why should wee be more blamed than the vulgar Latine translator who commonly translateth it Sectas and namely Gal. 5. 2. Pet. 2. Actes 24. diuerse times 26. and 28 in all which places you your selues translate sectes Is it because he or you fauour heresies and heretikes will you neuer leaue this foolish wrangling which alwaies turneth you to the greater discredite MART. 4. As also they suppresse the very name Catholike when it is expresly in the Greeke for malice towarde Catholikes and Catholike religion because they know them selues neuer shall be called or knowen by that name And therefore their two English Bibles accustomed to be reade in their Churche therefore by like moste authenticall leaue it cleane out in the title of all those Epistles which haue bene knowen by the name of Catholicae Epistolae euer since the Apostles time and their later English Bible dealing somewhat more honestly hath turned the worde Catholike into General saying The Generall
Epistle of Iames of Peter c. As if a man shoulde say in his Creede I beleeue the general Churche because hee would not say the Catholike Churche as the Lutheran Catechismes say for that purpose I beleeue the Christian Church So that by this rule when S. Augustine telleth that the maner was in cities where there was libertie of religion to aske Qua itur ad Catholicam Wee muste translate it Which is the way to the General And when Sainct Hierome sayth If we agree in faith with the B. of Rome ergo Catholici sumus we must translate it Then we are Generals Is not this good stuffe Are they not ashamed thus to inuert and peruert all wordes against common sense and vse and reason Catholike and Generall or vniuersall we knowe is by the originall propertie of the word all one but according to the vse of both as it is ridiculous to say A Catholike Councell for a Generall Councell so is it ridiculous and impious to say Generall for Catholike inderogation thereof and for to hide it vnder a bushell FVLK 4. I doe not knowe where the name of Catholike is once expressed in the text of the Bible that it might be suppressed by vs which are not like to beare malice to the Catholike Church or religion seeing we teache euen our young children to beleue the holy Catholike Church But not finding the word Catholike in the text you runne to the title of the seuen Epistles called as commonly Canonicall as Catholike or Generall But Eusebius belike testifieth that they haue bene so called euer since the Apostles time lib. 2. cap. 22. I maruell you are not ashamed to auouch suche an vntruth Eusebius speaking of his owne time saith they are so called but that they haue bene so called euer since the Apostles time he sayth not And so farre off he is from saying so that he pronounceth the Epistle of S. Iames in the same place to be a bastarde and speaketh doubtfully of the Epistle of S. Iude. But whereas in one translation we vse the worde Generall for Catholike you make a greate may game of it shewing your witte and your honestie both at once For these 5. of Iames 2. of Peter one of Iude and the first of Iohn which are properly rightly so intituled haue that title because they are not sent to any particular Church or persons but to all in general as the Greeke scholiast truly noteth And OEcumenius before the Epistle of S. Iames sayth expressely Catholicae id est vniuersales dicuntur hae c. These Epistles are called Catholike that is to say Vniuersall or General because not distinctly to one nation or citie as S. Paule to the Romanes or Corinthians this companie of our Lords disciples doth dedicate these Epistles but generally to the faithfull or to the Iewes that were dispersed as also Peter or else to all Christians liuing vnder the same faith For otherwise if they should be called Catholike in respect of the souÌ„dnes of the doctrine coÌ„tained in theÌ„ what reason were there more to call them so than to call all the Epistles of S. Paule Wherefore in this title which yet is no part of the holy Scripture it is rightly traÌ„slated general The other translatours seeing seuen to be called general where only fiue are so in deede and seeing them also called canonicall which should seeme to be a controulling of S. Paules Epistles left out that title altogither as being no part of the text and word of God but an addition of the stationers or writers MART. 5. Is it because they would followe the Greeke that they turne 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 generall euen as iust as when they turne 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 image 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 instruction 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ordinance 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 dissension 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sect 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 secrete and such like where they goe as farre from the Greeke as they can and will be glad to pretende for aunswere of their worde sect that they followe our Latine translation Alas poore shift for them that otherwise pretende nothing but the Greeke to be tried by that Latine which them selues condemne But we honour the sayd text and translate it Sects also as we there find it and as we doe in other places followe the Latine text and take not our aduantage of the Greeke text because we knowe the Latine translation is good also and sincere and approued in the Church by long antiquitie it is in sense all one to vs with the Greke but not so to them who in these daies of controuersie about the Greeke and Latine text by not following the Greeke which they professe sincerely to follow bewray them selues that they doe it for a malitious purpose FVLK 5. It is because we woulde haue the Greeke vnderstood as it is taken in those places when we turne Catholike generall Idolum image 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 instruction 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ordinaunce 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 dissention 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 sect 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 secret and such like And where you say we woulde be glad for our word sect to pretend to follow your Latine translation it is a fable For in translating sect we follow the Greeke as truely as your Latine translation doeth which if it be true and sincere as you confesse what deuilish madnesse possesseth your malicious mind to burthen vs with such purposes as no reasonable man would once imagine or thinke of that we should vse that terme in fauour of heresie and heretikes whome we thinke worthie to suffer death if they will not repent and cease to blaspheme or seduce the simple CHAP. V. Hereticall translation against the CHVRCH Martin AS they suppresse the name Catholike euen so did they in their first English Bible the name of Church it selfe because at their first reuolt and apostasie from that that was vniuersally knowen to be the only true Catholike Church it was a great obiectioÌ„ against their schismaticall proceedings and it stucke much in the peoples consciences that they forsooke the Church and that the Church condemned them WherupoÌ„ very wiâ—ily they suppressed the name Church in their English translation so that in all that Bible so long red in their congregations we can not once finde the name thereof Iudge by these places which seeme of most importaunce for the dignitie preheminence and authoritie of the Church Fulke HOwe can wee suppresse the name Catholike which the holy Scripture neuer vseth as for the name of Church I haue alreadie shewed diuerse times that for to auoyd the ambiguous taking of that terme it was at the first lesse vsed but neuer refused for doubt of any obiection of the Catholike Church against vs the profession of which being contained in our Englishe creede howe could we relinquish or not acknowledge to be contained in the Scripture in which we taught that all articles
a sacrament ioyned with the spirituall sacrifice of praise and thankes giuing Which sacrament being administred by the ministers thereto appoynted the sacrifice is common to the whole Church of the faithfull who are all spirituall priestes to offer vp spirituall sacrifices as much as the minister of the worde and sacraments MART. 3. To defeate all this and to take away all externall priesthood and sacrifice they by corrupt translation of the holy Scriptures make them cleane dumme as though they had not a word of any such Priestes or Priesthood as we speake of Their Bibles we graunt haue the name of Priestes very often but that is when mention is made eyther of the Priests of the Iewes or of the Priests of the Gentiles specially when they are reprehended blamed in the holy Scriptures and in such places our Aduersaries haue the name Priests in there translations to make the very name of Priest odious among the common ignorant people Againe they haue also the name Priests when they are taken for all maner of men women or children that offer internall and spirituall sacrifices whereby our Aduersaries would falsely signifie that there are no other Priestes as one of them of late freshly auoucheth directly against S. Augustine who in one briefe sentence distinguisheth Priests properly so called in the Church and Priests as it is a cōmon name to all Christians Lib. 20. de Ciuit. Dei cap. 10. This name then of Priest and Priesthood properly so called as S. Augustine saith which is an order distinct from the Laitie and vulgar people ordained to offer Christ in an vnbloudy maner in sacrifice to his heauenly father for vs to preach minister the Sacraments and to be the Pastors of the people they wholy suppresse in their translations in all places where the holy scripture calleth them Presbyteros there they neuer translate Priestes but Elders And that they doe obserue so duely and so warily and with so full and generall consent in all their English Bibles as the Puritans doe plainly confesse and M. Whit. gift denieth it not that a man would wonder to see how carefull they are that the people may not once heare the name of any such Priest in all the holy scriptures FVLK 3. Nowe you haue gotten a fine nette to daunce naked in that no ignorant blinde bussarde can see you The maskes of your nette be the ambiguous and abusiue significations of this worde Priest which in deede according to the originall deriuation from Presbyter should signifie nothing else but an Elder as we translate it that is one appoynted to gouerne the Church of God according to his word but not to offer sacrifice for the quicke and the deade But by vsurpation it is commonly taken to signifie a sacrificer such as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is in Greeke and sacerdos in Latine by which names the ministers of the Gospell are neuer called by the holy Ghost After this common acception and vse of this word Priest we call the sacrificers of the olde Testament and of the Gentiles also because the Scripture calleth them by one name Cohanin or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but because the Scripture calleth the ministers of the newe Testament by diuerse other names and neuer by the name of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we thought it necessary to obserue that distinction which we see the holye Ghost so precisely hath obserued Therefore where the Scripture calleth them 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we call them according to the etymologie Elders and not Priestes which worde is taken vp by common vsurpation to signifie sacrificers of Iewes Gentiles or Papistes or else all Christians in respect of spirituall sacrifices And although Augustine and other of the auncient fathers call the ministers of the newe Testament by the name of sacerdotes and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifie the ministers of the olde Testament yet the authoritie of the holy Ghost making a perfect distinction betweene these two appellations and functiōs ought to be of more estimation with vs. The Fathers were content to speake in Latin Greeke as the termes were taken vp by the common people newly conuerted from gentilitie but yet they retained the difference of the sacrificing priesthood of the one and the ministeriall office of the other This may suffice therefore to render a reason why we vse not the worde Priest for Ministers of the new Testament not that we refuse it in respect of the etymologie but in respect of the vse common signification thereof MART. 4. As for example in their translations When there fell a question about circumcision They determined that Paule and Barnabas should goe vp to Hierusalem vnto the Apostles and ELDERS about this question Act. 15. And againe They were receyued of the congregation and of the Apostles and ELDERS Againe The Apostles and Elders came togither to reason of this matter Againe Then pleased it the Apostles and Elders with the whole congregation to sende c. Againe The Apostles and Elders and brethren sende greeting c. Againe They deliuered them the decrees for to keepe that were ordained of the Apostles and ELDERS If in all these places they had translated Priests as in deede they should haue done according to the Greke word it had then disaduantaged them this much that men would haue thought both the dignitie of Priestes to be great and also their authoritie in Councels as being here ioyned with the Apostles to be greatly reuerenced and obeyed To keepe the people from all suche holy and reuerent cogitations of Priestes they put Elders a name wherewith our holy Christian forefathers eares were neuer acquainted in that sense FVLK 4. In al those places by you rehearsed Act. 15. and 16. your owne vulgar Latine text hath seniores which you had rather call auncients as the French Protestants call the Gouernours of their Churches than Elders as we doe That Popish Priestes should haue any dignitie or authoritie in Councels wee doe flatly denie but that the Seniors Auncients Elders or Priests if you wil of the new Testament should haue as much dignitie and auctoritie as Gods worde doth afford them we desire with all our hartes That our Christian Forefathers eares were not acquainted with the name of Elders it was because the name of Priest in their time soūded according to the etymologie and not according to the corruption of the Papistes otherwise I thinke their eares were as much acquainted with the name of Elders which we vse as with the name of Auncientes and Seniors that you haue newly taken vp not for that they differ in signification from Elders but because you woulde differ from vs. MART. 5. But let vs goe forward We haue heard often and of old time of making of Priestes and of late yeares also of making Ministers but did ye euer here in all England of making Elders Yet by these mens translations it hath bene in England a
phrase of Scripture this thirtie yeare but it must needes be verie straunge that this making of Elders hath not all this while bene practised and knowen no not among them selues in any of their Churches within the realme of Englande To Titus they make the Apostle say thus For this cause left I thee in Creta that thou shouldest ordaine ELDERS in euerie citie c. Againe of Paule and Barnabas When they had ordained Elders by Election in euerie congregration Act. 14. If they had sayed plainely as it is in the Greeke and as our forefathers were wont to speake and the truth is Titus was leâ—t in Creta to ordaine Priestes in euerie citie and Paule and Barnabas made Priestes in euerie Church then the people would haue vnderstoode them they know such speaches of old it had bene their ioy comfort to heare it specified in holy Scriptures Now they are tolde an other thing in suche newnesse of speaches and wordes of Elders to be made in euery citie congregation and yet not one citie nor congregation to haue any Elders in all Englande that we know not what is prophane noueltie of wordes which the Apostle willeth to be auoided if this be not an exceeding profane noueltie FVLK 5. When you haue gotteÌ„ a bable you make more of it than of the towre of London for you haue neuer done playing with it It must needes be a clarkely argument that is drawne from the vulgar speaches of making Priests and making Ministers Those Priests or Ministers that are made among vs are the same Elders that the Scripture in Greeke calleth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and the Bishops letters of orders testifying of their ordination call them by none other name but by the name of Presbyteri which the Scripture vseth which terme though in English you sounde it Priests Elders Auncients Seniors or Ministers which is the common peoples worde it is the same office which is described by the holy ghost Tit. 1. and in other places of Scripture As for the prophane noueltie wherewith this worde Elder is changed we will consider of it in the next section MART. 6. That it is noueltie to all English Christian eares it is euident And it is also profane because they do so English the Greeke worde of ordaining for of the worde Presbyter we will speake more anone as if they should translate Demosthenes or the lawes of Athens concerning their choosing of Magistrates which was by giuing voices with lifting vp their handes So do they force this worde here to induce the peoples election and yet in their Churches in England the people elect not ministers but their Bishop Whereas the holy Scripture saith they ordained to the people and what soeuer force the word hath it is here spoken of the Apostles and pertaineth not to the people and therefore in the place to Titus it is another worde which cannot be forced further than to ordaine and appoint And they might know if malice and Heresic would suffer them to see and confesse it that the holy Scriptures and fathers and Ecclesiasticall custome hath drawen this and the like words from their profane and common signification to a more peculiar and Ecclesiasticall speach as Episcopus an ouerseer in Tulite is a Bishop in the new Testament FVLK 6. The name Elders vsed in our translation is neither more nouell to English eares nor more prophane to godly eares than the name Auncients which your translation vseth And yet I thinke the Apostle 1. Tim. 6. spake not of noueltie to English eares but of that which was newe to the eares of the Churche of God But the worde Elders I weene muste be prophane because we English the Greeke worde of ordeining as if wee should translate Demosthenes or the Lawes of Athens concerning the choosing of Magistrates Doth not this cauill redounde more against the holy Ghost to accuse his stile of prophanenesse which vseth the same wordes for the ordeining of Priestes that Demosthenes or the lawes of AtheÌ„s might vse for choosing of their Magistrates But this worde we enforce you say to enduce the peoples election and yet the Bishop not the people elect our ministers We meane not to enforce any other election than the worde doth signifie Neyther doth our Bishops if they doe well ordeine any Ministers or Priestes without the Testimonie of the people or at leastwise of such as be of moste credite where they are knowne Where you vrge the pronowne 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to them as though the people gaue no consent nor testimonie it is more than ridiculous and beside that contrarie to the practise of the primitiue Churche for many hundreth yeares after the Apostles as also that you would inforce vpon the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vsed by S. Paule Tit. 1. as though that worde of constitution did exclude election That the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by the Fathers of the Church since the Apostles hath bene drawne to other signification than it had before it is no reason to teach vs howe it was vsed by the Apostles Election is an indifferent thing the election of Bishops Elders or Priestes is an holy thing the holynesse whereof is not included in the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but in the holy institution of Christ and authoritie by appointment deliuered by imposition of the handes of the Eldership MART. 7. And coÌ„cerning 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which we now speake of S. Hierom telleth them in c. 58. Esai that it signifieth Clericorum ordinationem that is giuing of holy orders whiche is done not onely by praier of the voice but by imposition of the hande according to S. Paul vnto Timothee Manus citò nemini imposueris Impose or put hands quickly on no man That is be not hastie or easie to giue holy orders Where these great etymologistes that so straine the originall nature of this worde to profane stretching forth the hand in elections may learne an other Ecclesiasticall erymologie thereof as proper and as well deduced of the worde as the other to wit putting forth the hand to giue orders and so they shall finde it is all one with that which the Apostle calleth imposition of hands 1. Tim. 4 2. Tim 1 and consequently for ordaining Elders by election they should haue sayd ordaining or making Priests by imposition of handes as else where S. Paule 1. Tim. 5. and the Actes of the Apostles Act. 6. and 13. do speake in the ordaining of the seuen Deacons and of S. Paul and Barnabas FVLK 7. The testimonie of S. Hierome whom you cite you vnderstand not for speaking there of the extension of the finger which the septuaginta translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and God requireth to be taken away he saith Many of our interpreters do vnderstande it of the ordination of Clerkes which is performed not onely at the imprecation of voice but also at the imposition of
hāds least as we haue laughed at in some men the secrete imprecation of the voyce should ordaine Clerkes being ignorant thereof And so proceedeth to inueigh against the abuse of them that would ordaine Clerkes of their basest officers and seruitours yea at the request of foolish women By which it is manifest that his purpose is not to tell what 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 properly doth signifie but that imposition of handes is required in lawfull ordination which many did vnderstand by the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 although in that place it signified no such matter And therefore you muste seeke further authoritie to proue your Ecclesiasticall etymologie that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth putting foorth of the handes to giue orders The places you quote in the margent out of the titles of Nazianzens sermons are to no purpose although they were in the texte of his Homilies For it appeareth not although by Synecdoche the whole order of making Clerkes were called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that election was excluded where there was ordination by imposition of handes As for that you cite out of Ignatius proueth against you that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 differeth from imposition of hands because it is made a distinct office from 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that signifieth to lay on handes and so 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by your owne author doe differ MART. 8. But they are so profane and secular that they translate the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in all the new Testament as if it had the old profane signification still were indifferent to signifie the auncients of the Iewes the Senatours of Rome the elders of Lacedemonia and the Christian Clergie In so much that they say Paul sent to Ephesus and called the Elders of the Church Act. 20. and yet they were such as had their flockes and cure of soules as foloweth in the same place They make S. Paul speake thus to Timothee Neglect not the gift so they had rather say than grace lest holy orders should be a Sacrament giuen thee with the laying on of the handes of the Eldership or by the authoritie of the Eldership 1. Tim. 4. What is this companie of Eldership Somewhat they woulde say like to the Apostles worde but they will not speake plainly least the worlde might heare out of the Scriptures that Timothee was made Priest or Bishop euen as the vse is in the Catholike Churche at this day Lette the fourth Councell of Carthage speake for bothe partes indifferently and tell vs the Apostles meaning A Prieste when hee taketh his orders the Bishoppe blessing him and holding his hande vppon his head let all the Priestes also that are present holde their handes by the Bishops hand vpon his head So doe our priestes as this daye when a Bishop maketh priests and this is the laying on of the handes of the companie of Priests which S. Paule speaketh of which they translate the companie of the Eldership Onely their former translation of 1562. in this place by what chaunce or consideration we know not let fall out of the penne by the authoritie of Priesthood FVLK 8. We desire not to be more holy in the englishe termes than the holye Ghost was in the Greeke termes Whome if it pleased to vse such a word as is indifferent to signifie the auncients of the Iewes the Senators of Rome the Elders of Lacedemonia and the Christian Cleargie why shoulde we not truely translate it into English But I pray you in good sadnes are we so profane and secular Act. 20. in calling those whome Saint Paule sent for out of Ephesus Elders What shall we saye then of the vulgar Latine text which calleth them Maiores natu as though they obtayned that degree by yeares rather than by any thing else and why doe you so profanely and secularly call them the Auncients of the Church Is there more profanenesse and secularitie in the Englishe worde Elders than in the Latine worde Maiores natu or in your Frenchenglishe terme Auncients Surely you doe nothing but play with the noses of such as be ignorant in the tongues and can perceiue no similitude or difference of these wordes but by the sounde of their eares But nowe for the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vsed by Saint Paule 1. Tim. 4. which we call the Eldershippe or the companye of Elders I haue shewed before howe it is vsed by Saint Luke in his Gospell cap. 22. and Act. 22. You saye we will not speake playnely lest the worlde shoulde heare that Timothie was made Priest or Bishop euen as the vse is in the Catholike Church at this day And then you tell vs out of the Councell of Carthage 4. cap. 3. that all the Priestes present shoulde laye their handes on the heade of him that is ordayned togither with the Bishoppe We knowe it well and it is vsed in the Church of England at this daye Onely the terme of Eldership displeaseth you when we meane thereby the companye of Elders But whereas the translators of the Bible 1562. call it Priesthood eyther by Priesthood they meant the same that we doe by Eldershippe or if they meant by Priesthood the office of Priestes or Elders they were deceiued For 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth a companie of Elders as it is twise vsed by S. Luke and oftentimes by the auncient writers of the Church both Greekes and Latines MART. 9. Otherwise in all their English Bibles all the bells ringe one note as The Elders that rule well are worthye of double honour And Against an Elder receiue no accusation but vnder two or three witnesses 1. Tim. 5. And If any be diseased among you let him call for the Elders of the Church and let them pray ouer him and annoynt him with oyle c. Iacob 5. Wheras Saint Chrysostom out of this place proueth the high dignitie of Priestes in remitting sinnes in his booke entituled Of Priesthood vnlesse they will translate that title also Of Eldershippe Againe they make S. Peter saye thus The Elders which are among you I exhort which am also an Elder feedeye Christes flocke as much as lyeth in you c. 1. Pet 5. FVLK 9. In these three textes you triumphe not a litle because your vulgar Latine text hath the Greeke worde Presbyter The high dignitie of Priestes or Elders in remitting sinnes we acknowledge with Chrysostom in his booke entitled of Priesthood which seing it is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we will neuer translate Eldershippe But we may lawfully wishe that both Chrysostom and other auncient writers had kept that distinction of termes which the Apostles and Euangelists did so precisely obserue In the last text 1. Pet. 5. your vulgar Latine sayth Seniores and Consenior your selues in English seniors and fellow senior What trespasse then haue we committed in saying Elders fellow Elder or an Elder also MART. 10.
heauen c. IstuÌ„ locuÌ„ episcopi presbyteri noÌ„intelligentes c. This place Bishops Priests not vnderstanding take vpon them somewhat of the pride of the Pharizees so that they thinke they may eyther condemne the innocentes or lose the guiltie persons whereas with God not the sentence of the Priests but the life of the persons accused is inquired of Wee read in Leuiticus of the Lepers where they are coÌ„maunded to shewe them selues to the Priestes and if they haue the Leprosie then by the Priest they are made vncleane Not that Priestes make Lepers and vncleane persons but that they may haue knowledge of him that is a Leper and him that is no Leper and may discerne who is cleane or who is vncleane Therefore euen as the Prieste doth there make the Leper cleane or vncleane So here also the Bishop and Prieste doth binde or lose not them that be innocent or guiltie but according to his office when he shall heare the varietie of sinners he knoweth who is to be bound and who is to be loosed But where you saye the people went to diuerse ghostly fathers as before when that extraordinarie penitentiarie Priest was taken away for the adulterie of a Deacoâ— at ConstaÌ„tinople you speake beside the booke to make the ignorant beleeue that the people went to auricular shrift For in Constantinople where this priuie confession was taken away the people were left to their owne consciences At Rome the same time great offenders did open penance neither were there any such diuerse ghostly fathers as you speake of That Chrysostom sayth lib. 3. de sacerdotio we receiue it being so vnderstood as iâ— be not contrary to that I cited euen nowe our of Hie 〈…〉 But what maketh all this against translating Presbyter an Elder MART. 27 Nowe then to conclude this point seeing we haue such a cloud of witnesses as the Apostle speaketh euen from Christes time that testifie not onely for the name but for the very principall functions of externall Priesthood in offering the sucrifice of Christs bodie bloud in remitting sinnes and so forth what a peâ—â—ish malicious and impudent corruption is this for the defacing of the testimonies of the holy scriptures tending therevnto to seeke to scratch aduantage of the â—ord Presbyter and to make it signifie an Elder not a Priest Presbytenum Eldership rather than Priesthoode as if other new fangled companions that would forge an Heresie that there were no Apostles shoulde for that purpose translate it alwaies legates or that there were no Angels should translate it alwaies Messengers that Baptisme were but a Iudaical ceremony should translate it washing which Castalio did much more tolerably in his traÌ„siatioÌ„ than any of these should if he did it only of curiosity folly And if to take away al distinction of clergie laiâ—y the Protestantes should alwayes translate clerum lotte or lotterie as they do translate is for the same purpose parish and heritage might not Beza him selfe controule them saying that the auncient fathers transferred the name clerus to the Colledge of Ecclesiastical Ministers FVLK 27. A cloude of testimonies in deede you haue heaped togither not as the Apostle did to vpholde the certainty of faith but to obscure the light of truth For our traÌ„slation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 an Elder is true cleare plaine without ambiguity Insomuch as the vulgar Latin interpreter who as it semeth was a GreciaÌ„ therfore vseth gladly many Greeke termes doeth yet translate this woâ—d almost twise as ofteÌ„ senior or maior natu as he doth Presbyter wheÌ„ he speaketh of the ministers of the gospel How the ancieÌ„t writers applied vnto theÌ„ improperly the name of sacrificer as vnto the sacrameÌ„t the name of oblation or sacrifice I haue spoken already sufficiently Our translation therefore is nothing lyke your vai 〈…〉 supposall of of new fangled companions which to 〈…〉 Apostles Angels and Baptisme would turne the wordes into Legates Messengers washing Whereas we haue no purpose to denie any office or function of the Churche appointed by Christ but to distinguish in name as his spirite in the Scriptures doth alwaies the sacrificers of the old Testament from the Ministers of the new TestameÌ„t The worde Clerus 1. Pet. 5 which we translate parishe or heritage your selues in your notes of that place confesse to comprehende in signification all Christians whiche you are not able to proue that in S Peters time it was transferred vnto the college of ecclesiasticall ministers as Beza saith it was afterwarde wherefore it is one of your accustomed slauÌ„ders to say we traÌ„slate it so of purpose to take away all distinction of Cleargie and Laitie when al men know that wheresoeuer our Churches are established we retaine the distinction and so thinke it necessarie alwayes MART. 28. But alâ—s the effect of this corruption and heresie concerning Priestes hathe it not wrought within these fewe yeares such contempt of al Priestes that nothing is more odious in our countrey than that name which before was so honourable venerable now is among all men If ministery or Eldership were growen to estimation in steede thereof somwhat they had to say but that is yet more contemptible and especially Elders and Eldership for the Queenes Maiestie and her Counsailours wil permit none in gouernement of anie Churche in Englande and so they haue brought all to nothing else but profane laiâ—ie And no maruel of these horrible inconueniences for as the Sacrifice and Priesthoode goe togither and therfore were both honourable togither so when they had according to Daniels prophecie abolished the daily sacrifice out of the churche what remained but the contempt of Priestes and Cleargie and their offices so farre foorth that for the holy Sacrifice sake Priestes are called in great despite Massing Priestes of them that litle consider or lesse care what notable holy learned fathers of all ages since Christes time this their reproch toucheth and concerneth as by the testimonies before alleaged is manifest and whereof the Reader may see a peculiar Chapter in the late Apologie of the English Seminaries FVLK 28. A meruaylous corruption for vs to cal them Elders whom you in your translation call Auncients and the vulgar Latine before vs both called Seniores But what is come to passe I pray you by this wonderfull corruption The name of Popish Priestes is so contemptible that nothing is more odious in England And good cause why both for their blasphemie against God and traiterous practises against the honourable state of the realme and our most gratious Queene But Elders and Eldership you weene is more contemptible because the Queenes Maiestie her Counsailors will permit none in gouernment of any Churches in England and so they haue brought all to nothing else but prophane Laitie This trayterous slaunder of yours is as true as all the rest For although the Queenes Maiestie and the Counsaile do not
their doctrine But what is their prastise in the regiment of their Churche cleane contrarie For in the order of the communion booke where it is appointed what the Minister shall do it is indifferently said Then shall the Prieste do or say this and that and Then shal the Minister c. Whereby it is euident that they make Priest a proper and peculiar calling applied to their Ministers and so their practise is contrarie to their teaching and doctrine FVLK 7. I haue satisfied your desire before if you list to knowe our translation must be as neere as it can to expresse the true signification of the originall words so it is in that place of the Acts. 14. v. 23. which being graunted by them that denie the necessitie of â—at forme of election to continue alwaies giueth no more aduauntage to the aduersaries than they woulde take out of the signification of the Greeke word how soeuer it were translated Your example of Maister Whitakers denying the name of Prieste to be applied to the ministers of the Gospel to proue that wee must mainteine our Ecclesiasticall state how soeuer we translate is very fonde and ridiculous as also the contradiction that you would make betweene him and the seruice booke touching the name of Prieste there vsed and allowed Maister Whitakers writing in Latine speaketh of the Latine terme Sacerdos the Communion booke of the English worde Priest is not this a goodly net for a foole to daunce naked in and thinke that no body can see him MART. 8. Nowe concerning imposition or laying on of handes in making their Ministers which the Puritans also are forced to allow by other wordes of Scripture howsoeuer they dispute and iangle againste 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 none of them all make more of it than of the like Iudaicall ceremonie in the olde Law not acknowledging that there is any grace giuen withall though the Apostle say there is in expresse termes but they will aunswer this text as they are wont with a fauourable translation turning grace into gift As when the Apostle saith thus Neglect not THE GRACE that is in thee which is giuen thee by prophecie with impositioÌ„ of the hands of Priesthood they translate Neglect not the GIFT and Beza most impudently for by prophecie translateth to prophecie making that onely to be this gift and withall adding this goodly exposition that he had the gift of prophecie or preaching before and now by imposition of hands was chosen onely to execute that function But because it might be obiected that the Apostle sayth Which was giuen thee with the imposition of handes or as he speaketh in an other place by imposition of handes making this imposition of handes an instrumentall cause of giuing this grace he sayth that it did onely confirme the grace or gift before giuen FVLK 8. Though we finde that by or with imposition of handes many rare and extraordinary giftes of prophecie of tongues and such like were giuen in the Apostles time yet we finde no where that grace is ordinarily giuen by that ceremonie vsed alwayes in the Church for ordination of the ministers therof But whether there be or not our translation of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 into gift is true and proper to the worde For albeit the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be taken not onely for the fauour of God but also for his gracious giftes yet 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is neuer taken in the Scripture but for a free gift or a gift of his grace That Beza referreth the preposition 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the ende of the gifte he hath the nature of the worde to beare him out which may well abide that sense and yet he doth not reiect the other common interpretation by prophecie that by appoyntment of the holye Ghost vttered by some of the Prophets But where you wrangle about the gift of prophecie as though he were vtterly voyde thereof before he receyued imposition of handes I knowe not what you meane Woulde you haue vs thinke that he was ordayned Prieste or Elder or to anye office of the Church without competent giftes meete to discharge his office That the gifte of prophecie as well as of speakinge with tongues might be giuen by and with imposition of hands Beza doubteth not But it is out of doubte that to an office none was chosen or admitted by the Apostle and the reste of the Presbyterie of Ephesus but such as had sufficient giftes to answere that office MART. 9. Thus it is euident that though the Apostle speake neuer so plaine for the dignitie of holy Orders that it giueth grace and consequently is a Sacrament they peruert all to the contrarie making it a bare ceremonie suppressing the worde grace which is much more significant to expresse the Greeke worde than gifte is because it is not euery gifte but a gratious gifte or a gifte proceeding of maruelous and mere grace At when it is saide To you it is giuen not onely to beleeue but also to suffer for him The Greeke worde signifieth this much To you this grace is giuen c. So when God gaue vnto S. Paule all that sayled with him this Greeke worde is vsed because it was a great grace or gratious gifte giuen vnto him When S. Paule pardoned the incestuous person before due time it is expressed by this worde because it was a grace as Theodorete calleth it giuen vnto him And therefore also the almes of the Corinthians 1. Cor. 16. v. 3. are called their grace which the Protestants translate liberalitie neglecting altogither the true force and signification of the Greeke wordes FVLK 9. Here is no euidence at al that the order of Priesthoode is a Sacrament or gyueth grace but that God by the ceremonie of laying on of handes did giue wonderfull and extraordinarie giftes of tongues and prophecying in the beginning and firste planting of the Churche But that grace should alwayes follow that ceremonie there is no proofe to bee made out of the holie Scriptures And experience sheweth that hee which was voide of giftes beefore hee was ordered Priest is as verye an asse and Dogbolte as hee was beefore for anye encrease of grace or gratious giftes althoughe hee haue authoritie committed vnto hym if hee bee ordained in the Church though vnworthily with great sinne both of him that ordaineth and of him that is ordained But wee suppresse the worde grace you say bicause charisma signifieth at least a gratious gift See how the bare sounde of tearmes delighteth you that you mighte therein seeke a shadowe for your singlesolde sacrament of popishe orders The worde signifieth a free or gratious gifte and so will euerie man vnderstande it whiche knoweth that it is giuen by God As also in all places where mention is made of Gods giftes wee must vnderstande that it proceedeth freely from him as a token of his fauoure and grace But that the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉
ascribed to Ignatius which heere I wil not dispute there is nothing sayde in this that you cite of the Bishops preeminence aboue the king but wee acknowledge it to be true of y e meanest priest of Gods Church in matters properly belonging to his office which yet doth not exempt him from subiection to his prince but that in causes ecclsiasticall also he is to be commanded by his prince to doe his duetie and to be punished by him if he doe otherwise MART. 24. But in the former sentence of S. Peter though they haue altered their translation about the kings headshippe yet there is one corruption remaining still in these words Submit your selues VNTO AL MANER ORDINANCE OF MAN Whereas in the Greeke it is worde for worde as in the olde vulgar Latine translation omni humanae creaturae and as we haue translated to euerie humane creature meaning temporall Princes Magistrates as is plaine by the exemplification immediatly following of king and dukes and other sent or appointed by him But they in fauour of their temporall statutes actes of Parliament Proclamations and Iniunctions made against the Catholike religion doe translate all with one consent Submit vour selues to all maner ordinance of man Doth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifie ordinance or is it all one to be obedient to euery one of our Princes and to all maner ordinance of the saide Princes FVLK 24. The worde ordinance you doe violently drawe to euerie statute proclamation or iniunction which is vnderstood of the ordinance or appointment of magistrates in what forme soeuer they be created or at the worst cannot be referred but onely to such decrees as are not contrarie to the worde of God The worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we knowe signifieth a creature or creation which speeches being not vsuall in our English tongue to signifie magistrates our interpretors haue expressed the same by the worde ordinance You your selues translate that which is in Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Latine Creaturae mark 16. of the creation and in the same sense doe our translators vse the worde of ordinance MART. 25. A strange case and much to bee considered how they wring and wrest the holy scriptures this way and that way and euery way to serue their hereticall proceedinges For when the question is of due obedience to Ecclesiasticall canons and decrees of the Church and generall Councels where the holy Ghost by Christes promise is assistant and whereof it is saide if he heare not the Church let him be vnto thee as an heathen and Publicane and He that heareth you heareth me he that despiseth you despiseth mee there they cry out aloude odiously terme all such ordinances mens traditions and commaundementes of men and most despitefully contemne and condemne them But heere for obedience vnto temporall edictes and Parliament statutes daily enacted in fauour of their schisme and heresies they once malitiously forged and still wickedly retaine without alteration a text of their owne making the Apostle to commaunde submission vnto all manner ordinance of man whereof hath ensued the false crime of treason and cruell death for the same vpon those innocent men and glorious martyrs that chose to obey God and his Churches holy ordinances rather then mans statutes and lawes directly against the same FVLK 25. It is no strange case for an heretike and a raytor that hath solde his tongue to vtter slaunders against the Church of God and the christian magistrate protector of the same to deuise and surmise that which neuer was intended neuer was practised As y t against the godly and laweful decrees of the Church we should translate mens traditions commaundementes of men and to the maintenance of all temporall lawes be they neuer so wicked we should translate ordināce in steede of creature As for the crime of treason and iust execution of them that haue suffered of your viperous brood I referre to the try all of the lawes and iudgements that haue passed vpon them as no matter meete for mee to dispute of onely this all good subiectes knowe yea all the worlde may knowe that they which take part with the pope our princes open and professed enemie not in matters of religion onely but in cases concerning her crowne and dignitie her Realmes and Dominions can not beare dutiful obedient hearts to her maiesty Whose clemencie hitherto hath spared them that acknowledge her princely authoritie although in all other pointes of poperie they continue as obstinate as euer they were CHAP. XVI Hereticall translation against the Sacrament of Matrimonie BVT as they are iniurious translatours to the sacred order of Priesthoode so a man woulde thinke they should be very friendly to the sacramēt of Matrimonie For they would seeme to make more of Matrimonie then we do making it equall at the least with virginitie Yet the trueth is we make it or rather the Church of God esteemeth it as a holy sacrament they do not as giuing grace to the maried persons to liue together in loue concorde and fidelitie they acknowledge no such thing So that Matrimonie with them is highly esteemed in respect of the flesh or to say the best onely for a ciuill contract as it is among Iewes and Pagans but as it is peculiar to Christians and as S. Augustin◠sayth in the sanctification also and holinesse of a Sacrament they make no account of it but flatly denie it FVLK 1. VE make no more of matrimonie than the holy scripture doeth teach vs neither doe wee in all respectes make it equall with virginitie howe so euer you doe slander vs. But you so make it an holy sacrament that you thinke the holy order of priesthoode is prophaned by it Wee acknowledge that God giueth grace to them that bee faithfull to liue in loue concorde and fidelitie euen as he did to the fathers of the olde testament liuing in the same honorable estate which prooueth that matrimonie is no sacrament of the newe testament although it be an holie ordinance for Gods children to liue in and in it is contained a holy secret or mysterie of the spirituall coniunction of Christ and his church It is therefore nothing else but a diuelish slander to say that wee esteeme it but in respect of the flesh or for a ciuill contract MART. 2. And to this purpose they translate in the epistle to the Ephesians 5. Where the Apostle speaketh of matrimonie This is a great secret Whereas the Latine Church and all the Doctors thereof haue euer read This is a great Sacrament the Greeke Church and all the fathers thereof This is a great mysterie because that which is in Greeke mysterie is in Latine Sacrament and contrariwise the wordes in both tongue◠being equiualent so that if one be taken in the large signification the other also as Apoc. 17. I will shewe thee the sacrament of the woman And I will shewe thee the mysterie of the woman And so in
wee examine otherwise by circumstance of the text and by the Churches and Doctors interpretation and we finde that heere it is taken for a Sacrament in that sense as we say seuen Sacramentes not so in the other places FVLK 5. No reasonable man can charge vs to be false translators when we turne the Greeke worde into that which it doth generally properly and alwaies signifie And for al your bragging of syncere translating if you should translate Tob. 12. I am perswaded you would not say it is a good thing to hide the kinges sacrament Yet is the Latine worde in that place Sacramentum and the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 But it is sufficient for you to haue a shadow of somthing to find your selfe occupied rather than you would be saying of nothing MART. 6. As when we reade this name Iesus in Scripture common to our Sauiour and to other men we translate it alwaies alike Iesus but when it is IESVS Christ when some other Iesus we knowe by other circumstances Likewise presuppose Baptisme in the Scripture were called a sacrament yet the Protestantes themselues would not nor could thereby conclude that it were one of their two Sacraments Yet I trow they would not auoyde to translate it by the worde sacrament if they found it so called euen so wee finding Matrimonie so called do so translate it neither concluding thereby that it is one of the Seuen nor yet suppressing the name which no doubt gaue some occasion to the Church and the holy doctors to esteem it as one of the Seuen They contrariwise as though it were neuer so called suppresse the name altogether calling it a secrete to put it out of all question that it is no Sacrament which they would not haue done if the Scripture had sayde of Baptisme or the Eucharist This is a great Sacrament So partiall they are to their owne opinions FVLK 6. Except you thought you had to doe with verie ignorant persons or else esteemed too much of your lately professed diuinitie you would neuer comber the reader with such childish trifles of the name of Iesus of the bare name of sacrament which could not proue baptisme or the Lords supper to be sacramentes c. and what we would do if wee found them so called c. I haue alreadie told you what we haue done where not onely the sacraments but all other pretious Iewels of Christs church committed to the dispensation of his ministers are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and translated secretes without any abasement of the dignitie of them or with out any intent to suppresse any of the honor and reuerence which is due vnto them Wherefore vsing y e word secret in this text wee had no purpose to derogate any thing from the worthines of matrimonie much lesse from the spiritual mysterie which the Apostle offereth to be considered by it in Christ his Church CHAP. 17. Hereticall translations against the blessed Sacrament and Sacrifice and Altar NOW let vs see concerning the Eucharist which they allow for a Sacrament how they handle the matter to the disgracing and defacing of the same also They take away the operation and efficacie of Christes blessing pronounced vpon the bread and wine making it onely a thankesgiuing to God and to this purpose they translate more gladly thanks-giuing then blessing as Mat. 26. the Greeke wordes being two the one signifying properly to blesse the other to giue thanks they translate both thus when he had giuen thanks Likewise Marc. 14. in the Bible printed 1562. And when they translate it blessing they meane nothing else but giuing thankes as Beza telleth vs in his Annotations Mat. 26. ver 26. Wee reply and by most manifest Scripture prooue vnto them that the former Greeke woorde doeth not signifie thankes giuing properly but blessing and a blessing of creatures to the operation of some great effect in them as when Christ tooke the fiue loaues and two fishes to multiply them he blessed them Luc. 9. What say they to this thinke you Doth not the Greeke worde here plainly signifie blessing of creatures No saith Beza no doubt but here also it signifieth giuing thankes Howe Beza he addeth Not as though Christ had giuen thankes to the bread for that were too absurd but wee must mollifie this interpretation thus that he gaue thankes to God the father for the loaues and the fishes Is not this a notable exposition of these wordes benedixit eis FVLK 1 THE Sacrament of the bodie bloud of Christ beeing a matter of some great weight controuersie between vs you might not omit but note our false translations against it But because wee haue dealt so syncerely as malice hath nothing to blame therein you must fayne a quarrell and forge a controuersie where none is betweene vs namely that we take away Christes blessing pronounced vpon the bread and wine making it onely a thanksgiuing vnto God which is a false and impudent slander as in that which followeth concerning this matter most plainly shall appeare euen by testimonie of him whom you doe most slaunder in this case But let vs see what fault is in our translation Math. 26. and Ma◠14. two of our translations for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 say when he had giuen thankes To this I answere that Beza telleth you that in seuen Greeke copies the word is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth giuing of thankes without controuersie as also 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doth but not onely so expressing rather the Hebrue worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth both to blesse and to giue thankes But seeing Saint Luke and S. Paul reporting the institution of the supper doe vse the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth giuing of thankes wee count them the best interpretors of the other two Euangelists which plainly teache vs that by blessing they meane giuing of thankes or that the Greeke worde doeth here signifie giuing of thankes as in manie other places The place Luke 9. where Christ blessed the loaues is also interpreted by S. Iohn who reporting the same miracle as Beza sheweth vseth the word which signifieth only thankes giuing but because 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is in Luke vsed as a verbe transitiue which cannot signifie thanks giuing or prayer made to the creatures wee must vnderstand that hee blessed the loaues that is he gaue thankes to God for them and with all prayed that so small a quantitie of bread and fish might feede so great a multitude and that this whole feast might be referred to the glorie of God This is Bezaes interpretation which because it was too long for your quarrell you cut off the better part of it and like a grinning hypocrite scoffe at a piece as though it were the whole exposition of these words henedixit eis he blessed them MART. 2. Wee aske him in the like cases when God blessed Adam and Eue Gen. 1. 9. Noe and his
Apostles which it is sufficient that it is receiued of the doctrine of the Apostles Ruffinus in deede expositione in symbolum sayeth it was an opinion receiued from the elders that the Apostles before their dispersion made this briefe forme of beliefe which is called their Creede And I acknowledge the opinion hath some probabilitie but that it is to be beleeued of necessitie of saluation neither Ruffinus sayeth nor if he did were he able to prooue it Ambrose Ep. 81. Syricio to prooue that Marie in the birth of Christ was a virgine sayeth Credatur symbolo Apostòlorum quod Ecclesia Romana iteratum semper custodit seruat Let credit bee giuen to the Apostles Creede which being repeted often the Church of Rome doth alwayes keepe and obserue That this Creede is called the Apostles symbole or Creede it may well be because it containeth the summe of the Apostles doctrine although it had not beene compiled by them The testimonie of Augustine which you quote Serm. 118. De tempore must needes be some yonger mans because he repeteth the verie wordes of Ruffinus which Augustine liuing almost in his time woulde not repete as his owne You might as well and more for your purpose haue quoted Serm. 115. De tempore where euery Apostle maketh an Article which is the absurde opinion of the late Papistes but neuer was credited by Augustine himselfe howsoeuer these sermons haue gotten vnder the shadow of his name To conclude as some of the auncient fathers thinke the Creede was of the Apostles making so none of them affirmeth that it is damnable to doubt thereof so a man doubt not of the doctrine contained therein whereof the holy ghost is author as it is proued by the holie scriptures whether the Apostles or their successours did gather this short summe or forme of beliefe which we call the Apostles Creede For the obseruation of the Easter day which is the seconde point wherein you dare Master Charke I dare affirme that seeing it is not commaunded in the scripture the obseruation thereof is not necessarie to saluation That Eusebius calleth it an Apostolike tradition it is not materiall seeing that verie contention which he reporteth was about the obseruation of Easter according to the Apostolike tradition by the immediate successors of the Apostles Anicetus and Polycarpus doe plainly testifie what credit is to bee giuen to the traditions of the Apostles without the warrant of the Apostles writings Euseb. lib. 5. Cap. 26. For while Anicetus pretendeth the tradition of S. Peter and Polycarpus S. Iohn and neither would yeelde to other they teache vs what to esteeme of traditions apostolical not contained in the holy scriptures Namely that in these dayes there can bee no certeintie of them when they which might see and heare the Apostles themselues could not agree about them Last of all which you make the greatest matter the perpetuall virginitie of the mother of Christ after his birth although for my part I do beleeue it and wish all men so to doe yet dare I affirme that it is not damnable not to beleeue it except it can be prooued that the scripture hath taught it But you obiect against mee first the condemnation of Heluidius testified by Sozomenus Whereto I aunswere that he was iustly condemned not because he beleeued not but because he did obstinately denie it troubled the peace of the church about an vnnecessary question But you aske vs if wee remember not the solemne curse for this matter of so many holy bishops recorded and confirmed by S. Ambrose Ep. 81. 79. It seemeth you remember it not your selfe for that curse contained in the ende of the Ep. 81. was against them that like Manichees denyed that our Sauiour Christ tooke flesh of a virgine And Ep. 79. he reprooueth them which did contende that the virgine Marie had more sonnes than our Sauiour Christ which to affirme is a great errour and conuinced by the authoritie of the scripture seeing as Ambrose well noteth our Sauiour Christ committed his mother to Iohn the Euangelist which had not beene needefull if shee had naturall sonnes of her owne which might take care of her But you will stoppe our mouthes if you can as you say with these wordes of Saint Augustine Integra fide credendum est c. Wee must beleeue with a sounde faith blessed Marie the mother of Christ to haue conceiued in virginitie to haue brought foorth her sonne in virginitie and to haue remained a virgine after her childbirth neither must wee yeeld to the blasphemie of Heluidius Your author goeth on and telleth what that was Qui dixis fuit virgo ante partum non virgo post partum Who sayd shee was a virgine before her child-birth shee was no virgine after her childbirth But where shall wee finde this saying in Saint Augustine Your quotation directeth vs to Augustine in Encherid Cap. 34. where in deede some mention is of Maries virginitie namely that she conceiued in virginitie but nothing of Heluidius or his heresie Wherefore it secmeth that out of Canisius or some other mans collection your common places of the doctors sayings are borowed and not taken out of your owne reading Therefore howsoeuer you haue mistaken the matter the saying you alledge is in the bastarde booke De dogmatibus Ecclesiasticis Cap. 69. which may as easily be knowen from Augustines writing as a goose from a swanne And yet if it were of as good authoritie as Augustines owne writing it were not sufficient to stop our mouth when wee heare that wee are slaundered For wee dare not say with Heluidius which is the blasphemie noted by that writer that the virgine Marie was no virgine after her childbirth although wee say that it is no article of faith necessarie to saluation except it haue demonstration out of the holy scriptures neither doth your author say it is blasphemie to doubt of it but to denye it although for my part I do neither denie it nor doubt of it but beleeue it as I do manie other truethes not expressed in the scripture but yet not as articles of Christian faith necessarie to saluation I will conclude with a saying of Saint Ierome and stoppe your mouth if I can which concerning this verie question in controuersie against Heluidius to shewe what a man is bound to beleeue vpon necessitie of saluation euen that which is contained in the scriptures and that which is not coÌ„teined that he is not bound vpon losse thereof to beleeue thus writeth Sed vt haec quae scripta sunt non negaâ—ius ita â—a quae non sunt scripta renuimus Natum Dâ—â—â— esâ—e de virgine credimus quia legimus Mariam â—â—psisse post partum non credimus quia non legimus But as wee do not deny those things that are written so we do refuse those things that are not written That God was borne of a virgin wee beleeue because we haue read it that Marie vsed marriage after her
¶ A DEFENSE of the sincere and true Translations of the holie Scriptures into the English tong against the manifolde cauils friuolous quarels and impudent slaunders of GREGORIE MARTIN one of the readers of Popish diuinitie in the trayterous Seminarie of Rhemes By WILLIAM FVLKE D. in Diuinitie and M. of Pembroke haule in Cambridge Wherevnto is added a briefe confutation of all such quarrels cauils as haue bene of late vttered by diuerse Papistes in their English Pamphlets against the writings of the saide WILLIAM FVLKE AT LONDON Imprinted by Henrie Bynneman Anno. 1583. Cum gratia Priuilegio To the moste high and mightie Princesse Elizabeth by the grace of God Queene of England Fraunce and Irelande defender of the fayth c. AMONG THE inestimable benefits wherwith almightie God hath woonderfully blessed this your Maiesties most honourable and prosperous gouernement it is not to be numbred among the least that vnder your most gratious and Christian protection the people of your Highnes dominions haue enioyed the most necessarie and comfortable reading of the holy Scriptures in their mother tongue and natiue language Which exercise although it hath of long time by the aduersaries of Him that willeth the Scriptures to be searched especially those of our nation beene accompted little better than an haereticall practise And treatises haue bene written praetending to shew great inconvenience of hauing the holie Scriptures in the vulgar tongue Yet now at length perceiuing they can not preuaile to bring in that darâ—knesse and ignorance of Gods most sacred word and wil therin contained wherby their blind deuotioÌ„ the daughter of ignorance as they them selues professe was wont to make them rulers of the world they also at the last are become Translators of the Newe Testament into English In which that I speak nothing of their insincere purpose in leauing the pure fountaine of the original veritie to folow the croked streame of their barbarous vulgar Latin translatioÌ„ which beside al other manifeste corruptions is founde defectiue in more than an hundred places as your Maiestie according to the excellet knowledge in both the tongs wherwith God hath blessed you is verie well able to iudge And to omit euen the same Booke of their translation pestred with so many annotations both false and vnduetifull by which vnder colour of the authoritie of holie Scriptures they seeke to infecte the mindes of the credulous readers with haeretical and superstitious opinions and to alienate their harts from yelding due obedience to your Maiestie and your most Christian lawes concerning true Religion established And that I may passe ouer the verie Text of their translation obscured without anie necessarie or iust cause with suche a multitude of so strange and vnusuall termes as to the ignorant are no lesse difficult to vnderstande than the Latine or Greeke it self Yet is it not meete to be concealed that they which neither truely nor praecisely haue translated their owne vulgare Latin and only Authenticall text haue neuerthelesse bene bolde to set forth a seuerall Treatise in which most slanderously and vniustly they accuse all our English translations of the Bible not of small imperfections and ouersightes committed through ignorance or negligence but of no lesse than most foule dealing in partiall false translations wilfull and haereticall corruptions Against which most leude and vntrue accusation though easie to be iudged of by such as be learned in the tongues yet daungerous to disquiet the conscience of them that be ignorant in the same I haue written a short and necessarie Defense Which although not labored in words yet in matter I hope sufficient to auoide all the aduersaries cauilles I am most humbly to craue pardon that I may be bolde to dedicate vnto your most excellent Maiestie that vnder whose high Christian authoritie your people haue so many yeares enioyd the reading of the holie bookes of GOD in their natiue language to the euerlasting benefit of many thousand soules Vnder the same your most gratious roial protection they may reade also the Defense of the syncere and faithfull translation of those Bookes to the quieting of their consciences and the confusion of the aduersaries of Gods truth and holie religion By which they may be stirred vp more and more in all duetifull obedience not only to be thankeful vnto your Maiestie as it becommeth them but also to continewe their most earnest and hartie prayers to almightie God for this your moste godlie and happie regiment ouer them for many yeares forwarde to be prolonged The God of glorie which hitherto hath aduaunced your Maiesties throne aboue all Princes of this age in true honour and glorie vouchsafe to preserue the same with his dailie blessing to the perfection of that glorious reparation of his Church which you haue most happily taken in hande to the euerlasting praise of his mercie and the endelesse felicity of your Maiestie Your Maiesties most humble subiect and most bounden daylie orator WILLIAM FVLKE THE PREFACE CONTEINING FIVE SVNDRIE ABVSES or corruptions of holy Scriptures common to all Heretikes and agreeing specially to these of our time with many other necessarie aduertisements to the reader MARTIN AS it hath bene alwaies the fashion of Heretikes to pretend Scriptures for shew of their cause so hath it bene also their custome and propertie to abuse the saide Scriptures many waies in fauour of their errours FVLKE WHETHER these fiue abuses haue bene common to all heretikes whether it hath bene the fashion of all heretikes to pretende Scriptures for shewe of their cause though I will spare nowe to enquire of as a thing wherin learned men at the first sight may espie the great skil that Martin pretendeth to haue in discerning of heretikes and heresies yet will I shew by the grace of God that none of these fiue abuses are committed by vs or our Catholike translations that the popish heretikes are in some sort or other guiltie of them all MART. 1. One way is to denie whole bookes thereof or partes of bookes when they are euidently against them So did for example Ebion all S. Paules epistles Manicheus the Actes of the Apostles Alogiani S. Iohns Gospell Marcion many peeces of S. Lukes Gospell and so did both these and other heretikes in other bookes denying and allowing what they liste as is euident by S. Irenaeus S. Epiphanius S. Augustine and all antiquitie FVLK 1. First we denie no one booke of the Canonicall scripture that hath bene so receaued of the Catholike church for the space of 300. yeares more as it hath bene often proued out of Eusebius S. Ierome and other ancient authorities but the Papists in aduauncing Apocryphall bookes to be of equall credite with the Canonicall Scriptures do in effect deny theÌ„ all Besides that to adde vnto the word of God is as great a fault as to take away from it the one being forbidden vnder as heauie a curse as the other Those blasphemies of
Pighius Eccius the one calling the holy Scripture a nose of waxe and a dumbe iudge the other terming the Gospel written to be a blacke Gospell and an ynkie Diuinitie and that of Hosius acknowleging none other expresse word of God but onely this one worde Ama or dilige loue thou what other thing do they import but a shamelesse deniall of all bookes of the holy Scripture in deede how soeuer in worde they will seeme to admitte them MART. 2. An other way is to call into question at the least and make some doubt of the authoritie of certaine bookes of holy scriptures therby to diminish their credite so did Manicheus affirme of the whole new Testamēt that it was not writtē by the Apostles and peculiarly of S. Matthewes Gospell that it was some other mās vnder his name therfore not of such credit but that it might in some part be refused So did Marcion the Ariās deny the epistle to the Hebrues to be S. Paules Epiph. li. 2. haer 69. Euseb. li. 4. hist. c. 27 Alogiani the Apocalypse to be S. Iohns the Euāgelist Epiph. August in haer Alogianorii FVLK 2. We neither doubt of the authoritie of anie certaine booke of the holy Scriptures neither cal we any of them into question but with due reuerence do acknowledge thē all euery one to be of equall credit authority as being al inspired of god giuē to the church for the building vp thereof in truth and for the auoiding of fables heresies But the Papists arrogating to their Pope authoritie to allowe or refuse any booke of holy Scripture affirming that no Scripture hath authoritie but as it is approued by their church do bring al bookes of the holy Scripture into doubting vncertaintie with such as wil depend vpō their Pope popish churches authoritie which they affirme to be aboue the holy Scriptures saying they might as wel receaue the gospel of Nicodemus as of S. Marke by the same authoritie reiect the Gospell of S. Matthew as they haue done the Gospel of S. Bartholomew These blasphemous assertions although some of them would couler or mitigate with gentle interpretations yet their is no reasonable man but seeth into what discredite and vncertaintie they must needes bring the authoritie of the Canonicall bookes of holy Scripture with the simple and ignorant MART. 3. An other way is to expound the Scriptures after their owne priuate conceite and phantasie not according to the approued sense of the holy auncient fathers and Catholike Church so did Theodorus Mopsuestites Act. Synod 5. affirme of all the bookes of the Prophets and of the Psalmes that they spake not euidently of Christ but that the auncient fathers did voluntarily draw those sayings vnto Christ which were spoken of other matters so did all heretikes that would seeme to ground their heresies vpon Scriptures and to auouch them by Scriptures expounded according to their owne sense and imagination FVLK 3. We expound not the Scriptures after our owne priuate conceite and fantasie but as neere as God giueth vs grace according to the plaine and natural sense of the same agreable vnto the rule or proportiō of faith which bene approued by the auncient fathers and Catholike church of Christ in al matters necessarie to eternall saluation Not bringing a newe and straunge sense which is without the Scriptures to seeke confirmation thereof in the Scriptures as the manner of heretikes is rightly noted by Clemens but out of the Scriptures thēselues seeke we the exposition of such obscure places as we find in them being perswaded with S. Augustine that nothing in a manner is founde out of those obscure and darke places which may not be found to be most plaine ly spoken in other places And as for the approued sense of the holy auncient Fathers and Catholike Church of the eldest and purest times if the Papists durst stand vnto it for the deciding of many of the most waightie controuersies that are betweene vs there is no doubte but they should soone and easily be determined as hath bene shewed in diuerse and many treatises written against them In which if any thing bee brought so plainely expounding the Scripture against their popish heresies as nothing can be more expresse nor cleare then they are driuen to seeke newe and monstrous expositions of those Fathers interpretations or else they answere they are but those Fathers priuate expositions appealing to the Catholike churches interpretation which is nothing else but their owne priuate conceipte and fansie hauing no recorde to proue that Catholike Churches interpretation but the present hereticall opinions of this late degenerated Antichristian congregation And whē they haue discoursed neuer so much of the Catholike churches interpretation they reduce and submitte all mens iudgements to the determinatiō of their Councels the decrees of the Councels to the approbation of their Pope which as he is oftentimes a wicked man of life so is he ignorant and vnlearned in the Scriptures to whose most priuate cēsure the holy Scriptures themselues and al sense and exposition of them is made subiect vnder colour that Christ praying for Peter that his faith should not fayle in temptation gaue all Popes suche a prerogatiue that they could not erre in faith though they were wicked of life voyde of learning ignorant in the Scriptures destitute of the spirite of God as is proued moste inuincibly by example of diuerse Popes that haue bene heretikes and mainteyners of such errours as are not now in controuersie betweene vs least they should say we begge the principle but of the secte of the Arrians Monothelites Eutychians Saduces and such other MART. 4. An other way is to alter the very originall text of the holy Scripture by adding taking away or changing it here and there for their purpose So did the Arians in sundry places and the Nestorians in the first epistle of S. Iohn and especially Marcion who was therefore called Mus Ponticus the mouse of Pontus because he had gnawen as it were certaine places with his corruptions whereof some are sayd to remaine in the Greeke text vntill this day FVLK 4. The originall text of the holie Scripture we alter not either by adding taking away or changing of any letter or syllable for any priuate purpose which were not only a thing most wicked and sacrilegious but also vaine and impossible For seeing not only so many auncient coppies of the original text are extant in diuers places of the worlde which we can not if we woulde corrupt and that the same are multiplied by printing into so many thousande examples wee shoulde bee rather madde than foolishe if we did but once attempt such a matter for maintenaunce of any of our opinions As also it is incredible that Marcion the mouse of Pontus coulde corrupt all the Greeke coppies in the world as Lindanus of whome you borrowed that conceite imagineth in those places in which he
is charged by Tertullian For Marcions heresie was not so generally receiued by the Greeke Churche that all men would yeeld vnto him neither was Tertullian so souÌ„d of iudgement in the Latine Church that whatsoeuer he iudged to be a corruption in Marcion must of necessity be so taken But if adding and detracting from the Scripture be proper notes of heretikes who can purge Stephen Gardiner Gregorie Martine The one for adding vnto a the verse of the Psalme this pronowne se him selfe to proue the carnall presens citing it thus Escam se dedit timentibus eum He gaue himselfe to be meate to them that feare him whereas the words of the Prophet according to the Hebrue Greeke and Latine are no more but Escam dedit He hath giuen meat c. The other in his fond booke of schisme citing this text out of 1. Cor. 10. as many Papistes doe against the certaintie of Faith Qui stat videat ne cadat He that standeth let him take heede he fall not Whereas not only the truth of the Greeke but euen the vulgar Latin translation hath Qui se existimat stare He that thinketh or supposeth that he standeth let him take heede that he fall not But of such additions and detractions vsed by the Romishe rattes farre worse than the myse of Pontus we shall haue more occasion to speake hereafter MART. 5. Another way is to make false translations of the Scriptures for the maintenaunce of errour and heresie so did the Arians as S. Hierome noteth in 26. Esa. reade and translate Prouerb 8. Dominus creauit me in intio viarum suarum that is The Lord created mein the beginning of his waies so to make Christ the wisedom of God a mere creature S. Augustin also lib 5. cont Iulian. c. 2. noteth it as the interpretation of some Pelagian Gen. 3. Fecerunt sibi vestimenta for perizómata or campestria that is They made them selues garments Whereas the word of the Scripture is bâ—eeches or aprons proper and peculiar to couer the secretparts Againe the selfe same heretikes did read falsely Rom. 5. Regnauit mors ab Adam vsque ad Moysen etiam in eos qui peccauerunt in similitudinem praeuaricationis Adae that is Death reigned from Adam to Moyses euen on them that sinned after the similitude of the preuaricatioÌ„ of Adam to maintaine their heresie against originall sinne that none were infected therewith or subiect to death damnation but by sinning actually as Adam did Thus did the old heretiks FVLK 5. As touching false and hereticall translations which is the chiefe argument of this booke I doubt not but by the grace of god to cleare our english translators from any wilfull corruptions for the maintenance of any errour or heresie such as were those of the Arrians Pelagians which Gregorie Martin as though he vttered some great peece of skill doth so diligently expresse I shall haue occasion also to shew that the Papistes them selues of our times maintaining their corrupt vulgar translation against the truth of the originall textes of Greeke and Hebrew are most guiltie of such corruption and falsification whereof although they be not the first authors yet by obstinate defending of such errors they may proue worse than they which did first commit them For the authors of that vulgar translation might be deceiued either for lacke of exact knowledge of the tongues or by some corrupt and vntrue copies which they followed or else perhaps that which they had rightly translated by fault of the writers negligence of the times might be peruerted but these men frowardly iustifying all errours of that translation howsoeuer they haue bene brought in do giue plaine testimony that they are not led with any coÌ„scieÌ„ce of Gods truth but wilfully carried with purpose of maintaining their owne errours least if they did acknowledge the errour of the Romish church in that one point they should not bee able to defende any one iote of their heresie whose chiefe colour is the credit and authoritie of that particular and false church rather than any reason or argument out of the holy Scriptures or testimonie of the most auncient Christian and Catholike church MART. 6. What these of our daies is it credible that being so wel warned by the condeÌ„nation detestation of theÌ„ they also would be as mad and as impious as those Heretikes gentle Reader be alwayes like Heretikes and howsoeuer they differ in opinions or names yet in this point they agree to abuse the Scriptures for their purpose by all meanes possibly I will but touch foure points of the fiue before mentioned because my purpose is to stay vpon the last onely and to discipher their corrupt translations But if I would stand vpon the other also were it not easie to shew the maner of their proceeding against the Scriptures to haue bene thus to deny some whole bookes and partes of bookes to call other some into question to expound the rest at their pleasure to picke quarrels to the very originall and Canonicall text â—o fester and infect the whole bodie of the Bible with cancred translations FVLK 6. It is very true that so many Heretikes as pretend the authoritie of the holy Scriptures abuse the same to their owne destruction and no Heretikes worse than the Antichristians or Papistes As partly hath bene seene already in euery one of your fiue markes more may appeare in those foure pointes which you will handle in the Preface because the argument of your whole booke is the fift so that in the ende you shal be proued no wiser with your fiue pointes than he that came forth with his fiue egges neuer a good of them all But you aske if it were not easie for you to shew if you would stand vpon them that the Protestants vse all the said siue meanes of defacing the Scripture I answer no and that shal you see when demonstratioÌ„ is made how vainly you haue laboured in the last point which howsoeuer you would haue it appeare to be a sudden writing of small trauail by interlacing a few lines here there against M. Whitaker against me some other yet it is euident both by Bristowes threatning and Campions promise that it hath bene a work of some yeares vnto you wherin beside that you are beholding much to Lindanus for diuers quarrels against Caluin and to sir Thomas More for many cauillations against W. Tyndals translation there is litle worthy of so long study and large promises as haue gone before this diligent discouerie so that if you will make the like triall in the rest you shall finde them as hard to proue as this last MART. 7. Did not Luther deny S. Iames epistle so contemne it that he called it an epistle of strawe and not worthy of an Apostolicall spirit must I proue this to M. Whitakers who would neuer haue denied it so vehemently in the superlatiue degree for
vntruths that in such matters as you may be conuinced in them by ten thousand witnesses What credit shal be giuen to you in matters that cōsist vpon your owne bare testimonie when you force not to faine of other men that wherin euery man may reproue you And as for the only pretence you speake of Caluine doth so litle esteeme it that notwithstanding the same he doubteth not to receiue the Epistle of S. Iames because it is agreable to the whole body of the canonical Scripture as if you had read his argumēt vpon that Epistle you might easily haue perceiued MART. 9. Marke gētle reader for thy soules sake thou shalt find that heresie only heresie is the cause of their denying these books so farre that against the orders Hierarchies particular patronages of Angels one of them writeth thus in the name of the rest We passe not for that Raphael of Tobie neither do we acknowledge those seuē Angels which he speaketh of al this is farre from Canonical Scriptures that the same Raphael recordeth sauoureth I wote not what superstition Against free will thus I litle care for the place of Ecclesiasticus neither will I beleeue free will though he affirme an hundred times That before men is life death And against praier for the dead intercession of Saincts thus As for the booke of the Machabees I do care lesse for it thā for the other Iudas dreame cōcerning Omas I let passe as a dreame This is their reuerence of the scriptures which haue uniuersally bin reuerenced for canonical in the church of God aboue 1100 yeres Con. Cart. 3. particularly of many fathers long before Aug. de doct Christ. l 2. c. 8. FVLK 9. The mouth that lieth killeth the soule The reader may thinke you haue small care of his soules health when by such impudēt lying you declare that you haue so smal regard of your own But what shal he mark That heresy c. You were best say that Eusebius Hierom Ruffine al the churches in their times were heretiks that only heresie was the cause of their deniall of these bookes For such reasons as moued thē moue vs some thing also their authority But how proue you that only heresie moueth vs to reiect thē Because M. Whit. against the orders Hierarchies particular patronages of Angels writeth in the name of the rest That we passe not c. Take heede least vpon your bare surmise you belie him where you say he writeth in the name of the reste as in the next sectiō following you say he writeth in the name of both the vniuersities for which I am sure he had no cōmissiō frō either of thē althogh he did write that which may well be aduouched by both the vniuersities yet I knowe his modestie is such as he will not presume to be aduocate for both the vniuersities and much lesse for the whole church except he were lawfully called therto This is a cōmon practise of you Papists to beare the world in hand that whatsoeuer is writtē by any of vs in defense of the truth is set forth in the name of al the rest as though none of vs could say more in any matter than any one of vs hath writtē or that if any one of vs chaūce to slip in any smal matter though it be but a wrong quotatiō you might open your wide sclaunderous mouths against the whole church for one mans particular offense Now touching any thing that M. Whit. hath written you shal find him sufficient to maintaine it against a strōger aduersary thā you are therfore I wil medle the lesse in his causes And for the orders patronage or protection of Angels by Gods appointment we haue sufficient testimonie in the Canonical Scriptures that we neede not the vncertain report of Tobies booke to instruct vs what to thinke of thē But as for the Hierarchies patronage of Angels that many of you Papistes haue imagined written of neither the canonical Scriptures nor yet the Apocryphal bookes now in controuersie are sufficient to giue you warrātise The like I say of freewil praier for the dead intercession of Saincts But it grieueth you that those Apocryphal scriptures which haue bin vniuersally receiued for canonicall in the church of God aboue 1100. yeares should find no more reuerēce amōg vs. Stil your mouth rūneth ouer For in the time of the Canon of the coūcel of Carthage 3. which you quote these bookes were not vniuersally reuerenced as canonical And Augustine him selfe speaking of the booke of Machabees Cont. 2. G and. Ep. c. 23. cōfesseth that the Iewes accoūt it not as the law the Prophetes the Psalmes to which our Lord giueth testimonie as to his witnesses saying It behoueth that all things should be fulfilled which are writtē in the Law in the Prophets in the Psalmes cōcerning me but it is receiued of the Church not vnprofitably if it be soberly read or heard This writeth S. Augustine whē he was pressed with the authority of that booke by the Donatists which defended that it was lawful for them to kil themselues by exāple of Razis who is by the author of that booke commēded for that fact He saith it is receiued not vnprofitably immediatly after Especially for those Machabees that suffred paciently horrible persecution for testimony of Gods religiō to encourage Christians by their example Finally he addeth a condition of the receiuing it if it be soberly read or heard These speches declare that it was not receiued without all controuersie as the authenticall word of God for then should it be receiued necessarily because it is Gods word especially how soeuer it be read or heard it is receiued of the Church not only necessarily but also profitably Beside this euen the decree of Gelasius which was neare 100. yeares after that councel of Carthage alloweth but one booke of the Maccabees Wherfore the vniuersal reuerence that is bosted of can not be iustified But M. Whitaker is charged in the margent to condemne the seruice booke which appointeth these books of Toby Ecclesiasticus to be read for holy Scripture as the other And where finde you that in the seruice booke M. Martin Can you speake nothing but vntruths If they be appointed to be read are they appointed to be read for holy Scripture and for suche Scripture as the other canonicall bookes are The seruice booke appointeth the Letanie diuerse exhortations and praiers yea homelies to be read are they therefore to be read for holy canonicall Scriptures But you aske Do they read in their Churches Apocryphall and Superstitious bookes for holy Scripture No verily But of the name Apocryphall I must distinguish which somtimes is taken for all bookes read of the Church which are not canonicall sometime for such bookes onely as are by no meanes to be suffered but are to be hid or abolished These bookes
there shal be in any person a sinne to be adiudged to death he shal be deliuered to death if thou shalt hang him vpoÌ„ a tree 23. Let not his carcase tarie all night vpon that tree but in any case thou shalt burie him the same day for accursed to God is he that is hanged The word tree being twise named before who would be so madde to say that S. Paule hath added it beside the Hebrue text Likewise where you bidde vs strike out of the Hebrue Psal. 21. that which concerneth our redemption on the crosse They haue pearced my handes and my feete because in the Hebrue there is no suche thing you say most vntruely for there is nothing else in the Hebrue no not in the common readings as Iohannes Isaake a Popishe Iewe will teache you who hath confuted the cauils of Lindanus against the Hebrue texte of whom you borrowed this exam le where if you had not beene blinde with mallice you mighte haue seene that Sainct Hierome did reade without controuersie Fixâ—runt they haue pearced as also that the most auncieÌ„t copie of the Hebrue Psalmes supposed to haue pertained to Sainct Augustine of CaÌ„terburie hath Charu they haue pearced though you had bene ignoraunt what is written concerning this word in the Masoreth and what Isaac also writeth of that word as it is commonly redde that it can not signifie as you fantasie sicut leo like a lion And therefore the Chalde paraphrast turneth it As a lion they pearced my handes and my feete But of this matter more hereafter as occasion shall be giuen As for the Apostle Ephes. 4. saying that Christ gaue giftes whereas of Dauid it is sayd he receiued giftes speaketh nothing contrarie to the Hebrue but sheweth wherefore Christ hath receiued gifts namely to bestow vpon his church Except you will say that Christ gaue of his owne and receiued none and so the Apostle doth shewe the excellencie of the trueth aboue the figure Christ aboue Dauid Likewise where the Psalmist sayeth in the Hebrue Thou hast opened mine eares the Apostle doth rightly collect that Christ had a bodie which in his obedience was to be offered vnto the father Last of all you would haue fiue soules cut from 75. in Sainct Stephens Sermon because it is not in the Hebrue but you are deceiued For Sainct Stephen gathereth the whole number of them that are named in the fortie sixt chapter of Genesis Namely the two sonnes of Iuda that were deade and Iacobes foure wiues to shewe howe greate his familie was at the vttermost before he went downe into Aegypt and howe greatly God did multiplie him afterwarde What is there in any of these examples like to Qui fuit Cainan about whiche you make so muche a doe MART. 20. Must such difficulties diuersities be resolued by chopping and changing hacking and hewing the sacred text of holy Scripture Sec into what perplexities wilfull heresie and arrogancie hath driuen them To discredit the vulgar Latine translation of the Bible and the fathers expositions according to the same for that is the originall cause of this and besides that they may haue alwaies this euasion It is not so in the Hebrue it is otherwise in the Greeke and so seeme iolly fellowes and great clerkes vnto the ignorant people what do they they admit onely the Hebrue in the old Test. and the Greeke in the newe to be the true and authenticall texte of the Scripture Wherevpon this foloweth that they reiect and must needes reiect the Greeke of the old Test. called the Septuaginta as false because it differeth from the Hebrue Which being reiected therevpon it foloweth againe that wheresoeuer those places so disagreeing from the Hebrue are cited by Christ or the Euangelists and Apostles there also they must be reiected because they disagree from the Hebrue and so yet againe it foloweth that the Greeke text of the new Testament is not true because it is not according to the Hebrue veritie consequently the wordes of our Sauiour and writings of his Apostles must be reformed to say the least because they speake according to the Septuaginta and not according to the Hebrue FVLK 20. Who alloweth or who can abide chopping and changing or hacking and hewing the sacred text of holy Scriptures As for the perplexities wherevnto you faine that wilfull heresie and arrogancie hath driuen vs is of your weauing for God be praised we can wel inough with good conscience sound knowledge that may abide the iudgement of all the learned in the world defend both the Hebrew text of the olde Testament and the Greeke text of the new Not of purpose to discredit the vulgar Latine translation and the expositions of the fathers but to fetch the truth vpon which the hope of our saluation is grounded out of the first fountaines and springs rather than out of any streames that are deriued from them And this we doe agreeable to the auncient fathers iudgements For who knoweth not what fruitfull paines S. Hierom tooke in translating the Scripture out of the originall tongue neither would he be disswaded by S. Augustine who although he misliked that enterprise at the first yet afterward he highly commended the necessitie of the Greeke Hebrue tongues for Latine men to find out the certaine truth of the text in the infinite varietie of the Latine interpretations for thus he writetth De doct Christ. lib. 2. cap. 11. Contra ignota signa propria magnum remedium est linguarum cognitio Eâ— latinae c. Against vnknowen proper signes the knowledge of tongues is a great remedie And truly men of the Latine tongue whom we haue now taken in hand to instruct haue neede also of two other tongues vnto the knowledge of the diuine Scriptures namely the Hebrue the Greeke that recourse may be had vnto the former copies if the infinite varietie of the Latine interpreters shal bring any doubt although we find ofteÌ„times in the bookes Hebrue words not interpreted as Amen Alleluia Racha Osanna c. and a litle after Sed noÌ„ propter haec pauca c. But not for these few wordes which to marke and inquire of it is a very easie thing but for the diuersities as it is said of the interpreters the knowledge of those tongues is necessarie For they that haue interpreted the scriptures out of the Hebrue toÌ„gue into the Greke tong may be nuÌ„bred but the Latine interpreters by no means can be numbred For in the first times of the faith as a Greeke booke came into euery mans hand he seemed to haue some skill in both the tongues he was bold to interpret it Which thing truly hath more helped the vnderstanding than hindred if the readers be not negligeÌ„t for the looking vpon many bookes hath often times made manifest sundry obscure or darke sentences This is S. Augustines sound iudgement of the knowledge of tongues and diuersitie of interpretations for the better
in Tullie of whom one sayd that he maruailed if when they mette togither one of them did not smile vppon another because they deluded the cittie got themselues much honour with such vaine superstitions So you beyng newly become subtill and partial translaters thinke other men to be like your selfes But euen as the head of your Church once iested with his Cardinall how great wealth honour that fable of Christ so the beast called the Christian religion had brought them euen so you his lewde limmes make sporte among your selfe of the holy worde of God which you haue corrupted somewhat with your blinde translatioÌ„s but much more with your hereticall Annotations So said your great friend Campion in open audience that he could make as good sport vpon the incarnation of Christ. According to your owne affection therefore you iudge of vs and not according to the truth as the day will trie when the secretes of all hartes shall be made manifest MART. 31. Fifthly that the very vse and affectation of certaine termes and auoiding other some though it be no demonstration against them but that they may seeme to defend it for true translation yet was it necessarie to be noted because it is and hath bene alwayes a token of hereticall meaning FVLK 31. When our translation is true I doubt not but we shall defende the vse of some termes and the auoiding of other some by as good reason as you shall defende the like in your translations especially where you affect new termes vnused or not vnderstoode and auoide common and vsuall termes of the same signification as Euangelizing for preaching the Gospel adueÌ„t of Christ for the coÌ„ming of Christ scandalizing for offending scandale for offense c. Which if it be as you say alwayes a token of hereticall meaning first plucke your selfe by the nose and then see if we can not defend our doings MART. 32. Sixtly that in explicating these things we haue endeuoured to auoide as much as was possible the tediousnesse of Greeke and Hebrue wordes which are only for the learned in these tongues and which made some litle doubt whether this matter which of necessity must be examined by them were to be written in Englishe or no. But being perswaded by those who them selues haue no skill in the sayd tongues that euerie reader might reape commoditie thereby to the vnderstanding and detesting of such false Hereticall translations it was thought good to make it vulgar and common to all our deere countrie men as the newe Testament it selfe is common whereof this Discouerie is as it were a handmaide attending therevpon for the larger explication and proofe of corruptions there brieâ—ly touched and for supply of other some not there mentioned FVLK 32. He that seeth your margent painted with Greeke and Hebrewe wordes in so many places may guesse whether it were possible for you to haue auoided the tediousnesse of them when in diuerse places the Greeke and Hebrew wordes are set without all neede of them and sometimes where there is no controuersie about them as in the 5. section of this Preface where you shew the corruptions of the Arrians and Pelagians and in the 19 section where you would shew the difference of the new Testament from the olde in citing of testimonies But the Hebrewe word in the Psalme 21. or 22. which you falsly say signifieth no such thing as pearcing you set not downe lest your falshood by them that haue skill might be conuinced And if you had cared as much to finde out the truth as to shewe your skill in both the tongues you would haue written in Latine especially against Beza which neuer wrote in English And vaine it is that you pretend to make the matter common to your deare countrimen that be vnlearned for the iudgement muste reste in them that haue knowledge in the tongues albeit you had written in Latine It is all one therefore to the vnlearned as if you had onely said there are many faults or corruptions which in a Latine booke shall be discouered to the iudgement of the learned seeing the ignorant can not vnderstand your demoÌ„stratioÌ„s MART. 33. Seuenthly that all the English corruptions here noted and refuted are either in all or some of their English Bibles printed in these yeares 1562. 1577. 1579. And if the corruption be in one Bible not in an other commonly the sayd Bible or Bibles are noted in the margent if not yet sure it is that it is in one of them and so the Reader shall find it if he find it not alwaies in his owne Bible And in this case the Reader must be very wise and circumspect that he thinke not by and by we charge them falsly because they can shew him some later edition that hath it not so as we say For it is their common and knowen fashion not onely in their translations of the Bible but in their other bookes and writings to alter and change adde put out in their later editions according as either them selues are ashamed of the former or their scholers that print them againe dissent and disagree from their Maisters So hath Luthers Caluins and Bezaes writings and translations bene changed both by them selues and their scholers in many places so that Catholike men when they confute that which they find euident faults in this or that edition feare nothing more than that the Reader hath some other edition where they are corrected for very shame and so may conceiue that there is no such thing but that they are accused wrongfully For example Call to minde the late pretended conference in the Tower where that matter was denied and faced out for Luthers credit by some one booke or edition of his which them selues and all the world knoweth was most truly layd to his charge FVLK 33. First this is vntrue for some you haue noted in the new Testament printed 1580. Secondly it is vncertaine for two of these translations might be printed in one yeare and so I thinke they were Therefore I know not well which you meane but I guesse that the Bible 1562. is that which was of Doctor Couerdales translation most vsed in the Church seruice in King Edwards time The Bible 1577. I take to be that which being reuised by diuerse Bishops was first printed in the large volume and authorized for the Churches about tenne or twelue yeares agoe That of 1579. I knowe not what translation it be except it be the same that was first printed at Geneua in the beginning of the Queenes Maiesties Raigne And this coniecture as the fittest I can make I must followe seeing your note of distinction is as good as that fond fellowes that would know his maisters horse by the bridle But it is a common and knowen fashion you say vsed of vs that not onely in translations but in other bookes and writings of ours we alter and change adde and put to in our later editions And who vseth not
say we you can not so answer the matter for in other places you translate it duely and truely tradition and why more in one place than in another They are ashamed to tell why but they must tell and shame both thom selues and the deuill if euer they thinke it good to answer this treatise as also why they changed congregation which was alwaies in their first translation into Church in their later translations and did not change likewise ordinances into traditions Elder◠into Priestes FVLK 51. That the Thessalonians had some parte of Christian doctrine deliuered by word of mouth that is by the Apostles preaching at such time as he did write vnto them and some part by his Epistles the text enforceth vs to graunt and we neuer purposed to denye But that the Church at this daye or euer since the newe Testament was written had any tradition by worde of mouth of any matter necessary to saluation which was not contayned in the olde or newe Testament we will neuer graunt neither shall you euer be able out of this text or any text in the Bible to proue Make your Syllogismes when you dare and you shall be aunswered But we knowe you saye that the Greeke word signifieth tradition as plaine as possibly but here and in like places we rather translate it ordinances instructions and what else soeuer We knowe that it signifieth tradition constitution instruction precept also mancipation treatise treason For al these the Greeke Dictionaries do teach that it signifieth Therefore if in any place we haue translated it ordinaunces or instructions or institutions we haue not gone from the true signification of the worde neither can you euer proue that the worde signifieth such a doctrine onely as is taught by worde of mouth and is not or may not be put in writing But in other places you can tell vs that we translate it duely and truly tradition and you will know why more in one place than in another affirming that we are shamed to tell why For my part I was neuer of counsaile with any that translated the Scriptures into English and therefore it is possible I can not sufficiently expresse what reason moued the translators so to varie in the exposition of one and the same worde Yet can I yeelde sufficient reason that might leade them so to doe which I thinke they followed The Papistes doe commonly so abuse the name of tradition which signifieth properly a deliuerie or a thinge deliuered for such a matter as is deliuered onely by worde of mouth and so receaued from hande to hande that it is neuer put in writing but hath his credite without the holye Scriptures of God as the Iewe had their Cabala and the Scribes Pharisees had their traditions beside the lawe of God and the Valentinian Heretikes accused the Scriptures as insufficient of authoritie and ambiguously written and that the truth could not be found in them by those that knewe not the tradition which was not deliuered by writing but by worde of mouth iumpe as the Papists doe This abusing of the word tradition might be a sufficient cause for the translators to render the Greeke worde where it is taken for such doctrine as is beside the commaundement of God by the name of tradition as the worde is commonly taken But where the Greeke worde is taken in the good parte for that doctrine which is agreeable with the holy Scriptures they might with good reason auoide it as you your selfe doe not alwayes translate tradere to betray but sometimes to deliuer So did the translators giue these words ordinances instructions institutions or doctrine deliuered which doe generally signifie the same that tradition but haue not the preiudice of that partiall signification in which the Papistes vse it who wheresoeuer they find tradition straight way imagine they haue found a sufficient argument against the perfection and sufficiencie of the holy Scripture and to bring in all riffe raffe and trishe trashe of mans doctrine not onely beside but also contrarye to the manifest worde of God conteined in his most holy and perfect Scriptures To the shame of the deuill therefore and of all popish maintainers of traditions vncommaunded by God this reason may be yelded Nowe to aunswer you why Ecclesia was first translated congregation and afterward Church the reason that moued the firste translators I thinke was this the worde Churche of the common people at that tyme was vsed ambiguously both for the assemblie of the faythfull and for the place in which they assembled for auoyding of which ambiguitie they translated Ecclesia the congregation and yet in their Creede and in the notes of their Bibles in preaching writing they vsed the word Church for the same the later translators seing the people better instructed able to discerne when they read in the Scriptures the people from the place of their meeting vsed the worde Church in their translations as they did in their preaching These are weightie matters that wee muste giue accompt of them Why we chaunge not ordinances into traditions and Elders into Priests wee will answere when we come to the proper places of them In the meane season wee thinke there is as good cause for vs in translating sometime to auoide the termes of traditions and prieste as for you to auoid the names of Elders calling them auncients and the wise men sages as though you had rather speake French than English as we do Like as you translate Conside haue a good hart after the french phrase rather than you would say as we do be of good comforte MART. 52. The cause is that the name of Church was at the first odious vnto thē because of the Catholike Church which stoode against them but afterward this name grewe into more favour with them because of their English Church so at length called and termed But their hatred of Priests and traditions continueth still as it first began and therefore their translation also remaineth as before suppressing the names both of the one and of the other But of all these their dealings they shal be told in their seuerall chapiters and places FVLK 52. I pray you who translated first the creed into the English tongue and taught it to the people for that cause were accounted heretikes of the Antichristian Romish rable If the name of Churche were odious vnto them why didde they not suppresse that name in the creede whyche they taught to yong and olde and in steede of Catholike Church call it the vniuersal congregation or assembly Wel Dauus these things be not aptely diuided according to their times The firste translation of the Bible that was printed in the english tong in very many places of the notes vseth the name Church most notoriously in the song of Salomon where before euery other verse almost it telleth which is the voice of the Church to Christ her spous◠which no reasonable man would thinke the translators would
haue done if the name of the Church had bene odious vnto them or that they thought the Catholike church stood against theÌ„ Looke Thomas Mathewes Bible in the Canticles of Salomon vpon the 16. of S. Mathewes Gospell the 18. verse the wordes of Christ to Peter Therfore your senseles imaginations shewe no hatred of the Catholike Church in our translators but cancred malice and impudent follie in your selues MART. 53. To conclude as I began concerning their shiftes and iumpes and windings and turnings euery way from one thing to an other till they are driuen to the extreme refuge of palpable corruptions and false translations consider with me in this one case onely of traditions as may be likewise considered in all other controuersies that the auncient fathers councels antiquitie vniuersalitie and custom of the whole Church allowe traditions the Canonicall Scriptures haue them the Latine text hath them the Greeke text hath them onely their translations haue them not Likewise in the olde Testament the approued Latine text hath such and such speeches that make for vs the renowmed Greeke text hath it the Hebrewe text hath it onely their translations haue it not These are the translations which we call heretical and wilful and which shal be examined and discussed in this Booke FVLK 53. By what windings and turnings I pray you are we driuen to that miserable refuge of palpable corruptions and false translations for hitherto you haue shewed none but such as shewe your owne ignoraunce or malice Neither I hope you shal be able to shewe any though you sweat neuer so sore at your work Yes I weene this one case only of traditions for so you seeme to say if it be considered wil discouer no lesse It is meruaile if for your sake al the Greeke Dictionaries in the world must not be corrected taught to say that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 caÌ„ signifie nothing but a tradition that is not written But yet you rolle in your accustomed rhetorike saying that the antieÌ„t fathers couÌ„cels antiquitie vniuersalitie custome of the whole Church allow traditioÌ„s so do we so many as be good agreeable to the holie scripturs but that there be traditioÌ„s of matter necessarie to saluatioÌ„ not contained in the holie scripturs wheÌ„ you bring your fathers Councels c. you shal receiue an answere to them That the canonical scripture alloweth any traditions contrary to the doctrine therof or to supply any want or imperfection therof as though al things required to make the man of God perfecte prepared to all good workes were not conteyned in the Scriptures you shall neuer be able to proue although for spite against the perfection of the Canonicall Scripture you should braste a sunder as Iudas did which betrayed the auctor of the Scripture Finally what so euer you say out of the old Testament without proofe or shew of proofe it is as easily denied by vs as it is affirmed by you When you bring but only a shadow of reason it shall sone be chased away with the light of truth The Argumentes of euerie chapter with the page where euery chapter beginneth CHAP. 1. THat the ProtestaÌ„ts translate the holie Scripture falsly of purpose in fauor of their heresies throughout al controuersies page 1. 2 Against Apostolical Traditions pag. 73. 3 Against sacred Images pag. 88. 4 The Ecclesiastical vse of words turned into their original and profane significations pag. 131. 5 Against the CHVRCH pag. 139. 6 Against Priest and Priesthoode Wheremuch also is saide of their profaning of Ecclesiastical wordes pag. 157. 7. Against Purgatorie Limbus Patrum and Christes descending into Hell pag. 196. 8. Concerning Iustification and Gods iustice in rewarding good workes pag. 252. 9 Against Merites meritorious workes and the reward for the same pag. 263. 10 Against Free will pag. 300. 11 For Imputatiue iustice against true inherent iustice pag 328. 12 For Speciall faith vaine securitie and onely faith pag. 342. 13 Against Penance and Satisfaction pag. 355. 14 Against the holy Sacraments namely Baptisme and Confession pag. 379. 15 Against the Sacrament of Holy Orders and for the Mariage of Priestes and Votaries pag. 390. 16 Against the Sacrament of Matrimonie pag. 423. 17 Against the B. Sacrament and Sacrifice and altars pa. 429. 18 Against the honour of Saincts namely of our B. LADY pa. 460. 19 Against the distinction of Dulîa and Latrîa pag. 474. 20 Adding to the text pag. 483. 21 Other hereticall treacheries and corruptions worthy of obseruation pag. 493. 22 Other faults Iudaical profane meere vanities follâ—es and nouelties pag. 507. ¶ A Discouerie of the manifolde corruptions of the holie Scriptures by the Heretikes of our dayes specially the English Sectaries of their foule dea ling herein by partiall and false Translations to the advantage of their heresies in their English Bibles vsed and authorized since the time of Schisme CHAP. 1. That the Protestantes translate the holie Scriptures falsly of purpose in fauour of their heresies MARTIN THOVGH this shall euidently appeare thorough out this whole Booke in euery place that shall be obiected vnto them yet because it is an obseruation of greatest importaunce in this case which stigeth theÌ„ sore toucheth their credit exceedingly in so much that one of them setting a good face vpon the matter sayth confidently that al the Papists in the worlde are not able to shew one place of Scripture mistranslated wilfully of purpose therfore I wil giue the reader certein brief obseruations and euident markes to know wilfull corruptions as it were an abridgement and summe of this Treatise FVLKE ALTHOVGH this trifling treatise was in hand two or three yeares ago as by the threatning of Bristow and Howlette it may appeare yet that it might seeme new and a sudden peece of worke compyled with small studie you thought good by carping at my confutation of Howlet last made and of M. Whitakers work set forth later than it as it were by setting on newe eares vpon your olde potte to make it seeme to be a newe vessell And first of all you would seeme to haue taken occasion of my confident speech in my confutation of Howlets nyne Reasons in reâ—earsing wherof you vse such fidelitie as commonly Papistes vse to beare towardes God the Churche your Prince and your Countrie For what face soeuer I set vpon the matter with a whorish forehead and a brasen face you make reporte of my saying which beeing testified by a thousande copies printed as it were by so many witnesses doth crie out vpon your falshode and iniurious dealing For my wordes out of the place by you quoted against Howlet are these That some error may bee in translation although by you it can not be shewed I will not denye but that any shameles translations or wilfull corruptions can be found of purpose to draw the Scriptures to any hereticall opinion all the Papistes in the world shall neuer be able to make demonsiration This
was my saying and I repeat it againe with as great confidence as before yea and with much greater too forasmuch as all the Papistes in the Seminarie hauing now beaten their heades togither to find out shameles translations and wilful corruptions of purpose to maintaine heresies can find nothing but olde friuolous quarrels answered long before or new trifling cauils not worthy in deede of any learned mans answer but for satisfying of the simple and ignoraunt Howe this my saying differeth from your slaunderous reporte I trust euery reasonable Papist that will take paines to conferre them togither will be enforced to acknowledge For where I say shamelesse translations and wilfull corruptions as Howlet chargeth vs you reporte me to saye mistranslated although in playne wordes I did confesse that there might be some errours euen in the best and perfectest of our translations For to translate out of one tongue into an other is a matter of greater difficultie than it is commonly taken I meane exactly to yeeld as much and no more than the originall containeth when the wordes and phrases are so different that fewe are found which in all pointes signifie the same thing neither more nor lesse in diuers tongues Wherefore notwithstanding any translation that can be made the knowledge of the tongues is necessary in the Church for the perfect discussing of the â—ense and meaning of the holy Scriptures Now if some of our translators or they all haue not attained to the best and most proper expressing of the nature of all wordes and phrases of the Hebrew and Greeke tongues in English it is not the matter that I will stande to defende nor the translators them selues I am well assured if they were all liuing But that the Scriptures are not impudently falsified or willfully corrupted by them to mayntayne anie hereticall opinion as the aduersarie chargeth vs that is the thing that I will by Gods grace stande to defende against all the Papistes in the worlde And this ende you haue falsely and fraudulently omitted in reporting my saying wherevppon dependeth the chiefe yea the whole matter of my assertion You plaiâ— manifestly with vs the lewde parte of Procustes the theeuâ—sh hoste whiche woulde make his guestes stature equall with his beddes eyther by stretching them out if they were too short or by cutting off their legges if they were too long So if our sayings be too short for your purpose you straine them to be longer if they be too long you cut of their shankes yea that which is worse the very head as you play with me in this place I my selfe and so did many hundreds beside me heare that reuerend father M. Doctor Couerdale of holy and learned memorie in a sermon at Paules crosse vpon occasion of some slaunderous reportes that then were raysed againste his translation declare his faithfull purpose in doing the same which after it was finished and presented to King Henry the eight of famous memorie and by him committed to diuerse bishops of that time to pervse of which as I remember Steuen Gardiner was one after they had kept it long in their handes and the King was diuerse times sued vnto for the publication thereof at the last being called for by the King him selfe they redeliuered the booke and being demaunded by the King what was their iudgement of the translation they aunswered that there were many faultes therein Well said the King but are there anye heresies maintayned thereby They answered there was no heresies that they could finde maintained thereby If there be no heresies sayd the King then in Gods name let it goe abroad among our people According to this iudgement of the King and the Bishops M. Couerdale defended his translation confessing that he did now him selfe espie some faultes which if he might reuiew it once ouer againe as he had done twise before he doubted not but to amend but for any heresie he was sure there was none maintained by his translation After the same maner I doubt not by Gods helpe so to defende all our translations for all your euident markes to know wilful corruptions that not one shal bee founde of purpose to maintaine any hereticall opinion and not many errours committed through negligence ignorance or humaine frailtie MARTIN 2. The first marke and most generall is If they translate elsewhere not amisse and in places of controuersie betwene them and vs most falsely it is an euident argument that they doe it not of negligence or ignoraunce but of partialitie to the matter in controuersie This is to be seene through the whole Byble where the faultes of their translations are altogither or specially in those Scriptures that concerne the causes inquestion betwene vs. For other small faultes or rather ouersights we will no further note vnto them than to the ende that they may the more easily pardon vs the like if they finde them FVLKE 2. This marke is too generall to knowe any thing thereby when you doe exemplifie it in speciall you shall easily be answered in the meane time it is sufficient to deny generally that wherwith you so generally charge vs that we haue in places of controuersie translated any thing falsely If one worde be otherwise translated in any place of controuersie than it is in other places out of controuersie there may be rendred sufficient reason of that varietie without that it must needes come of parcialitie to the matter in controuersie but rather of loue of the truth which in all matters of question betwene vs is confirmed by plaine text of Scriptures or necessary collection out of the same so that if the translation in those places were the same that yours is of the newe Testament it should neither hinder our truth nor fortifie your errour As for small faultes and ouersightes reason it is as you say they should be pardoned on both sides MART. 3. If as in their opinions and heresies they forsake the auncient fathers so also in their translations they goe from that text and auncient reading of holy Scriptures which all the fathers vsed and expounded is it not plaine that their translation followeth the veine and humor of their heresie And againe if they that so abhorre from the auncient expositions of the fathers yet if it seeme to serue for them sticke not to make the exposition of any one Doctor the very text of holy Scripture what is this but hereticall wilfulnesse See this 1. chap. num 43. chap. 10. num 1. 2. chap. 18. num 10. 11. and chap 19. num 1. FVL. 3. We neuer goe from that text and auncient reading which all the fathers vsed expouÌ„ded but we translate that most vsual text which was first printed out of the most auncient copies that could be found And if any be since found or if any of the auncient fathers did reade otherwise than the vsual copies in any word that is any way material in annotation commeÌ„taries readings sermons we spare not to declare
when they professe they are of thē selues vniust of Sacraments mysteries by which the benefits of Christ are sealed vp vnto them of altar when they beleue that Iesus Christ is our altar of Priests when they hold that al good Christians are Priests of deuotions when they dispute that ignorance is not the mother of true deuotion but knowledge of excommunication which they practise daily As for the names and thinges of procession shrines images traditions beside the holy Scriptures in religiō they haue iust cause to abhorre Neither do they vse the one sort of termes without probable ground out of the originall text nor auoide the other but vpon some good speciall cause as in the seueral places when we are charged with them shal appeare MART. 17. If in a case that maketh for them they straine the very originall signification of the word and in a case that maketh against them they neglect it altogither what is this but wilfull and of purpose See chap. 7. numb 36. FVLK 17. I answer we streine no words to signifie otherwise than the nature and vse of them will affoord vs neither doe we spare to expresse that which hath a shewe against vs if the propertie or vsuall signification of the word with the circumstance of the place doe so require it MART. 18. If in wordes of ambiguous and diuerse signification they will haue it signifie here or there as it pleaseth them and that so vehemently that here it must needes so signifie and there it must not and both this and that to one ende and in fauour of one and the same opinion what is this but wilfull translation So doth Beza vrge 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to signifie wife and not to signifie wife both against virginitie and chastitie of Priestes and the English Bible translateth accordingly See chap. 15. num 11. 12. FVLK 18. To the generall charge I answer generally we do not as you slaunder vs. Nor Beza whom you shamefully belye to vrge the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 1. Cor. 7. v. 1. not to signifie a wife against virginitie and chastitie of Priestes For cleane contrariwise he reproueth Erasmus restraining it to a wife which the Apostle saith generally it is good for a man not to touch a woman which doth not onely conteine a commendation of virginitie in them that be vnmaried but also of continencie in them that be maried And as for the virginity or chastitie of Priestes he speaketh not one worde of it in that place no more than the Apostle doth Now touching the other place that you quote 1. Cor. 9. v. 5. Beza doth truely translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a sister to wife because the word sister is first placed which comprehendeth a woman and therefore the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 following must needes explicate what woman he meaneth namely a wife For it were absurd to say a sister a woman Therfore the vulgar Latine Interpreter peruerteth the words saith Mulierem sororem It is true that many of the auncient fathers as too much addict to the singlenes of the Clergie though they did not altogither condemne mariage in them as the Papists doe did expound the sister whereof S. Paule speaketh of certaine rich matrones which followed the Apostles whithersoeuer they went ministred to them of their substance as we reade that many did to our Sauiour Christ. Math. 27. v. 55. Luc. 8. v. 3. But that exposition can not stand nor agree with this text for many causes First the placing of the wordes which I haue before spoken of Secondly this word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 were needeles except it should signifie a wife for the word sister signifieth both a woman a faithful woman and otherwise it was not to be doubted least the Apostle would leade a heathen woman with him Thirdly the Apostle speaketh of one womā not many wheras there were many that followed our Sauiour Christ whereas one alone to follow the Apostle might breede occasion of ill suspition and offence which many could not so easily Fourthly those that are mentioned in the Gospell our Sauiour Christ did not leade about but they did voluntarily follow him but the Apostle here saith that he had authoritie as the rest of the Apostles to leade about a woman which argueth the right that an husband hath ouer his wife or of a maister ouer his maide Fiftly it is not all one if women could trauel out of Galilie to Ierusalem which was nothing neare an hundred miles that women could followe the Apostles into all partes of the world Sixtly if the cause why such women are supposed to haue followed the Apostles was to minister to them of their substance the leading them about was not burdenous to the Church but helpeful but the Apostle testifieth that he forbare to vse this libertie because he would not be burdenous to the Church of Corinth or to any of them Seuenthly seing it is certaine that Peter had a wife and the rest of the Apostles are by antiquitie reputed to haue bene all maried It is not credible that Peter or any of the rest would leaue the companie of their owne wiues leade strange women about with them As for the obiection that you make in your note vppon the text to what ende should he talke of burdening the Corinthians with finding his wife when he himself cleerely saith that he was single I answer Although I thinke he was single yet is it not so cleere as you make it for Clemens Alexandrinus thinketh he had a wife which he left at Philippi by mutual consent But albeit he were single it was lawfull for him to haue maried and Barnabas also as wel as all the rest of the Apostles Againe to what end should he talke of burdening the Church with a woman which was not his wife when such women as you say ministred to the Apostles of their goods Wherby it should follow that none of the Apostles burdened the Churches where they preached with their owne finding which is cleane contrary to the Apostles wordes and meaning Wherefore the translation of Beza and of our Church is most true and free from all corruption MART. 19. If the Puritans grosser Caluinists disagree about the translations one part preferring the Geneua English Bible the other the Bible read in their Church if the Lutherans condemne the Zuinglians Caluinistes translations and contrariwise if all Sectaries reproue eche an others translation What doth it argue but that the translations differ according to their diuerse opinions See their bookes written one against another FVLK 19. Here againe is nothing but a generall charge of disagreeing about translations of Puritans Caluinists Lutherans Zuinglians and of all Sectaries reprouing one an others translation with as generall a demonstration See the bookes written one against an other which would aske longer time than is needeful to answer such a vaine cauil when it is alwaies sufficient
vs through faith Rom. 4. The Papistes say it is a qualitie inherent within vs for which wordes and matter they haue no warrant in the holy Scripture MART. 54. These few examples proue vnto vs that the Scriptures translated verbatim exactly and according to the proper vse and signification of the wordes do by the Heretikes confession make for the Catholikes and therefore Beza saith he altereth the wordes into other and I thinke it may suffice any indifferent reader to iudge of his purpose and meaning in other places of his translation and consequently of theirs that either allow him or follow him which are our English Caluinists and Bezites Many other waies there are to make mosta certaine proofe of their Wilfulnesse as when the translation is framed according to their false and hereticall commentarie and When they will auouch their translations out of prophane writers Homer Plutarch Plinie Tullie Virgil and Terence and reiect the Ecclesiastical vse of wordes in the Scriptures and Fathers which Beza doth for the most part alwaies But it were infinite to note all the markes and by these the wise reader may conceiue the rest FVLK 54 These examples proue nothing lesse For to runne ouer them all briefly the first two we translate verbatim A man is iustified by faith without the workes of the law and repent and repētance we say for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 What make these for Poperie If Luc 1. v. 6. we should call 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 iustifications what should Poperie gaine but a vaine cauill when you your selues cōfesse that those iustifications are often vsed for commandements Act. 2. v. 27. all our English translations are as you would haue them Thou shalt not leaue my soule in hell nor suffer thy holy one to see corruption by which verse no descent into Limbus but the resurrection from death can be proued If wee translate as you do Act. 3. v. 21. whome heauen must receaue wee will easily conuince that Christe muste be receaued of heauen In the laste example the question is not howe the worde is to be translated but by what worde the want of the texte is to be supplied whiche wee supplie not with wordes of our owne but with the Apostles owne wordes Haue you not gayned greatly by translating verbatim exactly and according to the proper vse and signification of the wordes I lyke well that euery indifferent Reader may iudge by these examples of Bezaes purpose in other places of his translation But you haue two other wayes to make certaine proofe of their wilfulnesse The firste is when the translation is framed according to their hereticall commentarie A reasonable man would thinke rather that the commentarie were framed according to the texte than the texte to the commentarie But to iustifie the truth of those translations for the firste texte you quote it is handled sect 26. of this chapter and so consequently Cap. 7. The seconde is answered sect 46. the other two concerning tradition sect 23. of the preface and in the chapiter following The second waye of proofe is when they will auouch their translations out of prophane writers I thinke there is no better waye to know the proper or diuerse signification of wordes than out of auncient writers though they be neuer so prophane who vsed the wordes most indifferently in respect of our controuersies of which they were altogither ignorant As for the ecclesiasticall vse of wordes in the Scripture and the Fathers which Beza you say doth for the most part reiect it is vntrue except there be good and sufficient cause why he should so do warranted by the Scripture it selfe or necessarie circumstances of the places which he doth translate For if the Scripture haue vsed a worde in one signification sometimes it is not necessarie that it should alwaies vse it in the same signification when it is proued by auncient writers that the worde hath other significations more proper to the place and agreeable to the rule of fayth which perhaps the vsuall signification is not As for example the Scripture vseth very often this worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for a boy or seruaunt but when the same worde is applied to our Sauiour Christ in the prayer of the Apostles Act. 4. 27. Who woulde not rather translate it childe or sonne as the worde doth sometime but more seldome signifie Howe the Fathers of the Churche haue vsed wordes it is no rule for translators of the Scripture to followe who oftentimes vsed wordes as the people did then take them and not as they signified in the Apostles tyme. As 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for a publicke testification of repentaunce which wee call penaunce 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 for imposition of handes and suche like in whiche sense these wordes were neuer vsed before the Apostles times and therefore it is not lyke that they woulde beginne a newe vse of them without some manifest explication of their meaning without the whiche no man could haue vnderstoode them as they haue done in the vse of these wordes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and such like It is not a faulte therefore prudently to seeke euen out of prophane writers what is the proper signification of wordes and howe many significations a woorde may haue and reuerently to iudge which is moste apte for the place to be translated and moste agreeable with the holy ghostes meaning in that texte and not alwaies to bee tyed to the vsuall signification of wordes as they are sometimes taken in Scripture and much lesse as they are vsed of the auncient Fathers MART. 55. But would you thinke that these men could notwithstanding speake very grauely and honestly against voluntarie and wilfull translations of Scripture that so notoriously offend therein them selues Harken what Beza saith against Castaleo and the like The matter saith he is now come to this point that the translatours of Scripture out of the Greeke into Latin or into any other tōgue think that they may lawfully doe any thing in translating Whom if a man reprehend he shall be answered by and by that they do the office of a translatour not that translateth worde for worde but that expresseth the sense So it commeth to passe that whiles euery man will rather freely folow his own iudgement than be a religious interpreter of the Holy Ghost he doth rather peruert many things than translate them Is not this well said if he had done accordingly but doing the cleane contrarie as hath ben◠proued he is a dissembling hypocrite in so saying and a wilfull Heretike in so doing and condemned by his owne iudgement FVLK 55. No wise man doubteth but they could both speake very grauely and auoyde most religiously al voluntarie wilful translations of scripture that might tende to maintaine any errour And the rather they will be perswaded that Beza hath auoyded that lewde kinde of translatiō for which he reproueth Castaleo when they shall see that
on your parte that should exactly folow the Greeke falsely translated when you translate in S. Peters Epistle thus You were not redeemed with corruptible things froÌ„ your vaine conuersation receiued by the tradition of the fathers Where the Greeke is thus rather to be translated froÌ„ your vaine conuersation deliuered by the fathers But your fingers itched to fâ—â—st in the word tradition and for deliuered to say receiued because it is the phrase of the Catholike Church that it hath receiued many things by tradition which you woulde here controll by likenesse of wordes in this false translation FVLK 6. I maruaile why you should compte it an heretical humor to vse the worde traditions in the euill part which the holy ghost so vseth and your owne vulgar translator also but that you are more partial in allowing the traditions of meÌ„ than we in auoiding the terme somtimes only for doubt lest traditioÌ„s of meÌ„ should creepe into the place of Gods coÌ„mandemeÌ„ts But how is it falsly translated on our part that professe to folow the Greke which is truly translated in your vulgar Latin text which professeth to translate the Greeke as well as we belike because we say receiued by the tradition of the fathers which according to the Greeke should be deliuered by the fathers but that our fingers itched to foyst in the word tradition What I pray you hath your vulgar traÌ„slator foisted in that word did his fingers itch against such catholike phrases that he would coÌ„trol theÌ„ by a false traÌ„slation do you not perceiue that while you raile vpoÌ„ vs you reuile your owne vulgar Latin translatioÌ„ which hath the same word traditioÌ„ for which you storme against vs But for deliuered we haue said receiued See whether frowardnes driueth you the Apostle saith they were deliuered froÌ„ the vaine coÌ„uersation of their fathers traditioÌ„ Do you then vnderstaÌ„d that it was deliuered by the fathers but not receiued by their sonnes Certainely they were deliuered from that vaine conuersation which they had receyued For receyuing doth necessarily importe deliuering And because you called for a Lexicon in the next section before Scapula will teach you that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 doth signifie as indifferently A patre traditus as à patre acceptus deliuered by the father and receyued by the father What wrangling then is this about the moone shine in the water to crie out false translation foysting itching fingers and I know not what MART. 7. But concerning the worde tradition you will say perhaps the sense thereof is included in the Greeke worde deliuered We graunt But would you be content if we should alwayes expresly adde tradition where it is so included then should we say 1. Cor. 11. 2. I praise you that as I haue deliuered you by tradition you keepe my precepts or traditions And againe v. 23. For I receiued of our Lord which also I deliuered vnto you by tradition c. And Luc. 1. v. 2. As they by tradition deliuered vnto vs which from the beginning sawe c. and suche lyke by your example wee should translate in this sorte But we vse not this licentious maner in translating holy Scriptures neither is it a translators parte but an interpreters and his that maketh a commentarie neither doth a good cause neede other translation than the expresse text of the Scripture giueth FVLK 7. We will say it is contained in the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth receaued by tradition or deliuerie froÌ„ the Fathers not in the verbe 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which signifieth otherwise many times thaÌ„ simply to deliuer when it signifieth to deliuer it doth not alway signifie to deliuer by word of mouth without writing as you vnderstand tradition but as well by writing as by preaching As when S. Paule saith I receaued of the Lord that which I deliuered vnto vou speaking of the institution of the supper he meaneth that which the Euangelists had written he him selfe doth write So 2. Thess. 2. when he willeth theÌ„ to hold the traditioÌ„s which they had learned of him he speaketh not only of such as they learned by his preaching but such also as they learned by his Epistle Wherefore if you should expresly adde the worde tradition in your partiall signification wheresoeuer you finde the word deliuered you shoulde not onely translate ridiculously but also heretically and falsly Wordes in deriuation and composition doe not alwaies signifie according to their primitiue MART. 8. And if you will yet say that our vulgar Latine translation hath here the worde tradition we graunt it hath so and therefore we also translate accordingly But you professe to translate the Greeke and not the vulgar Latine which you in England condemne as Papisticall and say it is the worst of all though Beza your maister pronounce it to be the very best and will you notwithstanding followe the sayde vulgar Latine rather than the Greeke to make traditions odious Yea such is your partialitie one way and inconstancie an other way that for your hereticall purpose you are content to followe the olde Latine translation though it differ from the Greeke and againe another time you will not follow it though it be all one with the Greeke most exactly as in the place before alledged where the vulgar Latine translation hath nothing of traditions but Quid decernitis as it is in the Greeke you translate Why are ye burdened with traditions FVLK 8. You may be sure we will saye that we know to be true and sufficient to discharge our translation from your foolish and malicious quarrelling But we professe you saye to translate the Greeke and not the vulgar Latine And I pray you what doth your vulgar Latine Interpreter professe to translate but the Greeke if he then translating out of Greeke could finde tradition in the Greeke worde why shoulde not we finde the same especially being admonished by him who if he translated truly why are we blamed for doing as he did if his translation be false why is it allowed as the onely authenticall text We follow not therefore the Latine translation but ioyne with it wheresoeuer it followeth the Greeke as we doe in ten thousand places more than this and willingly depart not from it but where it departeth from the Greeke or else vseth such wordes as would be offensiue if they were translated into English or occasion of errour as you doe likewise when you depart from the proper and vsuall signification of wordes which your Latine translator vseth as when you call foenerator a creditor which signifieth an vsurer Luc. 7. Stabulum an Inne and stabularius an host Luc. 10. Vna Sabathi the first of the Sabaoth Iohn 2. Ecclesia the assembly Act. 7. Baptismata washings Marc. 7. and such like But we in England you say condemne the Latine translation as papisticall We accuse it as not true in many places we saye it is the worst of all though
though wee accuse them not truly of false translation vnlesse it be false in that one Bible which for the present is redde in their Churches or as though it pertained not to them how their other English Bibles be translated or as though the people read not all indifferently without prohibition and may bee abused by euery one of them or as though the Bible which nowe is read as wee thinke in their Churches haue not the like absurde translations yea more absurde euen in this matter of images as is before declared or as though we must first learne what English translation is reade in their Church which were hard to know it changeth so oft before we may be bold to accuse them of false translation or as though it were not the same Bible that was for many yeares read in their Churches and is yet in euery mans handes which hath this absurde translation whereof we haue laste spoken FVLK 10. Mine answere was framed to Howlets reason who would proue that our seruice was naught because the Scriptures were therein redde in false and shamelesse translations example of whiche hee bringeth 1. Iohn 5. Children keepe your selues from Images To whome mine answere was apte when I saide in the Bible appointed to bee redde in the seruice it is otherwise and as he him self saith it ought to be which answere as though it were made to the generall accusation of our translations you with many supposings as though this as though that would make it seeme to be vnsufficient whereas to Howlets cauill it was not only sufficient but also proper And therfore this is a vaine supposell as though we accuse them not truely of false translation vnlesse it be false in that one Bible whiche for the present is redde in their Churche For we graunt you not the other to be false because this is true and so are all the rest As though it pertayned not to them howe their other English Bibles be translated It pertaineth so farre that if their were a faulte in the former we haue amended it in the later But in that text for which I answered I acknowledge yet no faulte neither is that mine only answere for I proue that Image and Idoll with the Apostle signifieth the same thing Or as though the people redde not all without prohibition and may be abused by euery one of them There is no suche false translation in any of them that the people canne bee abused there by to runne into heresie Yet againe Or as though the Bible which now is redde as we thinke haue not the like absurd translation yea more absurd euē in this matter of Images as is declared before As though you haue proued whatsoeuer you prate of once againe Or as though we must first learne what English translation is redde in their Church which were hard to knowe it changeth so often before we may be bold to accuse them of false translation If you will accuse that translation which is redde in our Church as Howlet doth reason would you should first learne which it is and that is no hard matter seeing there was neuer more appointed than two as oft as you say we chaunge Or at last as though it were not the same Bible that was for many yeares redde in their Churches and is yet in euery mans hands which hath this absurd translation whereof we last spake As though I could prophecie when I answered Howlet for the Bible appointed to be redde in the Church in 1. Iohn 5. that you would finde fault with an other text in that translation that sometime was redde in the church and yet is in many mens hands Which although it be well altered in that point which you quarrell at in the two later translations yet I see no absurditie in the first which for one Greeke word giueth two English words both of one signification yea the later being plainer explicating the former which to English eares is more obscure and lesse vnderstoode MART. 11. Surely the Bible that we most accuse not onely in this point but for sundrye other most grosse faultes and hereticall translations spoken of in other places is that Bible which was auctorised by Cranmer their Archbishop of Canterburie and redde all King Edwards time in their Churches and as it seemeth by the late printing thereof againe anno 1562 a great part of this Queenes reigne And certaine it is that it was so long redde in all their Churches with this venemous and corrupt translation of images alwaies in steede of idols that it made the deceiued people of their secte to despise contemne abandon the very signe and image of their saluation the crosse of Christ the holy roode or crucifixe representing the maner of his bitter passion and death the sacred images of the blessed virgin Mary the mother of God and of S. Iohn Euangelist representing their standing by the crosse at the very time of his passion In so much that now by experience we see the foule inconuenience thereof to wit that all other images and pictures of infamous harlots and heretikes of heathen tyrants and persecutors are lawfull in England at this day and their houses parlours and chambers are garnished with them onely sacredimages and representations of the holy mysterie of our redemption are esteemed idolatrous and haue bene openly defaced in most spitefull maner and burned to the great dishonour of our Sauiour Christ and his Saincts FVLK 11. That Bible perhaps you mislike more than the other translations because Archbishop Cranmer allowed it by his authoritie But howsoeuer it be as I thinke there be more imperfections in it than in the other it is not your accusation without due and substantiall proofe that can make it lesse esteemed with any indifferent or wise man If it haue caused the people to contemne and abandon all Popish Idols there is cause that we shoulde giue God thankes for it Albeit not the translation onely but preaching of the Gospell and Christ crucified especially by which Christ hath bene truely and liuely paynted forth vnto them and euen crucified amonge them hath made them contemne yea and abhorre all carnall and humane deuises of the image of our saluation or representation of his passion by vayne and dead images to be any helpes of faith religion or the worshippe of God Where you saye it is seene by experience that all other images of infamous harlots and heretikes of Heathen tyrants and persecutors are lawefull in England to garnish houses when sacred images are esteemed idolatrous defaced and burned I knowe not well your meaning For if you haue any true images of the Patriarches Prophetes Apostles or other holye persons I thinke they be as lawefull to garnishe priuate houses as the other you speake of Yea the stories of the whole Bible paynted both of the olde Testament and the newe are not forbidden but in many places vsed Prouided alwaies that in the places appoynted for
the publike seruice of God suche thinges are not lawefull for daunger of idolatrie nor in priuate places to be abused as they are of Papistes but rather though they were as auncient and as goodly monuments as the brasen serpent was which no images at this daye can be it is to the great honour of God that they shoulde be despised defaced burned and stamped to powder as that was which sometyme was erected by the commaundement of God by which not onely great miracles were wrought but the wonderfull mysterie of our saluation through faith in Christ was prefigured MART. 12. And as concerning the Bible that at this daye is redde in their Churches if it be that of the yeare 1577. it is worse sometyme in this matter of images than the other For where the other readeth Couetousnes which is worshipping of idolls there this later where vnto they appeale readeth thus Couetousnes which is worshipping of images and Ephes. 5. it readeth as absurdly as the other A couetous man which is a worshipper of images Loe this is the English Bible which they referre vs vnto as better translated and as correcting the fault of the former But because it is euident by these places that this also is partly worse and partly as ill as the other therefore this great confuter of Maister Iohn Houlet fleeth once more to the Geneua English Bible saying Thus we reade and so we translate to wit A couetous person which is an Idolater Where shall we haue these good fellowes and howe shall we be sure that they will stande to any of their translations from the first redde in their Churches they flee to that that is nowe redde and from this againe to the later Geneua English Bibles neither redde in their Churches as we suppose nor of greatest authoritie among them and we doubt not but they will as fast flee from this to the former againe when this shall be proued in some places more false and absurd than the other FVLK 12. It pleaseth you worse perhaps that lesse fauoureth your pelting distinction of images and idols but it is neuer the worse to be liked of them that be wise and learned which know that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in Greeke doe signifie the same thing which you can not deny And where you say in your scornefull moode loe this is the Bible which they referre vs vnto as better trāslated and as correcting the fault of the former you follow your accustomed vaine of lying For I acknowledge no fault of the former in this point of images but confute the frowardnes of that foolish reason which accuseth our seruice of reading the Bible in shamelesse translations in that text 1. Iohn 5. whereas in the Bible appointed for the seruice it is not as he sayth but euen as he would haue vs to saye I flye not therefore as it pleaseth your wisedom to say from that translation also to the Geneua Bible neither doe I alledge the Geneua trāslation for that cause you pretend but to shew that albeit we translate in such words as you can not mislike yet your venemous slaundering pennes and tongues can neuer giue ouer your peeuish quarrelling In the place by you quoted I defend both as true and answerable to the Greeke and of one sense and meaning where the sound of words onely is diuers the signification of matter one and the same And yet you must haue your foolish florish in roperipe termes Where shall we haue these good fellowes c You shall haue vs by the grace of God ready to iustifie all our translation from shamelesse falsification and hereticall corruptions which is your impudent charge against vs. And if in matter of lesser moment you can descry the least errour in any or in all of our translations we shall be willing to confesse the same and ready to reforme it For truth is deerer to vs than credit although we thinke it better credit to reforme a fault than being admonished wilfully to cōtinue it or defend it MART. 13. But what matter is it howe they reade in their churches or how they correct their former translations by the later when the olde corruption remaineth still being set of purpose in the top of euery dore within their churches in these wordes Babes keepe your selues from images Why remaineth that written so often and so conspicuously in the wals of their churches which in their Bibles they correst as a fault their later Bibles say Keepe your selues from idols their church walles say Keepe your selues from images S. Iohn speaking to the lately conuerted Gentiles biddeth them beware of the idols from whence they were conuerted they speaking to the olde instructed Christians bid them beware of the sacred image of Christ our Sauiour of the holy Crucifixe of the Crosse of euerie such representation and monument of Christes passion and our redemption And therefore in the verie same place where these holy monumentes were wont to stande in Catholike times to witte in the roode loft and partition of the Church and chauncell there nowe standes these wordes as confronting and condemning the foresayd holy monumentes Babes keepe your selues from images Which wordes whosoeuer esteemeth as the wordes of Scripture and the wordes of Sainct Iohn spoken against Christes image is made a verie babe in deede and sottishly abused by their scribled doores and false translations to count that idolatrie which is in deede to no other purpose than to the great honour of him whose image and picture it is FVLK 13. Still you harpe on the olde vntuneable string that the former is a corruption which saith Babes kepe your selues from images which sentence sore grieueth you to be written in the toppe of church dores or in place where the Roode loft stoode And you aske why it remaineth on the wals which we correct as a fault in the Bibles But who tolde you that they correct it as a fault in the Bibles Is euery alteration with you a correction The one explicateth the other that idols of which S. Iohn speaketh be images abused in religion Not that all images be idols as the worde idoll in the Englishe speach is taken nor that al idols be images but as images that are worshipped But S. Iohn you say speaking to the conuerted Gentiles biddeth them beware of the idols from whence they were conuerted That is true but not onely from them but from all other idols Except perhappes you thinke that Christians by that texte shoulde not abhorre the images of Simon Magus and Selene and the images of the Valentinians and Gnostikes and other heretikes which worshipped the image of Christ and of Sainct Paule as Irenaeus and Epiphanius doe testifie And it seemeth you so thinke in deede For you say soone after whosoeuer esteemeth those wordes as the wordes of Scripture if images be put for idolls spoken against Christes image is made a verie babe Suchs babes were Irenaeus
than a good subiect woulde call his lawfull Prince a Tyrant Doth he not here tell vs that which we would haue to wit that we may not speake or translate according to the originall propertie of the word but according to the common vsuall and accustomed signification thereof As we may not translate Phalaris tyrannus Phalaris the King as sometime Tyrannus did signifie and in auncient authors doth signifie but Phalaris the tyrant as now this worde tyrannus is commonly taken and vnderstoode Euen so we may not now translate My children keepe you selues from images as the word may and doth sometime signifie according to the originall propertie thereof but we must translate keepe your selues from idols according to the common vse and signification of the word in vulgar speech and in the holy Scriptures Where the Greeke word is so notoriously and vsually peculiar to idols and not vnto images that the holy fathers of the second Nicene Councell which knew right well the signification of the Greeke word them selues being Grecians doe pronounce Anathema to all such as interprete those places of the holy scripture that concerne idols of images or against sacred images as now these Caluinists doe not onely in their commentaries vpon the holy Scriptures but euen in their translatiōs of the text FVLK 17. We can not yet be rid of this mans extraordinarie and vnaduised surmises which are too many and tedious as where I say the name Idoll is odious in the English tongue he gathereth that I meane it to be odious onely in the English tongue and not in the Latine and Greeke I haue shewed before that in Tullies time it was not odious in Latine and it is not long since Maister Martin confessed the Greeke worde according to the originall proprietie to signifie as generally as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 an image which is not odious Although in later times among Christians both of the Greeke and the Latine Church the name of Idolum became odious as well as the word Idoll in English Therefore it is not my fond opinion but. M. Martines foolish collection that a man may say in Latine fecit hominem ad idolum suum and yet I am charged with rash assertions when nothing is reproued that I affirme but that which he him selfe doth imagine But nowe you will returne to those wordes of myne where I say that though the originall proprietie of the wordes hath that signification yet no Christian man would say that God made man according to his idoll no more than a good subiect woulde call his lawefull Prince a tyrant These wordes you say doe tell vs that we may not speake or translate according to the originall proprietie of the word but according to the common vsual and accustomed signification thereof For speaking I graunt as the words are vsed in our time but for translating I saye you must regarde howe the wordes were vsed in time of the writer whose workes you translate As if you would translate out of Euripides 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 would you say who is tyrant of this land or rather who is King or in Aristophanes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 would you translate Iupiter tyrant of the gods or King of the gods I thinke not But in S. Iohn seeing at that tyme that he wrote 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signified an image generally it may be translated an image generally and seeing he speaketh of the vnlawefull vse of images it may also be translated an idoll as the worde is nowe taken to signifie Howe the late pettie Prelates of the seconde Nicene Councell were disposed to vse the worde to colour their blasphemous idolatrie it is not materiall The auncient dictionaries of Suidas Phauorinus Hesychius with the examples of Homer Plato and other auncient Greeke Authors are of more credite for the true and auncient signification of that word MART. 18. This then being so that wordes must be translated as their common vse and signification requireth if you aske your olde question what great crime of corruption is committed in translating keepe your selues from images the Greeke being 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 you haue aunswered your selfe that in so translating idoll and image are made to signifie one thing which may not be done no more than Tyrant and King can be made to signifie all one And how can you say then that this is no more absurditie than in steede of a Greeke worde to vse a Latine of the same signification Are you not here cōtrary your selfe Are idoll and image Tyrant and King of one signification sayd you not that in the English tongue idoll is growen to an other signification than image as tyrant is growen to an other signification than King Your false translations therefore that in so many places make idols and images all one not onely forcing the word in the holy Scriptures but disgracing the sentence thereby as Ephes. 5. Col. 3. are they not in your owne iudgement very corrupt and as your owne consciences must confesse of a malitious intent corrupted to disgrace thereby the Churches holy images by pretence of the holy Scriptures that speake onely of the Pagans idols FVLK 18. Againe I repeate that wordes must or may be translated according to that signification they had in time of the writer whome you translate And to my question what absurditie is it in that text of Saint Iohn for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to translate image you aunswer by that meanes idoll and image are made to signifie one thing But that is not so for image signifieth more generally than idoll in English and image aunswereth properly to the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 idoll to the meaning of Saint Iohn that is of wicked images so that the translation is good Euen as 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 may be translated a King generally according to the worde and if the Author meane of a cruell King it may be translated a Tyrant For King is a generall word applyed to good Kings and to euill as image is to lawefull and vnlawefull images Therefore our translations that for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 saye an image are not false much lesse anye malicious corruptions And if the translators in so doing intended to disgrace popishe images I thinke they did wel and according to the meaning of the holy Ghost who forbidding generally all images that may be had in religious reuerence did not restraine the signification of the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to the wicked idols of the Gentiles but left it at large to comprehend all such images and all kindes of worshipping them as are contrary to the lawe and commaundement of God MART. 19. But of the vsuall and originall signification of wordes whereof you take occasion of manifold corruptions we will speake more anone if first we touch some other your falsifications against holy images as where you affectate to thrust the word Image into the text when there is
no such thing in the Hebrew or Greeke as in that notorious example 2. Par. 36. Bib. 1562. Carued images that were layd to his charge Againe Rom. 11. To the image of Baal and Act. 19 The image that came downe from Iupiter Where you are not content to vnderstand image rather than idoll but also to thrust it into the text being not in the Greeke as you knowe very well FVLK 19. Three places you note where the word Image is thrust into the text being neither in the Hebrew nor Greeke The first 2. Par. 36. bib 1562. which I confesse is a fault but I maruell how it crept in For Thomas Mathewes bible which was printed before it hath not that worde Carued images It is reformed also in both the translations that followed The second Rom. 11. is no corruption for seeing you acknowledge that a substantiue must be vnderstoode to beare vp the feminine article what reason is there why we should not vnderstand 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 rather than 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 seeing it is certaine Baal had an image that was worshipped in his temple 2. Reg. 10. The third place is Actes the 19. where the worde Image is necessarily to be vnderstoode which fell downe from Iupiter as it was fayned Herevnto Plinie beareth witnesse lib. 16. cap. 40. sheweth by whom it was made of what matter of the like speaketh Herodianus And the similitude of this Image is yet to be seene in those auncient Coygnes that yet remaine which were called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 temples Wherefore your vulgar translation which turneth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Iouis prolis is not right and therefore is corrected by Isidorus Clarius a Ioue delapsi simulachri with the consent of the deputies of the Councell of Trent MART. 20. Of this kinde of falsification is that which is crept as a leprosie through out all your Bibles translating Sculptile and conflatile grauen image molten image namely in the first commaundement where you know in the Greeke it is idoll and in the Hebrue such a worde as signifieth onely a grauen thing not including this worde image and you know that God commaunded to make the images of Cherubins and of oxen in the Temple and of the brasen serpent in the desert and therfore your wisedomes might haue considered that he forbadde not all grauen images but such as the Gentiles made and worshipped as Goddes and therefore Non facies tibi sculptile concurreth with those wordes that goe before Thou shalte haue none other gods but me For so to haue an image as to make it a God is to mke it more than an image and therefore when it is an Idoll as were the Idols of the Gentiles then it is forbid by this commaundement Otherwise when the Crosse stood many yeares vpon the Table in the Queenes Chappell was it against this commaundement or was it idolatrie in the Queenes Maiestie and her Counsellers that appointed it there being the supreme head of your Churche Or do the Lutherans your puefellowes at this day commit idolatrie against this commaundement that haue in their Churches the crucifixe and the holy Images of the mother of God and of S. Iohn the Euangelist Or if the whole storie of the Gospell concerning our sauiour Christ were drawen in pictures and Images in your Churches as it is in many of ours were it trow you against this commaundement fie for shame that you should thus with intolerable impudencie and deceite abuse and bewitch the ignorant people against your owne knowledge and conscience For wot you not that God many times expresly forbade the Iewes both mariages and other conuersation with the Gentiles least they might fall to worship their idols as Salomon did and as the Psalme reporteth of them This then is the meaning of the commaundement neither to make the idols of the Gentiles nor any other like vnto them and to that end as did Ieroboam in Dan and Bethel FVLK 20. This is a sore complaint that we haue falsified the Scripture as it were with a Leprosie in translating sculptile and conflatile a grauen and a molten Image and namely in the first commaundement where there is no worde of Image or Imagrie but in deede in the second commaundement wee translate the Hebrue worde Pesel a grauen Image You say it signifieth a grauen thing not including the worde Image I answere you are not able to bring a place in the Bible where it signifieth any other grauen thing but onely an Image yet it is deriued of a verbe that signifieth to graue or hewe as the worde Pisilim Iud. 3. taken for quarries of stone doth declare Beside this the worde nexte following signifying a similitude or Image sufficiently sheweth that it is not taken generally for any grauen worke but for such wherein the likenesse or similitude of God or any creature is meante to be resembled and the same doth also the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 testifie as for the Cherubins Oxen Brasen serpent or any thing which God commaundeth is not forbidden by this precept but that whiche man maketh of his owne head to honour as God or to worship God by it Wherefore very absurdely to cloake suche abhominable Idolatrie you say that this commaundement Non facies sculptile doth concurre with those words Thou shalt haue none other Gods but me By which not only two seuerall cōmaundements are confounded but also a vaine tautologie cōmitted or els that added for interpretatiō which is more obscure than the text interpreted Touching the crosse that stoode sometimes in the Queenes chappel whereof you speake your pleasure as also of hir Maiesties Councellours it is not by and by Idolatrie what soeuer is against that commaundement neither is the hauing of any Images in the Churche which are had in no vse of religion contrarie to this commaundement And although wee will not accuse the Lutherans of Idolatrie neither can wee because they worship no Images yet will we not excuse them for suffering of Images to be in their Churches whereof may ensue daunger of Idolatrie but that in some parte they goe against this commaundement deceyued in their iudgement and of vs not to be defended in their errour After you haue railed a fitte with fie for shame and suche like Rhetorike you seeme to make the prohibition of Images none other but such as the prohibition of mariage and other conuersation with the Gentiles which was only for feare of Idolatrie But when you can shewe the like absolute commaundement to forbid mariage and conuersation with the Heathen as this is for Images in religion and worshipping of them we may haue some regarde of your similitude otherwise the meaning of this commaundement is generally to forbid all Images of God and of his creatures to honour God by them for to honour them as Gods is a breach of the first commaundement
of faith necessarie to saluation are comprehended But we are content to be iudged by those places which seeme of most importance for the dignity preheminence authoritye of the Church MART. 2. Our Sauiour saith Vpon this Rocke I will build my Church and the gates of hell shall not preuaile against it They make him to say Vpō this rocke I wil build my congregation Againe If he heare not them tell the Church if he heare not the Church let him be to thee as an Heathen and as a publicane they say Congregation Againe who woulde thinke they woulde haue altered the worde Church in the Epistle to the Ephesians their English translation for many yeares red thus Ye husbands loue your wiues as Christ loued the congregation and clensed it to make it vnto him selfe a glorious congregation without spot or wrinkle And This is a great secrete but I speake of Christ of the cōgregation And to Timothee The house of God which is the cōgregation of the liuing God the pillar and grounde of truth Here is no worde of Churche which in Latine Greeke is Ecclesia Dei viui columna firmamētum veritatis Likewise to the Ephesians againe He hath made him heade of the congregation which is his bodie And to the Hebrues they are all bolde to translate The congregation of the first borne where the Apostle nameth heauenly Hierusalem the citie of the liuing God c. FVLK 2. In the first English Bible printed where it was thus translated Math. 16. vppon this rocke I will build my congregation the note in the margent is thus vpon this rock that is as saith S. Augustin vpon the confession which thou hast made knowledging me to be Christ the sonne of the liuing God I will build my congregation or Church Was not this translator thinke you sore afraid of the name of the Church What other thing should he vnderstand by the word congregation in al places by you noted or in any like but the church as he doth here expound him selfe And this translation almost worde for worde doth the Bible you call 1562. follow MART. 3. So that by this translation there is no more Church militant and triumphant but congregation and he is not head of the Church but of the congregation and this congregation at the time of the making of this translation was in a few new brethren of England for whose sake the name Church was left out of the English Bible to commend the name of congregation aboue the name of Church Whereas S. Augustine telleth them that the Iewes Synagogue was a congregation the Church a conuocation and that a congregation is of beasts also a conuocation of reasonable creatures onely and that the Iewes congregation is sometime called the Church but the Apostles neuer called the Church Congregation Doe you see then what a goodly chaunge they haue made for Church to say congregation so making themselues a very Synagogue that by the property of the Greeke word which yet as S. Augustine telleth them most truely signifieth rather a conuocation FVLK 3. A strange matter that the Church militant and triumphant should be excluded by vsing the word congregation when by it nothing is signified but the congregation or Church militant and triumphant and that Christ should no more be head of the Churche when he is head of the congregation where the differēce is only in sound of words not in sense or meaning Your vaine and ridiculous surmise why the name of Church shuld be left out of the Bible I haue before cōfuted shewing that in euery Bible it is either in the text or in the notes But S. Augustin telleth vs say you that the Iewes synagoge was a congregation the church a cōuocation that a congregation is of beasts also a conuocation of reasonable creatures only But S. Luke in the person of S. Stephen telleth vs and Augustine telleth vs as much that the synagoge of the Iewes is called also Ecclesia which signifieth the church and congregation That Congregatio the Latin word may be of beasts also it skilleth not for the church of Christ is called also a flocke and sheepe of his pasture But he that should say in English a cōgregation of beastes might be taken for as wise a man as he that said an audiēce of sheepe And wheras S. Augustine telleth you that the Iewes congregation is somtime called the church what is the cause that you doe translate it the assembly Act. 7. euen as you do the congregation of the Idolatrous Ephesians Act. 19 But further you say Augustine telleth vs that the Apostles neuer called the church congregation It is a worlde to see what foolishe fetches you haue to deceiue the ignoraunt Augustine sayeth the Apostles neuer called our assembly Synagoga but alwaies Ecclesia and yet he is a litle deceiued for S. Paul calleth our gathering togither vnto Christ 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but Congregatio a cōgregation he saith not And although he make a nice distinction betwene the wordes Congregation Conuocation yet all men which know the vse of these words will confesse no necessitie of a Iewish synagoge to be implied in the word cōgregation more than in the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which of the holy Ghost is vsed for an assembly or gathering togither either of Iewes Christiās or Gentils And therfore it seemeth the translatour vsed the word congregation which is indifferent for all euen as the worde Ecclesia is vsed both in the Greeke and vulgar Latine MART. 4. If they appeale here to their later translatiōs we must obtaine of them to condemne the former and to confesse this was a grosse fault cōmitted therein And that the Catholike Church of our coūtrie did not il to forbid burne such bookes which were so translated by Tyndal and the like as being not in deede Gods booke worde or Scripture but the Diuels worde Yea they must confesse that the leauing out of this worde Church altogither was of an hereticall spirite against the Catholike Romane Church because then they had no Caluinisticall Church in any like forme of religion gouernement to theirs now Neither will it serue them to say after their maner And if a man should translate Ecclesiam congregation this is no more absurdity than in steede of a Greeke word to vse a Latin of the same signification This we trow will not suffise them in the iudgement of the simplest indifferent Reader FVLK 4. Wee neede not to appeale to the later translations for any corruption or falsification of the former no nor for any mistranslation For seing the spirite of God as I haue said before vseth the word Ecclesia generally for a companie of Christians Iewes and Gentils the translator hath not gone from the truth and vse of the Scriptures to vse the word cōgregation which signifieth indifferently all three Wherefore there needeth no condemnation nor
ipse agit in omnibus vel per omnes homines haec implet membra Siue pleniâ—udinem complementum omne suum habet ipsa ecclesia ab illo qui omnia in omnibus adimplet That is the fulnesse of him\ for by all the members the bodie of Christ is filled because he filleth all in all while he worketh in all or throughout all men filleth these members Or else the Church hir selfe hath all hir fulnesse and accoÌ„plishment of him which filleth al in al. These meÌ„ both Papists were as good Grecians I warrant you as M. Gregorie Martin is or euer will be by whom if he will not be controlled it were folly to presse him with the iudgement of our Greeke readers which he requireth MART. 8. Yet saith Beza this is a forced interpretation because Xenophon forsooth and Plato once perhaps in all their whole workes vse it otherwise O hereticall blindnesse or rather stubburnnesse that calleth that forced which is moste common and vsuall and seeth not that his owne translation is forced because it is against the common vse of the worde But no maruel For he that in other places thinketh it no forced interpretation to translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to be conteined Which neyther Xenophon nor Plato nor any Greeke author will allow him to do 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 carcas 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 prouidence 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 them that ameÌ„d their liues may much more in this place dissemble his forced interpretatioÌ„ of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 But why he should call S. Chrysostoms interpretation forced which is the coÌ„mon and vsuall interpretation that hath no more reason than if a very theefe should say to an honest man Thou art a theefe and not I. FVLK 8. I haue shewed how it is inforced because in taking the participle passiuely you must either be enforced to admitte a playne soloecisme where none needeth or else you must hardly vnderstande the preposition 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to gouerne the accusatiue 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as Montanus telleth you in Theophylact and as Oecumenius doth the sense wil be no more than is contained in the worde Complemenium Whereas by taking it actiuely the wonderfull goodnesse of Christ shineth toward his Church who although he needeth nothing to make him perfect as Chysostome saith but supplieth al things in al things yet it is his gratious pleasure to accoumpt him selfe imperfect without his Church which he hath vnited to him as his bodie in which he is not perfect without all his members As for your vayne and tedious repetition lyke the Cuckowes songe of Bezaes misprisions I will not stand so often to answere as you are disposed to rehearse theÌ„ Only I must admonish the reader of a piece of your cunning that in repeating the participle you chaunge the temps and for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 you say 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as though it were the preterperfect temps whiche can not bee taken but only passiuely I know the Printer shall beare the blame of this ouersight but in the meane time it maketh a litle shew to a yong Grecian that considereth it not MART. 9. Is it forced Beza that Christe is filled all in all by the Church doth not S. Paul in the very next wordes before call the Churche the fulnesse of Christ saying Which is the fulnesse of him that is filled all in al If the Church be the fulnesse of him then is he filled or hath his fulnesse of the Church so that he is not a maymed head without a bodie This would S. Paule say if you would giue him leaue and this he doth say whether you will or no. But what is the cause that they will not suffer the Apostle to say so because saith Beza Christe needeth no such complement And if he needeth it not then may he be without a Church and consequently it is no absurditie if the Church hath bene for many yeares not only inuisible but also not at all Would a man easily at the first imagine or conceiue that there were such secrete poison in their translation FVLK 9. You should vrge Beza with a Latine Epistle seeing you are so earnest in the matter I haue tolde you that the sense of Chrysostome is true but not flowing easily from the wordes of S. Paule That Christ hath his fulnesse of the Churche it is graunted by Beza vpon the worde Plenitudo or Complemenium as you can not be ignorant if you haue redde Bezaes Annotations as you pretende But you charge Beza to say that Christ needeth no such complement Bezaes wordes are as I haue sett hem downe before Vt sciamus Christum per se non indigere hoc supplemento that wee may knowe that Christe of him selfe needeth not this supplie Is this al one with that you report him to say No his saying was too long for your theeuish bedde and therefore you cut of Perse of him selfe or by him selfe What say you Dare you affirme that Christe of him selfe in respect of his diuine nature hath neede of any complement That Christe hath had alwaies a Churche since the beginning of the worlde and shall haue to the ende Beza dothe plainely in an hundreth places confesse neither can it be otherwise proued by this translation nor vet by Bezaes wordes that Christe of him selfe is perfect and needeth no supply but that it pleaseth him to become the head of the Churche as of his bodie whiche his diuine and mercifull pleasure seeing it is immutable Christe can not be without his Churche nor the Churche without him Yea as Beza in plaine wordes affirmeth this is our whole hope and consolation that Christ esteemeth him selfe an vnperfect head and maymed of his members excepte he haue his Churche adioyned to him as his bodie MART. 10. Againe it commeth from the same puddle of Geneua that in their Bibles so called the English Bezites translate against the vnitie of the Catholike Church For whereas them selues are full of sectes and dissensions and the true Church is knowen by vnitie and hath this marke giuen her by Christe him selfe in whose person Salomon speaking saith Vna est columba mea that is One is my doue or My doue is one Therefore in steede hereof the foresayed Bible sayeth My doue is alone Neither Hebrue nor Greeke worde hauing that signification but being as proper to signifie one as Vnus in Latine FVLK 10. He that hath any nose may smel that this censure commeth from the stinking puddle of Popish malice For he that sayth my doue is alone Cant. 6. 8. doth a great deale more strongly aduouche the vnitie of the Church than he that sayeth my doue is one For whereas Salomon sayeth in the verse going immediatly before There are three score Queenes and foure score concubines and of the damsels without number if you adde thereto my doue is one it may bee
thought she is one of those last mentioned But if you say as the Geneua Bible doth but my doue is alone and my vndefiled is the onely daughter of her mother Nowe the church is excepted from all the rest of the Queenes concubines and damsels And where you say the Hebrue hath not that signification I pray you goe no further but euen to the same verse and tell me whether the sense be that she is one of her mothers daughters or the only daughter of her mother Here therefore as almost euery where you doe nothing but seeke a knot in a rush MART. 11. But we beseeche euerie indifferent Reader euen for his soules health to consider that one point specially before mentioned of their abandoning the name of Church for so many yeares out of their Englishe Bibles thereby to defeate the strongest argument that might and may possibly be brought against them and all other Heretikes to wit the authoritie of the Church which is so many wayes and so greatly recommended vnto all Christians in ho'y Scriptures Consider I pray you what a malitious intention they had herein First that the name Church shoulde neuer sound in the common peoples eares out of the Scriptures secondly that as in other things so in this also it might seeme to the ignoraunt a good argument against the authoritie of the Church to say We finde not this worde Church in all the holy Scriptures For as in other articles they say so because they finde not the expresse word in the holy Scripture so did they well prouide that the worde Church in the holy Scriptures should not stay or hinder their schismaticall and hereticall proceedings as long as that was the only English translation that was read and liked among the people that is so long till they had by preaching taken away the Catholike Churches credit and authorite altogither among the ignorant by opposing the Scriptures thereunto which them selues had thus falsely translated FVLK 11. We trust euerie indifferent Reader wil consider that they which translated the Greeke worde Ecclesia the congregation and admonished in the notes that they did by that worde meane the church and they which in the creede might haue translated Ecclesiam Catholicam the vniuersall congregation taught all children to say I beleue the Catholike churche coulde haue no such deuilish meaning as this malicious sclaunderer of his owne heade doeth imagine For who euer hearde any man reason thus This worde church is not found in the Scripture therefore the church must be despised c. Rather it is like beside other reasons before alleaged that those first translatours hauing in the olde Testament out of the Hebrue translated the wordes Cahal Hadath and such other for the congregation where the Papistes will not translate the church although their Latine text be Ecclesia as appeareth Act. 7. where they call it assembly thought good to retaine the word congregation throughout the newe Testament also least it might be thought of the ignoraunt that God had no church in the time of the olde Testament Howsoeuer it was they departed neither from the word nor meaning of the holy Ghost nor from the vsage of that word Ecclesia which in the Scripture signifieth as generally any assembly as the worde Congregation doeth in Englishe CHAP. VI. Hereticall translation against PRIEST and PRIESTHOODE Martin BVt because it may be they will stande here vpon their later translations which haue the name Church because by that time they sawe the absurditie of chaunging the name now their number was increased and them selues beganne to challenge to be the true Church though not the Catholike and for former times when they were not they deuised an inuisible Church If then they will stande vpon their later translations and refuse to iustifie the former let vs demaund of them concerning all their Englishe translation why and to what ende they suppresse the name Priest trāslating it Elder in all places where the holy Scripture would signifie by Presbyter and Presbyterium the Priestes and Priesthoode of the new Testament Fulke IF any errour haue escaped the former translations that hath bene reformed in the later all reasonable men ought to be satisfied with our owne corrections But because we are not charged with ouersights and small faults committed either of ignorāce or of negligence but with shamelesse trāslations wilful heretical corruptions we may not acknowledge any such crimes whereof our conscience is cleare That we deuised an inuisible church because we were few in number whē our translations were first printed it is a lewde sclaunder For being multiplied as we are God be thanked we holde still that the Catholike church which is the mother of vs all is inuisible and that the church on earth may at sometimes be driuen into suche streights as of the wicked it shall not be knowen And this we helde alwayes and not otherwise Nowe touching the worde Presbyter and Presbyterium why we translate them not Priest and Priesthoode of the new Testament we haue giuen sufficient reason before but because we are here vrged a freshe we must aunswere as occasion shall bee offered MART. 2. Vnderstand gentle Reader their wily pollicie therein is this To take away the holy sacrifice of the Masse they take away both altar and Priest because they know right well that these three Priest sacrifice and altar are dependentes and consequentes one of an other so that they can not be separated If there be an externall sacrifice there must be an external Priesthoode to offer it an altar to offer the same vpon So had the Gentiles their sacrifices Priestes and altars so had the Iewes so Christ him selfe being a Priest according to the order of Melchisedec had a sacrifice his bodie and an altar his Crosse vpon the which he offered it And because he instituted this sacrifice to continue in his Church for euer in commemoration and representation of his death therefore did he withall ordaine his Apostles Priests at his last supper there then instituted the holy order of Priesthoode and Priestes saying hoc faecite Do this to offer the selfe same sacrifice in a mysticall and vnblouddie maner vntill the worldes end FVLK 2. In denying the blasphemous sacrifice of the popish masse with the altar priesthood that therto belongeth we vse no wily policie but with open mouth at all times and in all places we cry out vpon it The sacrifices priestes and altars of the Gentiles were abhominable The sacrifices of the Iewes their priestes and altars are all accomplished and finished in the onely sacrifice of Christ our high Priest offered once for all vpon the altar of the crosse which Christ our Sauiour seeing he is a Priest according to the order of Melchisedech hath an eternall priesthood and such as passeth not by succession Heb. 7. Therefore did not Christ at his last supper institute any externall propitiatory sacrifice of his bodie and bloud but
Where if they wil tel vs as also in certaine other places that our Latine translation hath Seniores and maiores natu we tel them as heretofore we haue told them that this is nothing to them who professe to translate the Greeke Againe we say that if they meant no worse than the olde Latine translator did they would be as indifferent as he to haue sayde sometime Priests Priesthood when he hath the words Presbyteros Presbyterium as we are indifferent in our translation saying Seniors and Auncients when we finde it so in our Latine being well assured that by sundry wordes he meant but one thing as in Greeke it is but one as both Erasmus also Beza him selfe alwaies translate it keeping the name Presbyter Presbyteri of whome by reason they should haue learned rather than of our Latine translator whom otherwise they condemne And if they say they doe follow them not him because they translate not Senior maior natu but the word Presbyter or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 an Elder in all places we tell them and herein we conuent their conscience that they doe it to take away the externall Priesthood of the new Testament and to suppresse the name Priest against the Ecclesiasticall as nowe since Christ very proper vsual signification thereof in the newe Testament councels fathers in all common writing and speaking specially the Latine Presbyter which grew to this signification out of the Greeke in the foresayd places of holy scripture FVLK 10. I haue told you already you could not but know that it should be told you that seeing we translate none otherwise thaÌ„ your vulgar Latine traÌ„slator we are no more to be blamed of falshood corruption profanenesse nouelty thaÌ„ he is who professed to traslate the Greeke as much as we do But if we had meant no worse say you than he we would haue bene as indifferent to haue said somtimes priest priesthood where he hath the word Presbyteros PresbyteriuÌ„ I aunswer PresbyteriuÌ„ he hath but once and for that you haue Priesthood once as you confessed before And if the name Priest were of the same vnderstanding in common English that the worde Presbyter is from whence it is deriued we woulde neuer haue sought more wordes for it than we doe for the wordes Bishoppe Deacon and such like The wordes Presbyter and Presbyterium you confesse that Beza doth alwayes vse and so doe we when we write or speake Latine but we can not vse them in English except we shoulde be as fonde as you in your gratis deposiâ—um and suche fantasies And to tell you plainely as our conscience beareth vs witnesse we will neuer dissemble that we auoyde that worde Priest as it is vsed to signifie a sacrificer because we would shew a perfect distinction betwene the priesthood of the lawe and the ministerye of the Gospell betwene Sacerdos and Presbyter a sacrificer and a gouernor of the Church And I appeale to your owne conscience whether if the Englishe worde Priest were as indifferent as Presbyter and sounded no more towardes a sacrifice than either Presbyter or your owne Englishe wordes Auncient and Senior whether I saye you woulde make so muche a doe about it for to haue it in all places of the Newe Testament where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is in the Greeke But seeing your popishe sacrificing power and blasphemous sactifice of your Masse hath no manner grounde at all in the holye Scriptures eyther in the originall Greeke or in your owne Latine translation you are driuen to seeke a seelye shadowe for it in the abusiue acception and sounding of the Englishe worde Priest and priesthoode And therefore you doe in the seconde section of this chapiter in greate earnest affirme that Priest sacrifice and altar are dependents and consequents one of another so that they can not be separated If you shoulde saye in Latine Sacerdos sacrificium altare or in Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 be such consequents we will all subscribe vnto you but if you will chaunge the first word and say Presbyter sacrificium altare or 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 euerie learned mans eares will gloe to heare you say they are dependents and consequentes inseparable Therefore we must needes distinguish of the word Priest in your Corollarie for you meane thereby Sacerdotem we graunt the consequence of sacrifice and altar but if you meane Presbyterium we deny that euer God ioyned those three in an vnseparable bande or that Presbyter in that he is Presbyter hath any thing to doe with sacrifice or altar more than Senior or Maicr natu or Auncient or Elder MART. 11. Insomuch that immediatly in the first Canons and Councels of the Apostles and their successors nothing is more common than this distinction of Ecclesiasticall degrees and names Si Episcopus vel Presbyter vel Diaconus c. If any Bishop or Priest or Deacon doe this or that Which if the Protestantes or Caluinistes will translate after their maner thus If a Bishoppe or Elder or Deacon c. they doe against them selues which make Presbyter or Elder a common name to all Ecclesiastical persons and not a peculiar degree next vnto a Bishop So that either they must condemne all antiquity for placing Presbyter in the 2. degree after a Bishoppe or they must translate it Priest as we doe or they must make Elder to be their seconde degree and so put Minister out of place FVLK 11. The distinction of Episcopus and Presbyter to signifie seuerall offices we graunt to be of great antiquitie albeit we may not admitte the counterfaite Canons of the Apostles nor the Epistles of Ignatius for suche mens writings as they beare the name to be We make Presbyter or Elder a common name to all Ecclesiasticall persons none otherwise than you doe this word Priest For Deacons with vs are not called Presbyteri or Elders As for the distinction of Bishoppes and Elders names which the Scripture taketh for the same doth no more condemne all antiquity in vs than in you Who acknowledge that the Scripture vseth those names without distinctioÌ„ in your note vpon Act. 20. v. 28. where they are called Bishoppes which before ver 17. are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which you translate Auncients and expound Priests and thus you write Bishops or Priests for those names were sometime vsed indifferently Gouernours of the Churche of God and placed in that roome and high function by the holy Ghost But it seemeth you haue small regard to defende your owne notes so you might find occasion to quarrell at our wordes MART. 12. And here we must aske them how this name Minister came to be a degree distinct from a Deacon whereas by their owne rule of translation Deacon is nothing else but a Minister why keepe they the old and vsuall Ecclesiasticall name of Deacon in translating Diaconus and not the name of Priest in translating
Presbyter Doeth not Priest come of Presbyter as certainly and as agreeably as Deacon of Diaconus Doth not also the French and Italian word for Priest come directly from the same Will you alwaies followe fansie and not reason doe what you list translate as you list and not as the truth is and that in the holy Scriptures which you boast and vaunt so much of Because your selues haue theÌ„ whom you call Bishops the name Bishops is in your Englishe Bibles which otherwise by your owne rule of translation should be called an Ouerseer or Superintendent likewise Deacon you are content to vse as an Ecclesiasticall word so vsed in antiquitie because you also haue those whom you call Deacons Only Priests must be turned contemptuously out of the text of the holy Scriptures Elders put in their place because you haue no Priestes nor will none of them and because that is in controuersie betwene vs. And as for Elders you haue none permitted in EnglaÌ„d for feare of ouerthrowing your Bishops office and the Queenes supreame gouernment in all spiritual things and causes Is not this to followe the humour of your heresie by Machiauels politike rules without any feare of God FVLK 12. Here I must aunswere you that we haue no degree of Ministers distinct from Deacons but by vulgar and popular vse of speaking which we are not curious to controule Otherwise in truth we account Bishops Elders and Deacons all Ministers of the Church It is no more therefore but the common speache of men which vseth that worde which is common to all Ecclesiasticall persons as peculiar to the Elders or Priestes Why we keepe the name of Deacons in translating Diaconus rather than of Priestes in translating Presbyter I haue tolde you often before The name Priest being by long abuse of speache applied to signifie Sacrificers of the olde Testament called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 we could not giue the same name to the Ministers of the new Testament except we had some other name whereby to call the Ministers of the olde Testament wherein we followe reason and not fansie for it is great reason we should retaine that difference in names of the Ministers of both the Testamentes which the holy Ghost doth alwaies obserue But you follow fansie altogither imagining that Priestes onely are put out of the text because we haue no Priestes Whereas we haue Priestes as well as we haue Bishops and Deacons and so are they called in our booke of common prayer indifferently Priestes or Ministers And where you say we haue no Elders permitted in Englande it is false for those that are commonly called Bishoppes Ministers or Priestes among vs be suche Elders as the Scripture commendeth vnto vs. And although we haue not suche a consistorie of Elders of gouernemente as in the Primitiue Churche they had and many Churches at this daye haue yet haue wee also Elders of gouernement to exercise discipline as Archbishoppes and Bishoppes with their Chauncellours Archedeacons Commissaries Officialles in whome if any defecte bee we wishe it may be reformed according to the worde of God MART. 13. Apostles you say for the most parte in your translations not alwayes as we doe and Prophetes and Euangelistes and Angels and such like wheresoeuer there is no matter of controuersie betwene you and vs there you can pleade verie grauely for keeping the auncient Ecclesiasticall wordes as your maister Beza for example beside many other places where he bitterly rebuketh his fellow Castalâ—ons translation in one place writeth thus I can not in this place dissemble the boldnesse of certaine men which would God it rested within the compasse of words only These men therefore concerning the worde Baptizing though vsed of sacred writers in the mystery or Sacrament of the new Testament and for so many yeares after by the secrete consent of all Churches consecrated to this one Sacrament so that it is now growen into the vulgar speaches almost of all nations yet they dare presume rashly to chaunge it and in place thereof to vse the word washing Delicate men forsooth which neither are moued with the perpetual authority of so many ages nor by the daily custom of the vulgar speach can be brought to thinke that lawfull for Diuines which all men graunt to other Maisters and professors of artes that is to retaine and holde that as their owne which by long vse and in good faith they haue truly possessed Neither may they preteÌ„d the authoritie of some auncient writers as that Cyprian sayeth TINGENTES for BAâ—PTIZANTES and Tertullian in a certaine place calleth SEQVESTREM for MEDIATOREM For that which was to those auncientes as it were newe to vs is olde and euen then that the selfe same words which we now vse were familiar to the Church it is euident because it is very seldome that they speake otherwise But these men by this noueltie seeke after vaine glorie c. FVLK 13. If in any place we vse not the name of the Apostles Prophetes Euangelists Angels and such like wee are able to giue as sufficient a reason why we translate those wordes according to their Generall signification as you for translating somtime Baptismata washings and not baptismes Ecclesia the assembly and not the Church with such like Therefore as Castaleo such other Heretikes are iustly reprehended by Beza for leauing without cause the vsuall Ecclesiasticall termes so when good cause or necessitie requireth not to vse them it were superstition yea and almost madnes sometimes in translating to vse them as to call the Pharisees washings Baptismes or the assembly of the EphesiaÌ„ Idolaters the Churche yet both in Greeke and Latine the wordes are Baptismata ecclesia MART. 14. He speaketh against Castaleon who in his newe Latine translation of the Bible changed all Ecclesiasticall wordes into profane and Heathenish as Angelos into genios Prophetas into Fatidicos Templum into fanum and so foorth But that which he did for foolish affectation of finenesse and stile do not our English Caluinistes the very same when they list for furthering their Heresies When the holy Scripture saith idols according as Christians haue alwayes vnderstood it for false goddes they come and tell vs out of Homer and the Lexicons that it may signifie an image and therfore so they translate it Do they not the like in the Greeke worde that by Ecclesiasticall vse signifieth penaunce and doing penaunce when they argue out of Plutarch and by the profane sense therof that it is nothing else but chaunging of the minde or amendment of life Whereas in the Greeke Church Poenitentes that is they that were in the course of penance and excluded from the Church as Catechumeni and Energumeni till they had accomplished their penance the very same are called in the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 FVLK 14. That Castaleo did for foolish affectatioÌ„ of finenesse you slauÌ„der vs to do for furthering of heresie
alleageth it thus the holy Euangelist S. Luke in the Acts of the Apostles cap. 2. recordeth it and for this S. Augustine calleth him an infidel that denyeth it yet all this would not suffise to make Beza translate it so because of certaine errours as he heretically termeth them which he would full gladly auoide hereby namely the Catholike true doctrine of limbus patrum and Purgatorie What neede we say more he translateth animam a Carcase so calling our Sauiour Christes bodie irreuerently and wickedly he translateth infernum graue FVLK 2. That many of the Christian fathers helde this error that the godly of the old Testament were not in heauen before Christes death it is no cause why we should be afraid to confesse the truth reuealed to vs out of the holy Scriptures to the glorie of God And if the wrong or ambiguous translation of one Hebrue word Sheol deceiued them that were for the most parte ignoraunt of the Hebrue tongue what reason were it that we shoulde not in translation reforme that errour But as for Bezaes first translation of the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 deade bodie and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 graue I haue aunswered at large Cap. 1. sect 31. where also it is shewed howe vainely you take hold of the English worde carcase to charge Beza with vnreuerent calling of our Sauiour Christes bodie when it was deade because he calleth it in Latine Cadauer MART. 3. Neede we take any great labour to proue this to be a foule corruption or that it is done purposely whē he confesseth that he thus translateth because else it woulde serue the Papistes Which is as much to say as the word of God if it be truly and sincerely translated maketh in deede for them For the first part we will not stand vpon it partly because it is of it selfe most absurd and they are ashamed of it partly because it shall susfise to confute Beza that two other as famous heretikes as he Castalio and Flaccus Illyricus write against him in this point and confute him partly also because we speake not here vniuersally of all hereticall translations but of the English corruptions specially therfore we may only note here how gladly they also would say somwhat else for soule euen in the text if they durst for shame for in the margent of that English trāslation they say or life or person thereby aduertising the Reader that he may reade thus if it please him Thou shalt not leaue my life in the graue or Thou shalt not leaue my person As though either mans soule or life were in the graue or anima might be translated person which the selfe same Englishe Bible doeth not no not in those places where it is euident that it signifieth the whole person For though this worde soule by a figure is sometime taken for the whole man yet euen there they doe not nor must not translate it otherwise than soule beause our tongue beareth that figure as well as Latine Greeke or Hebrue but here where it can not signifie the whole person it is wicked to translate it so FVLK 3. If you take more labour than you are wel able to beare yet shall you proue it no hereticall corruption As Castaleo and Illyricus the one an heretike the other a schismatike haue inueyed against Beza so hath he sufficiently confuted them But to our English translation where in the margent they say life or person when in the text they say soule what doeth this offende you They render the vsuall English word for the Greke word but they admonish the reader that the word soule in this place signifieth not the soule separated from the bodie but either the life or the whole person Because that although the bodie onely be layed in the graue yet according to vulgar speache and sense the whole man is sayed to be buried and his life seemeth to be inclosed in the graue according to which popular and humane conceyt the Prophet in that Psalme speaketh as appeareth in the later parte of that verse which is all one in sense with the former Neither wilt thou giue thy holy one to see corruption where corruption which is proper onely to the bodie is there spoken generally of the whole man If this expositiō please you not yet you haue no cause to finde fault with the translation which in that place is according to the cōmon and ordinarie signification of the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 soule Which as it is somtime taken for the whole person as you note Act. 7. 14. So is it here as the later parte of the verse doth most plainly declare MART. 4. But as for the worde graue that they put boldly in the text to signifie that howsoeuer you interprete soule or whatsoeuer you put for it it is not meant according to S. Augustine and the faith of the whole Catholike Church that his soule descended into Hell whiles his bodie was in the graue but that his soule also was in the graue howsoeuer that is to be vnderstoode So making it a certaine and resolute conclusion that the holy Scripture in this place speaketh not of Christs being in Hell but in the graue and that according to his soule or life or person or as Beza will haue it His carcase or bodie and so his soule in Hell as the holy Scripture speaketh shall be his bodie in the graue as Beza plainly speaketh the Bezites couertly insinuate white shall be blacke and chaulke shall be cheese and euery thing shall be any thing that they will haue it And all this their euident false translation must be to our miserable deceiued poore soules the holy Scripture and Gods word FVLK 4. The Greeke word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 wel beareth to be translated in some places a graue here the later part of the verse speaketh of corruption which can not be vnderstoode to be but in the graue so doth S. Peter vnderstand it saying that Dauid the Patriarch died and was buried and his sepulchre remayneth with vs vnto this day and S. Paule vpon the same verse of the Psalme saith he saw corruption Both the Apostles therfore interpreting this verse of the resurrection of Christ we thinke it in deede a resolute conclusion that the Scripture in this place speaketh not of Christs being in hell which we acknowledge in the article of our Creede but of his buriall and resurrection Your trifling of white and blacke chaulke and cheese may seeme pleasaunt Rhetorike to grosse eares whom you seeke to fill with such vanities But the wiser sort that are acquainted with figuratiue speaches wil thinke it nothing straunge if words be not alwaies taken in their vsual proper signification That the Hebrue worde Nephesh which the Prophet in that verse of the Psalme vseth is taken diuerse times in the Scripture for a deade bodie I haue before proued more plainly than euer you shall
FVLK 13. That which is spoken indifferently of the elect and reprobate must needes be vnderstoode of that which is common to both that is corporall death How can it be verified of their soules that they were laid to the fathers when betwene the godly and the wicked there is an infinite distance but the earth the graue or pitte is a common receptacle of all dead bodies That Samuel which being raysed vppe spake to Saul might truely say of his soule though not of all his sonnes that he should be with him in hell for it was the spirite of Satan and not of Samuel although counterfaiting Samuel he might speake of the death of Saule and his sonnes As for that verse of the eighty and fiue Psalme whereupon you do falsely so often alleage S. Augustines resolution what absurditie hath it to translate it from the lowest graue or from the bottome of the graue whereby Dauid meaneth extreame daunger of death that he was in by the malice of his persecuting enemies Saule and his complices But we are afrayed to say in any place that any soule was deliuered and returned from hell We say that the soules of all the faithfull are deliuered from hell but of any which after death is condemned to hell we acknowledge no returne And these wordes are spoken by Dauid while he liued and praised God for his deliueraunce which might be not onely from the graue but also from hell sauing that here he speaketh of his preseruation from death MART. 14. And that this is their feare it is euident because that in al other places where it is plaine that the holy scriptures speake of the hel of the daÌ„ned from whence is no returne they translate there the verie same worde Hell and not graue As for example The way of life is on high to the prudent to auoide from Hell beneath Loe here that is translated Hell beneath which before was translated the lowest graue And againe Hell and destruction are before the Lorde howe muche more the harts of the sonnes of men But when in the holy Scriptures there is mention of deliuery of a soul from Hell then thus they translate God shal deliuer my soul from the power of the graue for he will receiue me Can you tell what they would say doeth God deliuer them from the graue or from teÌ„porall death whom he receiueth to his mercie or hath the graue any power ouer the soule Againe when they say What man liueth and shall not see death shall he deliâ—er his soule from the hand of the graue FVLK 14. I haue shewed before diuerse times that although the Hebrue word Sheol doe properly signifie a receptacle of the bodies after death yet when mention is of the wicked by consequence it may signifie hell as the day signifieth light the night darkenesse fire heate peace signifieth prosperitie and an hundreth suche like speaches But where you say that Prouerb 15. v. 24. that is translated hell beneath which before was translated the lowest graue Psalm 85. v. 13. You say vntruly for although in both places there is the worde Sheol yet in that Psalme there is Tachtyah in the Prouerbes Mattah for which if it were translated the graue that declineth or is downewarde it were no inconuenience In the other textes you trifle vpon the worde soule whereas the Hebrewe worde signifieth not the reasonable soule which is separable from the bodie but the life or the whole person of man which may rightly be said to be deliuered from the hande or power of the graue as the verse 48. doth plainely declare when in the later parte is repeated the sense of the former as it is in many places of the Psalmes MART. 15. If thâ—y take graue properly where mans bodie is buried it is not true either that euerie soule yea or euery bodie is buried in a graue But if in all such places they will say they meane nothing else but to signifie death and that to goe downe into the graue and to die is all one we aske them why they followe noâ— the wordes of the holy Scripture to signifie the same thing which call it going downe to Hell not going downe to the graue Here they must needes open the mystery of Antichrist working in their translations and say that so they shoulde make Hell a common place to all that departed in the olde Testament which they will not no noâ— in the most important places of our beleefe concerning our Sauiour Christes descending into Hell and triumphing ouer the same Yea therefore of purpose they will not onely for to defeate that parte of our Christian Creede FVLK 15. We can not alwaies take the word graue properly when the Scripture vseth it figuratiuely But if we say to goe downe to the graue and to die is all one you aske vs why we followe not the wordes of the holy Scripture I aunswere we doe for the Scripture calleth it graue and not hell Where is then your vaine clattering of the mysterie of Antichrist that we must open Because we will not acknowledge that hereticall common place inuented by Marcion the heretike we purpose to defeate the article of Christes descending into hell A monstrous sclaunder when we doe openly confesse it and his triumphing ouer hell in more triumphant manner than you determine it For if he descended into that hell onely in which were the soules of the faithfull which was a place of rest of comfort of ioy and felicitie what triumphe was it to ouercome suche an hell which if you take away the hatefull name of hell by your owne description will proue rather an heauen than an hell But we beleeue that he triumphed ouer the hell of the damned and ouer all the power of darkenesse which he subdued by the vertue of his obedience and sacrifice so that it should neuer be able to claime or holde any of his elect whome he had redeemed MART. 16. As when the Prophet first Osee. 13. and afterward the Apostle 1. Cor. 15. in the Greeke sâ—y thus Ero mors tua ô mors morsus tuus ero inferne Vbi est mors stimulus tuus vbi est inferne victoria tua O death I will be thy death I will be thy sting ô Hell Where is ô death thy sting where is ô hell thy victorie They translate in both places O graue in steede of ô Hel. What else can be their meaning hereby but to draw the Reader from the common sense of our Sauiour Christs descending into hell conquering the same and bringing out the fathers and iust men triumphantly from thence into heauen which sense hath alwaies bene the common sense of the Catholike church holy Doctors specially vpon this place of the Prophet And what a kinde of speach is this and out of all tune to make our Sauiour Christ say O graue I will be thy destruction as though he had triumphed ouer the graue not
not complaine of the singularitie of this exaÌ„ple although you require but one I wil adde out of the Psalme 141. where the Prophet saith our bones are scattered at the very brinke or mouth of sheol the graue Howe can you vnderstand him to speake of hel For the graue and not hell is a place for dead mens bones as he speaketh of the faithfull by the wicked compted as good as dead rotten consumed to the bones By these and many other examples it is manifest that the proper signification of sheol in English is a graue and not hell MART. 22. And therefore Beza doth strangely abuse his Reader more than in one place saying that the Hebrue word doth properly signifie graue beyng deduced of a verbe that signifieth to craue or aske because it craueth alwayes newe coarses As though the graue craued moe than Hel doth or swallowed moe or were more hardly satisfied and filled than Hell for in all such places they translate graue And in one such place they say The graue and destructioÌ„ can neuer be ful Whereas them selues a litle before translate the very same wordes Hel destructioÌ„ and therefore it might haue pleased them to haue said also Hel and destructioÌ„ can neuer be ful as their powfellowes do in their translation and againe We shal swalow them vp like Hel. The Diuel we reade goeth about continually like a roaring lion seeking whom he may deâ—ouâ— Who is called in the Apocalypse Abaddon that is destruction And so very aptly Hel and destruction are ioyned togither and are truly said neuer to be filled What madnesse and impudencie is it then for Beza to write thus Who is ignorant that by the Hebrue worde rather is signified a graue for that it seemeth after a sorte to craue alwaies new câ—rcasses FVLK 22. Beza doth not abuse his reader to tel him that sheol is deriued of a verbe that signifieth crauing or asking but you doe vnhonestly abuse Beza as you doe euery man when you take in hand to affirme that he standeth onely vpon the etymologie of sheol to proue that it signifieth the graue MART. 23. And againe coÌ„cerning our Sauiour Christs descending into hell and deliuering the fathers from thence it is maruel fâ—iâ—lr Beâ—a that the most parte of the auncient fathers were in this errour whereas with the Hebrues the word SHEOL signifieth nothing else but GRAVE Before he pleaded vpon the etymologie or nature of the worde now also he pleadeth vpon the authoritie of the Hebrues themselues If he were not knowen to be very impudent and obstinate wee woulde easily mistrust his skill in the Hebrue saying that among the Hebrues the worde signifieth nothing else but graue FVLK 23. Beza sayth that the worde Sheol properly signifieth nothing but the graue neuerthelesse hee saith it is taken figuratiuely for tribulation whiche is neere to extreeme destruction yea and sometime for the bottomlesse pitte of hell MART. 24. I would gladly knowe what are those Hebrues doth not the Hebrue text of the holy Scripture best tell vs the vse of this word Do not themselues translate it Hel very often do not the Septuaginta alwaies If any Hebrue in the world were asked how he would turne these wordes into Hebrue Similes estis sepulchris dealbatis you are like to whited graues And Sepulchrum eius apud vos est His graue is among you would any Hebrue I say translate it by this Hebrue worde which Beza saith among the Hebrues signifieth nothing else but graue Aske your Hebrue Readers in this case and see what they will answere FVLK 24. The best of the Hebrues that either interpreted Scriptures or made Dictionaries Iewes or Christians do acknowledge that sheol doth properly signifie the graue That the Septuaginta do alwaies traÌ„slate it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 it proueth not that it alwaies signifieth hel for 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth not alwaies hell as in the place of NuÌ„b. 16. As for the turning of Latin into Hebrue is not our coÌ„trouersie but of translating Hebrue into English sheol may signifie the graue the hole the pit as Fâ—â—ea though it be not all one with the Latine worde Sepulchrum And yet Rabbi Salomon whome you boldly cite in the 27. Section saith plainely that the true and proper interpretation of Sheol is Keber whiche you say is as proper for graue as Lac is for milke MART. 25. What are those Hebrues then that Beza speaketh of forsooth certaine Iewes or later Rabbines which as they doe falsely interprete all the holy Scriptures agaynst our Sauiour Christ in other points of our beleefe as against his Incarnation Death and Resurrection so do they also falsely interprete the holy scriptures against his descending into Hell which those Iewish Rabbines deny because they looke for another Messias that shal not die at al and consequeÌ„tly shal not after his death go downe into Hel deliuer the fathers expecting his comming as our sauiour Christ did And therfore those Iewish Rabbines hold as the heretikes do that the fathers of the old Testament were in heauen before our sauiour Christs Incarnation these Rabbines are they which also peruert the Hebrue word to the significatioÌ„ of graue in such places of the holy scriptures as speake either of our Sauiour Christes descending into hel or of the fathers going downe into Hell euen in like maner as they peruert other Hebrew wordes of the holy scripture as namely alma to signifie a young woman not a virgin against our Sauiours birth of the B. Virgin Marie FVLK 25. Beza speaketh of the holy men of God which did write the Scriptures and so vse that word Sheol as it can not be taken to signifie any thing properly but the graue or pit And as for the Iewish RabbiÌ„s what reason is there why we should not credite them in the interpretatiou of wordes of their owne tongue rather than any auncient Christians ignorant of the Hebrewe tongue And although they doe sometimes frowardly contend about the significatioÌ„ of a word or two against the truth of the Gospell that is no sufficient cause why they should be discredited in all words But beside them Beza hath also the best Hebritians that haue bene in this laste age among the Christians not onely Protestants but Papistes also namely Pagninus and Masius in their Dictionaries MART. 26. And if these later Rabbines be the Hebrewes that Beza meaneth and which these gay English translators followe we lament that they ioyne themselues with such companions being the sworne enemies of our Sauiour Christ. Surely the Christian Hebrewes in Rome and elsewhere which of great Rabbines are become zealous Doctors of Christianitiâ— and therefore honour euery mysterie and article of our Christian faith concerning our Sauiour Christ they dispute as vehemently against those other Rabbines as we doe against the Heretikes and among other things they tell them thus Saul sayd Raise me vp Samuel
and that the woman sayd I see Gods ascending out of the earth and An olde man is ascended or come vp and that Samuel sayd Why hast thou disquieted me that I should be raysed vp and To morow thou and thy sonnes shall be with me And the booke of Ecclesiasticus sayth that Samuel died and afterward lifted vp his voice out of the earth c. All which the holy Scripture would neuer haue thus expressed whether it were Samuel in deede oâ— not if Saul and the Iewes then had beleeued that their Prophets and Patriarches had bene in heauen about And as for the Hebrew worde they make it as euery boye among the Iewes doth well know as proper a word for Hell as panis is for bread and as vnproper for a graue though so it may be vsed by a figure of speech as Cymba Charontis is Latine for death FVLK 26. If we followed the Iewes in exposition of the Scriptures against Christ we were not so much to be pitied as to be abhorred but if we be content to learne the proprietie of Hebrew wordes of the learned Rabbinsi as Hierom was glad to doe of his Rabbin who as it appeareth by his scholler in some places was not excellently learned there is no cause why any man should pitie vs but them rather that to cloke their ignorance in the Hebrewe tongue pretende as if it were more vnlawfull to learne Hebrew of the Hebrew Rabbins than Latine of Quintilian or Priscian and Greeke of Gaza Suidas and such like That you tell vâ— of the Romishe Rabbins conuerted from Iudaiâ—me to Papistrie is not worth a straw For their argument of Saules and a witches opinion that the deade might be raysed proueth nothing in the worlde that they were in Hell And the sonne of Syrach sheweth him selfe not to be directed by the spirite of God which affirmeth Samuel did lift vp his voice after his death out of the earth contrarye to the iudgement of Catholike Doctors of the Church For that the Scripture speaketh of Samuel raysed by the witche is meant of a wicked spirite counterfetting the shape and similitude of Samuel For the soules of the faithfull and holy Prophets be not at the commaundements of witches but at rest with God where they can not be disquieted As for the authoritie of those vnknowen authors that teach boyes to say Sheol is as proper for hell as panis for bread we may esteeme it to be of as good credit as Charons boate Plutoes pallace and Cerberus three heads c. MART. 27. But what speake I of these doe no the greatest and most auncient Rabbines so to call them the Septuaginta alwayes translate the Hebrew word by the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is properly hell doe not the Talmudistes and Chaldee paraphrases and Rabbi Salomon Iarhi handling these places of the Psalmes He will deliuer my soule from the hande of Sheol interprete it by Gehinum that is Gehenna hell and yet the Caluinists bring this place for an example that it signifieth graue Likewise vpon this place Let all sinners be turned into SHEOL the foresayde Rabbines interprete it by Gehinum Hell Insomuch that in the Prouerbs and in Iob it is ioyned with Abaddon Where Rabbi Leui according to the opinion of the Hebrewes expoundeth Sheol to be the lowest region of the world a deepe place opposite to heauen whereof it is written If I descended into Hell thou art present and so doth Rabbi Abraham expounde the same worde in chap. 2. Ionâ— FVLK 27. Although the Septuaginta doe alwayes translate Sheol by the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 yet doe they not thereby alwayes vnderstand hel as it is manifest in all those places where the Scripture speaketh of a receptacle of dead bodies But now you will beare vs downe with Rabbins Talmudists and Chaldee paraphrases And firste you saye that all these handling that verse of the 49. Psalme He will deliuer my soule from the hand of Sheol interprete it by Gehinnom that is hell I graunt that Rabbi Ioseph vsing the libertie of a Paraphrast rather than a translator interpreteth the worde by Gehinnom that signifieth hell fire and so the sense is true For God deliuered Dauid from eternall damnation But Rabbi Dauid Chimchi expounding the same place according to the proper signification of Sheol sayeth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. The Prophet sayde when he sawe the destruction of the soules of the wicked in their death In the day in which my bodie shall goe downe to Sheol the graue God shall deliuer my soule from the hande of Sheol the graue that my soule shall not perishe with my bodie You see therefore that all the Rabbines be not of your side no nor Rabbi Salomon Iarchi whom you cite For vpon 37. of Genesis verse 35. where Iacob sayth he will goe downe to the graue mourning thus he writeth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Mourning to Sheol according to the plaine and literall sense the interpretation thereof is the grane in my mourning I will be buried and I will not be comforted all my dayes but after the Midrash or exposition not according to the letter it is hell This signe was deliuered by handes or by tradition from the mouth of his power that is from a diuine oracle if not one of my sonnes shall dye in my life time I had confidence that I should not see hell By this saying it is manifest that this Rabbine acknowledged the true and proper translation of this worde Sheol was to the graue although after figuratiue and sometimes fond expositions it was interpreted for hell Likewise you say but vntruly of this verse Psal. 9. v. 18. Let all sinners be turned to Sheol for there the Chaldee Paraphrast retaineth the worde Sheol and doth not giue any other word for it Dauid Chimchi interpreteth it according to the literall sense 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Let the wicked be turned into the graue which is so straung with you to be aunswerable to Sheol although as R. Salomon he sayth it may be vnderstoode of their buriall in hell That Sheol in the Prouerbs Iob is ioyned with abaddoÌ„ it hindreth it not to signify the graue where is the destru ction and consumption of the body And Prou. 15. v. 11. the Chaldee Paraphrast retaineth Sheol which Kabuenaki expoundeth thus 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. It is sayd of Sheol and Abaddon that Sheol is the graue 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and Abaddon is hell which is deeper than the graue c. And although in Iob Rabbi Leui and others expound Sheol for a secret place about the center of the earth which should seeme to be hell yet they say not that this is the proper signification of the word Sheol For in the 21. of Iob. v. 13. the Chaldee Paraphrast for Sheol interpreteth Kebureta the graue and in the 14. verse 13. beith kebureta the house of the graue and 17. v. 12. and
because it apeareth by the effects that he speaketh of faith as it was a speciall gift of working of myracles of which effectes he nameth one remouing of mountaines And that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is so taken namely for the perfection of one kynde not the vniuersall comprehension of al kindes he bringeth you example Ro. 7. v. 8. and elsewhere oftentimes But if it shoulde be taken as you say all knowledge all mysteries is generally to be taken yet he telleth you this separation is but vppon an impossible supposition for iustifying faith can neuer bee separated from charitie but if it might be separated it shoulde not profite to iustifie The Angels of heauen can not preach an other gospel but if they did preach an other gospel they should be accursed A great argument I promise you against iustification by faith onely that a solitarie dead or barraine faith doth not iustifie MART. 7. And I woulde haue anye of the Bezites giue me a sufficient reason why hee translated totam fidem and not also totam scientiam vndoubtedly there is no cause but the heresie of speciall and onely faith And againe why he translateth Iaco. 2. 22. Thou seest that faith was administra a helper of his workes and expoundeth it thus Faith was an efficient cause and fruitful of good workes Wheras the Apostles wordes be plaine that faith wrought togither with his workes yea and that his fayth was by workes made perfecte This is impudent handling of Scripture to make workes the fruite onely and effecte of fayth which is your heresie FVLK 7. If you dare draw foorth your pen against Beza and demande an answere of himselfe although he hath already giuen you a sufficiēt reason to induce that the Apostle speaketh not of faith as generally as of knowledge because by an example of remouing mountaines he restraineth it to one kinde of faith As for the other question why he translateth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Iam. 2. v. 22. was an helper me thinke you should make best answere your selfe who not long since by force of that word woulde needes prooue that men were helpers of God chap. 10. sect 6. Haue you so soone forgotten your own voice and is this impudent handling of the scripture to translate as you your selfe in an other case thoughe impertinently did contend the word to signifie But works you wil not haue to be the fruit only and effect of faith because the Apostle saieth that faith wrought togither with his workes and by workes his faith was made perfite as thoughe apples are not the fruite of the tree because the tree doth beare them and by them if they be good the tree is made a good tree MART. 8. Which heresie also must needes be the cause that to suppresse the excellencie of charitie which the Apostle giueth it aboue faith or any other gift whatsoeuer in these wordes And yet I shew you a more excellent way 1. Cor. 12. v. 31. he in one edition of the new Testament in the yeare 1556. translateth thus Behold moreouer also I shew you a way most diligently What cold stuffe is this howe impertinent In an other edition an 1565. he mended it thus And besides I shew you a way to excellencie In neither of both expressing the comparison of preeminence excellencie that charitie hath in the Apostles words and in all the chapter following Wherein you did well for your credite not to followe him no not your Bezites them selues but to translate after our vulgar Latine interpreter as it hath alwayes bene read vnderstoode in the Church FVLK 8. The rarenesse of the phrase 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 c. as al indifferēt men wil iudge rather than any mind to suppresse the excellencie of charitie caused Beza to giue dyuerse interpretations of that place of whiche yet the latter more commendeth the excellencie of charitie than the vulgar Latin or our Eaglishe translation whiche expoundeth it as the Latine doth for if charitie be the way to excellencie it is a greater commendation thereof than to saye it is a more excellent waye than other giftes whereof he spake last as of healing of tongues of interpretations c. MART. 9. Luther was so impudent in this case that because the Apostle spake not plà inely ynough for onely faith he thrust only into the text of his translation as himself witnesseth you durst not hitherto presume so farre in this question of onely faith though in other controuersies you haue done the like as is shewed in their places But I wil aske you a smaller matter which in words shew you may perhaps easily answer but in your conscience there wil remaine a gnawing worme In so many places of the Gospell where our Sauiour requireth the peoples faith when he healed them of corporall diseases only why do you so gladly translate thus Thy faith hath saued thee rather than thus thy faith hath healed thee or made thee whole is it not by ioyning these wordes togither to make it sound in English eares that faith saueth or iustifieth a man in so much that Beza noteth in the margent thus fides saluat that is faith saueth your Geneua Bibles in that place where it can not be taken for faith that iustifieth because it is not the parties faith but her fathers that Christ required there also trāslate thus Beleeue only she shall be saued Which translation though very false and impertinent for iustifying faith as you seeme to acknowledge by translating it otherwise in your other Bibles yet in deede you must needes mainteine and hold it for good whiles you alleage this place for onely faith as is euident in your writings FVLK 9. That which Luther might wel do as an interpretor or expounder it was much boldnesse for him to doe as a translator but seeing he him selfe hath redressed his owne offence wee haue lesse to say for him and you against him For our additions except suche as the necessitie of our English phrase dothe require for vnderstanding you slaunder vs to say that wee haue in any controuersies done the like The question you aske is not worthy any answere why wee translate thy faith hath saued thee c. seing wee vse all these wordes indifferently healing making safe and making whole as in S. Iames we say Can faith saue him And it is al one to say thy faith hath saued thee and thy fayth hath made thee whole But you say wee alledge this place for onely faith iustifying citing the answeres of Maister Gough M. Tomson against Feckenham I thinke you lie as in other places very commonly And yet an argument though not a plaine testimonie may be taken out of these places for only faith iustifying Seing Christ was not a phisition for the body but to teach mē that he was a Physition for the soule and as he healed the diseased in bodie onely by faith so hee cureth the sickuesse of
I maruell whether you redde that saying in Basil and durst for sinne shame alledge it for your popistâ— penance where he plainly sheweth the vse ende of sack cloth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Sackecloth is an helper vnto repentance being a signe of humiliation for of olde tyme the Fathers repented sitting in sackeclothe ashes This signe of humbling or of submission you haue cleane omitted Thus you vse to gelde the Doctors sayings when you rehearse them Sackecloth therefore serueth to repentance as a testimonie of sorrow and humbling of our selues before God not as any satisfaction or amendes for our sinnes The rest of the places that you cite to proue that sorrowe is a part of repentance are altogither needelesse for we also doe acknowledge the same Our question is not of sorrow but of satisfaction to be a part of repentance Likewise the workes worthy or meete for repentance doe argue the repentance to be vnfained and vndissembled but they proue not that by them a satisfaction is made for the sinnes committed before repentance For a newe life newe maners newe fruites must follow a mind that is truely turned vnto God and chaunged from delight in sinne to hate and abhorre sinne and to studye vnto amendment of life MART. 3. Secondly for the signification of this Greeke word in all the Greeke Church and Greeke fathers euen from S. Denys the Areopagite S. Paules scholler who must needes deduce it from the Scriptures and learne it of the Apostles it is most euident that they vse this word for that penance which was done in the Primitiue Church according to the penitentiall Canons whereof all antiquitie of Councels and Fathers is full in so much that S. Denys reckoning vp the three sortes of persons that were excluded from seeing and participating of the diuine mysteries of Christes bodie and bloud to wit Catechumens Poenitents and the possessed of ill spirits for Poenitents he sayth in the Greeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that is such as were in their course of penance or had not yet done their full penance Which penance S. Augustine declareth thus Ho. 27. inter 50. ho. and ep 108. Est poenitentia grauior c. There is a more grieuous more mournefull penance whereby properly they are called in the Church that are Poenitentes remoued also from partaking the sacrameÌ„t of the altar And the Greeke Ecclesiastical history thus In the Church of Rome there is a manifest known place for the POENITENTS in it they stand sorowfull as it were mourning when the sacrifice is ended being not made partakers thereof with weeping and lamentation they cast them selues flat on the grounde then the Byshop weeping also with compassion lifteth them vp and after a certain time enioined absolueth them from their penaunce This the Priests or Bishops of Rome kepe froÌ„ the verie beginning euen vntil our time FVLK 3. Although Denis whose bokes are now extant were no more S. Paules disciple than hee was S. Paule himselfe yet I will grant that the publique testification of repentance in suche as hadde openly fallen was in the primitiue church not onely called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by a metonymie but also that the worde of satisfaction was vsed not that they had anye meaning to satisfie the iustice of God by suche externall works but that by those outwarde trials of their repentaunce the Churche was satisfied which by their fal was offended and the gouernours of the Church by suche signes of true sorrow and amendment were persuaded to receiue them againe into the congregation from whence vntill sufficient trial had of their repentance they were separated and excluded But this prooueth not that the inward repentaunce which God giueth when he turneth vs vnto him hath in it any satisfaction for our sinnes which no sacrifice was able to make but onely the lambe of God whiche taketh away the sinnes of the worlde The places you cite as well out of Denis as of S. Augustine and Sozomene do prooue this that I say to be vnderstoode of publique signes of repentaunce without that any satisfaction vnto Gods iustice in those times by such penaunce was intended MART. 4. In these wordes and other in the same Chapter and in Socrates Greeke historie likewise when they speake of Poenitents that confessed and lamented theyr sinnes that were enioyned penaunce for the same and did it I woulde demaunde of oure Englishe Grecians in what Greeke wordes they expresse al this Doe they it not in the wordes whiche wee nowe speake of and whyche therefore are prooued moste euidently to signifie penaunce and dooing penaunce Againe when the moste auncient Councell of Laodicea can 2. saith That the time of penance should bee giuen to offenders according to the proportion of the fault And againe can 9. That such shal not coÌ„municate till a certaine time but after they haue doone penaunce and confessed their faulte then to bee receyued And againe can 19. After the Catechumens are gone out that praier bee made of the Poenitentes or them that are in dooing penaunce And when the firste Councel of Nice saith can 12. about shortening or prolonging the dayes of penaunce that they muste well examine their purpose and manner of dooing penaunce that is wyth what alacritie of minde teares patience humilitie good workes they accomplished the same and accordingly to deale more mercifully with them as is there expressed in the Councel when Saint Basil Can. 1. ad Amphiloch speaketh after the same sorte when Saint Chrysostome calleth the sackecloth and fasting of the Niniuites for certaine dayes tot dierum poenitentiam so many dayes penaunce in all these places I woulde gladly knowe of our Englishe Grecians whether these speaches of penaunce and dooing penaunâ—ce are not expressed by the saide greeke wordes which they wil in no case so to signifie FVLK 4. A matter of great waight I promise you to enquire of our Englishe Grecians in what Greeke wordes they expresse all this Verily in the same Greke wordes which signifie repentaunce or repenting and so may be expressed in Englishe neyther is there anie thing in any of the Councels or Doctors by you cited or quoted that hathe anie other intention than I haue before expressed The words of penaunce and doing penaunce if you meant the same by them that we and you do by repenting and repentaunce wee would not striue with you for termes but that you haue an other meaning in them appeareth by this that you translate the same word poenitentia commonly penance as when it is agere poenitentiam but when it is saide that God doth dare poenitentiam then you translate it repentance Whereby it appeareth you meane the penaunce whiche you woulde haue men to doe is not that repentance whiche is the gift of God Else why saye you not Acts. 5. that God hath exalted Christ to be Prince and Sauiour to giue penaunce to Israel and remission of sinnes if penaunce
seruice ecclesiastical or temporal sacred or prophane If the world bee restrained to any one peculiar seruice or function as one of the Greeke wordes is then doth it signifie Deacons onely Whiche if they know not or wil not beleeue me let them see Beza himselfe in his Annotations vpon Saint Mathew who protesteth that in his translation he vseth alwaies the word Minister in the generall signification and Diaconus in the speciall and peculiar Ecclesiasticall function of Deacons So that yet wee can not vnderstande neither can they tell vs whence their peculiar calling and function of Minister commeth which is their second degree vnder a Bishop and is placed in steede of Priestes FVLK 2. What the general worde of Minister signifieth howe it is taken both generally and specally we are not so ignorant that wee neede bee taught of you And yet al learned men are not agreed when the greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is restrained to the Minister of the poore and when it signifieth generally all the officers in the Churche As for the name of Minister by which Elders or Priestes are commonly called among vs I haue euen nowe and diuers times before shewed vppon what occasion it was taken vp so to be applied which yet generally signifieth all that serue in the Church and common wealth also MART. 3. Againe what can bee more against the dignitie of sacred orders and Ecclesiastical degrees than to make them profane and secular by their termes and translations For this purpose as they translate Elders and Eldershippe for Priests and Priesthode so do they most impudently terme S. Peter and S. Iohn lay men they say for Apostle Embassador and Messenger Ioh 13. v. 16. and for Apostles of the Churches Messengers of the same 2. Cor. 8. for Bishoppes ouerseers Act. 20. Why my maisters doth idiota signifie a lay man Suppose a lay man be as wise and learned as any other is he idiota or that one of your Ministers be as vnlerned ignorant as any shepheard is he not idiota so then idiota is neither Clearke nor lay man but euerie simple and ignoraunt man They that spake with miraculous tongs in the primitiue church were they not lay men many of them yet the Apostle plainely distinguisheth them from idiota So that this is more ignorantly or wilfully translated than Neophytus a young scholler in al your bibles FVLK 3. There can be no greater wrangling nor more vnprofitable than about wordes and tearmes But why I pray you shoulde the tearmes of Elder and Eldershippe be more prophane and secular in English than they bee in Greeke yea than the names of ancients and seniors which you your selues in your translation vse for the same office wil you neuer be ashamed of these vanities which turne alwaies to your owne reproche yet do they say you most impudently terme S. Peter and Iohn lay men And do not you dishonour them as much to say in your translation they were of the vulgare sorte what signifieth 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 a lay man but one of the vulgare sorte or common people Againe were they of that Cleargie whereof Annas and Caiphas were highe Priestes or were they not as perfectely distincte from that sacrificing Priesthode as any lay man at this day is from the christian cleargie yet you goe on whether the furie of your malice doth carry you and say that Idiota is neither Cleark nor lay man but euerie simple and ignorant maÌ„ If it be so then reforme your translation as wel in thys place of the Act. 4. as in 1. Cor. 14. where you cal idiota of the vulgar sorte or the vulgar and plucke your selfe first by the nose for false translating beefore you finde fault with vs. Againe if the high Priests did take the Apostles for vnlearned and lay men what impudencie is it to say that wee tearme them so And touching your signification of idiota although the Priests knew that they had not bin brought vp in studie of learning as they themselues were yet hearing their bold wise answere they coulde not take them for simple and ignoraunt menne therefore it followeth that they meant they were none of their cleargie rather than that they were ignoraunt and foolishe for simple in the good parte they woulde not acknowledge them to be As for the terme Embassadour and Messenger for the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Io 13 v. 16. may wel be vsed in that place seeing it is like he speaketh as generally of the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as he doeth of 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 which is a seruaunt The seruant is not greater than his Lord nor the embassadour than he that sent him And for the messengers of the Churches wheÌ„ those are vnderstoode by the word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 whiche are sent on message from the Churches and not those that are sent by Christe to preach vnto the Churches no wise manne can blame the translation Acts. 20. where 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 are of vs translated ouerseers of you Bishoppes yet in your note you say or Priests as though the worde maye signifie Priestes whyche all menne of skill doe knowe to signifie ouerseers although the terme bee giuen to them whiche beefore are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Elders or Priestes But it proceedeth of greate ignoraunce that Neophytus is translated in all our Bibles a young Scholler O what knowledge haue wee learned of you to translate Neophytus a Neophyte For before we did take Neophytus to signify one that is newly planted or lately â—ngraffed and by a Metaphor one that is a young and newe scholler in the mysteries of Christian religion But because your Pope vseth to make boyes and vnlearned young men Bishoppes and greate Prelates in your Churche you can not abide that a young scholler shoulde by Saint Paules rule be excluded from a Bishopricke and therefore you mocke the reader with a Neophyte Wee knowe that in the auntient Churche they were called Neophyti whyche were lately baptised but yet in the same sense because they were young schollers and therefore looke in the Homilies that are intituled ad Neophytos and you shal see they are directed and spente almost or altogither in teaching the principles of Christian religion plainely wherein they were but younge schollers not yet perfectly instructed MART. 4. Nowe for changing the name Apostle into Messenger though Beza doe so also in the foresayd places yet in deede he controuleth both him selfe and you in other places saying of the same word Apostles A man may say in Latine Legates but we haue gladly kept the Greeke word Apostle as many other wordes familiar to the Church of Christ. And not onely of the principall Apostles but also of the other Disciples he both translateth and interpreteth in his commentarie that they are notable Apostles and he proueth that all Ministers of the worde as he termeth them are and may be so
called And for your Ouerseers he sayth Episcopos and not Superintendentes Which he might as well haue sayde as you Ouerseers But to saye the truth though he be too too profane yet he doth much more keepe and vse the Ecclesiasticall receiued termes than you doe often protesting it and as it were glorying therein against Castaleon especially As when he sayth Presbyterum where you saye Elder Diaconum where you saye Minister and so forth Where if you tell me that howsoeuer he translate he meaneth as profanely as you I beleeue you and therefore you shall goe togither like Maister like Schollers all false and profane translators for this Beza who sometime so gladly keepeth the name of Apostle yet calleth Epaphroditus legatum Philippensium Philip. 2. verse 15. Whereupon the Englishe Bezites translate your Messenger for your Apostle As if S. Augustine who was our Apostle should be called our Messenger FVLK 4. You can not leaue your olde byas in wresting mens sayings farre beyond their meaning Therefore you alledge against vs the saying of Beza for the terme of Apostles to be retained where meÌ„tion is made of the Apostles of Christ not onely those that are specially so called but also all the ministers of the worde But what is this to terme them by the honourable name of Apostles which are not sent by God but by men about some ciuil or Ecclesiastical busines For both he we cal Epaphroditus the Messenger and not the Apostle of the Philippians because he was sent by the Philippians vnto Paule and not by Christ vnto them As for that Augustine which was sent by Gregorie might better be called Gregories Apostle than our Apostle for he was not sent by vs but to vs not immediatly from God as an Apostle should but from Gregorie and by Gregorie Touching the termes of Bishops Elders Ministers Priestes c. enough hath bene sayd already Our translators haue done that which they thought best to be done in our language as Beza did in the Latine tongue MART. 5. As also when you translate of S. Matthias the Apostle that he was by a common consent counted with the eleuen Apostles Act. 1. v. 26. what is it else but to make onely a popular election of Ecclesiasticall degrees as Beza in his annotations would haue vs to vnderstande saying that nothing was done here peculiarly by Peter as one of more excellent dignitie than the rest but in common by the voyces of the whole Church though in an other place vpon this election he noteth Peter to be the chiefe or Corypheus And as for the Greeke worde in this place if partialitie of the cause would suffer him to consider of it he shoulde finde that the proper signification thereof in this phrase of speache is as the vulgar Latine Interpreter Erasmus and Valla all which he reiecteth translate it to wit He was numbred or counted with the eleuen Apostles without all respect of common consent or not consent as you also in your other Bibles doe translate FVLK 5. The election of Matthias to be an Apostle was extraordinarily and therefore permitted to the lot the maner whereof as it is not to be drawen into example so the proper election can not be proued thereby yet hath both Beza and the English translator faithfully expressed the Greeke worde which S. Luke there vseth although neyther Erasmus nor Valla beside your vulgar Interpretor did consider it Neither doth that common consent in accepting Mathias for an Apostle whome the lotte had designed more proue a popular election or derogate from the singularitie of Peter than that by common consent of the whole brotherhood two were chosen and set vp that the Apostleshippe should be layd vpon one of them MART. 6. Which diuersitie may proceede of the diuersitie of opinions among you For we vnderstand by Maister Whitegifts bookes against the Puritanes that he and his fellowes deny this popular election and giue preeminence superioritie and difference in this case to Peter and to Ecclesiasticall Prelates and therefore he proueth at large the vse and Ecclesiasticall signification of the Greeke word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 not to be the giuing of voices in popular elections but to be the Ecclesiasticall imposing of handes vpon persons taken to the Churches ministerie Which he sayth very truely and needeth the lesse here to be spoken of specially beeing touched elsewhere in this booke FVLK 6. The diuersitie of the translation proceedeth of this that the former translators did not obserue the nature of the Greeke worde which Beza hath considered more absolutely than any interpretors before him Although it is not vnlike that Chrysostome did well acknowledge it when speaking of this election he vseth these words I am illud considera quam Petrus agit omnia ex communi discipuâ—orum sententia nihil authoritate sua nihil cum imperio Now also consider this thing how Peter doth all things by common consent of the Disciples nothing of his owne authoritie nothing with rule or commaundement And as for the popular election if you had redde those bookes you make mention of you might perceiue that neither of both parts allowe a meere popular election And that Maister Whitgift doth not so much contend what forme of election was vsed in the time of the Apostles and of the Primitiue Church as whether it be necessary that such forme of election as then was practised shoulde in all ages of the Church and in all places be of necessitie continued and obserued MART. 7. One thing onely we woulde knowe why they that pleade so earnestly against their brethren the Puritanes about the signification of this worde pretending herein onely the primitiue custome of imposition of handes in making their Ministers why I saye them selues translate not this worde accordingly but altogither as the Puritanes thus When they had ordayned them Elders by election in euerye Church Act. 14. verse 23. For if the Greeke worde signifie here the peoples giuing of voyces as Beza forceth it onely that way out of Tullie and the popular custome of olde Athens then the other signification of imposing handes is gone which Mayster Whitgift defendeth and the popular election is brought in which he refelleth and so by their translation they haue in my opinion ouershotte themselues and giuen aduantage to their brotherly Aduersaries Vnlesse in deede they translate as they thinke because in deede they thinke as heretically as the other but yet because their state of Ecclesâ—asticall regiment is otherwise they must maintaine that also in their writings howsoeuer they translate For an example They all agree to translate Elder for Priest and Maister Whitakers telleth vs a freshe in the name of them all that there are no Priestes nowe in the Church of Christ that is as he interpreteth himselfe This name Prieste is neuer in the New Testament peculiarly applied to the Ministers of the Gospell this is
and reasoning against al other interpreters both auncient later for the coÌ„trary yea and affâ—ming that S. Paul him self did foolishly if he spake there of other rich womeÌ„ Such a fansie he hath to make the Apostles not onely maried man but that they caried about their wiues with them that they were the Apostles wiues for so he translateth it Act. 1. v. 14 that returned with them after our Lordes ascension to Hierusalem and continued togither in praier til the holy Ghost came vpon them Whereas S. Luke there speaketh so euidently of the other holy and faithful women which are famous in the Gospel as the Maries and other that the English Bezites them selues dare not here folow his translation For I beseech you M. Beza to turne my talke vnto you a litle is there any circumstance or particle here added why iâ— should be translated wiues none then by your owne reason before alleaged it should rather be trsÌ„lated women Againe did Erasmus translate well saying It is good for a man not to touch a wife 1 Cor. 7. v. 1. No say you reprehending this translation because it dehorteth from mariage If not shew your commissioÌ„ why you may translate in the foresaid places wife wiues at your pleasure the Greeke being all one both where you will not in any wise haue it translated wife and also where you will haue it so translated in any wise FVLK 12. Nay great must be the impudencie of the Papists that imagine the Apostles which had wiues of their owne did leaue them behinde them and leade straung women aboute with them into all partes of the world The first that inuented that glose of coÌ„tinent women such as followed Christ was Tertullian the Montanist in his booke of Monogamy which he wrote against the Church condeÌ„ning secoÌ„d mariage reprouing the Latine translation of his time as it seemeth which in this text 1. Cor. 9. vsed the terme of vxor by the ambiguitie of the Greeke word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 saying that if the Apostle had spoken of matrimonie he would haue vnderstood this of wiues but seeing he speaketh De victuaria exhibitione of the exhibition toward his liuing he vnderstandeth it of such women as followed Christe Than the which distinction nothing can be more absurde for speaking of exhibition towarde his liuing the Apostle sheweth that he might haue lawfully charged the Church with finding not only of him self but also of his wife as the other Apostles did Againe if rich womeÌ„ did folow the Apostles ministring to theÌ„ of their substance as they folowed our Sauiour this was no burden but an easement vnto the Church which the Apostle would not haue absteined froÌ„ as a thing burdenous to the Church of Corinth CoÌ„cerning the other place Act. 1. v. 14. although perhaps it be not necessary to translate wiues yet it is necessary to vnderstand wiues For to answere you in M. Bezaes name who telleth you that it was meete as also Erasmus thinketh that their wiues should be coâ—firmed who partly were to be companions of their trauaile and peregrinatioÌ„ partly to tarie patieÌ„tly at home while their husbaÌ„ds were about the Lords businesse and therfore their wiues also were present Againe what a shamefull absurditie were it to thinke that the Apostles would tarie in a close house so long togither with other women than their wiues and shut out their owne wiues which must needes haue bene subiect to great offense and obloquie And what deuilish malice haue you agaynst the Apostles wiues that you caÌ„not abide that they should ioyne with their husbandes in praier and supplication and be made partakers of the holy Ghost with them as well as other women which were also maried women Mary the wife of Cleophas Ioanna the wife of Chuza and other holy women the mothers or wiues of holy men Will you say the Apostles had no wiues Peters wiues mother will testifie againste you Will you saye she was forsaken by Peter the storie of his martiredome if it bee true affirmeth that she continued with him to his dying day will you say he had no matrimoniall companie with hir his daughter Petronilla will beare witnes against you so yong that she was desired in marriage by Flaccus the Comes Touching the place 1. Corin. 7. where Erasmus translateth vxorem I haue answeared alreadie the circumstance of the place doth argue that it is spoken generally of continence not of abstinence in marriage only And who is such a nouice in the greke tongue that he knoweth not that the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth a wife or woman as the circumstaunce of the place requireth where it is vsed MART. 13. Againe to this purpose they make Sainct Paule say as to his wife I beseech thee also faithful yokfellow Phil. 4. v. 3. for in Englishe what doth it else sounde but man and wife but that S. Paule shoulde hâ—ere meane his wife moste of the greeke fathers count it ridiculous and foolishe S. Chrisostome Theodorete Oecumenius Theophilactus Beza and Caluin bothe mislike it translating also in the masculine gender S. Paule himselfe saith the contrarie that he had no wife 1. Cor. 7. And as for Clemens Alexandrinus who alleageth it for Paules wife Eusebius plainely insinuaâ—eth and Nicephorus expresly saith that he did it 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by the way of contention and disputation whiles hee â—arnestly wrote against them that oppugned matrimonie FVLK 13. The Greeke worde being 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 signifieth a fellow or companion in yoke they haue not therfore translated amisse when they say yoke fellowe whiche signifieth felow in any yoke whatsoeuer If it sound man and wife in Englishe what matter is that for so it soundeth in Greeke Men must not follow the sound of wordes onely but examine the matter And great probabilitie there is that he speaketh there of his wife as Clemens Alexandrinus thinketh neither dothe S. Paule himselfe say precisely he had no wife 1. Cor. 7. but that he liued without the vse of a wife whiche might be hys wife consenting to remaine at â—hilippi That the later writers mislike the iudgement of Clemens and specially that fabulous historiaÌ„ Nicephorê° it derogateth nothing to his credite nor to the likelihoode of the matter That Theophy lact saith the adiectiue should be of the foeminine gender he is not to be credited aboue Clemens Alexandrinus who knewe the puritie of the Greke tong as wel as he But whether it be to be vnderstoode of hys wife or no we leaue it indifferent and translate according to the Greeke word without preiudice of either opinion which kind of translation at other times you do highly commend MART. 14. Againe for the mariage of Priests and of all sorts of men indifferently they translate the Apostle thus wedlock is honorable among al men Where one falsificatioÌ„ is that they say among all men and Beza inter quosuis in
chast which haue made them selues chast for the kingdome of heauens sake for a man might saye all doe so that liue chastly in matrimonie but our Sauiour speaketh of them that are impotent and vnable to generation called* Eunuches or gelded men and that in three diuers kindes some that haue that infirmitie or maime from their birth othersome that are gelded afterward by men and other that geld themselues for the kingdom of heauen not by cutting of those partes which were an horrible mortall sinne but hauing those partes as other men haue yet geld themselues for so is the Greeke and make them selues vnable to generation Which how it can be but by voluntarie profession promise and vâ—w of perpetuall continencie which they may neuer breake let the Protestants tell vs. Christ then as it is most euident speaketh of gelded men either câ—rporally or spiritually which are al such as professe perpetuall continencie and they tell vs of some that were borne chast and some that were made chast by men and some that make them selues chast â— most foolish and false translation of the Greeke wordes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 FVLK 16. Concerning the former part of this matter Math. 19. v. 11. we haue aunswered sufficiently in the chapter of free will but here is a new cauill Because chastitie is also in mariage as in single life our translators doe not well to expresse the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 by chast and haue made chaste I confesse they should more properly haue sayd gelded men or gelded them selues or els continent and made continent Although they meane none other by the worde chaste which they vse And touching your question howe men may lawfully geld them selues but by voluntary purpose of continencie which they may not breake I aunswer that we deny not but that such as be assured they haue the gift of continencie may professe to keepe it and after such profession or promise made to God they sinne if they breake it But if any haue rashly vowed that which they are not able to keepe they haue sinned in vowing and can not keepe their vowe by abstinence from mariage except they abstaine also from all filthines out of mariage for such we holde with Epiphanius and Saint Hierome that immoderate aduauncer of virginitie that it is better to marye than out of mariage to liue incontinently MART. 17. The Bezites here are blamelesse who translate it word for word Eunuches but they are more to blame in an other place where in derogation of the priuiledge and dignitie of Priestes they translate thus The Priestes lippes should preserue knowledge and they should seeke the Law at his mouth where in the Hebrew and Greeke it is as plaine as possibly can be spoken The Priestes lippes shall keepe knowledge and they shall seeke the Lawe at his mouth Which is a maruelous priuiledge giuen to the Priestes of the olde Law for true determination of matters in controuersie right expounding of the Law as we reade more fully Deutero 17. Where they are commaunded vnder paine of death to stand to the Priestes iudgement which in this place God by the Prophet Malachie calleth his couenant with Leui and that he will haue it to stand to wit in the newe Testament where Peter hath such priuiledge for him and his successors that his faith shall not faile where the holy Ghost is President in the Church of Bishops and Priestes All which these Heretikes would deface and defeate by translating the wordes otherwise than the holye Ghost hath spoken them FVLK 17. The verbe in deede which the Prophet Malachie vseth is of the future temps But who knoweth not that the Hebrewes lacke the potentiall mode and therefore they doe very often expresse it by the future temps of the indicatiue mode Which if you shoulde alwaies traÌ„slate by the future indicatiue you should make many faire promises to them that are sharpely rebuked But the circuÌ„stance of the place doth plainly declare that the Priestes of that time had broken the couenant made with Leui concerning keeping of the lawe Yea the very wordes following expresse the same But you haue departed out of the way and haue caused many to fall against the lawe You haue made voyde the couenant of Leui sayth the Lord of Hostes. By which words it is manifest that the Prophet before spake of that knowledge of the law which the Priest ought to haue not which the Priestes alwaies had for certaine it is that many of them were ignorant yea sometimes all the high Priest was ofteÌ„ an Idolater And who condemned Christ his Gospell but the high Priestes The authoritie that was giuen to the Priestes in case of controuersie was limited within the bounds of Gods law from which if they declined no man was bound to obey them For who was bound to obey Vrias the high Priest preferring the idolatrous altar of Damasco before the true altar of the Lorde or those deuilish tyrants Menclaus Alcimus and such other as occupied the Priests roomes in the time of the Maccabees or Annas and Caiphas in the â—yme of Christ. Peter then hauing none other priuiledge for him and his successors than Aaron had he and his successors might fall and be deceiued although Christ praied that his faith should not faile as he prayed for all the Apostles and for all their successors yea for all beleuers that they might be sanctified in the truth yet it were madnes to say that none of them could erre But whensoeuer you wil go about to proue this priuiledge out of those wordes of our Sauiour Christ make your Syllogisme and let vs haue no more brabling Our translation in that place of Malachie is more true than you are able to impugne for those wordes are rather a commaundement what the Priestes lippes should doe not a promise or assurance that they alway did so MART. 18. And when the Prophet addeth immediatly the cause of this singular prerogatiue of the Priest quia angelus Domini exercituum est because he is the Angell of the Lord of hostes which is also a wonderfull dignitie so to be called they after their cold maner of profane translation say because he is the messenger of the Lord of hostes So doe they in the next chapter call S. Iohn the Baptist messenger where the Scripture no doubt speaketh more honourably of him as being Christes precursor than of a messenger which is a terme for postes also and lackies The Scripture I saye speaketh thus of S. Iohn Behold I send mine Angel before thee and our Sauiour in the Gospell Mat. 11. Luc. 7. telling the people the wonderful dignisies of S. Iohn that he was more than a Prophet citeth this place giueth this reason For this is he of whom it is written Behold I send mine Angel before thee Which Saint Hierom
calleth meritorum 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the encrease and augmenting of Iohns merites or priuiledges that in Malachie he is called an Angell and Saint Gregoriâ— sayth he which came to bring tidings of Christ him selfe was worthily called an Angell that in his very name there might be a dignitie and all the fathers and all witte and reason conceiue a greate excellencye in this name onely our profane Protestants that thinke of all diuine things and persons most basely translate accordingly euen in the foresayd Gospell also making our Sauiour to say that Iohn was more than a Prophet because he was a Messenger Yea where our Sauiour him selfe is called Angelus Testamenti the Angell of the Testament there they translate the messenger of the couenant FVLK 18. It is not safe to translate alwayes the messenger of God by the name of an Angell which is commonly taken to signifie a spirite not a bodily creature therefore our translators thought good to expresse the signification of the Hebrew and Greeke worde in English and to vse the terme of Messenger as the worde doth signifie nothing derogating from the dignitie of the persons or office of them of whome it is vttered which consisteth in the addition following of God of the Lorde of the Church For the name of Angell of it selfe is no name of dignitie seeing there be Angells of the deuill and of darkenes as well as of God of light And Isidorus Clarius interpreteth the word in this place of Malachie Legatus the Ambassador or Messenger It is not therefore of any profane minde that for Angell we say Messenger Your owne vulgar Interpretor Agg. 1. v. 13. translateth Maleach Iehouah nuncius domini the Lords Messenger and so diuerse times where mention is made of Gods Messengers This is therefore a vayne contention about termes when the matter is not in question That the name of Angels soundeth more honorably as Hierom and other thinke it is no rule to binde translators but expounders may as occasion is offered obserue it MART. 19. If S. Hierome in all these places had translated nuntium then the English were messenger but translating it angelum and the Church al antiquitie so reading and expounding it as a terme of more dignitie and excellencie what meane these base coÌ„panions to disgrace the very eloqueÌ„ce of the Scripture which by such termes of amplification would speake more significantly and emphatically what meane they I say that so inuey against Castaleo for his profanenesse them selues to say for Angell Messenger for Apostle Legate or Embassadour and the like Are they afraid lest by calling meÌ„ Angels it would be mistaken as though they were Angells in deede by nature then S. Paule spake daungerously when he sayd to the Galathians As Gods Angel you receiued me as Christ Iesus But to proceede FVLK 19. The verye eloquence of the Scripture is best expressed when the wordes are translated as they signifie in the originall tongue And although some words be appropried to certaine callings which it is not conuenient to turne into the generall signification yet is neither the Hebrew nor the Greeke word that signifieth Messengers in the Scripture so restrayned but that it is vsed for all Messengers indifferently of God and men yea of God and the deuill Wherefore there is no cause why we should vse the Greeke worde Angell rather than the English worde Messenger And where you aske whether we be afrayd lest by calling men Angels it would be mistaken as though they were Angels in nature we may well feare lest the ignorant vnlearned might so be deceiued when Bristow so great a Doctor writer among you is so fondly disguised that he mistaketh the Angell of the Church of Philadelphia for an Angell by nature and alledgeth that which God promiseth that his enimies the Iewes shall worship before his feete to proue the inuocation and worship of heauenly Angels Neither spake Paule daungerously when he said the GalathiaÌ„s receiued him as an Angel of God as Christe Iesus For the worde Angell in the Greeke tongue signifieth a messenger it was easie to vnderstand that the messenger or embassadour of a Prince is receiued as the Prince him selfe without confounding the persons of the Prince and his messenger MART. 20. It is much for the authoritie and dignitie of Gods Priests that they do bind and loose and execute al Ecclesiasticall functioÌ„â—â— in the person and power of Christ whose ministers they are So Saint Paule saieth 2. Cor. 2. v. 10. that when hee pardoned or released the penaunce of the incestuous Corinthian he did it in the person of Christe That is as Saint Ambrose expoundeth it in the name of Christe in his steede as his Vicar and deputie But they translate it In the sight of Christ. Where it is euident they can not pretende the Greeke and if there be ambiguitie in the Greeke the Apostle him selfe taketh it away interpreting himselfe in the very same case when he excommunicateth the said incestuous person saying that he doth it in the name and with the vertue of our Lord Iesus Christe so expounding what he meaneth also in this place FVL. 20. That the Bishops Elders or Priests of gods Church do bind and lose as in the person and power of Christ in his name by his authority is acknowledged by vs But when we translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the sight of Christ we respect what the Greeke phrase doth more properly require yea what the Hebrewe phrase mipenei doth signifie wherevnto it is like that the Apostle doth allude Otherwise Beza in his annotations vpoÌ„ the place doth not mislike the sense and interpretation of Ambrose whereof he maketh mention but preferreth the other as more simple and agreeable to the meaning of the Apostle in that place and to the nature of the Greke and Hebrew phrase MART. 21. And it may bee that for some suche purpose they change the antient and accustomed reading in these words of S. Mathew Ex te enim exiet dux qui regat populuÌ„ meum Israel translating thus Out of thee shal come the gouemour that shall feede my people Israel for that shall rule my people Israel This is certaine that it is a false translation because the Prophets wordes Mich. 5. cited by Saint Mathew both in Hebrewe and Greeke signifie onely a ruler or Gouernour and not a Pastor or feeder Therefore it is either a great ouer sight which iâ— a smal matter in coÌ„parison of the least corruption or rather because they do the like Act. 20. v. 28. it is done to suppres the signification of ecclesiastical power gouernement that concurreth with feeding first in Christ and from him in his Apostles and Pastâ—rs of the Church both which are here signified in this one Greeke word to wit that Christ our Sauiour shall rule and feede Ps. 2. Apoc. 2. v. 27. yea he
shal rule in a rod of yron and from him Peter and the rest by his coÌ„mission giuen in the same word feede rule my sheepe Io. 21. yea and that in a rod of yron as when he stroke Ananias and Sapphîra to corporal death as his successors do the like offenders to spiritual destruction vnlesse they repent by the terrible rod of excoÌ„munication This is imported in the double significatioÌ„ of the Greeke word which they to diminish Ecclesiasticall authoritie they translate feede rather than rule or gouerne FVLK 21. That wee shoulde not meane any thing against the gouernement of Christe whome we wishe desire from our hearts that he alone mighte raigne and his seruants vnder him he himselfe is iudge to whome in this case we do boldely appeale But let vs see how we may be charged with false translation The Hebrewe and greek say you do signifie only a ruler or gouernor Mich. 5. And do not we translate a gouernor or captain which may answere there the Hebrew of the Prophet or the Greeke of the Septuaginta or of the Euangelist The word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 that we translate sometime to gouerne sometime to feede is not in the Prophete but in the Euangelist and signifieth properly to feede as a sheepeheard and metaphorically to gouerne What cause haue you here to crie out false translation and to oppose the Hebrewe worde of the Prophet which is fully satisfied in the worde gouernour And the Greeke word which the Euangelist vseth hath his proper signification in some translations in other that which is figuratiue neither doth the one exclude the other But feeding doth import gouerning But it seemeth you would haue rule without feeding that you are so zealous for gouernement The worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Act. 20. in some translations is rendred to rule in other to feede The more proper is to feede yet the greek word wil beare the other also But feeding as a sheephearde doeth his sheepe comprehendeth both The same word Ioan. 21. our Sauiour Christ limiteth rather to feeding as y e Euangelist reporteth his words vsing 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 twise 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 once For by lording ruling Peter shuld not so wel testifie his loue towards Christ as by painefull feeding And there your owne vulgar interpreter translateth Pasce and your selues feede though in the margent you woulde faine pray aide of the Greeke to establish your popes tyrannicall rule Yea you will giue him a rodde of yron which is the scepter of Christ yea an armie of souldiers to subdue Irelande and to wrest it out of the Queene of Englandes dominion that is 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 feed and rule my sheepe in your secret meaning and for that purpose you bring in the miraculous striking of Ananias and Sapheira for their hypocrisie pretending that you meane but spirituall destruction by the rodde of excommunication which howe terrible it is when it is duely exercised by theÌ„ that haue authoritie we neede not learne of you The other text Psalme the 2. Apoc. 2. v. 27. we translate alwaies rule And your vulgar interpretor Pet. 5. translateth the same worde pascite feede you the church of God c. and else where diuerse times Doth he so diminish ecclesiasticall authoritie c. MART. 22. To the diminishing of this Ecclesiasticall authoritie in the later ende of the reigne of king Henrie the â—ight and during the reigne of king Edwarde the sixt the onely translation of their English Bibles was submit your selues vnto all manner ordinance of man whether it be VNTO THE KING AS TO THE CHIEFE HEAD 1. Pet. 2. Where in this Queenes time the later translatours can not finde those wordes nowe in the Greeke but doe translate thus To the king as hauing preeminence or to the king as the Superiour Why so because then the King had first taken vpon him this name of Supreme heade of the Church and therefore they flattered both him and his sonne till their heresie was planted making the holie Scripture to say that the king was the chiefe head which is all one with supreme head but now being better aduised in that point by Caluine I suppose and the Lutherans of Magdeburge who doâ— ioyntly inueigh against such title and Caluine against that by name which was first giuen to king Henry the eight because they may be bolder with a Queene than with a king and because now they thinke their kingdome is well established therfore they suppresse this title in their later traÌ„slations would take it froÌ„ her altogether if they could to aduance their owne Ecclesiasticall iurisdiction whithout any dependence of the Queenes supreme gouernement of their church which in their conscience if they be true Caluinistes or Lutherans or mixâ— of both they doe and must mislike FVLK 22. Touching this text 1. Pet. 2. I haue answered before y t the word signifieth him that excelleth and therfore it is no corruption to translate it y e chiefe For the name of supreme heade in y e sense which Caluine other abroade did mislike it it was neuer allowed nor by authoritie graunted to the kings Henrie and Edward but in the same sense it is now graunted to Queene Elizabeth whom we acknowledge to haue the same authoritie in causes ecclesiasticall which her father and brother kinges before her had exercised to Gods glorie But as Steâ—en Gardiner vnderstoode y e title in conference with Bucer at Ratisbone we doe vtterly abhorre it and so did all godly men alwaies that a king should haue absolute power to do in religion what he will In what sense the popish clergie of England being cast in the premunire did first of all ascribe it to the king in their submission looke you vnto it we thinke it was rather of flatterie than of dutie wisedome or religion As for the ecclesiasticall gouernement which the scripture prescribeth may well stande which craueth the aide of a christian Prince which is y e Queenes authoritie in causes ecclesiasticall MART. 23. But howsoeuer that he let them iustifie their translation or confesse their fault And as for the kinges supremacie ouer the Church if they make any doubt let theÌ„ read S. Ignatius wordes who was in the Apostles time â—uen when S. Peter gaue the foresaide admonition of subiection to the king and knewe very wel how farre his preeminence extended and therefore saith plainely in notorious wordes that we must first honour God then the Bishop and then the king Because in all thinges nothing is comparable to God in the Chuch nothing greater then y e Bishop who is consecrated to God for the saluation of the whole worlde and among magistrates tempâ—rall rulers none is like the king See his other wordes immediatly folowing where he preferreth the Bishops office before the kings al other thinges of price among men FVLK 23. Howsoeuer those Epistles bee truely or vntruely
sundrie places againe if one be restrained from the larger signification peculiarly applyed signifie the Sacramentes of the Church the other also As the Sacrament of the bodie and bloud of Christ or the Mysterie of the bodie and bloud of Christ and the Caluinists in their Latine and Greeke Catechisme say two Sacramentes or two Mysteries FVLK 2. The English worde secret signifieth fully as much as the Greeke worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in which we must seeke no holinesse as papistes doe in vaine sounde of wordes but in the matter annexed which plainely expresseth that it is a great secret of great holines whereof the Apostle speaketh And it is verie false that you say that the Latine worde sacramentum is equiualent to the Greeke for both it signifieth an oth which y e Greke word doth not and also it includeth holinesse which the Greeke worde doth not Or else why sayth not your vulgar translator and you the sacrament of iniquitie 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 therefore signifieth euerie secrete sacramentum onely an holy sacrament as when you say Apoc. 17. the sacrament of the woman the meaning is the secret to be reuealed concerning her is an holy thing else in the same chapter you haue not a sacrament written in her forheade but a mysterie or secret Babylon the mother of abhominations That the sacramentes are called mysteries we confesse but that whatsoeuer is called a mysterie may also be called a sacrament that doe we vtterly denie MART. 3. This being so what is the fault of their translation in the place aforesaide this that they translate neither Sacrament nor Mysterie As for the worde Sacrament they are excused because they translate not the Latine but translating the Greeke why sayde they not Mysterie which is the Greeke worde heere in the Apostle I meane why sayde they not of matrimonie This is a great Mysterie No doubt there can be no other cause but to auoide both those wordes which are vsed in the Latin and Greeke Church to signifie the Sacramentâ—s For in the Greeke Church the Sacrament of thâ— bodie bloud it self is called but a mystery or mysteries which yet the ProtestaÌ„ts themselues call a true Sacrament Therfore if they shold haue called Matrimonie also by that name it might easily haue sounded to be a Sacrament also But in saying it is a great secret they put it out of doubt that it shall not be so taken FVLK 3. Seeing the word secrete y t we vse signifieth wholy as much as mysterie we hope all reasonable men wil allow y e same also Sacrament without preiudice to y e trueth we could not translate and mysterie for the better vnderstanding of the people we haue expressed in the English worde secrete Out of which if it haue any force of argument in it you may proue matrimonie to be a sacrament as well as out of the Greeke worde mysterie But it is the sounde of an vnknowen worde that you had rather play vpon in the eares of the ignorants then by any sound argument out of y e scripture to bring them to the knowledge of the trueth MART. 4. They will say vnto mee Is not euerie sacrament mysterie in english a secrete Yes as Angel is a messenger Apostle one that is sent But when the holy Scripture vseth these words to signifie more excelleÌ„t diuine things then those of the common sort doth it become translators to vse baser termes in steede therof so to disgrace the writing meaning of the holy Ghost I appeale to themselues when they translatâ— this word in other places whether they say not thus And wtout doubt great was y t MYSTERIE of godlines God was shewed manifestly in y e flesh c. againe The MYSTERIE which haue bin hid since y e world began but now is opened to his saincts againe I shew you a MYSTERIE we shal not al sleep but we shal all be changed And the like Where if they should traÌ„slate secret in steed of mysterie as the Bezites do in one of these places saying I wil shew you a secret thing what a disgracing debasing were it to those high mysteries there signified And if it were so in these is it not so in matrimonie which the Apostle maketh such a mysterie that it representeth no lesse mater then Christ his Church whatsoeuer is most excellent in that coniunctioÌ„ Noâ—then if in all other places of high mysterie they translate it also mysterie as it is in the Greeke only in Matrimonie do not so but say rather This is a great secret vsing so base a terme in so high excellent a mysterie must we not needs thinke at no dout it is that they do it because of their heretical opinioÌ„ against the SacrameÌ„t of Matrimony for their base estimation therofâ— FVLK 4. Nowe you flie to your old shift of y e ecclesiastiall vse of termes which you cannot proue to be like of this English word mysterie which is coÌ„moÌ„ly as prophanely secularly vsed as any other word For what is more coÌ„mon among artificers thaÌ„ their science or mystery of weauing of dying such like And yet the word may be vsed of the highest secrets of Christian ReligioÌ„ as it is of our translators And wheresoeuer they haue said a mysterie they might as truely haue saide a secret where they say a secrete they might haue said a mysterie But wher you say y t in al other places of high mystery they translate y e word mysterie it is false For Mat. 13. Mark the 4. Luk. the 8. where all y e mysteries of the kingdome of God are spokeÌ„ of they translate mysteria the secrets of y e kingdome of heauen 1. cor 4. where the sacraments al other secrets of Christian Religion are spokeÌ„ of they translate 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 stewards of y e mysteries of God Wherefore it is a shamefull and senselesse slander that heere only we vse this word secret to shew our base estimation of matrimonie MART. 5. But they wil yet reply againe aske vs what we gaine by translating it either Sacrament or mysterie Doth that make it one of the Sacramentes properly so called to wit such a Sacrament as Baptisme is no surely but howsoeuer wee gaine otherwise at least we gaine the coÌ„mendation of true translators whether it make with vs or against vs. For otherwise it is not the name that maketh it such a peculiar Sacrament For as is said before Sacrament is a generall name in Scripture to other thinges Neither do we therefore so translate it as though it were foorthwith one of the seuen Sacraments because of the name but as in other places wheresoeuer we finde this word in the Latine we translate it Sacrament as in the Apocalipse the sacrament of the woman so finding it heere we doe heere also so translate it and as for the diuerse taking of it heere and else where that
Lorde the sacred cup. why or to what effect It followeth changing it by the holie spirite Where is signified the transmutation and consecration thereof into the bodie and bloud But in the other worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 there may be some question because it signifieth properly to giue thankes therefore may seeme to be referred to God onely and not to the element and creature But this also we finde contrarye in the Greeke fathers who vse this worde also transitiuely saying panem calicem eucharistisatos or panem in quo gratiae actae sunt that is the bread and the cuppe made the Eucharist the bread ouer which thankes are giuen that is which by the worde of prayer and thankes-giuing is made a consecrated meate the fleshe and bloud of Christ as S. Iustine in fine 2. Apologo and Saint Irenaeus lib. 4. 34 in the same places expound it Whereas it may also signifie that for which thankes are giuen in that most solemne sacrifice of the Eucharist as S. Denyâ— in one place seemeth to take it Eccl. Hier c. 3. in fine Who in the selfe same chapter speaketh of the consecration thereof most euidently FVLK 4. That the creatures or elements are blessed and consecrated that by the working of Gods spirite they shoulde bee chaunged into the bodye and bloud of Christ after a diuine and spirituall manner vnto the worthye receyuers Beza and we agree with the Greeke Liturgies But that this blessing is performed by the worde of God prayer and thankes-giuing both Iustinus and Irenaeus doe most plainely testifie with Beza and vs. When the mixed cuppe and bread sayth Irenaeus receyueth the worde of God it is made the Eucharist c. The breade on which or for which thankes is giuen The bread which is of the earth receyuing the vocation or inuocation of God So sayth Iustinus the meate for which thankes are giuen by the worde of prayer which is receyued from him and speaking of the verie manner of the consecration vsed in his tyme. When the breade and wine with water is offered the chiefe Minister sendeth forthe prayers and thankes-giuing with all his might and the people consenteth saying Amen Then followeth the distribution and participation of those thinges for which thankes was giuen to euery one c. As for the Magicall mysteries of Dionyse although in this behalfe they make nothing againste vs we make not so great account of that we will stand to his iudgement any more than you to his practise MART. 5. Whereby we haue to note that the Heretikes in vrging the worde Eucharist as meere thankes-giuing thereby to take away blessing and consecration of the elements of bread and wine doe vnlearnedly and deceitfully because all the fathers make mention of both Saint Paule also calleth it blessing of the chalice which the Euangelistes call giuing of thankes Whose wordes Theophylacte explicateth thus THE CHALICE OF BLESSING that is of the Eucharist For holding it in our handes we blesse it and giue thankes to him that shedde his bloud for vs. See here both blessing and Eucharist blessing the chalice and thankes-giuing to Christ. Saint Iames and the Greeke fathers in their Liturgies put both wordes in the consecration of eche element saying thus giue thankes sanctifying breaking and giuing thankes blessing sanctifying and taking the cuppe giuing thankes sanctifying blessing filling it with the holy Ghost he gaue it to vs his Disciples Saint Chrysostome who in many places of his workes speaketh much of thankes-giuing in these holy mysteries doth he not as often speake of the blessing consecration yea and the transmutation thereof and that with what wordes and by what power it is done Doth not Saint Augustine saye of the same benedicitur sanctificatur it is blessed and sanctified who often speaketh of the solemne giuing of thankes in the sacrifice of the Church Doth not the Church at this daye vse the very same termes as in Saint Augustines time Gratias agamus Domino Deo nostro Let vs giue thankes to the Lord our God and Verè dignum iustum est semper vbique tibi gratias agere c. It is very meete and right alwayes and in all places to giue thee thanks Which the Greeke Church also in their Liturgies expresse most aboundantly yet doth there follow blessing and consecration and whatsoeuer Saint Ambrose describeth to be done in this holye sacrifice touching this poynt writing thereof moste excellently in his booke de ijs qui initiantur mysterijs c 9. FVLK 5. If it were to proue any thing that we deny you would be as bare and hungry as nowe you are franke and plentifull of your testimonies Theophylact sayth the same that Beza sayde out of Chrysostome and Oecumenius The Greeke Liturgies falsely intituled to Saint Iames Basil and Chrysostome haue no other thing nor any other author whome you name But your popish Church doth not either as the Greeke Liturgies or as the Churches in Ambrose and Augustines time For they holde that the elements are consecrared by prayer and thankes-giuing whereof although you vse some termes in your masse yet you holde that the consecration consisteth onely in a Magicall murmuration of the wordes Hoc est corpus meum ouer the bread by a Priest with intent of consecration wherefore you are farre from the iudgement that the auncient fathers had and we haue of the consecration of the bread and wine to be the sacraments of the bodye and bloud of Christ. MART. 6. Of all which this is the conclusion that the Eucharist is a solemne name taken of the worde 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 so called because this sacrament and sacrifice is blessed and consecrated with prayer thankes-giuing as S. Iustine speaketh and because in this sacrifice so blessed and consecrated into the body and bloud of Christ him we offer vp a most acceptable oblation of thankes-giuing and a memorie of all Gods maruelous benefites towarde vs. In this sense the fathers and the holye Church speake of the Eucharist including all the rest to wit sacrament sacrifice blessing consecration without which thiâ— were no more to be called Eucharist than any other common giuing of thanks as S. Irenaeus doth plainly signifie when he declareth that being before bread receiuing the inuocation of God ouer it now is no more coÌ„mon bread but the Eucharist coÌ„sisting of two things the earthly the heauenly So that it is made the Eucharist by circuÌ„stance of solemne wordes and ceremonies and therefore is not a meere giuing of thankes and further we learne that S. Iustines and S. Irenaus wordes before alledged Panis calix Eucaristisatus signifie the bread and chalice made the Eucharist and consequently we learne that the a 〈…〉 e thereof is by thankes-giuing to make the Eucharist a 〈…〉 â—ecause the other word of blessing and this of thankes-giuing are vsed indifferently one for an other in Christs action
this Greeke worde by any other equiualent and more plaine to signifie this mixture FVLK 22. The authoritie of the holy Scriptures with vs is more woorth than the opinion of all the men in the world In the Scripture we finde the fruite of the vine water we find not therefore we account not water to be of any necessitie in the celebration of the Lordes supper In the primitiue Church we know water was vsed first of sobrietie then of ceremonie and at length it grew to be compted of necessitie The Armenians therfore are cōmendable in this point that they would neuer departe from the authoritie of the Scriptures to yeeld to the custome practise or iudgement of any men But against this mixture as you surmise we haue trāslated powred out or drawne I confesse our translators should more simply according to the worde haue saide mingled hir wine and the wine that I haue mingled but because that speach is not vsuall in the English tongue it seemeth they regarded not so much the propertie of the worde as the phrase of our tongue But that they had no purpose against the mixture of the wine with water in the Sacrament it is manifest by this reason that none of them did euer thinke that this place was to be interpreted of the Lordes supper but generally of such spirituall foode as wisedome giueth to mens soules Therefore it is certaine they had no meaning to auoide the worde of mixing for any such intent as you surmise MART. 23. Thus then the Greeke is neither drawing of wine nor powring out thereof as they translate but mingling But the Hebrew perhaps signifieth both or at the least one of the two either to draw or to poure out Gentle Reader if thou haue skill looke the Hebrew Lexicon of Pagnine esteemed the best if thou haue not skill aske and thou shalt vnderstande that there is no such signification of this worde in all the Bible but that it signifieth onely mixture and mingling A straunge case that to auoid this mingling of the cuppe being a most certaine tradition of the Apostles they haue inuented two other significations of this Hebrew word which it neuer had before FVLK 23. The Dictionaries are more sure to teach what a word doth signifie than what it doth not signifie I confesse Pagnine giueth none other signification of that roote 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 but miscuit But euen the worde miscuit may signifie a powring out when there is no respect of ioyning diuers things togither but of seruing one with the cuppe as Tullie vseth the word Qui alteri misceat mulsum ipse non sitiens He that serueth an other with sweete wine when he is not a thirst him selfe So is the Hebrew word vsed Esai 19. where the Prophet sayth The Lorde hath powred forth amonge them the spirite of errour Where the worde of mixture is not so proper Againe your owne vulgar Latine Interpretor Prouerb 23. translateth mimsach a worde deriued from the same roote not for any mixture but for drinking vppe or making cleane the cuppes student calicibus epotandis which study how to empty or drinke vp all that is in the cuppes In Hebrew it is which go to seeke strong wine or mingled wine And if a mixture be graunted in the place you require how proue you a mixture with water rather than with any thing else Verily the circumstance of the place if there must needes be a mixture requireth a mixture of spices hony or some such thing to make the wine delectable vnto which Wisedome doth inuite and allure all men to drinke it rather than of water onely to abate the strength of it As also in the text Prouerbes 23. the drunkards that continued at the wine and went to seeke 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 mingled wine went not to seeke wine mingled with water but some other delicate mixture And Esay 5. where woe is pronoūced to drunkards the same word is vsed woe be to them that are strong to drinke wine and men of might limsoch to mingle strong drinke not to mingle it with water for sobrietie but with some other delectible matter to prouoke drunkennesse as your vulgar Interpretor translateth it So that albeit the word did signifie to mingle neuer so properly and certainly you can make no good argument for mingling with water in that place Prouerbs 9. where either it signifieth simply to drawe broche or powre out or else to prepare with some other more pleasant mixture than of water onely CHAP. XVIII Hereticall translation against the honour of SAINCTS namely of our B. LADIE Martin LEt vs passe from Gods holy Sacraments to his honourable Saincts in heauen and we shall finde that these translations plucke from them also as much honour as they may In the Psalme 138. where the Catholike Church and all antiquitie readeth thus Nimis honorati sunt amici tui Deus c. Thy friendes O God are become exceeding honourable their princedome is exceedingly strengthened which verse is sung and sayd in the honour of the holy Apostles agreeably to that in an other Psalme Constitues cos principes super omnem terram Thou shalt appoint them Princes ouer all the earth what meane they in all their English Bibles to alter it thus Howe deare are thy counsels or thoughts to me O God O how great is the summe of them Doth not the Hebrew make more for the olde receiued Latine translation than for theirs because the Hebrew word is vsed more commonly for to signifie friendes than cogitations doth not S. Hierom so translate in his translation of the Psalmes according to the Hebrew doth not the great Rabbine R. Salomon Doth not the Greeke put it out of doubt which is altogither according to the sayd auncient Latine translation Fulke THe context of the verse going before also the verse following not any enuye against the Saincts of god haue moued our translators to depart from the vulgar translation which is neither so proper for the words altogither impertinent to the matter of the text For when the Prophet had in the verse going before celebrated the wonderfull worke of God in the framing of his body in his mothers womb in this verse he breaketh out into an exclamatiō to behold the maruelous vnsearchable wisedom of gods councels whose strength is aboue mans reach whose nūber is as the sand of the sea To answer R Salomō we haue R. Dauid Kimchi as great a Rabbine as he and a more sincere Interpretor that expoundeth the whole verse euen as we doe MART. 2. And you my Maisters that translate otherwise I beseech you is it in Hebrew How great is the summe of thē not rather word for word most plainly how are the heades of them strengthened or their Princedoms as in the Greeke also it is most manifest Why do you then hunt after nouelties forsake the troden path of the
he adored in respect of things to come it is not otherwise easie to vnderstād but that he partly for saw the kingdō of Ephraim the posteritie of Ioseph partly the kingdome of Christ prefigured in Ioseph then Prince of Aegypt and so by faith adored his scepter or toward his scepier which is all one as the Greeke fathers for the most part expound it But let vs hasten towà rd an end FVLK 6. S. Hierom in deede denieth that Iacob did worship his staffe or his scepter or toward the toppe of his Sonnes scepter but onely towardes the beds head as the Hebrue text is For reuerent estimation of reliques the Holy land and the monuments of Christs doing and being as he sometime vpon contention perhaps was immoderate so for adoration of such things after such Idolatrous manner as is vsed in the popish Church he was farre off yea he saith expresly that hee dothe not allowe the adoration of any creature and that to adore any creatures is plaine idolatrie Has autem non dico martyrum reliquias c. But we doe worshippe and adore I saye not the reliques of martyres but neither the sunne truly nor the moone c. not Aungelles not Archaungels not Cherubin not Seraphin or any name that is named in this worlde or in the worlde to come least we should serue the creature rather than the creator whiche is blessed for euer But we honour the reliques of martyres that wee might adore him whose martyres they are Doe you not heare how Hierome alloweth the adoring of creatures I see no cause therefore why wee may not be tryed by his iudgement for adoration of holie things and namely reliques and whatsoeuer you will name beside seeing he maketh adoration proper onelie to God Finally the Apostle saith not that Iacob adored in respecte of things to come but that by faith he blessed his sonne concerning things to come and worshipped God whome no man can worshippe truely but by faith And Iacobs faith was the more commendable that being neere his ende and in that infirmitie of bodie he both beleeued the promises of God made to him concerning his sonnes and also gaue thankes vnto God for those benefites whyche hee shoulde neuer taste of in the flesh but was assured by them as tokens of Gods fauour towards him to the attainement of the lande of eternall life whereof the lande of Canaan was but a holie figure and sacrament CHAP. XX. Hereticall translation by ADDING TO THE TEXT Martin BEcause in the last corruption I spake of adding to the texte thoughe i◠bee their common and vniuersal fault in euerie controuersie as is to bee seene in euerie chapiter of this booke yet here I wil adde certaine places not yet mentioned As The reste of the actes of Iehoakim and his abhominations whych he did and CARVED IMAGES THAT VVERE LAID TO HIS CHARGE BEHOLDE THEY ARE VVRITTEN c these words carued images laid to his charge are more than is either in the Greeke or the Hebrewe Fulke YOu forget your self in the first place wherof made mention Chap. 3. sect 9. where I haue aunsweared that our firste translators added that which is the common interpretation and supply of them that write vpon this place but because that hadde beene better in the note than in the texte it is corrected in twoo later translations MART. 2. Againe Saule confounded the Iewes proouing by conferring one Scripture with an other that this is very Christe These wordes by conferring one Scripture with another are added more than is in the greeke texte in fauour of their presumptuous opinion that conference of scriptures is ynough for any man to vnderstand them and so to reiecte bothe the commentaries of the Doctours and exposition of holy Councels and Catholike Churche it is so muche more I saye than is in the Greeke text and a notorious corruption in their Bible read daily in their churches as most authenticall See the rest of their Bibles and thou shalte finde no more for al those wordes but affirming or confirming and the selfe same Bible in the first epistle to the Corinthians translateth the same Greeke worde thus Who shal instruct And indeede that is the true and vsuall signification of the word both in the olde Testament and in the newe as Deut. 4. Thou shalt teach them thy children And Esay 40. Who shal instruct our Lord The Hebrewe worde also in both places signifying no more but instructing and teaching And so doth the Apostle cite i◠to the Corinthians out of Esay and he vseth i◠to the Coloss c. 2. v. 2. in the same signification as the Churche readeth and expoundeth it and so consequently S. Luke in the place whereof we nowe treate saith nothing else but that S. Paule earnestly taught or instructed them that Iesus is Christe And yet our newe translators without respect of Hebrewe or Greeke haue coined a new signification of conferring one scripture with an other So ignorant they are in the signification of Greke wordes or rather so wilfully malitious FVLK 2. Either you make aloude lie or else some one print whych you haue of the Bishops Bible whiche you cal Bib. 1577. hath put that into the line that should be the note in the margent For of four translations that I haue neuer a one hath that addition The Bishoppes Bible hathe that 22. verse Chap. 9. this But Saule increased the more in strength and confounded the Iewes which dwelt at Damascus affirming that this was very Christe The Geneua Bible thus But Saule increased the more in strength and confounded the Iewes that dwelt at Damascus confirming that this was the Christ where the note in the margent vppon the word confirming is this proouing by the conference of the scriptures Thomas Mathews Bible translateth that verse thus But Saule increased in strength and confounded the Iewes which dwelt at Damascus affirming that this was verie Christe Maister Couerdales Bible 1562. hatla it thus But Saule increased the more in strength and confounded the Iewes whiche dwelte at Damascus affirming that this was verie Christ. Thus are al our translations without that addition which although it is not to be borne in the text yet is no hereticall addition excepte you counte it heresie to prooue a thing by conference of Scriptures MART. 3. Againe in the firste epistle of Saint Peter they translate thus The worde of the Lorde indureth euer and this is the word which by the gospel was preached vnto you where these wordes by the Gospel are added deceitfully and of il intent to make the reader thinke that there is no other word of God but the written word for the common reader hearing this word Gospel conceiueth nothing else But indeede al is the gospell whatsoeuer the Apostles taught either by writing or by tradition and word of mouth a◠S. Paul speaketh 2. Thess. 2. and S. Peter saith nothing else in the place alleadged but This
I speake of your affectation of the worde Iehôua for so it pleaseth you to accent it in steede of Dominus the Lord whereas the auntient fathers in the verie Hebrewe texte did reade and sounde it rather Adonai as appeareth both by S. Hieromes translation and also his commentaries and I woulde knowe of them the reason why in the Hebrewe Bible whensoeuer this word is ioined with Adonai it is to be read Elohim but only for auoiding Adonai twice togither This I say wee might iustly demaunde of these that take a pride in vsing this word Iehôua so ofte both in Englishe and Latin though otherwise we are not superstitious but as occasion serueth only in the Hebrue text we pronounce it and reade it Againe we might aske them why they vse not aswel Elohim in steede of Deus God and so of therest changing al into hebrue that they may seeme gay fellowes and the people may wonder as their wonderful and mystical diuinitie FVLK 23. In our Englishe translation Iehoua is very seldome vsed in other speache no wise man vseth it oftner than there is good cause why And when there is cause we haue no superstition in pronouncing it as we are not curious in acceÌ„ting it Although perhaps you quarrel at our accent because you can not discerne betweene time and time The middle syllable wee knowe to be long whether it be to be eleuated wee make no question wee know where the accent is in the Hebrue but we thinke not that all accents be sharpe and eleuate that syllable in which they are It is a great matter that you demaunde the reason why ioygned to Adonai it is to bee redde Elohim you should rather demaunde why it is otherwise pointed when it is ioygned with Adonai for being pointed as it is I see not why it shoulde not bee read according to the vowels Adonai Iehouih Many other questions might bee moued about the names of God in pronouncing or writing of which we know the Iewes were reuerente euen to superstition and therefore in bookes that shoulde come in all mennes handes made other alterations than you speake of and yet retayned in other authenticall copies the true letters and pointes If any desire vaine gloriously to vtter his skill in the tongues when hee should edifie the people of all them that be wise and learned he is misliked for so doing MART. 24. To conclude are not your scholers thinke you muche boundâ— vnto you for giuing them in steede of Gods blessed worde and his holy Scriptures such translations heretical Iudaical profane false negligent phantasticall newe naught monstrous God open their eyes to see and mollifie your hartes to repent of all your falshood and treacherie both that which is manifestly conuinced against you and can not be denied as also that which may by some shewe of answer be shifted of in the sight of the ignorant but in your consciences is as manifest as the other FVLK 24. Happy and thrise happy hath our English nation bene since God hath giuen learned translators to expresse in our mother tongue the heauenly mysteries of his holy worde deliuered to his Church in the Hebrew and Greeke languages Who although they haue in some matters of no importance vnto saluation as men bene deceiued yet haue they faithfully deliuered the whole substaunce of the heauenly doctrine conteyned in the holy Scriptures without any hereticall translations or wilfull corruptions And in the whole Bible among them all haue committed as fewe ouersights for any thing that you can bring and of lesse importance than you haue done onely in the newe Testament Where beside so many omissions euen out of your owne vulgar Latine translation you haue taken vpon you to alter that you founde in your texte and translate that which is onely in the margent is redde but in fewe written copies As for Italia you say Aâ—talia noted before Heb. 13. for placuerunt you translate latuerunt 2. Pet. 2 for coinquinationis which is in the text you translate coinquinationes which was founde but in one onely copie by Hentenius as the other but in one or two of thirtie diuerse copies most written FINIS A briefe table to direct the Reader to such places as Martin in this boke cauilleth to be corrupted in diuers translations of the Englishe Bibles by order of the bookes chapters verses of the same with some other quarels against Beza and others for their Latine translations with the aunsweares of W. Fulke Genesis CHap. 4. v. 7. pag. 31. numb 28. and pag. 316. num 9. chap. 14. v. 18. p. 55. numb 42. and pag. 447. chap. 34. v. 35. p. 206. num 7. chap. 42. v. 38. p. 216. num 12. 4. of the Kings Chap. 29. v. 5. p. 501. numb 6. 2. Paralipomenon Chap. 28. v. 19. p. 518. nu 10. chap. 38. v. 8. p. 116. num 19. and p. 4â—3 num 1. 1. Esdras Chap. 9. v. 5. p. 373. num 16. Psalmes Psal. 48. v. 16. p. 252. psal 84. v. 7. p. 511. psal 85. v. 13. p. 218. num 13. and p. 59. num 46. psal 89. v. 48. p. 219. num 14. psal 95. v. 6. p. 478. psal 98. v. 5. ibidem psal 131. v. 7. ibid. psal 138. v. 17. p. 460. psal 147. v. 19. p. 252. and â— 18. p. 516. num 3. Prouerbes Chap. 1. v. 12. p. 22â— numb 22. chap. 9. v. 2. p. 456. nu 21. cum sequent chap. 27. v. 20. p. 228 chap. 30. v. 16. ibid. Cantica canticorum Chap. 6. v. 8. p. 155. num 10 chap. 8. v. 6 p. 29. num 46. see p. 508. numb 2 Of Wisdome Chap. 3. v. 14. p. 346. num 3 chap. 15. v. 13. p. 127. num 27 Ecclesiasticus Chap. 5. v. 5. p. 348. numb 4 chap. 7. v. 31. p. 390 Esay Chap. 2. p. 513. numb 7 chap. 26. v. 18. p. 508 chap. 30. v. 22. p. 121. num 23 and v. 20. p. 511. num 5 chap. 33. p. 513. num 6 Hieremie Chap. 7. v. 18. p. 467. num 9 chap. 11. v. 19. p. 453. num 18 chap. 44. v. 19. p. 467. num 9 Daniel Chap. 4. v. 24. p. 375. numb 18 chap. 6. v. 22. p. 256. num 3 chap. 10. v. 12. p. 372. num 15 chap. 14. v. 4. p. 126. num 26 and v. 12. 17. 20. pâ— 451. num 16 Osee. Chap. 12. v. 10. p. 514. num 8 chap. 13. v. 14. p. 159 num 46 and p. 221. num 16 Ioel. Chap. 2. v. 23. p. 511 Habacuc Chap. 2. v. 18. p. 122. num 23 see p. 510. num 4 Malachie Chap. 2 v. 7. p. 412. num 17 chap. 3. v. 1. p. 414. num 18 and v. 14. p. 374. num 17 1. Machabees Chap. 1. v. 51. p. 252. chap. 2. v 21. ibid. 2. Machabees Chap. 6. v. 7. p. 501. num 5 S. Matthew Chap. 1. v. 19. p. 257. num 4 and v. 25. p. 470 chap. 2. v. 6. p 417 chap. 3. v. 8. p. 355. chap. 16. v. 18. p. 140. numb
you to proue Forsooth that his aduersaries do confesse all the olde fathers to be on their side and to haue erred with them as Fulke doth of S. Ambrose Austen Tertullian Origen Chrysostom Gregorie and Bede by name with most reprochefull and contemptuous words against them This is spoken generally as though we confesse all the doctors to bee on their side in euery controuersie which we doe not acknowledge to be true in any one although many of the later sort do in some part fauour one or two errours of theirs among an hundreth But let vs examine his prooues which seeme to be verie plentifull yet of nine quotations I must needes strike out two page 306. and 279. because in them is not one syllable of my writing but all of Allens In the pages 315. 316. is nothing more contained touching this matter than I haue alreadie declared There remaineth nowe page 349. where I say touching a rule of S. Augustine which hee giueth to trie faith and doctrine of the Church onely by the scripture that if he had as diligently followed it in examining the common error of his time of prayer for the dead as he did in beating downe the schisme of the Donatistes or the heresie of the Pelagians hee woulde not so blindly haue defended that which by holy scripture he was not able to maintaine as he doeth in that booke De Cura pro mortuis agenda and else where What most reprochefull or contemptuous wordes are here against S. Augustine Seeing the holie scripture is a light shining in a darke place as S. Peter sayeth who so goeth without it must walke blindly which I say in commendation of the light of the scripture not in contempt of Augustines reason whome as I may not honour with contempt of the trueth so when he is a patrone maintainer of the truth I honour him from my heart Likewise page 78. Saint Ambrose is named but nothing acknowledged to fauour any popish errour Augustine is againe noted speaking of the amending fire whereof he hath no ground but in the common errour of his time and whereof he affirmeth sometimes that it is a matter that may bee doubted of sometimes that there is no third place at all Wherefore this place hath neither reprochful wordes nor confession of any constant opinion of Augustine inclining to your errours Then let vs passe to the next place which is page 435. where concerning this matter I haue written thus I denie that any of the auncient fathers in Christs time or scholers to his Apostles or within one or two hundreth yeares after Christ except one that had it of Montanus the heretike as he had more things beside in any one word maintained your cause for purgatorie or prayers for the dead Secondly of them that maintained prayers for the dead the most confessed they had it not out of the scriptures but of tradition of the Apostles and custome of the church therefore they are not to be compared vnto vs in better vnderstanding of the scriptures for that point which they denyed to be receiued of the scriptures Thirdly those of the auncient fathers that agreed with you in any part of your assertion for none within 400. yeares was wholly of your errour notwithstanding manie excellent gifts that they had yet maintained other errors beside that and about that diffented one from another and sometime the same man from himselfe and that is worst of all from manifest truth of the holy scriptures Therefore neither is their erronious interpretation in this matter to be receiued nor M. Allens wise iudgement of vs to bee regarded Here also I appeale to the iudgement of indifferent readers what confession I haue made of the fathers to be on their side or what reprochefull or contemptuous wordes I haue vsed against them for dissenting from vs. The next place is quoted page 247. where I say against Allen boasting of auncient testimonies for prayer for the dead I will not denie but you haue much drosse and dregges of the later sort of doctors the later the fuller of drosse But bring me any worde out of Iustinus Martyr Irenaeus Clemens Alexandrinus or any that did write within one hundreth yeares after Christ that aloweth prayer or almes for the dead I will say you are as good as your word Here except he will cauil that I acknowledge much drosse and dregs to be in the later sort of doctors I knowe not what hee findeth that hath any shadowe of his slander But the trueth must be confessed that the pure waters of life are to be founde onely in the worde of God and beside that the best and purest liquors that are to bee seene are not cleare from all dregges and drosse of humane error and frailtie In the next page Origen deliuered from the shamefull mangling of Allens allegation is shewed plainly to be an enimie of purgatorie prayer for the dead in that he affirmeth the day of a Christian mans death to be the ende of all sorrowe and the beginning of all felicitie There remaineth nowe the last place quoted page 194. where I acknowledge that Gregorie Bernard Bede vpon the text Matth. 12. are of opinion that sinnes not remitted in this world may be remitted in the world to come But how happeneth it say I that Chrysostome Ieronyme which both interpreted that place could gather no such matter although they otherwise allowed prayer for the dead The reason must needes be because the errour of purgatorie growing so much the stronger as it was neerer to the full reuelation of Antichrist Gregorie and Bede sought not the true meaning of Christ in this scripture but the confirmation of their plausible error Here is all the confessions most reprochefull contemptuous wordes that are conteined in so manie of those places as he hath quoted in which I will not tarrie to rehearse how manie vntruthes he hath vttered against mee but wish the indifferent reader to consider that if he be so bolde to slander mee concerning a booke printed in English by which he may be conuinced of euerie simple reader what dare he not aduouch of matters done and past at Rome whither none may trauell to trie out his tretcherie but he is in manifest danger neuer to returne the answere of his message From this Popish Parson whatsoeuer his name be I must passe to another gentleman namelesse in deede but not blamelesse yea much more blame worthie than the other who among so manie and so great flanders as it is wonder howe they could bee conueyed into so small a booke against our prince her lawes her councellors her iudges her officers the nobilitie the comminaltie the church the gouernors the pastors the people thereof against all states persons of the land in whome there is religion towardes God ioyned with dutie towarde their prince and countrie hath founde yet some emptie corners where he might place me in particular And
to maintaine any cause of ours by plaine syllogismes onely In the meane time to finde you occupieâ— â—here hath beene a booke called syllogisticon set fooâ—th by maister Foxe more than twentie yeares agoe let vs see in a sheete of printed paper what ye haue to answere those syllogismes whether you will finde them defectiue in forme or matter or else there is no reason but you should graunt their conclusion Pag. 146. to prooue that protestantes are lordes of the scripture to make them say what they list D. Fulkes wordes to maister Bristowe are cited For the diuision of parishes excommunication suspension publike solemnizing of mariages with the lawes thereof and punishing of heretikes by death they are all manifestly prooued out of the scripture This I say alleaging no one place of scripture to prooue it sayth our censurer I say as much of holding of councels which Bristowe with the rest wil haue vs as apes to haue borrowed of the popish church Whereas I affirme they are proued out of the scriptures if Bristow wil reply denie y t such things may be proued out of the scriptures it shall be no harde matter to do it Yet in the meane time if you thinke I haue sayde more than I can shewe I will giue you this tast For diuision of Churches or parishes Act. 14. v. 23. Elders in euerie church and Tit. 1. v. 5. elders in euerie citie or towne Holding of councelles Act. 15. excommunication where the partie cast out is to be taken for an heathen or publicane Math. 18. v. 17. separation or suspension where the partie separated is to be taken as a brother 2. Thess. 3. publike solemnizing of mariage Mat. 1. v. 18. where betrothing and publike comming together are expressed Example Ioan. 2. for punishment of heretikes I haue cited before What the Puritans will grant I care not although I thinke there are none of them that are so called will denie any of these except he be some madde schismatike and for the last which you say was for a long time denied by our selues till nowe we haue burned some for religion in Englande you should haue tolde howe long For we haue not now first of all consented to the burning of heretikes The Arrians and Anabaptistes burned in king Edwardes dayes for thirtie yeares agoe can beare witnesse But you may say your pleasure I knowe few in other countries but heretikes themselues that denie it to be lawful to punish blasphemous obstinate heretikes by death If any haue any priuate opinion what haue we to doe wich it or to bee charged by it If I shoulde note your phrase when you say that protestantes doe now reigne in Englande as though there were more kinges than one you would say perhaps I were ouer captious Well let it passe But such thinges sayde I as are not euidently conteined in the worde a Christian is not absolutely bounde to beleeue them In plaine dealing you should haue bestowed a note in your margent where I haue so sayde as well as placed there hereticall audacitie of your papisticall charitie The saying I confesse or the like yet the circumstances of the place where it was vttered would perhaps haue bewrayed some part of your vsuall and honest dealing But what cause haue you to criâ—â—ut so loude Behoulde the last refuge of a proude hereticall spirite in breaking where he cannot otherwise get out Call you it proude heresie to holde that nothing is to be credited vpon necessitie of saluation which hath not authoritie of the holy scripture which are able to make a man wise to saluation which are written that beleeuing we might be saued which are able to make the man of God perfect prepared to euerie good worke And why doe yee dare M. Charke to aâ—ouch that which I haue affirmed I knowe he dare affirme and is able to defend this truth but there is no reason that he should be dared with my assertioÌ„s I dare affirm to your face if you dare shewe it that a christian man is not bounde to beleeue that the common creede was made by the Apostles after that fabulous maner that you papistes doe teach Namely that Peter made one peece Andrewe another and so of the rest yet I doubt not but it is gathered out of the doctrine and writinges of the Apostles But you haue ancient doctors which affirme that it was made by the Apostles Origen Terâ—llian Ierome Ruffinus Ambrose Austen and all the primitiue church doe so constantly affirme to be their doingâ—s Let vs consider then in order First Origen in proâ—â— lib. de princip testifieth that the Apostles by their preaching did most plainely deliuer y e summe of faith according to the capacitie of the most simple whereof hee maketh a rehearsall contayning in deede some articles of the creed but neither al nor any one in such forme of words as our creede doth expresse them And before he beginneth the rehearsall of them thus he sayeth Species verò eoruÌ„ quae per praedicationem ApostolicaÌ„ manifesté traduntur istae sunt These are the particulars of those thinges which by the preaching of the Apostles are manifestly deliuered Which wordes doe shewe that the Apostles in deede taught the doctrine yet prooue not that they made this creede rather than the Nicen creede or Athanasius Creede Tertullian against Praxeas much after the same maner yet more neere the wordes of the creede rehearseth the articles pertaining to the three persons of the deitie and then he addeth Hâ—â—c regulam ab initio euangelii de cucurrisse etiam ante priores quosque haereticâ—s nedum ante Praxeam hesternum probabis â—â—â— ipsa posteritaâ— omnium hâ—â—â—â—icorum quà m ipsa nouellitas Praxeae hesterni That this rule hath runne downe from the beginning of the gospell euen before all former heretikes not onely before Praxeas a yesterdayes birde as wel the later spring of all heretikes shall prooue as the verie noueltie of Praxeas one that came but yesterday That the rule of faith contained in the Creede is as auncient as the preaching of the Gospel I alwayes agreed with Tertullian but that the Apostles made the Creede I heare him yet say neuer a worde Ierom ad Pammachium against the errours of Iohn of Ierusalem sayth In symbolo fidei spei nostrae quod ab Apostolis traditum non scribitur in charta atramento sed in tabulis cordis carnalibus post confessioneÌ„ trinitatiâ— vnitatem ecclesiae omne Christiani dogmatis sacramentâ—m carnis resurrectione includitur In the symbole of our faith and hope which being deliuered from the Apostles is not written in paper and ynke but in the fleshie tables of our hearts after the confession of the Trinitie and the vnitie of the Church all the mysterie of Christian doctrine is inclosed in the resurrection of the flesh Although it be graunted that Saint Ierome here speaketh of our common Creede yet it followeth not that hee affirmeth it to bee made by the
childbed wee beleeue not because wee haue not read it That you say Lo M. Chark S. Augustine maketh it both a matter of faith and the doubting thereof to be blasphemie how will you auoid this It is easily auoyded for it is false in many respects first S. Augustine fayeth it not but some obscure man of much latter time lesse learning and authoritie as the barbarous stile in many places declareth secondly hee fayth not that it is a matter of faith to beleeue the perpetuall virginitie of Marie but that shee conceiued brought foorth and remained a virgine after her child-birth Thirdly he maketh not the doubting thereof to be blasphemie but the obstinate denying of Heluidius which saide shee was no virgine after her childbirth But how will you auoide that which S. Ierome writeth We refuse those things that are not written we beleeue not because wee haue not read in y e scripture anything hereof as necessarie to saluation Pag. 158. you do not see why you should beleeue a Charke or a Fulke comming but yester day from the grammar schole before a Cyprian a Tertullian a Basil a Ierom an Ambrose or an Augustine especially in a matter of fact as your case is seeing they liued more than twelue or thirteene hundred yeares nearer to the deede dooing than these ministers do Why sir I pray you who requireth you to beleeue any minister of these dayes before any of those auncient fathers in respect of the credite of the persons and not of the truth which they bring You knowe that Panormitane thinketh more credite is to be giuen to one lay man speaking the trueth according to scripture than to all men of all ages speaking contrarie to the trueth or beside the truth of the scriptures But it is a matter of fact you say whether such and such traditions came from Christ his Apostles or no and therefore they that liued neerer the time of the deede dooing by twelue or thirteene hundreth yeares are more like to knowe the trueth than wee I answere that all things that you pretende for traditions are not of one sort some are contrary to the word of God and are reproued by euidence of the holy scriptures other are beside the worde of God and therefore not necessarie to bee receiued because they are not found in the holie scriptures As for the prerogatiue of antiquitie cannot argue a certaine knowledge of the fact in these ancient fathers seeing in two or three hundreth yeares that was before their time and the time of the deede supposed to be done any fable might be obtruded vnder pretence of such tradition as we prooue that many were Yea when they that were neerest of all to the Apostles time as Polycarpus and Anicetus do not agree what was the Apostles traditioÌ„ which was not expressed in their writing it is manifest that they of much latter time coulde haue no certeintie thereof And that whatsoeuer ceremonie or practise the Apostles deliuered which was not expressed in the scripture was but temporall or arbitrarie in the power of the Church to vse or not vse as it might best serue for edifying Finally where you affirme that Fulk came but yesterday from the Grammar schole to make it seeme that he is but a yong grammatian either your dayes be neere as long as thirtie yeres or else your pen runneth beyond your knowledge of him or at leastwise your malice ouer reacheth your knowledge But yet to this extremitie of crediting one Charke or Fulke before so many auncient fathers you say you are driuen and bid men hearken a little howe D. Fulke handleth these men about traditions And first S. Cyprian alledging the tradition of Christ himselfe concerning the mingling of wine and water in the chalice but if Cyprian had beene well vrged faith Fulke he would haue better considered of the matter Thus you woulde make men beleeue that I oppose nothing but mine owne authoritie or credit against S. Cyprian But then you shamefully beelie me for this is the matter and these are my wordes which you haue gelded at your pleasure Whereas Cyprian ad Pompeiâ—â— calleth all traditions to the writinges and commandements of the Apostles Martiall cryeth out that Cyprian is slandered because he himselfe alleageth the tradition of Christ for mingling of water with wine If Cyprian breake his owne rule who can excuse him But if he had beene vrged as much for the necessitie of water as he was for the necessitie of wine in the sacrament he would haue better considered of the matter Who seeth not I suppose no lesse authoritie against Cyprian than of Cyprian himselfe and therefore I boast not of mine owne credite aboue his To proceede Tertullian is alleaged saying that the blessing with the signe of the crosse is an apostolike tradition Fulke Tertullians iudgement of tradition without scripture in that place is corrupt If I should search no further heere is a reason of Fulkes mislike of Tertullians iudgement added because he affirmeth tradition of the Apostles without the writing of the Apostles But in deede there is in the place by you noted other argumentes in these wordes Tertullians iudgement of tradition without scripture in that place is corrupt for Martiall himselfe confesseth that a tradition vnwritten should be reasonable and agreeable to the scriptures and so he sayth the tradition of blessing with the crosse is because the Apostles by the holy ghost deliuered it But who shall assure vs thereof Tertullian and Basill are not sufficient warrant for so worthy a matter seeing S. Paule leaueth it out of the vniuersall armour of God This last and inuincible argument in rehearsing my wordes you leaue out which because perhaps you could not see in sewe wordes I will set it more abroade The vniuersall spirituall armour of God is deliuered by S. Paule Eph. 6. blessing with the signe of the crosse is not there deliuered by S. Paul therefore blessing with the signe of the crosse is no part of the spirituall armour of God Nowe let vs see whether you will beleeue a Paule before a Tertullian or a Basill or a Fulke with S. Paule before a Basil with Tertullian without S Paule or against S. Paule But you goe forwarde S. Ierome is alleaged saying that lent fast is the tradition of the Apostles Fulke Ierome vntruely ascribeth that tradition to the Apostles My wordes are against Bristowes Mot. pag. 35. these Againe S. Ierome fayth it was a tradition of the Apostles to fast 40. dayes in the yeare If this be true then is the popish storie false that maketh Telesphorus bishoppe of Rome author of that lenten fast Eusebius sheweth y e great diuersitie of fasting before Easter li. 5. cap. 26. saying that some fasted but one day some two dayes some more some 40. houres of day and night This diuersitie prooueth that Ierome vntruely ascribeth that tradition to the Apostles which should haue beene kept vniformely if it had any institution
the difference betweene a storie at large and an abridgement c. If you be able to defende that booke to be Canonicall answere my reasons prepare your selfe to answere as many â—â—re as may bee alledged to conuince the vanitie and falshod of that stories and so I leaue you to a better minde if it be Gods will to giue it you I finde also that in the Popish annotations vpon the new Testament printed at Rhemes my writings are carped at in two places the former vpoÌ„ 2. Thes. 2. where my wordes against Saunders Rocke page 248. page 278. are rehearsed In which I say that Leo Gregorie bishops of Rome although they were not come to the full pride of Antichrist yet the mysterie of iniquitie hauing wrought in that seate neere fiue or sixe hundred yeares before them and then greatly increased they were so deceiued with the long continuance of errour that they thought the dignitie of Peter was much more ouer the rest of his fellowe Apostles than the holy scriptures of God against which no continuance of errour can prescribe doeth either allowe or bearâ— withall Againe the testimonies of Leo Gregorie bishops of Rome as alwayes so nowe I deeme to bee vnmeete to be heard in their owne cause though otherwise they were not the worst men yet great furtherers of the authoritie of Antichrist which soone after their dayes tooke possession of the chayre which they had helped to prepare for him For this I am called a malepeart scholer of Bezaes impudent schoole But by what reason For placing the mysterie of Antichrist as woorking in the see of Rome euen in S. Peters time That the mysterie of Antichrist did worke in S. Peters time the text of S. Paul is plaine That it did worke in Rome where Antichrist should be openly shewed S. Iohn is plaine in the Reuelation Ca. 17. ver 9. 18. yea the Papists confessing that S. Peter called Rome Babylon must needes grant as much this onely then remaineth in controuersie whether in the sea or church of Rome the mysterie of iniquitie did worke from the Apostles time vntill Antichrist was openly shewed Seeing it wrought at Rome it wrought either in the church or altogether out of the church but it wrought not altogether out of the church therefore it wrought in the church That the mysterie of iniquitie preparing for that Antichrist wrought not altogether out of the church it is manifest because the seat of Antichrist is prophesied to bee in the Temple and Church of God Without the Church was not the mysterie of iniquitie against Christ but open wickednesse and persecution of Christes Church Therefore within the Church that mysterie did worke By what meanes first it is not certaine because it was a secrete not reuealed by the Apostle Some coniecture that it was by preferring one bishop before all the clergie of elders or priests which at the first were equall Some thinke that such factions began at Rome as afterwarde were at Corinth one holding of Cephas that is Peter another of some other How euer it was the challenge made to Peters chayre and from the dayes of Victor diuerse bishops of Rome creeping vp by litle and litle pretending authoritie ouer other Churches other churches reuerencing that see for many good respects were abused by Satan to set forwarde his purpose in aduauncing the throne of Antichrist And where I saide that Leo Gregorie were great furtherers of the authoritie of Antichrist my meaning was not that they did wittingly willingly prepare a seat for Antichrist but that the dâ—uel by Gods permission because he was to send the efficacie of error into the world tooke hold in the time appointed of that authoritie which the bishops for the dignitie of their see and as they thought for the benefite of the church did labour so greatly to maintaine encrease Neither write I any thing contrarie to the challenge of that reuerend father the bishop of Sarum as they charge mee who saide at Paules crosse O Gregorie O Leo if we be deceiued you haue deceiued vs For his meaning was not thereby to allow whatsoeuer they had done or written but that in some such matters as are in controuersie betweene the Papistes and vs euen Gregorie and Leo are witnesses against them A great accusation is in the note vpon Heb. 5. ver 6. in these wordes You must beware of the wicked heresie of the Arrians and Caluines except in these latter it be rather an error proceding of ignorance that stick not to say that Christ was a priest or did sacrifice according to his godhead which is to make Christ God the fathers priest and not his sonne and to do sacrifice and homage to him as his lorde and not as his equall in dignitie and nature Therefore S. Augustine sayeth in Psal. 109. That as he was man he was priest as God he was not priest And Theodoret in Psal. 109. As man he did offer sacrifice but as God he receiued sacrifice And againe Christ touching his humanitie was called a priest and hee offered none other host but his owne bodie c. Dâ—m 1. circa med Some of our newe masters not knowing so much did let fall out of their pennes the contrarie and being admonished of the error and that it was verie Arrianisme yet they persist in it of meere ignorance in the grounds of diuinitie First note the intollerable pride of these Popish interpreters that challenge to themselues all learning and knowledge in diuinitie condemning all other men of ignorance meere ignorance in the groundes of diuinitie So playeth Bristowe with the bishop of Sarum whome in the place by them quoted I reproued in these words The like impudent cauil he bringeth against M. Iewel whoÌ„ no man I thinke without laughter can read to be charged with ignorance by blundering Bristowe for affirming Christ to be a priest according to his deitie whom the Apostle expressely sayeth by his eternall spirite to haue offered himselfe Heb. 9. ver 14. But that you may the better vnderstand this controuersie betweene vs we denie not that Christ was a priest according to his humanitie but wee affirme that whole Christ is a priest as he is both God and man For in the office of priesthood two things must be considered a ministerie and an authoritie In respect of the ministeriall part our Sauiour Christ perfourmed that office as man but in respect of authoritie of entring into the holiest place reconciling vs to God presenting vs vnto God which was the principall part of his priesthood hee did perfourme it as the sonne of God as Lorde and maker of the house and not as a seruant but as God which hath created all things Heb. 3. vers 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. Against this sound doctrine let vs examine what the heretikes alledge First they charge it most odiously with Arrianisme but without all â—parke of reason seeing wee distinguish plainly
the authoritie of God the sonne which is equall with his father from the ministerie of y e man Iesu Christ inferior to his father as touching his manhood Secondly they charge vs that we sticke not to say Christ was a priest or did sacrifice according to his Godhead Wee say he was a priest and did offer sacrifice both according to his godhead according to his manhood And the same saâ—eth the Apostle in effect when he saith The bloud of Christ which by his eternal spirit offered himself vnreprouable to God shal purge your conscience c. Heb. 9. 14. For not y e bloud of beastes nor of any man though he had beene innocent but the bloud of that man which was God was the price of our redemption in which respect the Apostle Act. 20. ver 28. sayeth that God purchased his Church vnto him selfe by his owne bloud For by the eternall spirite is vnderstood that infinite power of the diuinitie vnited to the humanitie by which the sacrifice of Christ was consecrated that by the same liuely or quickening vertue by which he created vs he might also restore vs. Whereunto our Sauiour Christ had regard when he saide Ioh. 6. It is the spirite that giueth life the flesh profiteth nothing But this say the Papistes is to make Christ God the fathers priest not his sonne Nay rather this is to acknowledge Christ to be both his fathers sonne and his priest euen as the Apostle sayeth The law appointeth priestes men that haue infirmitie but the worde of the othe which is after the lawe the Sonne for euer perfected Heb. 7. v. 28. Where by the oppositioÌ„ of men hauing infirmitie with the Sonne perfected for euer it is most cleare that the worde of the othe maketh Christ as he is the Sonne of God a priest after the order of Melchisedech Where I cannot omitte the shamefull corruption of this text in the popish translation which to hide this opposition betweene men and God the sonne of God hath altogither left out this worde men although it be in the Latine expressed manifestly Lex enim homines constituit sacerdotes infirmitatem habentes which they translate thus For the law appointeth priestes them that haue infirmitie But to proceede Our accusers adde further that our assertion is to make Christ to doe sacrifice and homage to God his father as his Lorde and not as his equall in dignitie and nature I aunswere no more than when S. Paul sayeth that Christ when hee was in the forme of God and thought it no robberie to bee equall with God he made himselfe of no reputation tooke vpon him the shape of a seruant became obedient to the death euen the death of the crosse I haue sufficiently before distinguished that all partes of his priesthood that required obedience seruice homage ministerie subiection he perfourmed as man but the authoritie of reconciling men vnto God he wrought as God and man euen as the Apostle writeth God was in Christ reconciling the world to him selfe 2. Cor. 5. ver 19. That he might be a priest therefore able and worthie to make attonement with God he was God that his reconciliation and satisfaction might extende to men he was man and so beeing God and man he is â— perfect mediator betweene God and man and an high priest for euer after the order of Melchisedech All this notwithstanding they oppose against vs the authoritie of the fathers who doubtlesse had no other meaning than we to keepe this distinction First Augustine in Psal. 109. is produced to say that as hee was man he was priest as God he has not priest But Augustines wordes are somewhat otherwise vppon the text Iurauit Dominus c. Ad hoc enim natus ex vtero ante luciferum vt esses sacerdos in aeternum secundum ordineÌ„ Melchisedech Si natuÌ„ ex vtero de virgine intelligimus ante LuciferuÌ„ noctu sicut â—uangelia contestantur procul dubio inde ex vtero ante luciferuÌ„ vt esset Sacerdos in aeternuÌ„ secunduÌ„ ordinem Melchisedech Nam secundum id quod natus est de patre Deus apud Deum coaeternus gignenti non Sacerdos sed sacerdos propter carnem assumptam propter victimam quam pro nobis offerre◠á nobis acceptam The Lorde hath sworne c. For to this ende thou wast borne out of the wombe before the day starre that thou mightest be a priest for euer after the order of Melchisedech For according to that he is borne of God the father God with God toeternall with him that begetteth he is not a priest but a priest for his flesh assumpted for the sacrifice which being taken of vs he might offer for vs. In these words Augustines meaning is plaine ynough that Christ according to his diuine and eternall generation could not haue beene a priest for vs except hee had taken our flesh and beene borne a man which wee doe alwaies confesse But that our redemption by his sacrifice was the meere worke of his manhoode onely he sayth not but the contrarie if he be marked For he sayth that the sonne of God was a priest for the fleshe which he tooke of vs that he might offer for vs that sacrifice which he tooke of vs. Heere it is plaine that Christ as God offereth sacrifice but he offereth as a priest for to offer sacrifice pertayneth to a priest therefore Christ as God is a priest yet not as God only but as God and man Whereupon the same Augustine saith afterwarde O domine qui iâ—rasti c. O Lorde which hast sworne and sayde Thou arâ— a priest for euer after the order of Mâ—lchisâ—dech the same priest for euer is the Lorde on thy right hande the very same I say priest for euer of whom thou hast sworne is the Lorde on thy right hande because thou hast sayde to the same my Lorde Sit thou on my right hande vntill I make thine enemies thy footestoole Heere he affirmeth that the eternall God Dauids Lorde as he was God Dauids sonne as he was man is that eternall priest And to what ende but to perfourme those partes of a priest which were proper to God that is to reconcile vs vnto God to haue authoritie of himselfe and of his owne nature and worthynesse to come before God and to remaine in the fauour of God alwayes which no creature hath but through his worthinesse and gracious gift The next authoritie brought against vs is Theodoret in Psal. 109. who is cited thus As man he did offer sacrifice but as God he did receiue sacrifices verily we say as much and more also that he offered sacrifice as God also reconciling the world to himselfe But in truth the wordes of Theodoret are otherwise and to an other ende Sacerdos autem non est Christus qui ex Iuda secundum carnem ortus est non ipse aliquid offerens sed vocatur caput eorum qui offerunâ— quandoquidem eius corpus ecclesiam
vocat propterea sacerdotio fungitur vt homo recipis autem ea quae offeruntur vt Deus offeri verò ecclesia corporis eius sanguinis symbola omne fermentum per primitias sanctificans And Christ is nowe a priest which is sprung of Iuda according to the flesh not offering any thing himselfe but is called the head of them that offer seeing he calleth the church his bodie and therefore he exerciseth the priesthoode as a man and hee receiueth those thinges that are offered as God and the church truely doth offer the tokens of his bodie and bloud sanctifying euerie leauen by the first fruites In these wordes Theodoret speaketh not of the sacrifice that Christ offered himselfe but of the spirituall sacrifice of thankesgiuing which the church offereth to him in celebrating the memorie of his death Not of the priesthoode which Christ did exercise in earth but of the priesthoode that he doth exercise in heauen not now offering anie thing but as God receiuing oblations And where he sayth that nowe he exerciseth the priesthoode as man he denieth not but that he doeth exercise it as mediator God and man Which is more plaine in his exposition of the Epistle to the Heb. cap. 8. where he enquireth how Christ doth both sit at the right hande of maiestie and yet is a minister of the holy thinges Quonam enim munere sacerdotali fungitur qui seipsum semelobtuliâ— non offert amplius sacrificium Quomodo autem fieri potest vt idem sedeaâ— socerdotali officio fungatur Nisi fortè dixerit quispiam esse munus sacerdotale salutem quam vt dominus procurat Tabernaculum autem vocauit coelum cuius est ipse opifex quem vt hominem dixit Apostolus fungi sacerdotio For what priestly office doth he exercise which hath once offered vp himselfe and doth no more offer any sacrifice And howe can it be that the same person shoulde together both sit and exercise the priestly office Except perhaps a man will say that the saluation which he procureth as Lorde is a priestly office Neither hath he any other meaning Dialog prime where his purpose is to prooue that Christ had a body Si est ergo sacerdonum proprium offerre munera Christus autem quod ad humanit atem quidem attinet sacerdos appellatus est non aliam autem hostiam quam suum corpus obtuliâ— Dominus ergo Christus corpus habuiâ— If therefore it be proper for priestes to offer giftes and Christ as concerning his humanitie truely is called a priest and he offered none other sacrifice but his owne bodie therefore our Lorde Christ had a bodie He sayth not that Christ is a priest according to his humanitie onelie whereas the excellencie of his person being both God and man caused â—is sacrifice to be acceptable and auaileable for the redemption of man But to make the matter cleare beside that which the Apostle writeth to the Hebrues ca. 9. these argumentes may plainely be drawen out of the 7. cap. where he speaketh expresly of his priesthood after the order of Melchisedech Christ as he is without father and without mother is â— priest after the order of Melchisedech Christ as he is God and man is without father and without mother therfore Christ as he is God and man is a priest after the order of Melchisedech Againe Christ as he hath no beginning of his dayes nor ende of his life is a priest after the order of Melchisedech Christ according to his diuinitie hath no beginning of his daies nor ende of his life according to his whole person Therefore Christ according to his diuinitie and according to his whole person is a priest after the order of Melchisedech Againe except you vnderstand Christ to haue beene a priest according to his diuinitie he was tythed in the loynes of Abraham as well as Lcui but according to his diuinitie hee was not in the loynes of Abraham and therfore payde no tythe in Abraham as God though as man he was subiect to the law but receiued tythes of Abraham in his priest and figure Melchisedech For the priest receiueth tythes in the name of God as also he blesseth in the name of God Therefore if Christ giue priestly blessing in his owne name he giueth it as he is God and not as man onely Finally to say that that Christ was a priest only in respect of his manhood â—auoreth rankely of Nestorianisme whereas our assertion that Christ is an high priest both according to his deitie in which he is equall with his father and also according to his humanitie in which the father is greter than he is as farre from Arrianisme as the Papistes are from honestie and synceritie to charge vs with such open blasphemie God be praised Imprinted at London by George Bishop and Henrie Binneman 1583. D. Standish D. Heskins Heretikes fiue vvaies specially abuse the Scriptures â— Denying certaine bookes or parts of bookes 2 Doubting of their authoritie and calling theÌ„ into question 2 Voluntarie expositions according to euery ones fansie or heresie 4. Changing some vvordes or sentences of the very originall text Tertul. cont Marae cio li. â— in princ Tertul. lib. 5. False and heretical traÌ„slation 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 possedi◠〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Aug. ep 89. lib. 1. de pec mer. cap. 11. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 That the Protestants Caluinists vse the foresaid fiue meanes of defacing the Scriptures * Cont. rat Edm. Camp pag. 18. Retent pag. 32. dist of the Rock pag. 307. Luther in noâ—o Test. Germa in Prefat Iacobi Conc. Cart. 3. can 47. * Argu. in epist. Iacob * Whitak p. 10. * Ibid. Lib. 6. cap. 18. De doct Christ. lib. 2. cap. 8. Anno. 1532. Anno. 1537. Ibid. pag. 17. M. VVhitaker by these vvords condemneth their ovvne Seruice booke vvhich appointeth these bookes of Tobie and Ecclesiasticus to be read for holy Scripture as the other Doe they read in their Churches Apocryphall superstitious bookes for holy Scripture or is he a Puritane that thus disgraceth their order of daily Seruice In expositione Symbolâ— pag. 10. M. VVhitakers booke In the argument Bib. an 1579. * 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Euseb. lib. 6. cap. â— Hieronim ad â—aâ—d Tom. 3. â—â—â—â—â—â— lib. 3. cap. 6. in EuaÌ„g Math. â—â— 5. cap. 26. Cyprianus aliâ— in Concilio Aphricano * Whitak pag. 17. 120. Ibid. pag. 101. Praef. ad 6. theses Oxon pag. 25. Lib. Confess 1. cap. 14. lib. 7. c. 20. Cicer. de Senect Beza the mouse of Geneua gnavveth the text of Scripture De ineam dom cap. 4. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 No. Test. an 1556. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Beza reconcileth the Greeke â—â—â—â— of the nevv TestameÌ„t vvith the Hebrevve text of the old by putting out of the Greeke text so much as pleaseth him Est. 6. 9. 10. Gal. 3. 13. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉
therefore in controuersie with other of the same sort are sometimes called Hagiographa holy writings as of S. Hierom praefat in lib. Tobiae sometime Ecclesiastica Ecclesiastical writings and so are they called of Ruffinus Because sayth he they were appointed by our Elders to be read in the Churches but not to be brought forth to confirme authoritie of faith but other Scriptures they named Apocryphall which they would not haue to be read in the Churches So sayth S. Hierom in praefat in Prouerb Euen as the Church readeth in deede the bookes of Iudith Tobias and the Machabees but yet receaueth them not among the Canonical Scriptures so let it read these two bookes of Ecclesiasticus and wisedom for the edifying of the people not for the confirmation of the authoritie of Ecclesiastical doctrines These auncient writers shal answer for our seruice booke that although it appoint these writings to be read yet it doth not appoint them to be read for Canonicall Scriptures Albeit they are but sparingly read by order of our seruice booke which for the Lordes day other festiuall daies commonly appointeth the first lesson out of the Canonicall Scriptures And as for superstition although M. Whitaker say that some one thing sauoreth of I know not what superstition he doth not by and by condemne the whole booke for superstitious and altogither vnworthy to be read neither can he thereby be proued a Puritane or a disgracer of the order of dayly seruice MART. 10. As for partes of bookes doe they not reiect certaine peeces of Daniel and of Hester because they are not in the Hebrew which reason S. Augustine reiecteth or because they were once doubted of by certaine of the fathers by which reason some part of S. Marke and S. Lukes Gospell might nowe also be called in controuersie specially if it be true which M. Whitakers by a figuratiue speech more than insinuateth That he can not see by what right that which once was not in credit should by time winne authoritie Forgetting him selfe by by in the very next lines admitting S. Iames epistle though before doubted of for Canonicall Scriptures vnles they receiue it but of their curtesie so may refuse it when it shall please them which must needes be gathered of his wordes as also many other notorious absurdities contradictions and dumbe blanckes Which onely to note were to confute M. Whitakers by him selfe being the answerer for both Vniuersities FVLK 10. As for peeces of Daniel of Hester we reiect none but only we discerne that which was written by Daniel in deede from that which is added by Theodotion the false Iew that which was written by the spirit of God of Esther from that which is vainly added by some Greekish counterfecter But the reason why we reiect those patches you say is because they are not in the Hebrew which reason S. Augustine reiecteth Here you cite S. Augustine at large without quotation in a matter of controuersie But if we may trust you that S. Augustine reiecteth this reason yet we may be bold vpon S. Hieroms authoritie to reiect whatsoeuer is not found in the canō of the Iewes written in Hebrew or Chaldee For whatsoeuer was such S. Hierom did thrust through with a spit or obeliske as not worthy to be receyued Witnes hereof S. Augustine him selfe Epist. ad Hier. 8. 10. in which he disswaded him from translating the Scriptures of the olde Testament out of the Hebrew tongue after the 70. Interpreters whose reasons as they were but friuolous so they are derided by S. Hierom who being learned in the Hebrew Chaldee tongues refused to be taught by Augustine that was ignorant in them what was to be done in translations out of them Also Hieronym him selfe testifieth that Daniel in the Hebrew hath neither the story of Susanna nor the hymne of the 3. children nor the fable of Bel the Dragon which we saith he because they are dispersed throughout the whole world haue added setting a spit before them which thrusteth them through lest we should seeme among the ignorant to haue cut of a great part of the booke The like he writeth of the vaine additions that were in the vulgar edition vnto the booke of Esther both in the Preface after the ende of that which he translated out of the Hebrew There are other reasons also beside the authoritie of S. Hierom that moue vs not to receiue them As that in the storie of Susanna Magistrats iudgement of life death are attributed to the Iewes being in captiuitie of Babylon which hath no similitude of truth Beside out of the first chapter of the true Daniel it is manifest that Daniel being a young man was caried captiue into Babylon in the dayes of Nebucadnezer but in this counterfect storie Daniel is made a young child in the time of Astyages which reigned immediatly before Cyrus of Persia. Likewise in the storie of Bel and the Dragon Daniel is said to haue liued with the same king Cyrus and after when he was cast into the lyons denne the Prophet Habacuck was sent to him out of Iurie who prophecied before the first comming of the Chaldees and therefore could not be aliue in the daies of Cyrus which was more than 70 yeares after The additions vnto the booke of Esther in many places bewray the spirite of man as that they are contrary to the truth of the story containing vaine repetitions amplifications of that which is contained in the true historie that which most manifestly conuinceth the sorgerie that in the epistle of Artaxerxes cap. 16. Haman is called a Macedonian which in the true storie is termed an Agagite that is an Amalekite whereas the Macedonians had nothing to doe with the Persians many yeares after the death of Esther Haman I omit that in the ca. 15. ver 12. the author maketh Esther to lie vnto the king in saying that his countenance was ful of all grace or else he lyeth him selfe v. 17. where he saith the king beheld her in the vehemēcy of his anger that he was exceding terrible As for other reasons which you suppose vs to follow because these parcels were once doubted of by certaine of the fathers it is a reason of your owne making and therefore you may confute it at your pleasure But if that be true which Maister Whitaker by a figuratiue speech doth more than insinuate parte of S. Markes and S. Lukes Gospell may also be called in controuersie Why what saith M. VVhitaker Marie that he can not see by what right that which once was not in credit should by tyme winne authoritie But when I pray you was any part of S. Marke or S. Luke out of credit if any part were of some person doubted of doth it follow that it was not at al in credit you reason profoundly and gather very necessarily As likewise that he forgetteth him selfe in the very next lines admitting