to be set at liberty upon Baile and are in the nature of Objections out of Record I shall deliver them summarily to your Lordships with all faith as also the true Copies of them Out of which it shall appear cleerly to your Lordships that of those of the first kind there are no lesse then twelve most full and directly in the point to prove that persons so committed are to be delivered upon baile and among those of the other kind there is not so much as one that proves at all any thing to the contrary I shall first my Lords go through them of the first kind and so observe them to your Lordships that such scruples as have been made upon them by some that have excepted against them shall be cleered also according as I shall open them severally The first of this first kind is of Edw. 3. time It is in Pasche 18. E. 3. Rot. 33. Rex The case was thus King E. 3. had committed by Writ that under his Great Seal as most of the Kings Commands in that time were one Iohn de Bidleston a Clergie-man to the prison of the Tower without any cause shewed of the commitment The Lieutenant of the Tower is commanded to bring him into the Kings Bench where he is committed to the Marshall But the Court asked of the Lieutenant if there were any cause to keep this Bidleston in prison besides that commitment of the King He answered No. Whereupon as the Roll saith Quia videtur Curiae breve predictum that is the Kings Command sufficientem non esse causam predictum Johannem de Bidleston in prisona Marr. Regis hic detinend idem Johannes dimittitur per manucaptionem Will. de Wakefield and some others Where the Judgement of the Court is fully declared in the very point The second of this first kind of Presidents of Record is in the time of H. the 8. One Iohn Parker was committed to the Sheriffs of London pro securitate pacis at the Suit of one Brinton ac pro suspicione fellonie committed by him at Cowall in Glocestershire ac per mandatum Dni Regis he is committed to the Marshall of the Kings Bench postea isto eodem Termino traditur in Ballium There were other causes of the commitment but plainly one was a Command of the King signified to the Sheriff of London of which they took notice But some have interpreted this as if the commitment here had been for suspicion of fellony by command of the King in which case it is agreed of all hands that the Prisoner is bailable But no man can think so of this President that observes the Contents and understands the Grammar of it wherein most plainly ac per mandatum Regis hath no reference to any other cause whatsoever but is a single cause enumerated in the Return by it self as the Record cleerly shewes It is in the 22. H. 8. Rot. 37. The third is of the same time It is 35. H. 8. Rot. 33. Iohn Bincks case He was committed by the Lords of the Councell pro suspicione fellonie ac pro aliis causis illos moventibus Qui committitur Marescallo c. et immediate ex gratia curiae special traditur in ballium They commit him for suspicion of fellony and other causes them thereunto moving wherein there might be matter of State or whatsoever else can be supposed and plainly the cause of the commitment is not expressed yet the Court bailed him without having regard to those other unknown causes that moved the Lords of the Councell But it is indeed somewhat different from either of those other two that precede and from the other nine that follow For it is agreed That if a cause be expressed in the return insomuch as the Court can know why he is committed that then he may be bailed but not if they know not the cause Now when a man is committed for a cause expressed pro aliis causis Dominos de Concilio moventibus certainly the Court can no more know in such a case what the cause is then in any other The fourth of these is in the time of Queen Mary It is Pasche 2. and 3. Phil. and Mar. Rot. 58. Overtons case Richard Overton was returned upon a habeas Corpus directed to the Sheriffs of London to have been committed to them and detained per mandatum prenobilium virorum honorabilis Concilii Dominorum Regis Reginae Qui committitur Marescallo c. immediate traditur in ballium In answer to this President or by way of objection against the force of it hath been said that this Overton stood at that time indicted of Treason It is true he was so indeed but that appeares in another Roll that hath no reference to the Return as the Return hath no reference to that Roll. Yet they that object this against the force of this President say That because he was indicted of Treason therefore though he was committed by the command of the Lords of the Councell without cause shewed yet he was bailable for the Treason and upon that was here bailed Then which Objection nothing can be or is more contrarie to Law or common Reason It is most contrarie to Law for that cleerly every Return is to be adjudged by the Court out of the body of the Writ it self not by any other collaterall or forrain Record whatsoever Therefore the matter of Indictment here cannot in Law be cause of the bailing of the Prisoner And it is so adverse to all common Reason that if the objection be admitted it must of necessity follow that whosoever shall be committed by the King or the Privie Councell without cause shewed and be not indicted of Treason or some other offence may not be inlarged by reason of the supposition of matter of State But that whosoever is so committed and withall stands so indicted though in another Record may be inlarged whatsoever the matter of State be for which he was committed The absurdity of which assertion needs not a word for further confutation as if any of the Gent. in the last Judgement ought to have been the sooner delivered if he had been also indicted of Treason Certainly if so Traitours and Fellons had the highest priviledges of personall Liberty and that above all other Subjects of the Kingdome The first of this first kind is of Queen Marie's time also It is Pasche 4. 5. P. M. Rot. 45. the Case of Edward Newport He was brought into the Kings Bench by habeas Corpus out of the Tower of London cum causa viz. Quod commissus fuit per mandatum Conciliorum Dominae Reginae Qui committitur Marr. c. et immediate traditur in ballium To this the like kind of answer hath been made as in that other Case of Overton next before cited They say that in another Roll of another Terme of the same year it appears he was in question for suspicion of Coyning And it
prisona praedict virtute cujusdam ordinis in curia Canc. Domini Regis fact cujus ordinis tenor patet per rot record istius Termini Ad quem diem praedict Samuel remittitur prisonae praedict et secund dies proxim post Term. dat est praefat gardiano prisonae praedict ad emend return suum sufficient super breve praedict de habeas Corpus return quod praedict Samuel commissus fuit prisonae praedict undecimo die Martii 1608. per warrant a Dominis de Privato Concilio dict Domini Regis apud Whitehall tunc seden Et quod postea undecimo die Februarii anno 1610. commissus fuit extra cur Concil Domini Regis apud Westm. pro contemptu suo quod tent fuit etiam idem Sam. in prisona praedict per mandatum Dom. Concilii iterum remittitur prisonae praedict ulterius dies dat est praefat Gardian ad emend return suum super habeas Corpas versus defend prout stare voluer usque diem Jovis proxim post mensem Pasche tunc ad habendum corpus c. Ad quem diem praefat Gardian habuit corpus hic in curia return super habeas Corpus quod praedict Samuel commissus fuit prisonae praedict 11 Martii anno 1608. virtute cujusdam warranti a Dominis de privato Concilio Domini Regis tunc seden apud Whitehall Et quod etiam commissus fuit idem Samuel prisonae praedict 11 die Februarii anno 8 Iacobi Regis per cur Canc. dict Domini Regis apud Westm. tunc existen pro quodam contemptu per eundem Samuel in cur praedict illat perpetrat ibidem proinde salvo custodiend Remittitur Qui remittitur prisonae praedict De Termino sanctae Trinitatis anno 8 Iacobi Regis per scr ejusdem rot 71. Samuel Saltonstal mil. per Iohannem Wilkinson Ar. Gardian prison de le Fleet virtute brevis Domini Regis de habeas Corpus ad subjiciendum recipiendum c. ei inde direct coram Domino Rege apud Westm. duct cum causa viz. Quod praedictus Samuel Saltonstall commissus fuit prisonae praedict 11 die Martii anno Domini 1608. anno Regni Domini Iacobi Regis Angliae 6. virtute cujusdam warr a Dominis de Privato Concilio dict Domini Regis tunc seden apud Whitehall commissus fuit etiam idem Samuel Saltonstall mil. prisonae praedict 12. die Februarii anno 1610. anno Regni Domini Iac. nunc Regis Angliae c. 8 per considerationem cur Canc. dict Domini Regis apud VVestm pro contemptu eidem Cur. ad tunc per praedict Samuel illat ibidem prout inde salvo custodiend Et haec sunt causae captionis detentionis praedict cujusdam tamen Corpus ad diem locum infra content Remittitur parat habeo prout mihi praecipitur S r Edward Coke REsolved upon question that no Free-man ought to be committed or detained in prison or otherwise restrained by the command of the King or the Privie Councell or any other unlesse some cause of the commitment detainer or restraint be expressed for which by Law he ought to be committed detained or restrained That the Writ of Habeas Corpus may not be denyed but ought to be granted to every Free-man that is committed or detained in prison or otherwise restrained though it be by Command of the King the Privie Counsel or any other he praying the same That if a Free-man be committed or detained in prison or otherwise restrained by the Command of the King or the Privy Counsel or any other no cause of such commitment detainer or restraint being expressed for which by Law he ought to be committed detained or restrained and the same returned upon a Habeas Corpus granted for the same partie that then he ought to be delivered or bailed All this without one negative That these Acts of Parliament and these judiciall Presidents in affirmance thereof recited by Colleagues are but declarations of the fundamentall Lawes of this Realm I shall prove by manifest reasons legall reasons which are the grounds and Mothers of all Lawes First generall reason The first generall reason is drawn à re ipsa from imprisonment ex visceribus causae be it close or other imprisonment which is divided into three parts First No man can be imprisoned at the will and pleasure of any but he that is bond Vide the writ de â—ativo habendo and a villain for that imprisonment at will Et Tayler lug haut et base are propria quarto modo to villaines Second 7. E. 3. fo 50. in the new print and 348 in the old 33 E. 3. tit Dom. 253. infant inpris Fitz. Herbert faeit â—â— note de Ceo. But if Free-men of England might be imprisoned at the will and pleasure of the King by his Command then were they in worse case then bondmen and villaines for the Lord of a villain cannot command another to imprison his villain without cause as of disobedience or refusing to serve as is agreed in our books Third Imprisonment is accounted in Law civil death perdit domum familiam vicinos patriam his house his family his wife his children his neighbours his countrey and to live among wretched and wicked men 39. H. 1.65 c. If a man be threatned to be killed he may avoid a Feoffment of lands gifts of goods c. so it is if he be threatned to be imprisoned he should do the like for that it is civill death Second generall reason The second generall reason is à minore ad majus minima poena corporalis est major qualibet pecuniaria But the King himself cannot impose a fyne upon any man but it must be done judicially by his Judges Bracton fol. 105. it is called duritiae imprisonment per Iusticiarios in Curia non per Regem in Camera and so it hath been resolved by all the Judges of England 2 R. 3.11 Third generall reason The third generall reason is drawn from the number and diversity of remedies which the Law giveth against imprisonment viz. breve de homine replegiando de odio acia de habeas Corpus an appeal of imprisonment breve de manucaptione The latter two of these are antiquated but the writ de odio acia is revived for that was given by the statute of Magna Charta ca. 26. and therefore though it were repealed by the statute of 28. E. 3. yet it is revived 42. E. 3. ca. 1. by which it is provided that all statutes made against Magna Charta are void Vide W. 2. ca. 29. Now the law would never have given so many remedies if the Free-men of England might be imprisoned at free will and pleasure Fourth generall reason The fourth generall reason is drawn from the extent and universality of the pretended power to imprison for it should extend not only to the Commons of the Realm and their posterity but
have done Commune periculum commune requirit Auxilium and thereupon take such further course as may secure your Lordships and us and all your and our posterities in enjoying of our ancient undoubted and fundamentall Liberties The Argument of Sergeant Bramston upon the Habeas corpus MAy it please your Lordship to hear the return read or shall I open it Chief Iustice Hide Let it be read M r. Keeling read the return being the same as that of Sir Thomas Darnell May it please your Lordship I shall humbly move upon this return in the behalf of Sir Iohn Henningham with whom I am of Councell it is his petition that he may be bailed from his imprisonment it was but in vain for me to move that to a Court of Law which by Law cannot be granted and therefore in that regard that upon his return it will be questioned whether as this return is made the Gent. may be bailed or not I shall humbly offer up to your Lordship the case and some reasons out of mine understanding arising out of the return it self to satisfie your Lordship that these Prisoners may and as their case is ought to be bailed by your Lordship The exception that I take to this return is as well to the matter and substance of the return as to the manner and legall form thereof the exceptions that I take to the matter is in severall respects That the return is too generall there is no sufficient cause shewn in speciall or in generall of the commitment of this Gentleman and as it is insufficient for the cause so also in the time of the first imprisonment for howsoever here doth appear a time upon the second warrant from the Lords of the Councell to detain him still in prison yet by the return no time can appear when he was first imprisoned though it be necessary it should be shewen and if that time appear not there is no cause your Lordship should remand him and consequently he is to be delivered Touching the matter of the return which is the cause of his imprisonment It is expressed to be Per speciale mandatum domini Regis This is too generall and uncertain for that it is not manifest what kind of command this was Touching the Legall form of the return it is not as it ought to be fully and positively the return of the Keeper himself onely but it comes with a significavit or prout that he was committed Per speciale mandatum domini Regis as appeareth by warrant from the Lords of the Councell not of the King himself and that is not good in legall form For the matter and substance of the return it is not good because there ought to be a cause of that imprisonment This writ is the means and the onely means that the subject hath in this and such like case to obtain his liberty there are other writs by which men are delivered from restraint as that de homine replegiando but extends not to this cause for it is particularly excepted in the body of the writ de manucaptione de cantione admittenda but they lie in other cases but the writ of Habeas corpus is the onely means the subject hath to obtain his liberty and the end of this writ is to return the cause of the imprisonment that it may be examined in this Court whether the parties ought to be discharged or not but that cannot be done upon this return for the cause of the imprisonment of this Gentleman at first is so farre from appearing particularly by it that their is no cause at all expressed in it This writ requires that the cause of the imprisonment should be returned if the cause be not specially certified by it yet should it at the last be shewn in generall that it may appear to the Judges of the Court and it must be expressed so farre as that it may appear to be none of those causes for which by the Law of the Kingdome the subject ought not to be imprisoned and it ought to be expressed that it was by presentment or indictment and not upon petition or suggestion made to the King and Lords which is against the statute made in the 25 Ed. 3. c. 4. 42 E. 3. c. 3. By the Statute 25 Ed. 3. cap. 4. It is ordained and established that no man from henceforth shall be taken by petition or suggestion made to the King or his Councell but by indictment or course of Law and acordingly it was enacted 42 E. 3. c. 3. the title of which statute is None shall be put to answer an accusation made to the King without presentment Then my Lord it being so although the cause should not need to be expressed in such manner as that it may appear to be none of these causes mentioned in the statute or else the Subject by this return loseth the benefit and advantage of these Laws which be their birth-right and inheritance but in this return there is no cause at all appearing of the first commitment and therefore it is plain that there is no cause for your Lordship to remand him but there is no cause you should deliver him since the writ is to bring the body and the cause of the imprisonment before your Lordship But it may be objected that this writ of Habeas Corpus doth not demand the cause of the first commitment but of the detaining onely and so the writ is satisfied by the return for though it shew no cause of the first commitment but of detaining onely yet it declareth a cause why the Gentleman is detained in prison this is no answer nor can give any satisfaction for the reason why the cause is to be returned is for the Subjects liberty that if it shall appear a good and sufficient cause to your Lordship then to be remanded if your Lordship think and finde it insufficient he is to be enlarged This is the end of this writ and this cannot appear to your Lordship unlesse the time of the first commitment be expressed in the return I know that in some cases the time is not materiall as when the cause of the commitment is and that so especially returned as that the time is not materiall it is enough to shew the cause without the time as after a conviction or triall had by Law But when it is in this manner that the time is the matter it self for intend what cause you will of the commitment yea though for the highest cause of treason there is no doubt but that upon the return thereof the time of it must appear for it being before triall and conviction had by Law it is but an accusation and he that is onely accused and the accusation ought by Law to be let to bail But I beseech your Lordship to observe the consequence of this Cause If the Law be that upon this return this Gentleman should be remanded I will not dispute whether or no a man may
there wants legall form for the writ of Habeas Corpus is the commandment of the King to the Keeper of the prisons and thereupon they are to make return both of the body and of the cause of the commitment and that cause is to appear of them who are the immediate Officers And if he doth it by signification from another that return is defective in Law and therefore this return cannot be good for it must be from the Officer himself and if the cause returned by him be good it bindes the prisoners The warrant of the Lords was but a direction for him he might have made his return to have been expresly by the Kings commandment there was a warrant for it I shall not need to put your cases of it for it is not enough that he returns that he was certified that the commitment was by the Kings command but he must of himself return this fact as it was done And now my Lord I shall offer to your Lordship presidents of divers kindes upon commitments by the Lords of the Privy Councel upon commitments by the speciall command of the King and upon commitments both by the King the Lords together And howsoever I conceive which I submit to your Lordship that our case will not stand upon presidents but upon the fundamentall Laws and Statutes of this Realm and though the presidents look the one way or the other they are to be brought back unto the Laws by which the Kingdome is governed In the first of Henry the eighth Rot. Parl. one Harison was committed to the Marshalsey by the command of the King and being removed by Habeas Corpus into the Court the cause returned was that he was committed per mandatum Domini Regis and he was bailed In the fortieth of Elizabeth Thomas Wendon was committed to the Gatehouse by the commandment of the Queen and Lords of the Councell and being removed by an Habeas Corpus upon the generall return and he was bailed In 8 Iacobi one Caesar was committed by the Kings commandment and this being returned upon his Habeas Corpus upon the examination of this case it doth appear that it was over ruled that the return should be amended or else the prisoner should be delivered The presidents concerning the commitment by the Lords of the Councell are in effect the same with these where the commitment is by the reason why the cause of the commitment should not be shewn holds in both cases and that is the necessity of suit and therefore Master Stamford makes the command of the King and that of the Lords of the Privy Councell to be both as one and to this purpose if they speak he speaks and if he speaks they speak The presidents that we can shew you how the Subject hath been delivered upon commitment by the Lords of the Councell as in the time of Henry the eight as in the times of Queen Elizabeth Queen Mary are infinite as in the ninth of Elizabeth Thomas Lawrence was committed to the Towre by the Lords of the Councell and bailed upon an Habeas Corpus In the 43 of Elizabeth Calvins case In the third of Elizabeth Vernons case These were committed for high treason and yet bailed for in all these cases there must be a conviction in due time or a deliverance by Law There be divers other presidents that might be shewn to your Lordship In 12 Iacobi Mâ—les Renards In 12 Iacobi Rot. 155. Richard Beckwiths case In 4 Iacobi Sir Thomas Monson was committed for treason to the Towre of London and afterwards was brought hither and bailed and since our case stands upon this return and yet there is no sufficient cause in Law expressed in the return of the detaining this Gentleman and since these presidents do warrant our proceedings my humble suit unto this Court is that the Gentleman Sir Iohn Henningham who hath petitioned his Majesty that he may have the benefit of the Law and his Majesty hath signified it it is his pleasure that justice according to the Law should be administred at all times in generall to all his Subjects and particularly to these Gentlemen which is their birth-right My humble suit to your Lordship is that these Gentlemen may have the benefit of that Law and be delivered from their imprisonment The Argument of Master Noye upon the Habeas corpus May it please your Lordship I am of Councell with Sir Walter Earl one of the prisoners at the Barre the return of this writ is as those that have been before they are much of one tenour and as you have heard the tenour of that so this Gentleman coming hither by an Habeas Corpus I will by your Lordships favour read the writ Carolus Dei Gratia Iohanni Lylo Milit Guardian Prison nostrae de le Fleet Salut Praecipimus tibi quod corpus Walteri Earl Milit in prison nostra sub custodia tua detent ut dicit una cum causa detentionis suae quocunque nomine praedict Walter censeat in eadem Habeas Corpus ad subjiciendum recipiendum ea quae curia nostra de eo ad tunc ibidem ordin conting in hac parte haec nallatenus omit periculo incumbent habeas tibi hoc breve Test Hyde apud Westminster quarto die Novembris Anno 8. Executio istius brevis patet in quadam schedula huic brevi annexat Respons Johan Liloe Guardian Prison de le Fleet. Ego Iohannes Lyloe Mil Guardian Prison domini Regis de le Fleet Serenissimo Domino Regi apud Westminster 8. Post receptionem hujus brevis quod in hac schedula est mentionat ' Certifico quod Walter Earl miles in eodem brevium nominat detentus est in prisona de le Fleet sub custodia mea praedict per speciale mandatum domini Regis mihi significatum per VVarrantum duorum aliorum de Privato Concilio per Honorabilissimi dicti Domini Regis cujus quidem tenor sequitur in haec verba Whereas Sir Walter Earl Knight was heretofore committed to your custody these are to will and require you still to detain him letting you know that both his first commitment and this direction for the continuance of him in prison were and are by his Majesties speciall commandment from White Hall 7 Novembris 1627. Thomas Coventree C. S. Henry Manchester Thomas Suffolk Bridgewater Kellie R. Duneln ' Thomas Edmunds Iohn Cook Marlborough Pembrook Salisbury Totnes Grandisson Guliel Bath and Wells Robert Nanton Richard Weston Humphrey Mayes To the Guardian of the Fleet or his Deputy Et haec est causa detentionis praedict Walteri Earl sub custodia mea in Prison praedict Attamen corpus ejusdem Walteri coram Domino Rege ad diem locum praedictum post receptionem brevis praedict pa rat habeo prout istud breve in se exiget requiret Respon Johan Liloe milit Guardian Prison de le Fleet. My Lord the first Habeas corpus bears date the
4 of November then there is an Alias habeas bears Teste after that and the tenour thereof is a command to the Warden of the Fleet quod habeas corpus Walteri Earl coram nobis ad subjiciendum recipiendum ea quae curia nostra de eo c. ordin conting And the Warden of the Fleet he certifies as your Lordship have heard May it please your Lordship I desire as before was desired for the other Gentlemen that Sir Walter Earl may be also bailed if there be no other cause of his imprisonment for if there were a cause certified and that cause were not sufficient to detain him still in prison your Lordship would bail him and if a man should be in worse case when there is no cause certified at all that was very hard The writ is that he should bring the prisoner coram nobis before the King the end of that is ad subjiciendum recipiendum now I conceive that though there be a signification of the Kings pleasure to have this Gentleman imprisoned yet when the King grants this writ to bring the prisoner hither ad subjictendum recipiendum his pleasure likewise is to have the prisoner let go if by Law he be not chargeable or otherwise to detain him still in prison if the case so require it I will put your Lordship in mind of a case and it was Pasch. 9. Ed. 3. M. 3. I will cite by the placita because my Book is not paged as other Books are it is in the case of a Cessavit In that case there were two things considerable the one that there was a signification of the Kings pleasure past and that determined with him the other that though there was a signification of the Kings pleasure before which was yet there comes after that a writ and that was another signification of the Kings pleasure that the prisoner should be brought hither ad subjiciendum to submit himself to punishment if he have deserved it or ad recipiendum to receive his enlargement and be delivered if there be no cause of his imprisonmet And if upon an Habeas corpus a cause of commitment be certified that cause is to be tried here before your Lordship But if no cause be shewn then the proceedings must be ut curia nostra ad mar contigerit the Court must do that which stands with Law and Justice and that is to deliver him My Lord I shall be bold to move one word more touching this return I conceive that every Officer to a Court of Justice must make his return of his own act or of the act of another and not what he is certified of by another But in this case the Warden of the Fleet doth not certifie himself of himself that this Gentleman was commanded to him by the King but that he was certified by the Lords of the Councill that it was the Kings pleasure that he should detain him But in our case the Warden of the Fleet must certifie the immediate cause and not the cause of the cause as it doth by this return Detentus est sub custodia mea per speciale mandatum Domini Regis mihi significatum per Warrantum duorum de Privato Concilio that is not the use in Law but he ought to return the primary cause and not the subsequent cause as in 32 Edw. 3. return Rex vicecom 87. in a writ De homine replegiando against an Abbot the Sheriffe returns that he hath sent to the Bayliffe of the Abbot and he answered him that the party was the Abbots villain and so he cannot deliver him that is held an insufficient return and a new Alias was granted but if the Sheriffe had returned that the Abbot did certifie him so it had been good but he must not return what is certified him by another In one of the presidents that hath been noted as that of Parker 22 Hen. 8. there the Guardian of the prison certifies that Parker detentus est sub custodia mea per mandatum Domini Regis mihi nunciatum per Robertum Pecke now our case is by the Nunciation of many but in Law majus minus non variant in spetione the certification of one and of many is of the same effect although in morall understanding there may be a difference Trin. 2. Ed. 3. Rot. 46. in this Court in 21 Ed. 3. in the printed Book there is a piece of it The Abbot of Burey brings a prohibition out of this Court the Bishop of Norwich pleadeth in Barre of that Quod mihi testificatū quod continetur in Archivis that he is excommunicated there were two exceptions taken to this case in this president and they are both in one case the first was that no case appeareth why he was excommunicated there may be causes why he should be excommunicated and then he should be barred and there may be causes why the excommunication should not barre him for it may be the excomunication was for bringing the action which was the Kings writ and therefore because there was no cause of the excommunication returned it was ruled that it was not good The other reason is that upon the Roll which is mihi testificatum Now every man when he will make a certificate to the Court Proprium factum suum non alterius significare debet he must inform the Court of the immediate act done and not that such things are told him or that such things are signified unto him but that was not done in this case and therefore it was held insufficient and so in this case of ours I conceive the return is insufficient in the form there is another cause my Lord for which I conceive this return is not good But first I will be bold to inform your Lordship touching the Statute of Magna Charta 29. Nullus liber homo capiatur vel imprisonetur c. neo super eum mittimus nisi per legale judicium parium suorum vel per legem terrae That in this Statute these words in Carcerem are omitted out of the printed Books for it should be nec eum in Carcerem mittimus For these words per legem terrae what Lex terrae should be I will not take upon me to expound otherwise then I finde them to be expounded by Acts of Parliament and this is that they are understood to be the processe of the Law sometimes by writ sometimes by attachment of the person but whether speciale mandatum Domini Regis be intended by that or no I leave it to your Lordships exposition upon two petitions of the Commons and answer of the King in 36 Ed. 3. no 9. and no 20. In the first of them the Commons complain that the great Charter the Charter of the Forrest and other Statutes were broken and they desire that for the good of himself and of his people they might be kept and put in execution and that they might not be infringed by making an
arrest by speciall command or otherwise and the answer was that the assent of the Lords established and ordained that the said Charter and other Statutes should be put in execution according to the petitition and that is without any disturbance by arrest by speciall command or otherwise for it was granted as it was petitioned In the same year for they were very carefull of this matter and it was necessary it should be so for it was then an usuall thing to take men by writs quibusdam de causis and many of these words caused many Acts of Parliament and it may be some of these writs may be shewn and I say in the same year they complained that men were imprisoned by speciall command and without indictment or other legall course of Law and they desired that thing may not be done upon men by speciall command against the great Charter The King makes answer that he is well pleased therewith that was the first answer and for the future he hath added farther if any man be grieved let him complain and right shall be done unto him This my Lord is an explanation of the great Charter as also the Statute of 37 Ed. 3. ch 18. is a commentary upon it that men should not be committed upon suggestion made to the King without due proofs of Law against them and so it is enacted twice in one year We find more printed Books as in Henry the sixth Minus de facts Fitz. 182. which is a strong case under favour in an action of Trespasse for cutting down trees the defendant saith that the place where the trees are cut is parcell of the Manor of B whereof the King is seised in fee and that the King did command him to cut them and the opinion of the Court was that this was no good plea without shewing the specialty of the command and they said if the King command me to arrest a man and I arrest him he shall have an action of false imprisonment against me altough it were done in the Kings presence In 1 Ioh. cap. 7. fol. 46. it is in print and there we leave it Hussey Chief Justice saith that Sir Iohn Markham told King Edward the fourth that he could not arrest a man upon suspition of felony or treason as any of his Subjects might because if he should wrong a man by such arrest the parties could have no remedy against him if any man shall stand upon it here is a signification of the Kings pleasure nor to have the cause of the commitment examined he hath here another signification of his pleasure by writ whereby the party is brought hither ad subjiciendum recipiendum that he hath made your Lordship Judge of that that should be objected against this Gentleman and either to punish him or to deliver him and if here be no cause shewn it is to be intended that the party is to be delivered and that it is the Kings pleasure it should be so and the writ is a sufficient warrant for the doing of it there being no cause shewn of the imprisonment and now my Lord I will speak a word to the writ of de homine replegiando and no other writ for that was the common writ and the four causes expressed in that Statue to wit the death of a man the command of the King or his Justices or Forrest were excepted in that writ before that Statute made as appears Bracton 133. so that the writ was at the Common Law before that Statute And it appears by our Books that if a man be brought hither by an Habeas corpus though he were imprisoned De morte hominis as in the 21 of Edward the fourth 7. Winkfield was bailed here this Court bailed him for he was brought hither ad subjiciendum recipiendum and not to lie in prison God knows how long and if the Statute should be expounded otherwise there were no bailing men outlawed or breakers of prisons for they are not within this Statute and yet this Court doth it at pleasure But plainly by the Statute it self it appears that it meant only to the common writ for the preamble recites that the Sheriffs and other have taken and kept in prison persons detected of felony and let out to plevin such as were not reprisable to grieve the one party and to the gain of the other and forasmuch as before this time it was not determined what prisoners were reprisable which not but onely in certain cases were expressed therefore it is ordained c. Now this is no more but for direction of the keepers of the prisons for it leaves the matter to the discretion of the Judges whether bailable or no not of the Judges for when the Statute hath declared who are repleviable who are not as men outlawed have abjured the Realm Proves such as be taken in the manner breakers of prisons burners of houses makers of false money counterfeiting of the Kings Seal and the like it is then ordained that if the Sheriff or any other let any go at large by surety that is not reprisable if he be Sheriff Constable or any other that hath the keeping of prisons and thereof be attainted he shall lose his office and fee for ever so that it extends to the common Goalers and keepers of prisons to direct them in what cases they shall let men to bail and in what cases not and that they shall not be Judges to whom to let to replevin and whom to keep in prison but it extends not to the Judges for if the makers of the Statute had meant them in it they should have put a pain upon them also So then I conclude upon these under your Lordships favour that as this case is there should have been a cause of the commitment expressed for these Gentlemen are brought hither by writ ad subjiciendum if they be charged and ad recipiendum if they be not charged and therefore in regard there is no charge against them whereupon they should be detained in prison any longer we desire that they may be bailed or discharged by your Lordship The Argument of Master Selden upon the Habeas corpus My Lords I am of Councell with Sir Edmond Hampden his case is the same with the other two Gentlemen I cannot hope to say much after that that hath been said yet if it shall please your Lordship I shall remember you of so much as is befallen my lot Sir Edmond Hampden is brought hither by a writ of Habeas corpus and the keeper of the Gate-house hath returned upon the writ that Sir Edmond Hampden is detained in prison per speciale mandatum Domini Regis mihi significatum per Warrantum duorum Privati Concilii dicti domini Regis and then he recites the warrants of the Lords of the Councell which is that they do will and require him to detain this Gentleman still in prison letting him know that his first imprisonment c. May it
and not by way of information out of another mans mouth may not be good as appeareth by the severall books of our law 23 Ed. 3. Rex vic 181. upon a Homine replegiando against the Abbot of C. the Sheriffe returneth that he had sent to the Bailiffe of the Abbot that answered him that he was the villain of the Abbot by which he might not make deliverance and a Sicut alias was awarded for this return was insufficient insomuch that he had returned the answer of the Bailiffe of the Abbot where he ought to have returned the answer of the Abbot himself out of his own mouth Trin. 22. Ed. 2. Rot. 46. parent vill Burg. Evesque de Norwich repl 68. Nat. Br. Case 34. Fitz. Nat. Br. 65. 34. Ed. 3. Excom 29. the case appeareth to be such in a trespasse the defendant pleadeth the plaintiffe is excommunicate and sheweth forth the letter of the Bishop of Lincoln witnessing that for divers contumacies c. and because he had certified no excommunic done by himself but by another the letter of excommunication was annulled for the Bishop ought to have certified his own act and not the act of another Hillarii 22 Hen. 8. Rot. 37. it appeareth by the return of an Habeas corpus that Iohn Parker was committed to prison for security of the peace and for suspicion of felony as per mandatum Domini Regis nunciatum per Robertum Peck de Cliffords Inne and upon his return Iohn Parker was bailed for the return Commiss fuit per speciale mandatum domini Regis nunciatum per Robertum Peck was not good insomuch that it was not a direct return that he was committed per mandatum Domini Regis And for the first point I conclude that this return is insufficient in form insomuch that it doth not make a precise and direct return that he was committed and detained by the speciall command of the King but onely as he was signified by the warrant of the Lords of the Councell which will not serve the turn and upon the book of 9 Hen. 6.44 the return of the cause of a mans imprisonment ought to be precise and direct upon the Habeas corpus insomuch as thereby to be able to judge of the cause whether it be sufficient or not for there may not any doubt be taken to the return be it true or false but the Court is to accept the same as true and if it be false the party must take his remedy by action upon the case And as concerning the matter of the return it will rest upon these parts First whether the return be that he is detained in prison by speciall commandment of our Lord the King be good or not without shewing the nature of the commandment or the cause whereupon the commitment is grounded in the return The second is whether the time of the first commitment by the commandment of the King not appearing to the Court is sufficient to detain him in prison Thirdly whether the imprisonment of the subjects without cause shewed but onely by the commandment of the King be warantable by the laws and statutes of this Realm As unto the first part I find by the books of our law that commandments of the King are of severall natures by some of which the imprisonment of a mans body is utterly unlawfull and by others of them although the imprisonment may be lawfull yet the continuance of him without bail or mainprise will be utterly unlawfull There is a verball command of the King which is by word of mouth of the Kings onely and such commandment by the King by the books of our law will not be sufficient either to imprison a man or to continue him in prison 16.6 Monstrans de faict si upon an action of trespasse brought for cutting of trees the defendant pleadeth that the place where he cut them is parcell of the Manor of D. whereof the King is seised in fee and the King commanded him to cut the trees and the opinion of the Court there is that the plea in barre was ill because he did not shew any speciall commandment of the King and there it is agreed by the whole Court that if the King commandeth one to arrest another and the party commanded did arrest the other an action of trespasse or false imprisonment is maintainable against the party that arrested him although it were done in the presence of the King 39 H. 6.17 where one justifieth the seisure of the goods of a person that is outlawed by the commandment of the King such a party being no Officer may not in an action brought against him have any aid of the King for such a commandment given to one that is not an Officer will not any wayes avail him that is to justifie himself by the return of that commandment 37 Hen. 6.10 If the king give me a thing and I take the same by his commandment by word of mouth it is not justified by law nothing may passe without matter of Record 10 Hen. 7.7 17.18 it is agreed that Justices may command one to arrest another that is in their view or presence but not one that is out of their view or presence And Keble 10 Hen. 7.13 said that where one is arrested by a parroll command in their view or presence it is fitting that a record may be made of it insomuch that without such a record there can hardly be a justification in another Term. Secondly there is a commandment of the King by his Commission which according unto Calvins case in the seventh Report it is called by him breve mandatum non remediabile and by virtue of such a commandment the King may neither seise the goods of his subject nor imprison his body as it is resolved in 42 Ass. pl. 5. where it is agreed by all the justices that a Commission to take a mans goods or imprison his body without indictment or suit of the party or other due processe is against the Law Thirdly there is a commandment of the King which is grounded upon a suggestion made to the King or to his Councell and if a man be committed to prison by such a suggestion by commandment of the King it is unlawfull and not warranted by the Law of the Realm The 25 of Edward the third cap. 4. de Provisoribus whereas it is contained in the great Charter of the Franchises of England that none shall be imprisoned or arrested of his Free-hold or of his Franchises nor of his free customes but by the Law of the land It is awarded consented and established that from henceforth none shall be taken by petition or suggestion made to our Soveraign Lord the King or to his Councell untill it be by indictment or presentment of his good and lawfull neighbours where such deeds are done in due manner or by processe made by writ originall at the common law nor of his free-hold unlesse he be duely brought
touching the resolution of the house of Commons To the second of these 12. which is Parkers Case in the 22. H. 8. Rot. 37. his Objections were two First that it is true that he was returned to be committed Per mandatum domini Regis but it appeared that this command was certified to the Shreiffs of London by one Robert Peck gentleman and that in regard that the command came no otherwise the return was held insufficient and that therefore he was bailed Secondly that it appears also in the Record that he was committed pro suspicione felloniae ac per mandatum domini Regis so that in regard that the command that in the expression of the causes of his commitment suspicion of fellony preceeds the command of the King therefore it must be intended that the Court tooke the Cause why the King committed him to be of less moment then fellony and therefore bailed him For he Objected that even the house of Commons themselves in some Arguments used by them touching the interpretation of the statute of Westminster the first cap. 15. about this point had affirmed that in enumeration of particulars those of greatest nature were first mentioned and that it was supposed that such as followed were usually of less nature or moment But the reply was to the first Objection that the addition of the certefying of the Kings command by Robert Peck altered not the Case First because the Sheriffs in their Return took notice of the command as what they were assured of and then howsoever it came to them it was of equal force as if it had been mentioned without reference to Peck Secondly as divers Patents pass the great Seal by writ of privy Seal and are subscribed Per breve de privato sigillo so diverse per ipsum Regem are so subscribed and oftentimes in the Roll of former times to the words per ipsum Regem are added nunciante A. B. So that the Kings command generally and the Kings command related or certified by such a man is to this purpose of like nature Thirdly in the late great Case of Habeas Corpus where the Return of the commitment was Per speciale mandatum Domini Regis mihi significatum per Dominos de privato Confilio the Court of Kings-Bench did agree that it was the same and of like force as if mihi significatum c. had not followed and that those words were void According whereunto here also Per mandatum Dom. Regis nunciatum per Robert Peck had been wholly omitted and void likewise And in truth in that late Case this Case of Parker was cited both at the Barr and Bench and at the Bench it was interpreted by the Judges no otherwise then if it had been onely per mandatum Domini Regis in place of it but the Objection there was made of another kinde as was delivered in the first Argument made out of presidents in the behalf of the house of Commons Therefore to the second Objection touching the course of Enumeration of the Causes in the Return it was said that howsoever in some Acts of Parliament and else where in the solemn expressions used in the Law things of greater nature preceded and the less follow yet in this Case the contrary was most plain for in the Return it appears that there were three Causes for detaining the Prisoners Surety of the peace Suspicion of Pellony and the Kings command and Surety of the peace is first mentioned which is plainly less then Fellony And therefore it is plain if any force of Argument be taken from this enumeration that the contrary to that which M r. Attorney inferred is to be concluded that is that as Fellony is a greater Cause then Surety of the peace so the matter whereupon the Kings command was grounded was greater then Fellony But in truth this kinde of Argument holds neither way here and whatsoever the Cause were why the King committed him it was impossible for the Court to know it and it also might be of very high moment in matter of state and yet of farr less nature then Fellony All which shews that this president hath his full force also according as it was first used in Argument by the house of Commons To the third of these which is Binckes Case in the 35. H. 8. Rot. 33. the Objection was that there was a Cause expressed pro suspicione felloniae and though pro aliis causis illos moventibus were added in the Return yet because in the course of enumeration the general name of aliis comming after particulars includes things of less nature then the particuler doth therefore in this Case suspition of fellony being the first the other Causes afterwards generally mentioned must be intended of less nature for which the Prisoner was bailable because he was bailable for the greater which was suspition of fellony Hereunto it was replyed that the Argument of enumeration in these Cases is of no moment as is next before shewed and that although it were of any moment yet any Case though less then fellony might be of very great consequence in matter of state which is pretended usually upon general Returns of command without cause shewed and it is most plain that the Court could not possible know the reasons why the Prisoner here was committed and yet they bailed him without looking further after any unknown thing under that title of Matter of state which might as well have been in this Case as in any other whatsoever To the 4. of these which is Overton's Case in 2. 3. Phet M. Rot. 58. and to the 5. which is Newports Case P. M. 4. 5. Rot. 45. onely these Objections were said over again by Mr. Attorney which are mentioned in the Argument made out of presidents in behalf of the house of Commons at the first conference and in the same Argument are fully and clearly satisfied as they were in like manner now again To the 6. of these which was Lawrence his Case M. 9. Eliz. Rot. 35. and the 7. which is Constables P. 9. Eliz. Rot. 68. the same Objections onely were likewise said over again by Mr. Attorney that are mentioned and clearly and fully answered in the Argument made at the first conference out of presidents in behalf of the house of Commons the force of the Objection being onely that it appeared in the Margent of the Roll that the word Pardon was written but it is plain that the word there hath no reference at all to the reason why they were bailed nor could it have reference to the Cause why they were committed in regard the Cause why they were committed is utterly unknown and was not shewed To the 8. of these Presidents which was Brownings Case P. 20. Eliz. Rot. 72. It was said M r. Attorney that he was bailed by a letter from the Lords of the Councel directed to the Judges of the Court but being asked for that letter or any Testimony of it
then by giving a confirmation upon this occasion we have bettered our Case very much Thirdly have not the Judges in the Kings-bench in open Parliament upon our complaint disclaimed to have given any Judgement in the point which generally before by the Parliament was otherwise conceived for now they say it was but an Award and no Judgement Will such a Notorious Act upon so important an occasion in so publick a place be quickly forgotten Nay will not the memorie of it for ever remain upon Records is not our Case then much better then when we came hither Fourthly will not the resolution of this House and all our Arguments and reasons against imprisonment without a Cause expressed which no doubt by the course we have taken will be transferred to posterity be a great means to stay any Judge hereafter for declaring any Judgement to the contrary especially if there be likelyhood of a Parliament is not our Case in this very much amended Lastly have we not received Propositions from the Lords wherein amongst other things they declared that they are not out of love with our proceedings is not this a great strenghtning to it but after so long debate amongst them about it they cannot take any just exception to it and doth not this also much amend our Case From all these reasons I conclude that the second Objection that by a confirmation we are in no better case then when we came together is also a weak Objection Now for reasons to move us to proceed in this course of accepting a confirmation First we have his Majesties gracious promise to yield to a confirmation of the old Laws from which we may rest most assured he will not depart If we tender him with all our Proposition to be enacted we have cause to doubt that we shall loose both the one and the other Secondly we are no less assured of the Lords joyning with us for in their Propositions sent to us they have delivered themselves to that purpose This is then a secure way of getting somewhat of great advantage to us as we have great hopes and in a manner assurance on this side So on the other side we have great doubts and fears that by offering our resolution to be enacted we shall loose all For first we have had already experience of the Lords that they are not very foreward to joyn with us in a Declaration of our Proposition to be Law If they stumble at a Declaration much more will they in yielding to make Law in the same point And have we not much more cause to doubt that his Majesty will not yield unto it seeing it toucheth him so near Is it not the notice of his pleasure that hath wrought thus with the Lords If we should clog our Bill with our Proposition and it should be rejected by the Lords or by the King is not our resolution much weakned by it And are we not then in far worse case then before we made it Our resolution for the rejecting of our Proposition will tend to a Justification of all that hath been done against us in this great point of our Liberty Let us then like wise-men conform our desire to our hopes and guide our hopes by probabilities other desires and other hopes are but vain This is my poor opinion in this weighty business Secretary COKES Message 1. May 1628. Mr. Speaker I Have a very short message to deliver from his Majesty that shews both his Royal care to be rightly understood of this House and no less care to understand us in the best part and to shew clearly it shall not be his fault if this be not a happy Parliament His Majesty hath commanded me to desire this House clearly to let him know whether they will rest upon his Royal word and promise made at several times and especially by my Lord Keepers Speech made in his own presence which if they do he doth assure you that it shall be royally and really performed After speaking of himself and the nature of his place under his Majesty he proceeded in these words GIve me leave freely to tell you that I know by experience that by the place I hold under his Majesty if I will discharge the duty of my place and the Oath I have taken to his Majesty I must commit and neither express the cause to the Jaylor nor to the Judges nor to any Councellour in England but to the King himself yet do not think I go without ground of reason or take this power committed to me to be unlimmitted Yea rather it is to me a charge burthen and danger for if I by this power shall commit the poorest porter if I do it not upon a just cause if it may appear the burthen will fall upon me heavier then the Law can inflict for I shall loose my credit with his Majesty and my place And I beseech you consider whether those that have been in the same place have not committed freely and not any doubt made of it nor any complaint made by the Subject Veneris 2. May 1628. A Report was this day made from the grand Committee for grievances concerning the cause of Nicholas Clegat Cittizen and Vintner of London imprisoned by the Lord Major and Aldermen of the said Citie for refusing to lend a certain summe of money assessed upon him by the Company of Vintners of London whereof he is free towards the proportion of money imposed upon the Company by an Act of Common-Councel of the said Citie in pursuance of a contract of Land with his Majesty By which report it appeared that the said grand Committee had unanimously agreed that the said Citie might make Acts of Councel so as they were consonant to Law and reason and for regulating and deciphering of trade agreeable to reason and the Law of the Realm and might leavy money of the Cittizens by Act of Common-Councel for building or repairing of their Walls Gates or making or cleansing of Sewers or other like causes tending to the general and publick good and welfare of the Citie or towards Triumphs or other like occasions tending to the Honour of the Citie in general but could not by such Act of Common-Councel tax or leavy money towards the purchasing of Lands or other like occasions forreign to the government of the Citie Whereupon it is resolved by the House of Commons super totam materiam that the said Commitment of the said Nicholas Clegat was unlawfull and that a Petition should go from the House to his Majesty for the inlargement of the said Nicholas Clegat his commitment by the Lord Major and Aldermen being since strengthned by special command Henry TOMPSON one of the Shrieffs and Robert HENISVVORTH Alderman of the Citie of YORK their submission for their indirect chusing of S r. Thomas SAVIL Knight I Henry Tompson one of the Shrieffs of the Citie of York do hereby acknowledge to have offended the Lord Major and all the Cominalty
have been imprisoned for suing ordinary Actions and Statutes at the Common-Law untill they have been constrained to leave the same against their wills and put the same to order albeit Judgement and Execution have been had therein to their great losses and griefs for the aid of which Persons her Majesties Writs have sundry times been directed to divers Persons having the custody of such Persons unlawfully imprisoned upon which Writs no good or Lawfull cause of imprisonment hath been returned or certified whereupon according to the Laws they have been again committed to Prison in secret places and not to any common ordinary Prison or Lawfull Officer as Shrieff or other lawfully authorized to have or keep a Goal so that upon Lawfull complaint made for their delivery the Queens Courts cannot learn to whom to direct her Majesties Writs and by this means Justice cannot be done and moreover divers Officers and Serjeants of London have been many times committed to Prison for Lawfull executing of her Majesties Writ sued forth of her Majesties Courts at West-minster and thereby her Majesties Subjects and Officers are so terrified that they dare not sue or execute her Majesties Laws her Writs and Commandments Divers others have been sent for by Pursevants and brought to London from their dwellings by unlawfull imprisonment have been constrained not onely to withdraw their Lawfull Suits but have also been compelled to pay the Pursevants for bringing such Persons great summes of money All which upon complaint the Judges are bound by Office and Oath to relieve and help by and according to her Majesties Laws And when it pleaseth your Lordships to will divers of us to set down in what cases a Prisoner sent to custody by her Majesty her Councel some one or other or two are to be detained in Prison and not to be delivered by her Majesties Court or Judges we thinck that if any Person be committed by her Majesties Command from her Person or by order from the Councel board or if any one or two of her Councel commit one for high Treason such Persons so in the cases before committed may not be delivered by any of her Courts without due Trial had Nevertheless the Judges may Award the Queens Writ to bring the bodies of such Persons before them and if upon return thereof the causes of their commitment be certified to the Judges as it ought to be then the Judges in the cases before ought not to deliver him but to remaund the Prisoner to the place from whence he came Which cannot conveniently be done unless notice of the cause in general or else special be known to the Keeper or Goaler that shall have the custody of such Prisoner All the Judges and Barons did subscribe their names to these Articles Termino Pascha 34. Eliz. and sent one to the Lord Chancellor and another to the Lord Treasurer after which time there did follow more quietness then before in the cause afore mentioned The KINGS Message the 2. May 1628. by Secretary COKE HIs Majesty hath commanded me to make known to this House that howsoever we proceed with the business we have in hand which he will not doubt but to be according to our constant professions and so as he may have cause to give us thanks yet his resolution is that both his royal care and his harty and true affection towards all his loving Subjects shall appear to the whole Kingdom and to all the World that he will govern us according to the Laws and Customes of the Realm that he will maintain us in the Liberties of our Persons and propriety of our goods so as we may enjoy as much happiness as our Forefathers in their best times and that he will rectifie what hath been or may be amiss amongst us so that there may be hereafter no just cause to complain wherein as his Majesty will ranck himself amongst the best of our Kings and shew he hath no intention to invade or impeach our Lawfull Liberties or Rights so he will have us to match our selves with the best Subjects by not incroaching upon that Soveraignty and Prerogative which God hath put into his hands for our good and by containing our selves within the bounds and Laws of our Forefathers without streining or inlarging them by new Explanations Interpretations Expositions or Additions in any sort which he clearly telleth us he will not give way unto That the weight of the affairs of Christendom do press him more and more and the time is now grown to that point of maturity that it cannot indure long debate or delay so as this Session of Parliament must continue no longer then Tuesday come sevenight at the furthest within which time his Majesty for his part will be ready to perform what he hath promised to us and if we be not as forward to do that is fit for us it shall be our own faults Lastly upon the assurance of our good dispatch and correspondency his Majesty declareth that his Royal intention is to have another Session at Michalmass next for the perfecting of such things as cannot now be done M r. MASONS speech 2. May 1628. I Am of opinion with the Gentleman that spake first that in our proceedings in the matter now in debate we should have use of the Title of the Statute called circumspecte agatis for it concerns the Liberty of our Persons without which we do not enjoy our lives The Question is WHether in this Bill for the explanation of Magna Charta and the rest of the Satutes we shall provide that the cause of the commitment must be expressed upon the commitment or upon the Return of the Habeas Corpus Before I speak to the question it self I shall propose some observations in my conceit necessarily conduceing to the debate of the Matter 1. That we ought to take care and to provide for posterity as our Predecessors have done for us and that this provident care cannot be expounded to be any distrust of the performance of his Majesties gracious Declaration this Act providing for perpetuity to which his Highness promise unless it were by Act of Parliament cannot extend 2. That we having long debated and solemnly resolved our Rights and Priviledges by virtue of these Statutes and if now we shall reduce those Declarations and those resolutions into an Act we must ever hereafter expect to be confined within the bounds of that Act being made at our Suit and to be the limmits of the Prerogative in in that respect and it being an Act of explanation which shall receive no further explanation then it self contains 3. That by this Act we must provide a remedy against the Persons which detain us in Prison for as to the Commander there can be no certain Concerning the Question it self IT hath been solemnly and clearly resolved by the House that the commitment of a Freeman without expressing the cause at the time of the commitment is against the Law If by this Act
as it is called also The first two are Writs to be directed to the Sheriff of the Countie and lye only in some particular cases with which it would be untimely for me to trouble your Lordships because they concern not that which is committed to my charge But that Writ of habeas Corpus or Corpus cum causa is the highest remedy in Law for him that is imprisoned by the speciall command of the King or of the Lords of the Councell without shewing cause of the commitment Neither is there any such thing in the Lawes of this Land as a Petition of Right to be used in such cases for the Liberty of the person nor is there any other legall Course to be taken for enlargement in such cases howsoever the contrary hath upon no ground or colour of Law been pretended Now my Lords if any man be so imprisoned by any such command or otherwise in any prison whatsoever through England and desire either by himself or any other in his behalf this Writ of habeas Corpus for the purpose in the Court of King's Bench the Writ is to be granted to him and ought not to be denied him no otherwise then any ordinary originall Writ in the Chauncery or other common processe of Law may be denyed Which amongst other things the House of Commons hath resolved also upon mature deliberation and I was commanded to let your Lordships know so much This Writ is to be directed to the Keeper of the Prison in whose custody the Prisoner remaines commanding him that at a certain day he bring in the body of the Prisoner ad subjiciendum recipiendum juxta quod Curia consideraverit una cum causa captionis detentionis and oftentimes una cum causa detentionis only captionis being omitted The Keeper of the Prison thereupon returnes by what Warrant he detaines the Prisoner and with his Return filed to his Writ brings the Prisoner to the Barre at the time appointed When the Return is thus made the Court judgeth of the sufficiency or insufficiency of it only out of the body of it without having respect to any other thing whatsoever that is they are to suppose the Return to be true whatsoever it be For if it be false the party may have his remedy by action on the case against the Gaoler that brings him Now my Lords when this Prisoner comes thus to the Barre if he desires to be bailed and that the Court upon view of the Return think him in Law to be bailed then he is alwayes first taken from the Keeper of the Prison that brings him and committed to the Marshall of the Kings Bench and afterwards bailed and the Entrie perpetually is Committitur Marr. postea traditur in ballium For the Court never bailes any man untill he becomes their own Prisoner and be in custodia Marescalli of that Court. But if upon return of the habeas Corpus it appears to the Court that the Prisoner ought not to be bailed nor discharged from the Prison whence he is brought then he is remanded or sent back again there to remain untill by Course of Law he may be delivered And the Entrie in such case is Remittitur quousque secundum legem deliberatus fuerit or Remittitur quousque c. which is all one and is the highest award or Judgement that ever was or can be given upon a habeas Corpus But if the Judges doubt only whether in Law they ought to take him from the prison whence he came or give daie to the Sheriff to amend his Return as often they do then they remand him only during the time of their debate or untill the Sheriff hath amended his Return and the Entrie upon it is Remittitur only or Remittitur prisonae predict without any more And so remittitur generally is of farre lesse moment in the award upon the habeas Corpus then remittitur quousque howsoever vulgar opinions raised out of the fame of the late Judgement be to the contrary All these things are of most known and constant use in the Court of Kings Bench as it cannot be doubted but your Lordships will easily know also from the grave and learned my Lords the Judges These two causes the one of the Entrie of Committitur Marescallo postea traditur in ballium and the other Remittitur quousque and Remittitur generally or Remittitur prisonae predict together with the nature of the habeas Corpus being thus stated it will be easier for me to open and your Lordships to observe whatsoever shall occurre to this purpose in the Presidents of Record to which I shall come in particular But before I come to the Presidents I am to let your Lordships know the resolution of the House of Commons touching the enlargement of any man committed by the command of the King or of the Privie Councell or of any other without cause shewed of such commitment It is thus That if a Free-man be committed or detained in prison or otherwise restrained by the Command of the King the Privie Councell or any other and no cause of such commitment detainer or restraint be expressed for which by Law he ought to be committed detained or restrained and the same be returned upon a habeas Corpus granted for the partie that then he ought to be delivered or bailed This resolution as it is grounded upon those Acts of Parliament already shewed and the reason of the Law of the Land which is committed to the charge of another and an one to be opened unto you is strengthened also by many Presidents of Record But the Presidents of Record that concerne this point are of two kinds for the House of Commons hath informed it self of such as concern it either way The first such as shew expresly that persons committed by the Command of the King or of the Privie Councell without any cause shewed have been enlarged upon Baile when they prayed it Whence it appeares cleerly that by Law they were bailable and so by habeas Corpus to be set at liberty For although they ought not to have been committed without cause shewen of their commitment yet it is true that the reverend Judges of this Land in former Ages did give such a respect to such commitment by Command of the King or of the Lords of the Councell as also to the commitments sometimes of inferiour persons that upon the habeas Corpus they rarely used absolutely to discharge the prisoners instantly but to enlarge them only upon Baile which sufficiently secures and preserves the Liberty of the Subject according to the Lawes that your Lordships have already heard Nor in any of these cases is there any difference made between any such commitments by the King and commitments by the Lords of the Councell that are incorporated with him The second kind of Presidents of Record are such as have been pretended to prove the Law to be contrarie and that persons so committed ought not
and Acts of Parliament came onely to the Presidents used in the Argument before delivered and so endeavoured to weaken the strength of them that had been brought in behalf of the subjects to shew that some other were directly contrary to the Law comprehended in the Resolutions of the house of Commons touching the bailing of Prisoners returned upon the writ of Habeas Corpus to be committed by the special command of the King or the Councel without any cause shewed for which by Law they ought to be committed And the course which was taken it pleased the Committee of both houses to allow of was that M r. Attorney should make his Objections to every particuler President and that the Gentlemen appointed and trusted herein by the house of Commons by several Replies should satisfie the Lords touching the Objections made by him against or upon every particuler as the order of the Presidents should lead them he began with the first 12. Presidents that were used by the house of Commons at the conference delivered by them to prove that Prisoners returned to stand so Committed were delivered upon bail by the Court of Kings Bench The first was that of Bildstones case in the 18. Edw. 3. Rot. 33. Rex To this he Objected First that in the return of him into the Court it did not appear that this Bildstone was committed by the Kings command and Secondly that in the Record it did appear also that he had been committed for suspicion of counterfaiting the great Seal and so by consequence was bailable by the Law in regard there appeared a Cause why he was committed in which case it was granted by him as indeed it was plain and agreed of all hands that the Prisoner is bailable though committed by Command of the King and he said that this part of the Record by which it appeared he had been committed for suspicion of treason was not observed to the Lords in the Argument before used and he said also to the Lords that there were three several kinds of Records by which the full truth of every award or bailing upon a Habeas Corpus is known First the remembrance Roll wherein the award is given Secondly the file of the writt and the return and Thirdly the Scruect or Scruet finium wherein the baile is entered and that onely the remembrance Roll of this Case was to be found and that if the other two of it were extant he doubted not but that it would appear also that upon the return it self the Cause of the Commitment had been expressed and so he concluded that this proved not for the house of Commons touching the Matter of bail where a Prisoner was committed by the Kings special command without Cause shewed To this Objection the reply was First that it was plain that Bildstone was committed by the Kings express Command For so the very words of the Writt are to the Constable of the Tower quod eum tenendum Custodiae facias c. then which nothing can more fully express a Commitment by the Kings command Secondly how ever it be true that in the latter part of the Record it doth appear that Bildstone had been Committed for suspicion of Treason yet if the times of the proceeding expressed in the Record were observed it would be plain that the Objection was of no force for this one ground both in this Case and all the rest is infallible and never to be doubted of in the Law Nota. That Justices of every Court adjudge of the force and strength of a return out of the body of it self onely and as therein it appears Now in Easter term in the 18. Edward 3. he was returned and brought before them as Committed onely by the Writt wherein noe Cause is expressed and the Leivetenant the Constable of the Tower that brought him into the Court saies that he had no other warrant to detain him Nisi breve predictum wherein there was no mention of any Cause the Court thereupon adjudged that breve predictum for that speciall command was not sufficient causa to detain him in prison and thereupon he is by judgment of the Court in Easter term let to Mainprize But that part of the Record wherein it appears that he had indeed been committed for suspicion of Treason is of Trinity term following when the King after the letting of him to Mainprize sent to the Judges that they should discharge his Mainprize because no man prosecuted him And at that time it appears but not before that he had been in for suspicion of Treason so that he was returned to stand committed by the Kings special command onely without Cause shewed in Easter term And then by judgment of the Court let to Mainprize which to this purpose is but the same with bail though otherwise it differ And in the term following upon another occasion the Court knew that he had been committed for suspicion of Treason which hath no relation at all to the letting of him to Mainprize nor to the judgement of the Court then given when they did not nor could possible know any Cause for which the King had committed him And it was said in behalf of the house of Commons that they had not indeed in the Argument expresly used this latter part of Bildstones Case because it being onely of Trinity term following could not concern the reason of an Award given by the Court in Easter term next before yet notwithstanding that they had most faithfully at the time of their Argument delivered into the Lords as indeed they had a perfect coppy at large of the whole Record of this Case as they had done also of all other presidents whatsoever cited by them in so much as in truth there was not one president of Record of either side the coppy whereof they had not delivered in likewise nor did Mr. Attorney mention any one besides those that were so delivered in by them And as touching those 3. kinds of Records the remembrance Roll the return and file of the Writt and the Scruets it was answered by the gentlemen imployed by the house of Commons that it was true that the Scruect and return of this Case of Bildstone was not to be found but that did not lessen the weight of the president because always in the Award or Judgment drawn up in the remembrance Roll the Cause whatsoever it be when any is shewed upon the return is always expressed as it appears clearly by the constant Entries of the Kings-Bench Court so that if any Cause had appeared plainly in that part of the Roll which belongs to Easter term wherein the Judgment was given but the return of the commitment by the Kings command without Cause shewed and the Judgment of the Court that the Prisoner was to be let to Mainprize appears therein onely and so notwithstanding any Objection made by Mr. Attorney the Cause was maintained to be a clear proof among many others
have declared a man to be irreprieveable when he is committed by the Command of the King if the Law-makers had conceived that his commitment had been unlawfull And Divine truth informs us that the Kings have their power from God the Psalmist calling them the children of the most High which is in a more special manner understood then of other men for all the Sons of Adam are by election the Sons of God and all the Sons of Abraham by recreation or regeneration the Children of the most High in respect of the power which is committed unto them who hath also furnished them with ornaments and arms fit for the exercising of that power and hath given them Scepters Swords and Crowns Scepters to vestitute and Swords to execute Laws and Crowns as Ensigns of that power and dignity with which they are invested shall we then conceive that our King hath so far transmitted the power of his Sword to inferiour Magistrates that he hath not reserved so much Supream power as to commit an Offender to prison 10. H. 6. fol. 7. It appears that a Steward of a Court Lect may commit a man to prison and shall not the King from whom all inferior power is deduced have power to commit We call him the fountain of Justice yet when these streams and rivolets which flowe from that Fountain come fresh and full we would so far exhaust that Fountain as to leave it dry but they that will admit him so much power do require the expression of the cause I demand whether they will have a general cause alleadged or a special if general as they have instances for Treason Fellony or for Contempt for to leave fencing and to speak plainly as they intend it If loan of money should be required and refused and thereupon a commitment ensue and the cause signified to be for a contempt this being unequal inconvenience from yielding the remedy is sought for the next Parliament would be required the expression of the particular cause of the commitment Then how unfit would it be for King or Councel in Cases to express the particuler Cause it s easily to be adjudged when there is no State or pollicy of government whether it be Monarchal or of any other frame which have not some secrets of State not communicable to every vulgar understanding I will instance but one If a King imploy an Ambassadour to a Forreign Countrey of States with instructions for his Negotiation and he pursue not his instructions whereby dishonour and dammage may ensue to the Kingdom is not this commitment And yet the particuler of his instruction and the manner of his miscarrying is not fit to be declared to his Keeper or by him to be certified to the Judges where it is to be opened and debated in the presence of a great audience I therefore conclude for offences against the State in Case of State Government the King and his Councel have lawfull power to punish by imprisonment without shewing particuler cause where it may tend to the disclosing of State-Government It is well known to many that know me how much I have laboured in this Law of the Subjects Liberty very many years before I was in the Kings service and had no cause then to speak but to speak ex animo yet did I then maintain and publish the same opinion which now I have declared concerning the Kings Supream power in matters of State and therefore can not justly be censured to speak at this present onely to merit of my Master But if I may freely speak my own understanding I conceive it to be a question too high to be determined by any legal direction for it must needs be an hard case of contention when the Conquerour must sit down with irreparable losses as in this Case If the Subject prevails he gains Liberty but looseth the benefit of that State-Government by which a Monarchie may soon become an Anarchie or if the State prevails it gives absolute Soveraignty but looseth Subjects not their subjection for obedience we must yield though nothing be left us but prayers and tears but yet looseth the best part of them which is their affections whereby Soveraignty is established and the Crown formerly fixt on his Royal head between two such extreams there is not way to moderate but to finde a medium for the accommodation of the difference which is not for me to prescribe but onely to move your Lordships to whom I submit After Mr. Serjeant his speech ended my Lord President said thus to the Gentlemen of the House of Commons That though at this free conference Liberty was given by the Lords to the Kings Councel to speak what they thought fit for his Majesty Yet Mr. Serjeant Ashley had no Authority or direction from them to speak in that manner he hath done M r. NOYE his Argument the 16. of April 1628. HE offered an answer to the inconveniences presented by M r. Attorney which were 4. in Number First where it was objected that it was inconvenient to express the cause for fear of divulging Arcana Imperii for hereby all may be discovered and abundance of Traitors never brought to Justice To this that Learned Man answered That the Judges by the intention of the Law are the Kings Councel and the secrets may safely be committed to all or some of them who might advise whether they will bayl him and here is no danger to King or subjects for their Oath will not permit them to reveal the secrets of the King nor yet to detain the Subjects long if by Law he be to be bayled Secondly for that Objection of the Children of Odonell he laid this for a ground that the King can do no wrong but in Cases of extream necessity we must yield sometimes for preservation of the whole State ubi unius damnum utilitate publica rependitur he said there was no trust in the Children of Traitours no wrong done if they did tabe facere or marcesere in Carcere It is the same Case of necessity as when to avoid the burning of a Town we are forced to pull down an honnest mans House or to compell a man to dwell by the Sea-side for defence or fortitude Yet the King cannot do wrong for potentia juris est non injura Ergo the Act of the King though to the wrong of another is by the Law made no wrong as if he commanded to be kept in Prison yet he is responsal for his wrong he quoted a book 42.6 Ass. Port. Thirdly the instance made of Westminster First he said there was a great difference between those 3. Mainprize Bail and Replevin The Statute saith a man cannot be repleiued Ergo not bayled non sequitur Maniprize under pain Bayl body for body no pain ever in Court to be declared Replevin neither by surety nor bayl of Replevin never in Court the Statute saith a man cannot be Repleiued Ergo not bayled non sequitur Fourthly where it
speak confidently I did never see nor know by any Record that upon such a Retorn as this a man was bayled the King not first consulted with in such a Case as this The Commons House do not know what Letters and Commands we receive for these remain in our Court and were not viewed by them for the rest of the Matters presented by the House of Commons they were not in agitation before us whether the King may commit and how long he may detain a man committed therefore having answered so much as concerneth us I desire your Lordships good constructions of what hath been said Iudge IONES SAid he was here to deliver before us what judgement was given before them concerning the Habeas Corpus he answered no Judgement was given and the Matter of Fact was such as my brother delivered unto you yesterday These 4. Gentlemen were committed to the Fleet-Gate-House and Marshall of the Kings House-hold 4. Returns were made upon the Writs and every one of them had a Councellour appointed who had Coppies of the Returns A rule was granted their Councel heard and exception taken to the Return because it did not shew cause of their caption These were of no force in the opinion of the Judges the next exception was because no cause of their commitment was shewed which the Judges held to be all one in point of Law Then my Lords they alleadged many Presidents and Statutes of themselves which the Kings Attorney answered That Persons committed by the King or Councel were never bayled but his pleasure was first known We agreed at the Chamber of the Chief Justice that all the Statutes alleadged are in force but whether we should bayl them or no was the question therefore we remitted them quousque After which Mr. Attorney required a Judgement might be entered I commanded the Clark he should not suffer any such thing to be done because we would be better advised But some will say our Act is otherwise I answered no for we have done no more then we do upon ordinary Writ when we purpose to be better advised and that was onely an Interlocutorie order But my Lords put the case a Habeas Corpus should be granted for one that is committed by the House of Commons would they thinck you take it well he should be bayled at his first coming to the Court I thinck they would not and I thinck the King would have done so in this case now my Lords there is a Petition of Right and a Petition of Grace to be bayled is a matter of Grace therefore if a man be brought upon an Habeas Corpus and not bayled he cannot say the Court hath done him any wrong I have now served seven years Judge in this Court and my conscience beareth me witness that I have not wronged the same I have been thought sometimes too forward for the Liberty of the Subject I am my self Liber homo my Ancestors gave their voice with Magna Charta I enjoy that House still which they did I do not now mean to draw down Gods wrath upon my posterity and therefore I will neither advance the Kings prerogative nor lessen the Liberty of the Subject to the danger of either King or People this is my profession before God and your Lordships Iudge DODDERIDGE SAith it is no more fit for a Judge to decline to give an account of his doings then for a Christian of his Faith God knoweth I have endeavoured alwayes to keep a good conscience for a troubled one who can bear the Kingdom holds of none but God and Judgements do not pass privately in Chambers but publick in Court where every one may hear which causeth Judgement to be given with maturity Your Lordships have heard the particulers delivered by my brethren how that Councel being assigned to those 4. Gentlemen in the latter end of Michaelmass Term their Cause received hearing and upon consideration of the Statutes and Records we found some of them to be according to the good old Law of Magna Charta but we thought that they did not come so close to this Case as that bayl should be thereupon presently granted My Lords the Habeas Corpus consisteth of 3. parts the Writ the Return upon the Writ or schedule and the Entry or rule reciting the Habeas Corpus and the Return together with the opinion of the Court either a remittitur or traditur in ballium In this Case a remittitur was granted which we did that we might take better advisement upon the Case and upon the remittitur my Lords they might have had a new Writ the next day and I wish they had because it may be they had seen more and we had been eased of a great labour And my Lords when the Attorney upon the remittitur pressed an Entry we all straitly charged the Clark that he should make no other Entry then such as our Predecessors had usually made in like Cases for the difference my Lords betwixt remittitur and remittitur quousque I could never yet finde any I have now sat in this Court 15. years and I should know something surely if I had gone in a Mill so long dust would cleave to my cloaths I am old and have one foot in the grave therefore I will look to the better part as near as I can But omnia habere in memoria in nullo errare divinum potiùs est quam humanum THE LORD CHIEF IUSTICE SAith he shall not speak with confidence unless he might stand right in the opinion of the House and protested what he spake the day before was not said by him with any purpose to trench upon the Priviledges of this House but out of that respect which by his place he thought he owed to the King he said concerning the point he was to speak of that he would not trouble the Lords with things formerly repeated wherein he concurred with his brethren He said if it were true the King might not commit they had done wrong in not partly delivering for my Lords saith he these Statutes and good Laws being all in force we meant not to trench upon any of them most of them being Commentaries upon Magna Charta but I know not any Statute that goeth so far that the King may not commit Therefore justly we think we delivered the interpretation thereof to that purpose for my Lords Lex terrae is not to be found in this Statute they gave me no example neither was there any Cause shewed in the Return A President my Lords that hath run in a storm doth not much direct us in point of Law and Records are the best Testimonies These Presidents they brought being read we shewed them wherein they were mistaken if we have erred erramus cum Patribus and they can shew no President but that our Predecessors have done as we have done sometimes bayling sometimes remitting sometimes discharging Yet we do never bayl any committed by the King or his Councel
Mr. Serjeant Ashley the other day told your Lordships of the Embleme of a King but by his leave made wrong use of it For a King bears in one hand the Globe and in the other the golden Scepter the tipes of Soveraignty and mercie but the Sword of Justice is ever carried before him by a Minister of Justice which shews Subjects may have their remedies for unjustice done and appeals done to higher powers for the Laws of England are so favourable to their Princes as they can do no unjustice Therefore I will conclude as all disputes I hold do Magna est veritas praevalebit so I make no doubt we living under so good a Prince as we do when this is represented unto him he will answer us Magna est Carta praevalebit The ARCH-BISHOPS of CANTERBURIES Speech at the Conference of both Houses 25. April 1628. GEntlemen of the House of Commons the service of the King and safety of the Kingdom do call on us my Lords to give all convenient expedition to dispatch some of those great and weighty businesses for the better effecting whereof my Lords have thought fit to let you know that they do in general agree with you and doubt not but you will agree with us to the best of your power to maintain and support the fundamental Laws of the Kingdom and the fundamental Liberties of the Subject for the particulers which may hereafter fall in debate they have given me in charge to let you know that what hath been presented by you to their Lordships they have laid nothing of it by they are not out of love with any thing you have tendered to them they have voted nothing neither are they in love with any thing proceeding from themselves for that which we shall say and propose unto you is out of an intendment to invite you to a mutual and free conference that you with confidence may come to us and we with confidence may speak to you so that we may come to a conclusion of those things which we both unanimously desire we have resolved of nothing defined or determined nothing but desire to take you with us praying help of you as you have done of us My Lords have thought upon some Propositions which they have ordered to be read here and then left with you in writing that if it seem good to you we may uniformly concur for the substance and if you differ that you may be pleased to put out or add or alter or diminish as you shall think fit that so we the better come to the end that we do both so desireously embrace Then the 5. Propositions were read by the Lord BISHOP of NORVVHICH The 5. Propositions 25. April 1628. 1. THat his Majesty would be pleased gratiously to declare that the good old Law called Magna Charta and the 6. Statutes conceived to be Declarations or Explanations of that Law do stand still in Force to all intents and purposes 2. That his Majesty would be pleased gratiously to declare that according to Magna Charta and the Statutes aforesaid as also according to the most ancient Customes and Laws of this Land every free Subject of this Realm hath a fundamental propriety in his goods and a fundamental Liberty of his Person 3. That his Majesty would be pleased gratiously to declare that it is his Royal pleasure to ratifie and confirm unto all and every his faithfull and Loyal Subjects all their antient several just Liberties Priviledges and Rights in as ample and beneficial manner to all intents and purposes as their Ancestors did enjoy the same under the Government of the best of his most Noble Progenitors 4. That his Majesty would be pleased gratiously to declare for the good contentment of his Loyal Subjects and for the secureing them from future fears that in all causes within the Cognizance of the Common-Law and concerning the Liberty of his Subjects his Majesty would proceed according to the Laws established in the Kingdom and in no other manner or wise 5. And as touching his Majesties Royal Prerogative intrincical to his Soveraignty and intrusted him from God ad communem totius populi salutem non ad destructionem his Majesty would resolve not to use or divert the same to the prejudice of any his loyal People in the propriety of their goods and liberty of their Persons And in case for the security of his Majesties Royal Person the Common safety of his People or the peaceable Government of his Kingdom his Majesty shall finde just cause of State to imprison or restrain any mans Person his Majesty would gratiously declare that within a convenient time he shall and will express the cause of his commitment or restraint either general or special and upon a cause so expressed will leave him immediatly to be tried according to the Common Justice of the Kingdom Then S r. DUDLEY DIGGS in the behalf of the Commons saith MY Lords it hath pleased Almighty God many wayes to bless the Knights Cittizens and Burgesses now assembled in Parliamen with great comforts and strong hopes that this will prove as happy a Parliament as ever was in England and in their Consultations for the service of his Majesty and the safety of this Kingdom one especial comfort and strong hope hath risen from the continued good respects which your Lordships so nobly from time to time have been pleased to shew unto them particulerly at this present in your so Honourable profession to agree with them in general in desire to maintain and support the fundamental Laws and Liberties of England The Commons have commanded me in like fort they have been are and will be as ready to propugne the just Prerogatives of his Majesty of which in all their Arguments searches of Records and resolutions they have been most carefull according to that which formerly was and now again is protested by them Another Noble Argument of your Honourable disposition towards them is exprest in this that you are pleased to expect no present answer from them who are as your Lordships in your general wisdoms they doubt not have considered a great body that must advise upon all new Propositions and resolve upon them before they can give answer according to the ancient usage of our House but is manifest in general God be thanked for it there is a great concurrence of affection to the same end in both Houses and such a good Harmony that I intreat your Lordships leave to borrow a comparison from nature or natural Philosophy as two Lutes well strung and tun'd brought together if one be plaid on little straws or sticks will stir upon the other though it lye still so though we have no power to reply yet these things said and proposed cannot but work in our hearts and we will faithfully report these passages to our House from whence in due time we hope your Lordships shall receive a contentfull Answer S r. BENJAMIN RUDDIERDS Speech 28.
so glorious within the outward poverty will bring contempt upon them especially amongst those who measure men by the ounce and weigh them by the pound which indeed is the greatest part of men Mr. Pym I cannot but testifie how being in Germany I was exceedingly scandalized to see the poor stipendarie Ministers of the Reformed Churches there dispised and neglected by reason of their poverty being otherwayes very grave and learned men I am afraid this is a part of the burthen of Germany which ought to be a warning to us I have heard many Objections and difficulties even to impossibilities against this Bill to him that is unwilling to go there is even a Bear or Lion in the way First let us make our selves willing then will the way be easie and safe enough I have observed that we are alwayes very eager and fierce against Papistry against scandalous Ministers and against things which are not so much in our power I should be glad to see that we did delight as well in rewarding as in punishing and in undertaking matters within our own reach as this is absolutely within our power Our own duties are next us other mens further of I do not speak this that I do mislike the destroying or pulling down of that which is ill but then let us be as earnest to plant and build up that which is good in the room of it for why should we be desolate The best and the greatest way to dispell darkness and the deeds thereof is to let in light we say that day breaks but no man can ever hear the noise of it God comes in the still voice let us quickly mend our Candlesticks and we cannot want lights I am afraid this backwardness of ours will give the adversary occasion to say that we chuse our Religion because it is the cheaper of the two that we would willingly serve God with somewhat that cost us naught Believe it M r. Pym he that thinks to save any thing by his Religion but his Soul will be a terrible looser in the end we sow so sparingly and that is the reason we reap so sparingly and have no more fruit Me thinks whosoever hates Papistry should by the same rule hate covetousness for that 's Idolatry too I never liked hot professions and cold actions such a heat is rather the heat of a distemper and disease then of life and saving health For scandalous Ministers there is no man shall be more foreward to have them sincerely punnished then I will be when Salt hath lost its savour fit it is to be cast on the unsavory place the dunghill But Sr. let us deal with them as God hath dealt with us God before he made man he made the World a handsome place for him to dwell in so let us provide them convenient livings and then punish them on Gods name but till then scandalous livings cannot but have scandalous Ministers It shall ever be a rule to me that where the Church and Common-wealth are both of one Religion it is comely and decent that the outward splendor of the Church should hold a proportion and participate with the prosperity of the temporal State for why should we dwell in houses of Cedar and suffer God to dwell in Tin It was a Glorious and Religious work of King Iames and I speak it to his unspeakable Honour and to the praise of that Nation who though that Countrey be not so rich as ours yet are they Richer in their affections to Religion within the space of one year he caused to be planted Churches through all Scotland the Highlands and the Boarders worth 30. l. a year a piece with a house and some gleab belonging to them which 30. l. a year considering the cheapness of the Countrey and the modest fashion of Ministers living there is worth double as much as any where within a 100. miles of London the printed Act and Commission whereby it may be executed I have here in my hand delivered unto me by a Noble Gentleman of that Nation and a worthy Member of this House Sir Francis Stuart To conclude although Christianity and Religion be established generally throughout this Kingdom yet untill it be planted more particularly I shall scarce think this a Christian Common-wealth seeing it hath been moved and stirred in Parliament it will lye heavy upon Parliaments untill it be effected Let us do something for God here of our own and no doubt God will bless our proceedings in this place the better for ever hereafter And for my own part I will never give over solliciting this cause as long as Parliaments and I shall live together CHARLES REX To our trusty and well-beloved the Lords Spiritual and Temporal of the Higher House of PARLIAMENT WE being desirous of nothing more then the advancement of the good peace and prosperity of our people have given leave to free debates of highest points of our Prerogative Royal which in times of our Predecessors Kings and Queens of this Realm were ever restrained as Matters they would not have disputed and in other things we have been willing fairly to condiscend to the desires of our loving Subjects as might fully satisfie all moderate mindes and free them from all just fears and jealousies with those Messages which heretofore we have sent to the Commons House will well demonstrate to the World and yet we finde it still insisted on that in no case whatsoever should it never so nearly concern Matters of State and government we nor our privy Councel have power to commit any man without the cause shewed whereas it often happens that should the cause be shewed the service thereby would be destroyed and defeated and the cause alleadged must be such as may be determined by our Judges of our Courts at Westminster in a Legal and Ordinary way of Justice whereas the cause may be such whereof the Judges have no capacity of Judicature or rules of Law to direct or guide their Judgements in cases of that transcendent nature which hapning so often the very intermitting of the constant rules of government for many ages within this Kingdom practised would soon dissolve the very frame and foundation of our Monarchy wherefore as to our Commons we have made propositions which might equally preserve the just Liberty of the Subject So my Lords we have thought good to let you know that without overthrow of our Soveraignty we cannot suffer this power to be impeached But notwithstanding to clear our conscience and just intentions this we publish that it is not in our hearts nor ever will we extend our royal power lent unto us from God beyond the just rule of moderation in any thing which shall be contrary to our Laws and Customes where the safety of our people shall be our onely aim And we do hereby declare our royal pleasure and resolution to be which God willing we shall ever constantly continue and maintain that neither we nor our privy Councel
vouchsafe us your noble Company in this Petition without surcharging it with this addition A tempore Our next argument is drawn a tempore from the unseasonableness of the time The wise man saith there is a time for all things under the Sun tempus suum And if in the wise mans Judgement a word spoken in its due time be precious as Gold and Silver then an unseasonable time detracts as much from the thing or word done or spoken We hold under your favours that the time is not seasonable now for this addition It is true that of it self Soveraign power is a thing alwayes so sacred that to handle it otherwise then tenderly is a kinde of sacriledge and to speak of it otherwise then reverently is a kinde of blasphemy but every vulgar capacity is not so affected the most part of men nay almost all men judge and esteem all things not according to their own intrinsick virtue and quality but according to their immediate effects and operations which the same things have upon them Hence it is that Religion it self receiveth more or less credit and approbation as the Teachers and Professors are worser or better Yea if God himself send a very wet Harvest or Seed-time men are apt enough to censure Divine power The Soveraign power hath not now for the present the ancient amiable aspect in respect of some late sad influences but by Gods grace it will soon recover To intermix with this Petition any mention of Soveraign power rebus sic stantibus when angry men say Soveraign power hath been abused and the most moderate wish it had not been so used we hold it not seasonable under your Lordships correction A loco Our next argument is drawn a loco we think the place where your Lordships would have this addition inserted viz. in the Petition no convenient or seasonable place Your Lordships will easily believe that this Petition will run through many hands every man will be desirous to see and to read what their Knights and their Burgesses have done in Parliament upon their complaints what they have brought home for their 5. Subsedies If in perusing of this Petition they fall upon the mention of Soveraign power they presently fall to arguing reasoning and discanting what Soveraign power is what is the Latitude whence the Original and where the bounds with many such curious and captious questions by which course Soveraign power is little advanced or advantaged For I have ever been of opinion that it is then best with Soveraign power when it is had in tacite venerationem not when it is prophaned by publick hearings or examinations Our last argument is drawn from our duty and Loyalty to his Majesty in consideration whereof we are fearfull at this time to take this addition into our Petition least we should do his Majesty herein some disservice With your Lordships we make the great Councel of the King and Kingdom And though your Lordships having the happiness to be near his Majesty know other things better yet certainly the state and condition of the several parts for which we serve their dispositions and inclinations their apprehensions their fears and jealousies are best known unto us And here I pray your Lordships to give me leave to use the figure called Reticentia that is to insinuate and intimate more then I mean to speak Our chief and principal end in this Parliament is to make up all rents or breaches between the King and his Subjects to draw them and knit them together from that distance whereof the world abroad takes too much notice to work a perfect union and reconciliation how improperly and unapt at this time this addition would be in respect of this end we cannot but foresee and therefore shun it and do resolve that it is neither agreeable to the Persons of such Councellors whom we are nor answerable to that love and duty which we owe to his Majesty to hazard an end of such unspeakable consequence upon the admittance of this addition into our Petition whereof as we have shewed the omission at this time can by no means harm the Kings Prerogative the expression may produce manifold inconveniences and therefore since the admittance of your Lordships addition into our Petition is incoherent and incompatible with the body of the same since there is no necessary use of it for the saving of the Kings rerogative since the moderation of our Petition deserveth your Lordships cheerfull conjunction with us since this addition is unseasonable for the time and inconvenient in respect of the place where your Lordships would have it inserted and lastly may prove a disservice to his Majesty I conclude with a most affectionate prayer to your Lordships to joyn with the House of Commons in presenting this Petition unto his sacred Majesty as it is without this addition The KINGS speech in the Higher House at the meeting of both Houses 2. June 1628. Gentlemen I Am come hither to perform my duty and I think no man will think it long since I have not taken so many dayes in answering of the Petition as you have spent weeks in framing it and I am come hither to shew you that as well in formall things as in essential I desire to give you as much content as in me lies The Lord KEEPER in explanation of the same MY Lords and you the Knights Cittizens and Burgesses of the House of Commons his Majesty hath commanded me to say unto you that he takes it in good part that in consideration how to settle your own Liberty you have generally professed in both Houses that you have no intention for to lessen or diminish his Majesties Prerogative wherein as you have cleared your own intentions so his Majesty now comes to clear his and to strike a firm league with his people which is ever decreed to be most constant and perpetual when the conditions are equal and known to be so These cannot be in a more happy estate then when your Liberties shall be an ornament and strength to his Majesties Prerogative and his Prerogative a defence to your Liberties In this his Majesty doubts not but both you and he shall take a mutual comfort hereafter and for his part he is resolved to give an example in so using of his power as hereafter you shall have no cause to complain This is the summe of that which I am to say to you Here read your own Petition and his Majesties gracious answer The KINGS answer to the Petition of Right 2. June by the Lord KEEPER THe King willeth that Right be done according to the Laws and Customes of the Realm and that the Statutes be put in due execution that the Subject may have no cause to complain of any wrong or oppression contrary to their just Rights and Liberties to the preservation whereof he holds himself in conscience as well obliged as of his Prerogative Sir JOHN ELLIOTS Speech 3. June Mr. Speaker WE sit here
which now moves me to rise to be seasonable and necessary for which we shall either look upon the King or his people It did never more behove this great Physician the Parliament to affect a true consent amongst the parts then now This debate carries with it a double aspect towards the Sovereigne towards the Subject though both be innocent yet both are injured both to be cured In the representation of Injuries I shall crave your attention in the Cure I shall beseech your equall cares and better judgements Surely in the greatest humility I speak it these illegall wayes are punishments and marks of indignation the raising of Levies strengthened by Commission with unheard of instructions the billetting of Souldiers by the Lieutenants and Deputy-lieutenants have been as if they could have perswaded Christian Princes nay worlds the right of Empire had been to take away by strong hand and they have endeavoured as farre as was possible for them to do it This hath not been done by the King under the pleasing shade of whose Crown I hope we shall ever gather the fruits of Justice but by Projectours They have pretended the Prerogative of the King beyond the just proportion which makes the sweet harmony of the whole They have rent from us the light of our eyes enforced a company of guests worse then the Ordinaries of France vitiated our wives and daughters before our faces brought the Crown to greater want then ever by anticipating the revenew and can the Shepherd be thus smitten and the Sheep no scattered They have introduced a Privie Councel ravishing at once the sphears of all ancient government imprisoning us without bank or bond They have taken from us what shall I say indeed what have they left us all means of supplying the King and ingratiating our selves with him taken up the roots of all Propriety which if it be not seasonably set into the ground by his Majestie 's own hand we shall have instead of Beauty Baldnesse To the making of them whole I shall apply my self and propound a remedy to all these diseases By one and the same thing hath King and people been hurt and by the same must they be cured by vindicating what new things no our ancient sober and vitall Liberties by reinforcing the ancient Laws made by our Auncestours by setting such a Character on them as no licencious spirit shall dare to enter upon them And shall we think this is a way to break a Parliament no our desires are modest and just I speak truly both for the interest of King and people If we enjoy not these it will be impossible to relieve him therefore let us never fear that they shall not be accepted by his Goodnesse Therefore I shall descend to my Motion consisting of four parts two of which have relation to our Persons two to the propriety of our Goods For our Persons the freedome of them first from imprisonment secondly from imployment abroad contrary to the ancient Customes For our Goods that no levies may be made but by Parliament secondly no billetting of souldiers It is most necessary that these be resolved that the Subject may be secured in both For the manner in the second place it will be fit to determine it by a grand Committee The Speech and Argument of M r. Creswell of Lincolne's Inne one of the Members of the Commons House of Parliament concerning the Subjects grievance by the late Imprisonment of their persons without any declaration of the Cause I Stand up to speak somewhat concerning the point of the Subjects grievance by imprisonment of their persons without any declaration of the cause contrary unto and in derogation of the fundamentall Laws and Liberties of this Kingdome I think I am one of the puisnes of our profession which are of the Members of this House but howsoever sure I am that in respect of my own inabilities I am the puisne of all the whole House therefore according to the usuall course of Students in our profession I as the puisne speak first in time because I can speak least in matter In pursuance of which course I shall rather put the case then argue it and therefore I shall humbly desire first of all of this honourable House in generall that the goodnesse of the cause may receive no prejudice by the weaknesse of my Argument and next of all of my Masters here of the same profession in particular that they by their learned judgements will supply the great defects I shall discover by declaring of my unlearned opinion Before I speak of the Question give me leave as an entrance thereunto to speak first of the Occasion You shall know Iustice is the life and the heart bloud of the Common-wealth and if the Common-wealth bleed in the Master-vein all the Balm in Gilead is but in vain to preserve this our body of Policy from ruine and destruction Justice is both Columna Corona reipublicae she is both Column and the Pillar the Crown and the glorie of the Common-wealth This is made good in Scripture by the judgement of Solomon the wisest King that ever reigned on earth For first she is the Pillar for the saith that by Justice the Throne shall be established Secondly she is the Crown for the saith that by Justice a Nation is exalted Our Lawes which are the rules of this Justice they are the ne plus ultra to both the King and the Subject and as they are the Hercules Pillar so are they the pillar to every Hercules to every Prince which he must not passe Give me leave to resemble her to Nebuchadnezzars tree for she is so great that she doth shade not onely the Pallace of the King and the house of the Nobles but doth also shelter the Cottage of the poorest beggar Wherefore if either now the blasts of indignation or the unresistable violatour of lawes Necessitie hath so bruised any of the branches of this Tree that either our persons or goods or prossessions have not the same shelter as before yet let us not therefore neglect the Root of this great Tree but rather with all our possible endeavour and unfeigned dutie both apply fresh and fertile mould unto it and also water it even with our own teares that so these bruised Branches may be recovered and the whole Tree again prosper flourish For this I have learned from an ancient Father of the Church that though preces Regum sunt armatae yet arma subditorum are but only preces et lachrymae I know well that Cor Regis inscrutabile and that Kings although they are but men before God yet are they Gods before men And therefore to my gratious and dread Soveraigne whose virtues are true qualities ingenerate both in his judgement and nature let my arm be cut off nay let my soul not live that daie that I shall dare to lift up my arm to touch that forbidden fruit those flowers of his princely Crown and Diadem
give speedy command for the present putting in practice those Laws that prohibite all Popish Recusants to come to the Court or within ten miles of the City of London as also those Law that confine them to the distance of five miles from their dwelling houses and that such by-past licenses not warranted by law as have been granted unto them for their repair to the city of London may be discharged and annulled 4. That whereas it is more then probably conceived that infinite summes of money have within these two or three yeares last past been exacted out of the Recusants within the Kingdome by colour of Composition and small proportion of the same returned into your Majesties Coffers not onely to the suddain inriching of private persons but also to the imboldning of the Romish Recusants to entertain Massing Priests into their private houses and to exercise all the mimick Rites of their grosse Superstition without fear of controll amounting as by their daily practice and ostentation we may conceive to the nature of a concealed Toleration your Majesty would be graciously pleased to receive this particular more nearly into your Princely wisdome and consideration to dissolve this Mystery of Iniquity patch't up of colourable Licenses Contracts or Preconveyances being but masks on the one part of fraud to deceive your Majesty and stales on the other side for private men to accomplish their corrupt ends 5. That as the persons of Ambassadours from forraigne Princes their houses be free for exercise of their own Religion so their houses may not be made free Chappell 's and Sanctuaries for your Majesties Subjects Popishly affected to heare Masse and to participate in all other Rites and Ceremonies of that Superstition to the great offence of almighty God and scandall of your Majesties people loyally and religiously affected That either the concourse of Recusants to such places may be restrained or at least such a vigilant watch set upon them at their returne from those places as they may be apprehended and severely proceeded withall ut qui palaâ— in luce peccant in luce puniantur 6. That no place of authority or command within any the Counties of this your Majesties Kingdome or in any ships of your Majesties or which shall be imployed in your service be committed to Popish Recusants or to Non-communicants by the space of a year past or to any such persons as according to direction of former Acts of State are justly to be suspected as the place and authority of Lords Lieutenants Deputy Lieutenants Justices of Peace of Captains or other Officers or Ministers mentioned in the Statute made in the third year of the reign of your Father of blessed memory and that such as by connivance have crept into such places may by your Majesties royall Command be discharged of the same 7. That all your Majesties Justices Judges and Ministers of Justice unto whose care and trust Execution which is the life of your Majesties Laws is committed may by your Majesties Proclamation not only be commanded to put in speedy execution those Laws that stand in force against Jesuits Priests Seminaries and Popish Recusants but that your Majesty would be further pleased to command the said Judges and Justices of Assize to give a true and strict accompt of their proceedings at their return out of their Circuits to the Lord Keeper and by the Lord Keeper to be presented to your Majesty 8 And for a fair and clear eradication of all Popery for the future and for the breeding and nursing up of an holy generation and a peculiar people sanctified to the true worship of almighty God That untill a provisionall Law may be made for the trayning and educating of the Children of Popish Recusants in the grounds and principles of our holy Religion which we conceive will be of more power and force to unite your people unto your Majesty in fastnesse of Love Religion and loyall Obedience then all pecuniary mulcts and penalties that can possibly be devised your Majesty will be pleased to take it into your Princely care and consideration These our humble Petitions proceeding from hearts and affections loyally and religiously devoted to God and your Majesties service and to the safety of your Majesties Sacred Person we most zealously present to your Princely Wisdome craving your Majesties chearful and gracious approbation The King's Answer to the Petition against Recusants March 31. 1628. My Lords and Gentlemen I Do very well approve the method of your proceeding à Jove principium hoping that the rest of your Consultations will succeed the happier And I like the preamble of my Lord Keeper otherwise I should a little have suspected that you thought me not so carefull of Religion as I have been and ever shall be wherein I am as forward as you can desire As for the Petition I answere first in generall that I like it well and will use those as well as all other means for the maintenance and propagation of that Religion wherein I have lived and doe resolve to die But for the particulars you shall receive a more full answer hereafter And now I will only add this that as we pray to God to help us so we must help our selves for we can have no assurance of his assistance if we do ly in bed and only pray without using other means And therefore I must remember you that if we do not make provision speedily we shall not be able to put one Ship to sea this year Verbum sapienti satis est The Answer to the same Petition by the Lord Keeper Coventrey TO the first point his Majesty answereth That he will accorâ—ding to your desire give both life and motion to the Laws thaâ— stand in force against Iesuits Seminary Priests and all that havâ— taken Orders by authority of the Sea of Rome and to that end his Maâ—jesty will give strict order to all his Ministers for the discovering and apprehending of them and so leave them being apprehended to the triall of the Law and in case after tryall there shall be cause to respite the execution of any of them yet they shall be committed according to the example of best times to the Castle of Westbitch and there be safely kept from exercising their functions or spreading their Superstitious and dangerous Doctrine and for the receivers and abettors they shall be left to the Law To the second His Majesty granteth all that is desired in this Article and to this end will give order to the Lord Treasurer Lord high Admirall and Lord Warden of the Cinque Ports that in their severall places they be carefull to see this Article fully executed giving strict charge to all such as have place or authority under them to use all diligence herein and his Majesty requireth them and all other his Officers and Ministers to have a vigilant eye upon such as dwell in dangerous places of advantage or opportunity for receiving or transporting any such as are here
called because the Authour lay in the Fleet when he made the book for he lib. 2. cap. 52. in his cap. of Turnes and the views of the Hundred Courts in the Countrie sets down the Articles of the Charges that are there to be enquired of amongst which one of them is de replegiabilibus injuste detentis or irreplegiabilibus dimissis which cannot be meant of not bailing by the Justices for what have the inferiour Courts in the Countrey to do with the Acts of the Justices And to make it more plain he setteth down in this Chapter that concernes Sheriffs only the very Statute of Westm. cap. 15. which he translates verbatim out of the French into the Latin save that he renders taken by the command of the Justices thus per Iudicium Iustitiariorum and his Preface to the Statute plainly sheweth that he understood it of replevine by Sheriffs for he saith Qui debent per plegios dimitti qui non declarat hoc Statutum and per plegios is before the Sheriff But for direct authoritie it is the opinion of Newton the Chief Justice in 22. H. 6.46 where his words are these It cannot be intended that the Sheriff did suffer him to go at large by mainprize for where one is taken by the writ of the King or the command of the King he is irreplevisable but in such case his friends may come to the Justices for him if he be arrested and purchase a supersedeas So he declares the very Question That the Sheriffs had no power but that the Justices had power to deliver him that is committed by the Kings Command And both the ancient and modern practise manifests as much for he that is taken for the death of a man or for the Forrest is not replevisable by the Sheriff yet they are ordinarily bailed by the Justices and were by the Kings writs directed to the Sheriffs in the times of E. 1. and E. 2. as appeares in the Close Rolls which could not be done if they were not bailable And it is every dayes experience that the Justices of the Kings Bench do baile for murther and for offences done in the Forrest which they could not do if the word irreplevisable in Westm. 1. were meant of the Justices as well as of the Sheriffs For the authorities which have been offered to prove the contrarie they are in number 3. The first is 21. E. 1. Rot. 2. which also is in the book of the Pleas in Parliament at the Tower fol. 44. It is not an Act of Parliament but a resolution in Parliament upon an action there brought which was usuall in those times and the Case is That Stephen Rubar the Sheriff of the Counties of Leicester and Warwick was questioned for that he had let at large by sureties one William the son of Walter le Parsons against the will and command of the King when as the King had committed him by Letters under his Privie Seal that he should do no favour to any man that was committed by the command of the Earle of Warwick as that man was Whereunto the Sheriff answered that he did it at the request of some of the Kings houshold upon their Letters and because the Sheriff did acknowledge the receipt of the Kings Letters thereupon he was committed to prison according to the forme of the Statute To this I answer that he was justly punished for that he is expresly bound by the Statute Westm. 1. which was agreed from the beginning But this is no proof that the Judges had not power to baile this man The next Argument is 33. H. 6. in the Court of Common Pleas fol. 28.29 where Robert Poinings Esq was brought unto the Barre upon a Capias and it was returned that he was committed per duos de Consilio I believe it is misprinted for Dnos de Consilio i. e. Dominos de Consilio which is stongest against that which I maintain pro diversis causis Regem tangentibus and he made an Attorney there in an accusation whence is inferred that the return was good and the partie could not be delivered To this the Answer is plain 1. No opinion is delivered in that book whether he were delivered or bailed or not 2. It appeares expresly that he was brought thither to be charged in an accusation of debt at another mans Suit and no desire of his own to be delivered or bailed and then if he were remanded it is no way materiall to the question in hand But that which is most relied upon is the opinion of Stamford in his book of the Pleas of the Crown lib. 2. ca. 18. fol. 72.73 in his cap. of Mainprize where he reciteth the Statute of Westm. 1. cap. 15. and then saith thus By this Statute it appeareth that in 4 cases at the Common Law a man was not replevisable to wit those that were taken for the death of a man by command of the King or of his Justices or for the Forrest Thus farre he is most right Then he goeth on and saith As to the Command of the King that is understood of the command of his own mouth or his Councell which is incorporated unto him and speake with his mouth or otherwise every writ of Capias to take a man which is the Kings command would be as much And as to the command of the Justices that is meant their absolute command for if it be their ordinarie commandment he is replevisable by the Sheriff if it be not in some of the Cases prohibited by the Statute The answer that I give unto this is That Stamford hath said nothing whether a man may be committed without cause by the Kings command or whether the Judges ought not to baile him in such case but only that such a one is not replevisable which is agreed for that belongs to the Sheriff And because no man should think he meant any such thing he concludes his whole sentence touching the command of the King and his Justices That one committed by the Justices ordinarie command is replevisable by the Sheriff So either he meant all by the Sheriff or at least it appeares not that he meant that a man committed by the King or the Privie Councell without cause is not bailable by the Justices and then he hath given no opinion in this case What he would have said if he had been asked the question cannot be known neither doth it appeare by any thing he hath said that he meant any such thing as would be inferred out of him And now my Lords I have performed the command of the Commons and as I conceive shall leave their declaration of personall Liberty on ancient and undoubted truth fortified with 7 Acts of Parliament and not opposed by any Statute or authoritie of Law whatsoever The Objections of the King's Councell with the Answers made thereunto at the two Conferences touching the same matter IT was agreed by Master Attorney generall that the seven Statutes urged by
of Justice And thereupon the Statutes cannot be intended to restrain all commitments unlesse a cause be expressed for that it would be very inconvenient and dangerous to the State to publish the cause at the very first Answer Hereupon it was replied by the House of Commons that all danger and inconvenience may be avoided by declaring a generall Cause as for treason suspicion of treason misprision of treason or fellony without specifying the particular which can give no greater light to a Confederate then will be conjectured by his very apprehension upon the imprisonment if nothing at all were expressed It was further alledged that there was a kind of contradiction in the position of the Commons when they say the partie committed without a cause shewed ought to be delivered or bailed Bailing being a kind of imprisonment Delivery a totall freeing To this it was answered that it hath alwayes been the discretion of the Judges to give so much respect to a Commitment by the Command of the King or the Privie Councell which are ever intended to be done on just weightie Causes that they will not presently set him free but baile him to answer what shall be objected against him on his Majesties behalf But if any other inferiour Officer commit a man without a cause shewed they do instantly deliver him as having no cause to expect their pleasure So the Delivery is applyed to an imprisonment by the command of some mean minister of Justice Bailing when it is done by the Command of the King or his Councell It was said by M r Attorney That Bailing was a grace and favour of a Court of Justice and that they may refuse to do it This was agreed to be true in divers cases as where the case doth appeare to be for fellony or other crimes expressed for that there is another way to discharge them in some convenient time by their triall yet in some of these cases the constant practise hath been anciently modernly to baile them But where no cause of the imprisonment is returned but the Command of the King there is no way to deliver such persons by triall or otherwise but that of the habeas Corpus and if they should be then remanded they may be perpetually imprisoned without any remedy at all and consequently a man that had committed no offence be in worse case then a great Offender for the latter should have an ordinarie triall to discharge him the other should never be delivered It was further said that though the Statute of Westm. 1. cap. 15. as a Statute by way of provision did extend only to the Sheriff yet the recitall of that Statute touching the 4 cases wherein a man was not replevisable at the Common Law namely those that were committed for the death of a man by the command of the King or the Justices or for the Forrest did declare that the Justices could not baile such a one and that Replevisable and Bailable were Synonyma and all one and that Stamford a Judge of great authority doth expound it accordingly and that neither the Statute nor he sayes replevisable by the Sheriff but generally without restraint and that if the Chief Justice commits a man he is not to be enlarged by another Court as appeareth in the Register To this it was answered First that the recitall and body of the Statute relates only to the Sheriff as appeareth by the very words Secondly that replevisable is not restrained to the Sheriffs for that the words import no more that a man committed by the Chief Justice is bailable by the Court of Kings Bench. Thirdly that Stamford meaneth all of the Sheriff or at least he hath not sufficiently expressed that he intended the Justices Fourthly It was denyed that Replevisable and Bailable were the same for they differ in respect of the place where they are used Baile being in the Kings Court of Record Replevisable before the Sheriff and they are of severall natures Replevisable being a letting at large upon Sureties Bailing being when one Traditur in ballium and the Baile are his Gaolers and may imprison him and shall suffer bodie for bodie which is not true of replevying by sureties And Baile differeth from Mainprize in this that Mainprize is an undertaking in a summe certain Bailing is to answer the condemnation in Civil causes and in Criminall body for body The reasons and authorities used in the first Conference were then renewed and no exception taken to any save in 22. H. 6. it doth not appear that the Command of the King was by his mouth which must be intended or by his Councell which is all one as is observed by Stamford for the words are these That a man is not replevisable by the Sheriff who is committed by the Writ or Commandment of the King 21. E. 1. rot 2. dorso was cited by the Kings Counsell But it was answered that it concerned the Sheriff of Leicester only and not the power of the Judges 33. H. 6. the Kings Attorney confesseth was nothing to the purpose and yet that Book hath been usually cited by those that maintain the contrary to the Declaration of the House of Commons And therefore such sudden opinion as hath been given thereupon is not to be regarded the foundation failing And where it was said that the French of 36. E 3. Rot. Parliament 9. which can receive no answer did not warrant what was inferred thence but that these words Sans disturbance mettre ou arrest faire et le contre par special commandment ou en autre maniere must be understood that the Statutes should be put in execution without putting disturbance or making arrest to the contrarie by speciall command or in other manner The Commons did utterly deny the interpretation given by the Kings Counsell and to justifie their own did appeal to all men that understood French and upon the 7 Statutes did conclude That their Declaration remained in undoubted truth not controlled by any thing said to the contrary The true Copies of the Records not printed which were used on either side of that part of the debate INter Recorda domini Regis Caroli in Thesauro Recepto Scacarii sui sub custodia domini Thesaurarii et Camerarii ibidem remanentia viz. placita coram ipso Domino Rege Concilio suo ad Parliament suum post Pascham apud London in Mâ—nerio Archipiscopi Ebor Anno Regni Domini Regis Edw. vicessimo primo inter alia sie continetur ut sequitur Rot. secundo in Dorso Vic. Leic. sci Stephanus Rubaz Vic. Leic. War coram ipso Domino Rege ejus concilio arianatus ad Levem positus de hoc quod cum Io. Botetourte Edel Hatche W. Hemelin nuper in ballium ipsius vicecom per Dominum Regem fuissent assignati and Goalas Domini Regis celiberandum eidem vic quendam W. de Petling per quendam Appellatorem ante adventum eorundam Justic. ibidem
these is the Case of S r Samuel Saltonstall It is Hill 12. Iacob He was committed to the Fleet per mandatum Domini Regis and besides by the Court of Chauncery for disobeying an order of that Court and is returned upon his habeas Corpus to be therefore detained And it is true that a remittitur is entred in the Roll but it is only a remittitur prisonae predict without quousque secundum legem deliberatus fuerit And in truth it appeares in the Record that the Court gave the Warden of the Fleet 3 severall dayes at severall times to amend his Return and in the interim remittitur prisonae predict still Certainly if the Court had thought that the Return had been good they would not have given so many severall dayes to have amended it For if that mandatum Domini Regis had been sufficient in the Case why needed it to have been amended The ninth and last of these is Trinit 13. Iacob Rot. 71. the Case of the said S r Samuel Saltonstall He is returned by the Warden of the Fleet as in the Case before and generally remittitur as in the Roll which proves nothing at all that therefore the Court thought he might not by Law be enlarged and besides in both Cases he stood committed also for disobeying an order in Chauncery These are all that have been pretended to the contrary in this great point and upon the view of them thus opened to your Lordships it is plain that there is not one not so much as one at all that proveth any such thing as that persons committed by the Command of the King or of the Lords of the Councell without cause shewed might not be enlarged but indeed the most of them expresly prove rather the contrary Now my Lords having thus gone through the Presidents of Record that concern this point of either side before I come to the other kind of Presidents which are the solemn resolution of Judges in former times I shall as I am commanded by the House of Commons represent unto your Lordships somewhat else that they have thought very considerable with which they have met while they were in a most carefull enquirie of whatsoever concerned them in this great Question It is my Lords a draught of an Entry of a Judgement in that great Case lately adjudged in the Court of Kings Bench when divers Gentlemen imprisoned per speciale mandat Domini Regis were by the Award and Judgement of the Court after solemn debate sent back to Prison because it was expresly said that they could not in Justice deliver them though they prayed to be bailed The case is famous and well known to your Lordships therefore I need not further mention it And as yet indeed there is no Judgement entred upon the Roll but there is room enough for any kind of Judgement to be entred But my Lords there is a form of a Judgement a most unusuall one such a one as never was in any such Case before used for indeed there was never before any Case so adjudged and this drawn up by a chief Clark of that Court by direction of M r Attorney Generall as the House was informed by the Clark in which the reason of the Judgement and the remanding of those Gentlemen is expressed in such sort as if it should be declared upon Record for ever that the Law were that no man could be enlarged from imprisonment that stood committed by any such absolute command The draught is only in S r Iohn Henningham's Case being one of the Gentlemen that was remanded and it was made for a form for all the rest The words of it are after the usuall Entrie of a Curia advisur vult for a time that visis return predict nec non diversis antiquis Recordis in Curia hic remanent consimiles casus concernentibus maturaque deliberatione inde prius habita eo quod nulla specialis causa captionis five detentionis predict Johannis exprimitur sed generaliter quod detentus est in prisona predict per speciale mandatum Domini Regis ideo predictus Johannes remittitur perfato Custodi Marr. hospitii predict salvo custodiend quousque c. that is quousque secundum legem deliberatus fuerit And if that Court which is the highest for ordinary Justice cannot deliver him secundum legem what Law is there I beseech you my Lords that can be sought for in any other inferiour Court to deliver him Now my Lords because this draught if it were entred in the Roll as it was prepared for no other purpose would be a great declaration contrary to the many Acts of Parliament already cited contrary to all Presidents of former times and to all reason of Law to the utter subversion of the chiefest Liberty and Right belonging to every Free-man of the Kingdome and for that especially also it supposeth that divers ancient Records had been looked into by the Court in like Cases by which Records their Judgements were directed whereas in truth there is not one Record at all extant that with any colour not so much indeed as with any colour warrants the Judgement therefore the House of Commons thought fit also that I should with the rest that hath been said shew this draught also to your Lordships I come now to the other kind of Presidents that is solemn Resolutions of Judges which being not of Record remain only in authentick Copies But of this kind there is but one in this Case that is a resolution of all the Judges in England in the time of Queen Elizabeth It was in the foure and thirtieth yeare of her reign when divers persons had been committed by absolute command and delivered by the Justices of one Bench or the other whereupon it was desired that the Judges would declare in what Cases persons committed by such Command were to be enlarged by them The resolution hath been variously cited and variously apprehended The House of Commons therefore desiring with all care to enforme themselves as fully of the truth of it as possibly they might got into their hands from a member of their House a book of selected Cases collected by a learned and reverend Chief Justice of the Common Pleas that was one of them that gave the Resolution which is entred at large in that book I mean the Lord Chief Justice Anderson It is written in that book in his own hand as the rest of the book is And however it hath been cited and was cited in that great Judgement given upon the habeas Corpus in the King's Bench as if it had been that upon such commitments the Judges might not baile the prisoners yet it is most plain that in the resolution it self no such thing is contained but rather expresly the contrary I shall better represent it to your Lordships by reading it then by opening it Then it was read If this Resolution doth resolve any thing it doth indeed upon the matter resolve fully the
also to the Nobles and their honourable Progenies to the Bishops and Clergie and their successours to all persons of what condition or sex or age soever to all Judges Officers c. whose attendance are necessary c. without exception of any person Fifth generall reason The fifth is drawn from the indefinitnesse of time the pretended power being limited to no time may be perpetuall during life Sixth generall reason The sixth à damno dedecore from the losse and dishonour of the English Nation in 2 respects First for their valour and prowesse so famous through the whole world Secondly for their industry for who indeavours to apply himself in any profession either of warre liberall science or merchandise c. if he be but Tennant at will of his Liberty And no Tennant at will will support or improve any thing because he hath no certain estate And thus it should be both dedecus and damnum to the English Nation and it should be no honour to the King to be King of slaves Seventh generall reason The seventh is drawn ab utili inutili for that it appeareth by the statute of 36. E. 3. That the execution of the statute of Magna Charta 5. E. 3.25 E. 3. are adjudged in Parliament to be for the profit of the King and of his people Rot. Parl. 36. E. 3. num 9. 20. And therefore this pretended power being against the profit of the King and of his people can be no more part of this prerogative Eighth generall reason The eighth generall reason is drawn à tuto for it is safe for the King to expresse the cause of the commitment 1. E. 2. de frang prison stat unt pasche 18. E. 3. rot 33. coram Rege Bildestons case rot Parl. 28 H. 6. nu 16. Acts Apost cap. 25. v. the last and dangerous for him to omit it for if any be committed without expressing the cause though he escape albeit the truth be it were for treason or felony yet the escape is neither felony nor treason But if the cause be expressed to be for suspition of treason or felony then the escape albeit he be innocent is treason or felony Ninth generall reason The ninth generall reason is drawn from the authorities 16. H. 6. tit Monstrans defaits 182. by the whole Court the King in his presence cannot command one to be arrested but an action of false imprisonment lieth against him that arresteth 22. H. 6.46 Newton 1. H. 7.4 the opinion of Markham Chief Justice to E 4. and the reason because the party hath no remedy Fortescue cap. 18. proprio ore nullus Regum usus est c. to commit any man c. 4. Eliz. Plowd Com. 236. the common Common Law hath so admeasured the Kings prerogative as he cannot prejudice any man in his inheritance and the greatest inheritance a man hath is the Liberty of his person for all other are necessary to it Major haereditas venit unicuique nostrum à jure legibus quam à parentibus 25. E. 1. ca. 2. Confirm Cart. all judgements given against Magna Charta are void Objections Upon Conference with the Lords the objections were made by the Kings Attorney First object That these resolutions of the House were incompatible with a Monarchy that must govern by the state Bracton Answ. Whereunto it was answered that nihiltam proprium est imperii quam legibus vivere And again Attribuat Rex legi quodlex attribuat c. viz. dominationem imperium quia sine lege non potest esse Rex It can be no more prejudice to the King by reason of matter of state for if it be for suspition of treason misprision of treason or felony it may be by generall words expressed viz. pro suspitione proditionis 2 object To blind those that are committed one cause must be pretended and another intended especially when it toucheth matter of state Answ. Whereunto it was answered that all dissimulation especially in the course of Justice was to be avoided and soundnesse of truth to take place and therefore David that was both a King and a Prophet prayed to Almighty God against dissimulation in these words Lord send me a sound heart in thy statutes that I be not ashamed where sound in the originall signifieth upright without dissimulation and shame followeth dissimulation when the truth is known Third object If a Rebell be attainted in Ireland and his children for safety and for matter of state be kept in the Tower what shall be returned upon the Habeas Corpus Whereunto It was answered First that their imprisonment might be justified if they could not find good sureties for their good behaviour Secondly It was charity to find them meat drink and apparell that by the Attainder of their father had nothing Fourth object Though his Majesty expresseth no cause yet it must be intended that there was a just cause Answ. De non apparentibus de non existentibus eadem ratio Fifth object First The King in stead of gold or silver may make money currant of any base metall Secondly He may make warres at his pleasure Thirdly He may pardon whom he will Fourthly He may make denizens as many as he will and these were said to be greater priviledges then this in question Answ. To the first it is denyed that the King may make money currant of base metal but it ought to be gold or silver Secondly It was answered admitting the King might do it his losse and charge was more then of his Subjects both in the case of money and in the case of warre The pardon was private out of grace and no man had dammage or loss by it so of the making of denizens the King was only the looser viz. to have single custome where he had double Thirdly it was a non sequitur The King may do these things ergo he may imprison at will Your Lordships are advised by them that cannot be daunted by fear nor misled by affection reward or hope of preferment that is of the dead By ancient and many Acts of Parliament in the point besides Magna Charta which hath been 30 times confirmed and commanded to be put in execution wherein the Kings of England have thirty times given their Royall assent Secondly Judiciall Presidents per vividas rationes manifest and apparant reasons we in the house of Commons have upon great studie and serious consideration made a grand manifesto unanimously nullo contradicente concerning this great Liberty of the subject and have vindicated and recovered the body of this fundamentall Liberty both of your Lordships of our selves from shadowes which some time of the day are long sometimes short and sometimes long again and therefore no Judges are to be led by them Your Lordships are involved in the same danger and therefore ex congruo condigno we desire a conference to the end your Lordships might make the like declaration as we
be imprisoned before he be convicted according to the Law but if this return shall be good then his imprisonment shall not continue on for a time but for ever and the Subjects of this Kingdome may be restrained of their liberties perpetually and by Law their can be no remedy for the Subject and therefore this return cannot stand with the Laws of the Realm or that of Magna Charta Nor with the statute of 28 Ed. 3. ca. 3. for if a man be not bailable upon this return they cannot have the benefit of these two Laws which are the inheritance of the Subject If your Lordship shall think this to be a sufficient cause then it goeth to a perpetuall imprisonment of the subject for in all those causes which may concern the Kings Subjects and are appliable to all times and cases we are not to reflect upon the present time and government where justice and mercy floweth but we are to look what may betide us in the time to come hereafter It must be agreed on all sides that the time of the first commitment doth not appear in this return but by a latter warrant from the Lords of the Councell there is a time indeed expressed for the continuing of him in prison and that appeares but if this shall be a good cause to remand these Gentlemen to prison they may lie there this seven yeares longer and seven yeares after them nay all the dayes of their lives And if they sue out a writ of Habeas corpus it is but making a new warrant and they shall be remanded and shall never have the advantage of the Laws which are the best inheritance of every Subject And in Ed. 6. fol. 36. the Laws are called the great inheritance of every Subject and the inheritance of inheritances without which inheriritance we have no inheritance These are the exceptions I desire to offer to your Lordship touching the return for the insufficiency of the cause returned and the defect of the time of the first commitment which should have been expressed I will not labour in objections till they be made against me in regard the sttatute of Westminster primo is so frequent in every mans mouth that at the Common Law those men that were committed in four cases were not replevisable viz. those that were taken for the death of a man or the commandment of the King or his Justices for the forest I shall speak something to it though I intend not to spend much time about it for it toucheth not this Case we have in question For that is concerning a Case of the Common Law when men are taken by the Kings writs and not by word of mouth and it shall be so expounded as Master Stamford fol. 73. yet it is nothing to this Case for if you will take the true meaning of that statute it extends not at all to this writ of Habeas corpus for the words are plain they shall be replevisable by the Common writ that is by the writ de homine replegiando directed to the Sheriffe to deliver them if they were baileable but the Case is above the Sheriffe and he is not to be Judge in it whether the cause of the commitment be sufficient or not as it appears in Fitz Herbert de homine replegiando and many other places and not of the very words of the statute this is clear for thereby many other causes mentioned as the death of a man the commandment of the Justices c. In which the statute saith men are not replevisable but will a man conceive that the meaning is that they shall not be bailed at all but live in perpetuall imprisonment I think I shall not need to spend time in that it is so plain let me but make one instance A man is taken de morte hominis he is not baileable by writ saith this statute that is by the common writ there was a common writ for this Case and that was called de odio acia as appeareth Bracton Coron 34. this is the writ intended by the statute which is a common writ and not a speciall writ But my Lord as this writ de odio acia was before this statute so it was afterwards taken away by the statute of 28 Ed. 3. cap. 9. But before that sttatute this writ did lie in the speciall Case as is shewn in Brooks 9 th Reports Powlters Case and the end of this writ was that the Subject might not be too long detained in prison as till the Justices of Eyre discharged them so that the Law intended not that a man should suffer perpetuall imprisonment for they were very carefull that men should not be kept too long in prison which is also a Liberty of the Subject and my Lord that this Court hath bailed upon a suspicion of high treason I will offer it to your Lordship when I shall shew you presidents in these cases of a commitment by the Privy Councell or by the King himself But before I offer these presidents unto your Lordship of which there be many I shall by your Lordships favour speak a little to the next exception and that is the matter of the return which I find to be per speciale mandatum domini Regis 8. and what is that it is by this writ there may be sundry commands by the King we find a speciall command often in our Books as in the statute of Marlborough cap. 8. they were imprisoned Rediss shall not be delivered without the speciall command of our Lord the King and so in Bracton De Actionibus the last chapter where it appears that the Kings commandment for imprisonments is by speciall writ so by writ again men are to be delivered for in the case of Rediss or Post Rediss if it shall be removed by a Certiorare is by a speciall writ to deliver parties so that by this appears that by the Kings commandment to imprison and to deliver in those cases is understood this writ and so it may be in this case which we have heard And this return here is a speciall Mandatum it may be understood to be under some of the Kings Seals 42 Ass. and ought to be delivered and will you make a difference between the Kings command under his seal and his command by word of mouth what difference there is I leave it to your Lordships judgement but if there be any it is the more materiall that it should be expressed what manner of command it was which doth not here appear and therefore it may be the Kings command by writ or his command under his Seal or his command by word of mouth alone And if of an higher nature there is none of these commands then the other doubtlesse it is that by writ or under seal for they are of record and in these the person may be bailed and why not in this As to the legall forme admitting there were substances in the return yet
please your Lordship I shall humbly move you that this Gentleman may also be bailed for under favour my Lord there is no cause in the return why he should be any farther imprisoned and restrained of his liberty My Lord I shall say something to the form of the writ and of the return but very little to them both because there is a very little left for me to say My Lord to the form I say it expresseth nothing of the first caption and therefore it is insufficient I will adde one reason as hath been said the Habeas Corpus hath onely these words quod habeas corpus ejus una cum causa detensionis non captionis But my Lord because in all imprisonment there is a cause of caption and detention the caption is to be answered as well as the detention I have seen many writs of this nature and on them the caption is returned that they might see the time of the caption and thereby know whether the party should be delivered or no and that in regard of the length of his imprisonment The next exception I took to the form is that there is much incertainty in it so that no man can tell when the writ came to the keeper of the prison whether before the return or after for it appears not when the Kings command was for the commitment or the signification of the Councell came to him It is true that it appears that the warant was dated the seventh of November but when it came to the keeper of the prison that appears not at all and therefore as for want of mentioning the same time of the caption so for not expressing the same time when this warrant came I think the return is faulty in form and void And for apparent contradiction also the return is insufficient for that part of the return which is before the warrant it is said quod detentus est per speciale mandatum domini Regis the warrant of the Lords of the Councel the very syllables of that warrant are that the Lords of the Councell do will and require him still to detain him which is contrary to the first part of the return Besides my Lord the Lords themselves say in another place and passage of the warrant that the King commanded them to commit him and so it is their commitment so that upon the whole matter there appears to be a clear contradiction in the return and there being a contradiction in the return it is void Now my Lord I will speak a word or two to the matter of the return and that is touching the imprisonment per speciale mandatum domini Regis by the Lords of the Councell without any cause expressed and admitting of any or either of both of these to be the return I think that by the constant and settled Laws of this kingdome without which we have nothing no man can be justly imprisoned be either of them without a cause of the commitment expressed in the return My Lord in both the last Arguments the statutes have been mentioned and fully expressed yet I will adde a little to that which hath been said The statute of Magna Charta cap. 29. that statute if it were fully executed as it ought to be every man would enjoy his liberty better then he doth The Law saith expresly no Free-man shall be imprisoned without due processe of the Law out of the very body of this Act of Parliament besides the explanation of other statutes it appears Nullus liber homo capiatur vel imprisonetur nisi per legem terrae My Lord I know these words legem terrae do leave the question where it was if the interpretation of the Statute were not But I think under your Lordships favour there it must be intended by due course of Law to be either by presentment or by indictment My Lords if the meaning of these words Per legem terrae were but as we use to say according to the lawes which leaves the matter very uncertain and per speciale mandatum c. be within the meaning of these words according to the law then this Act had done nothing The Act is No Free-man shall be imprisoned but by the law of the land if you will understand these words per legem terrae in the first sense this statute will extend to Villains as well as to Free-men for if I imprison another man Villain the Villain may have an action of false imprisonment But the Lords and the King for then they both had Villains might imprison them and the Villain could have no remedy but these words in the statute per legem terrae were to the Free-man which ought not to be imprisoned but by due processe of law and unlesse the interpretation shall be this the Free-man shall have no priviledge above the Villain So that I conceive my Lord these words per legem terrae must be here so interpreted as in 42 Eliz. the Bill is worth the observing it reciteth that divers persons without any writ or presentment were cast into prison c that it might be enacted that it should not be so done hereafter the answere there is that this is an Article of the great Charter this should be granted so that it seemes the statute is not taken to be an explanation of that of Magna Charta but the very words of the statute of Magna Charta I will conclude with a little observation upon these words nec super eum mittimus which words of themselves signifie not so much a man cannot finde any fit sense for them But my Lord in the seventh year of King Iohn there was a great Charter by which this statute in the ninth of Henry the third whereby we are now regulated was framed and there the words are nec eum in Carcerem mittimus we will not commit him to prison that is the King himself will not and to justifie this there is a story of that time in Matthew Paris and in that Book this Charter of King Iohn is set down at large which Book is very authentique and there it is entred and in the ninth of Henry the third he saith that the statute was renewed in the same words with the Charter of King Iohn and my Lord he might know it better then others for he was the Kings Chronologer in those times and therefore my Lord since there be so many reasons and so many presidents and so many statutes which declare that no Free-man whatsoever ought to be imprisoned but according to the laws of the land and that the liberty of the subject is the highest inheritance that he hath my humble request is that according to the ancient laws and priviledges of this Realm this Gentleman my Client may be bailed The Argument of Master Calthrop upon the Habeas corpus Sir Iohn Corbet being brought to the Kings Bench Bar with Sir Edmond Hampden Sir Walter Earl and Sir Iohn Henningham who were also
the Privy Councell is a limited jurisdiction for they have no power in all causes their power being restrained in certain causes by severall Acts of Parliament as it appeareth by the statute of 20 Edward the third c. 11. 25 Ed. the third c. 1. stat 4. the private petition in Parliament permitted in the 1 of R. 2. where the Commons petition that the Privie Councell might not make any Ordinance against the Common Law Customes or Statutes of the Realm the fourth of Henry the fourth ca. 3. 13 Hen. the fourth 7. 31 Henry the sixth and their jurisdictions being a limited jurisdiction the cause and grounds of their commmitment ought to appear whereby it may appear if the Lords of the Councell did commit him for such a cause as was within their jurisdiction for if they did command me to be committed to prison for a cause whereof they had not jurisdiction the Court ought to discharge me of this imprisonment and howsoever the King is Vicarius Dei in terra yet Bracton cap. 8. fol. 107. saith quod nihil aliud potest Rex in terris cum sit Minister Dei Vicarius quam solum quod de jure potest nec obstat quod dicitur quod Principi placet legis habet vigorem quia sequitur in fine legis cum lege Regia quae de ejus imperio lata est id est non quicquid de voluntate Regis temere praesumptum est sed animo condendi Iura sed quod consilio Magistratuum suorum Rege author praestant habita super hoc deliberatione tract rect fuer definit Potestat itaque sua juris est non injuriae The which being so then also it ought to appear upon what cause the King committeth one to prison whereby the Judges which are indifferent between the King and his Subjects may judge whether his commitment be against the Laws and Statutes of this Realm or not Thirdly it is to be observed that the Kings command by his Writ of Habeas corpus is since the commandment of the King for his commitment and this being the latter commandment ought to be obeyed wherefore that commanding a return of the body cum causa detentionis there must be a return of some other cause then Per mandatum domini Regis the same commandment being before the return of the Writ Pasch. 9. E. 3. pl. 30. fol. 56. upon a Writ of Cessavit brought in the County of Northumberland the Defendants plead That by reason the Country being destroyed by Warres with the Scots King Edward the second gave command that no Writ of Cessavit should be brought during the Warres with Scotland and that the King had sent his Writ to surcease the Plea and he averreth that the Warres with Scotland did continue Hearle that giveth the Rule saith That we have command by the King that now is to hold this Plea wherefore we will not surcease for any writ of the King that is dead and so upon all these reasons and presidents formerly alledged I conclude that the return that Sir Iohn Corbet was committed and detained in prison Per speciale mandatum domini Regis without shewing the nature of the commandment by which the Court may judge whether the commandment be of such a nature as he ought to be detained in prison and that without shewing the cause upon which the commandment of the King is grounded is not good As unto the second part which is Whether the time of the commitment by the return of the Writ not appearing unto the Court the Court ought to detain him in prison or no I conceive that he ought not to be continued in prison admitting that the first commitment by the command of the King were lawfull yet when he hath continued in prison by such reasonable time as may be thought fit for that offence for which he is committed he ought to be brought to answer and not to continue still in prison without being brought to answer For it appears by the Books of our Laws that liberty is a thing so favoured by the Law that the Law will not suffer the continuance of a man in prison for any longer time then of necessity it must and therefore the Law will neither suffer the party Sheriffs or judges to continue a man in prison by their power and their pleasure but doth speed the delivery of a man out of prison with as reasonable expedition as may be And upon this reason it is resolved in 1 2 El. Dyer 175. 8 Ed. 4.13 That howsoever the Law alloweth that there may be no term between the rest of an originall Writ and the return of the same where there is onely a summons and no imprisonment of the body yet it will not allow that there shall be a term between the rest of a Writ of Capias and the return of the same where the body of a man is to be imprisoned insomuch that it will give no way that the party shall have no power to continue the body of a man imprisoned any longer time then needs must 39 E. 3.7 10 H. 7.11 6 E. 4.69 11 E. 4.9 48 E. 3.1 17 E. 3.1 2 Hen. 7. Kellawaies Reports do all agree that if a Capias shall be awarded against a man for the apprehending of his body and the Sheriffe will return the Capias that is awarded against the party a non est inventus or that languidus est in prisona yet the Law will allow the party against whom it is awarded for the avoiding of his corporall pennance and dures of imprisonment to appear gratis and for to answer For the Law will not allow the Sheriffe by his false return to keep one in prison longer then needs must 38 Ass. pl. 22. Brooks imprisonment 100. saith That it was determined in Parliament that a man is not to be detained in prison after he hath made tender of his fine for his imprisonment therefore I desire your Lordship that Sir Iohn Corbet may not be kept longer in durance but be discharged according to the Law The substance of the Objections made by Mr. Attorney General before a Committee of both Houses to the Argument that was made by the House of Commons at the first conference with the Lords out of Presidents of Record and Resolutions of Iudges in former times touching the Liberty of the person of every Freeman and the Answers and Replies then presently made by the House of Commons to these Objections AFter the first conference which was desired by the Lords and had by a Committee of both houses in the painted Chamber touching the Reasons Laws Acts of Parliament and Presidents concerning the Liberty of the person of every Freeman M r Attorney General being heard before the Committee of both houses as it was assented by the house of Commons that he might be before they went up to the conference after some preamble made wherein he declined the answering all Reasons of Law
predictae doth not always imply or remaunding upon judgment or debate And this answer was given to this of Cesars Case that is the sixt of this Number The seventh is the Case of Iames Demetrius It was 12 Iacobi Rot. 153. Mr Attorney objected that this Demetrius and divers others being Brewers were committed per consilium Domini Regis to the Marshal-sea of the houshould and that upon the commitment so generally returned they were remaunded and that the Entry was immediate remittitur prefato Marescallo hospitii predicti where he observed that immediate shews that the Judges of that time were so resolved of this Question that they remaunded them partly as men that well knew what the Law was herein Here unto the Gentlemen of the House of Commons gave these answers First that the Remittitur in this Case is but as the other in Cesars and so proves nothing against them Secondly that immediate being added to it shews plainly that it was done without debate or any argument or consideration had of it which makes the authority of the presidents to be of no force in point of Law for Judgments and Awards given upon delibration onely and debate are Proofs and Arguments of weight and not any sudden Act of the Court without debate or deliberation And the Entry of immediate being proposed to Mr. Keeling it was confirmed by him that by that Entry it appears by this course that the remaunding of him was the self same day he was brought which as it was said by the Gentlemen of the House of Commons might be at the riseing of the Court or upon advisement and the like And this answer was given to this president of the Brewers The last of the 8. which Mr. Attorney objected is Saltonstals Case in the 13. Iacobi Regis He was committed per mandatum Dominorum Regis de privato Consilio and being returned by the Warden of the Fleet to be so remittitur prisonae predictae and in the 13. Iac in the same year remittitur generally in the Roll and these two make but one Case and are as one president To this the Gentlemen of the House of Commons answered that it is true the Rolls have such Entries of remittitur in them generally but that proves nothing upon the reason before used by them in Cesars Case But also Saltonstall was committed for another cause besides per mandatum Dominorum Consilii for a contempt against an order in Chauncery and that was in the return also And besides the Court as it appears in the Record gave several days to the Warden of the Fleet to mend his return which they would not have done if they had conceived it sufficient because that which is sufficient needs no amendment To this M r. Attorney replyed that they gave him a day to amend his return in respect of that part thereof that concerned the order in Chancery and not in respect of that which was per mandat Concilij But the gentlemen of the house of Commons answered That it appears not any where nor indeed is it likely at all nor can be so reasonably understood because if the other return per mandatum Concilij had been sufficient by it self it appears fully that the Court conceived the return to be insufficient And so the gentlemen of the Commons house concluded that they had a great number of presidents besides the Acts of Parliament and reasons of Common Law agreeable to their resolution and that there was not one president at all that made against them but indeed that almost all that were brought as well against them as for them if rightly understood made fully to the maintenance of their resolution and that there was not one example or president of a Remittitur in any kinde upon this point before that of Cesars Case which is before cleared with the rest and is but of late time and of no moment against the resolution of the house of Commons And thus for so much as concerned the presidents of Record the first day of the conference desired by the Lords ended The next day they desired another conference which the house of Commons at which it pleased the Committee of both houses to hear M r Attorney again to make what Objection he would against other parts of the Arguments formerly delivered by the house of Commons He then Objected against the Acts of Parliament and against the reasons of Law and his Objections to these parts were answered as appears in the answers by order given into the house of Commons by the gentlemen that made them He Objected also upon the second day against that second kinde of presidents which are resolutions of Judges in former times and not of Records and brought also some other Testimonies of opinions of Judges in former times touching this point First for that resolution of all the Judges in England in 34. of Queen Eliz. mentioned and read in the Arguments made at the first conference he said That it was directly against the resolution of the House of Commons and observed the words of it to be in one place that Persons so committed by the King or the Councel may not be delivered by any of the Courts c. and in another that if the Cause were expressed either in generality or speciality it was sufficient and he said that the expressing of a cause in generality was to shew the Kings or Councels Command And to this purpose he read the whole words of that resolution of the Judges Then he Objected also that in a report of one Ruswells Case in the Kings-bench in the 13. Iac. he found that the opinion of some Judges of that Court S r. Edward Coke being then Chief Justice and one of them was that a Prisoner committed per mandatum Domini Regis or privati Consilii without cause shewed and so returned could not be bayled because it might be matter of State or Arcanum Imperii for which he stood committed And to this also he added an opinion that he found in a Journal of the House of Commons of the 13. Iac. wherein S r. Edward Coke speaking to a Bill preferred for the explanation of Magna Charta touching imprisonment said in the House That a Prisoner so committed could not be enlarged by the Law because it might be Matter of State for which he was committed And among these Objections of other nature also he spake of the confidence that was shewed in behalf of the House of Commons he said that it was not confidence could add any thing to the determination of the question but if it could that he had as much reason for the other side against the resolution of the House grounding himself upon the force of his Objections which as he conceived had so weakned the Argument of the Commons House that notwithstanding any thing yet Objected they were upon clear reason confident of the truth of their first resolution grounded upon so just
before them and mature deliberation taken by them Now plainly in that case of the 13. Iacob there is not so much as pretence of any debate at Bar or Bench. All that is reported to have been is reported as spoken upon the sudden and can any man take such a sudden opinion to be of value against solemne debates and mature deliberation since had of the point and all circumstances belonging to it which have within this half year been so fully examined and searched into that it may well be affirm'd that the learned'st man whatsoever that hath now considered of it hath within that time or might have learned more reason of satisfaction in it then ever before he met with Therefore the sudden opinions of any Judge to the contrary is of no value here Which also is to be said of that opinion obviously delivered in the Commons House 18. Iac. as M r. Attorney objected out of the Journal book of the House But besides neither was the truth of that report of that opinion in the Journal any way acknowledged For it was said in behalf of the House of Commons that their Journals were for matter of order and resolutions of the House of such Authority as that they were as their Records but for any particular Mans opinion noted in any of them it was so far from being of any Authority with them that in truth no particular opinion is at all to be entered in them and that their Clerks offend when ever they do the contrary And to conclude no such opinion whatsoever can be sufficient to weaken the clear Law comprehended in these resolutions of the House of Commons grounded upon so many Acts of Parliament so much reason of Common Law and so many Presidents of Record and the resolution of all the Judges of England and against which no Law written not one President not one reason hath been brought that makes any thing to the contrary And thus to this purpose ended the next day of the Conference desired by the Lords and had by a Committee of both Houses The Proceedings against the Earle of SUFFOLK 14. April 1628. MR. Kerton acquainted the House how that the Earle of Suffolk had said to some Gentlemen that M r. Selden had razed a Record and deserved to be hanged for going about to set division betwixt the King and his Subjects And being demanded to whom the words were spoken he was unwilling to name any till by question it was resolved he should nominate him He then named S r. Iohn Strangwaies who was unwilling to speak what he had heard from the Earle but being commanded by the House and resolved by question he confessed That upon Saturday last he being in the Committee Chamber of the Lords the Earle of Suffolk called him unto him and said Sir Iohn will you not hang Selden To whom he said for what The Earle replied By God he hath razed a Record and deserves to be hanged This the House took as a great injury done to the whole House M r. Selden being imployed by them in the conference with the Lords in the great cause concerning the Liberty of the Persons of the Subjects The House presently sent S r. Robert Philips with a message to the Lords to this effect He expressed the great care the Commons had upon all occasions to maintain all mutual respect and correspondency betwixt both Houses Then he informed them of a great injury done by the Earle of Suffolk to the whole house and to M r. Selden a particuler Member thereof who by their Command had been imployed in the late conference with their Lordships That the House was very sensible thereof and according to former Presidents made them truly acquainted with it and demaunded Justice against the Earle of Suffolk he read the words saying they were spoken to Sir Iohn Strangwayes a Member of their House After a short stay the Lords called for the Messenger to whom the Lord Keeper gave this Answer He signified the great desire and care of their Lordships to maintain and increase the correspondencies betwixt both Houses and as a Testimony thereof they had partly taken into consideration the charge That the Earle of Suffolk being a Man of great place and Honour had voluntarily protested upon his Honour and Soul that there passed no such words as those from him to Sr. Iohn Strangwayes And the Lord Keeper wished that their Lordships speedy proceedings in this business might testifie their love and good will to the Commons House The next day being the 15. of April Sr. Iohn Strangwayes made a Protestation openly in the House wherein he avowed that notwithstanding the Earls denial he did speak those words positively unto him and would maintain it any way fitting a Member of that House or a Gentleman of Honour They ordered that this Protestation should be entered into the Journal book and that a Committee should take into consideration what was fit for the House to proceed to for the justification of S r. Iohn Strangwayes and what was fitting to be done in this Case and to examine Witness of the proof of the words Upon the 17. day S r. Iohn Elliot reported what the Committee had done That they had sent for and examined Sr. Christopher Nevill who related that upon Saturday being in the Lords Committee Chamber the Earle of Suffolk said thus to him Mr. Attorney hath cleared the business and hath made the cause plain on the Kings side and further said M r. Selden hath razed a Record and hath deserved to be hanged and the Lower House should do well to joyn with the Higher in a Petition to the King to hang him and added as a reason For Mr. Selden went about and took a course to divide the King from his people or words to that effect And being asked whether he conceived that those words of dividing the King from his people had relation to the whole and general action of M r. Selden before the Lords or to the particuler of razing a Record he conceived they were referred to the general action They had examined one M r. Littleton who confessed he heard the Earle of Suffolk speak to a Gentleman whom he knew not words to this affect viz. That he would not be in M r. Seldens Coat for 10000 l. and that M r. Selden deserved to be hanged The second part of this Report concerned the particuler of S r. Iohn Strangwayes wherein though the Committee found no Witness to prove the words spoken to S r. Iohn Srangwayes yet there were many circumstances which perswaded them of the truth thereof 1. That the same words in the same syllables were spoken to Sr. Christopher Nevill and that the Earle as he called to him S r. Iohn Strangwayes so he called to him Sr. Christopher Nevill 2. That the Earle of Suffolk called S r. Iohn Strangwayes to him and spake to him was proved by S r. George Fane and S r. Alexander S r. Iohn
till his pleasure be first known Thus did the Lord Chief Justice Coke in Raynards Case They say this would have been done if the King had not written but why then was the Letter read and published and kept and why was the Town Clark sent carefully to enquire because the Letter so directed whether these men offered for bayl were subsedy men the Letter sheweth also that Beckwith was committed for suspition of being acquainted with the Gun-Pouder-Treason but no proof being produced the King left him to be bayled The Earle of WARVVICKS speech 21. April 1628. MY Lords I will observe something out of the Law wherein this liberty of the Subjects Person is founded and some things out of Presidents which have been alleadged For the Law of Magna Charta and the rest concerning these points they are acknowledged by all to be of force and that they were to secure the Subjects from wrongfnll imprisonment as well or rather more concerning the King then the Subject why then besides the grand Charter and those 6. other Acts of Parliament in the very point we know that Magna Charta hath been at least 30. times confirmed so that upon the matter we have 6. or 7. and thereby Acts of Parliament to confirm this liberty although it was made a matter of derision the other day in this House One is that of 36. E. 3. No. 9. and another in the same year No. 20. not printed but yet as good as those that are and that of 42. E. 3. cap. 3. so express in the point especially the Petition of the Commons that year which was read by M r. Littleton with the Kings answer so full and free from all exception to which I refer your Lordships that I know not have any thing in the World can be more plain and therefore if in Parliament ye should make any doubt of that which is so fully confirmed in Parliament and in case so clear go about by new glosses to alter the old and good Law we shall not onely forsake the steps of our Ancestors who in Cases of small importance would answer nolumus mutare leges Angliae but we shall yield up and betray our right in the greatest inheritance the Subjects of England hath and that is the Laws of England and truely I wonder how any man can admit of such a gloss upon the plain Text as should overthrow the force of the Law for whereas the Law of Magna Charta is that no Free-man shall be imprisoned but by lawfull judgement of his Peers or the Law of the Land the King hath power to commit without Cause which is a sence not onely expresly contrary to other Acts of Parliament and those especially formerly cited but against Common sence For Mr. Attorney confesseth this Law concerns the King why then where the Law saith the King shall not commit but by the Law of the Land the meaning must be as M r. Attorney would have it that the King must not commit but at his own pleasure and shall we think that our Ancestors were so foolish to hazard their Persons Estates and labour so much to get a Law and to have it 30. times confirmed that the King might not commit his Subjects but at his own pleasure and if he did commit any of his Subjects without a Cause shewen then he must lie during pleasure then which nothing can be imagined more ridiculous and contrary to true reason For the Presidents I observe that there hath been many shewen by which it appears to me evidently that such as have been committed by the Kings Councel they have been delivered upon Habeas Corpus and that constantly It is true that some Presidents were brought on the Kings part that when some of these persons desired to be delivered by Habeas Corpus the King or his Councel signified his Majesties pleasure that they should be delivered or the Kings Attorney hath come into the Court and related the Kings Command but this seems to make for the Subject For that being in his Majesties power to deliver them who by his special Command were imprisoned May not we well think that his Majesty would rather at that time have stayed their deliverance by Law then furthered it with his Letters and made the Prisoners rather beholding to him for his grace and mercy then to the Judges for Justice had not his Majesty known that at that time they ought to have been delivered by Law I think no man would imagine a wise King would have suffered his Grace and Prerogative if any such Prerogative were to be so continually questioned and his Majesty and his Councel so far from commanding the Judges not to proceed to deliver the Prisoner by them committed without Cause shewn as that on the other side which is all the force of these Presidents the King and the Councel signified to the Judges that they should proceed to deliver the parties certainly if the King had challenged any such Prerogative that a Person committed without any cause shewn ought not to be delivered by the Judges without his consent it would have appeared by one President or other amonst all that have been produced that his Majesty would have made some claim to such a Prerogative But it appears to the contrary that in many of these cases the King or his Councel did never interpose and where they did it was alwayes in affirmation and incouragement to that Court to proceed And besides the writing of Letters from his Majesty to the Judges to do Justice to his Majesties Subjects may with as good reason be interpreted that without those Letters they might not do Justice also the King signified his willingness that such such Persons which were committed by him should be delivered therefore they could not be delivered without it which is a strange reason So that findeing the Laws so full so many and so plain in the point and findeing that when ever any were committed without cause shewn brought their Habeas Corpus they were delivered and no Command ever given to the contrary or claim made on the Kings part to any such Prerogative I may safely conclude as the House of Commons have done and if any one President or two of late can be shewn that the Judges have not delivered the Prisoners so committed I think it is their fault and to be enquired of but contrary it seems to me to be an undoubted Liberty of the Subject that if he be committed without cause or without cause shewn yet he may have some speedy course to bring himself to Trial either to justifie his own innocencie or to receive punishment according to his fault for God forbid that an innocent man by the Laws of England should be put in worse case then the most grievous Malefactors are which must needs be if this should be that if a cause be shewed he may have his Trial but if none he must lie and pine in Prison during pleasure
that the Prisoner must sustain all without satisfaction or knowing the cause The onely reason given by those of the other opinion That it is requisite the King and Councel should have power to command the detainer of a man in Prison for sometime without expressing the cause is because it is supposed that the manifestation of the cause at first may prevent the discovery of a Treason The reason is answered by the remedy proposed by this Act it being proposed that it shall be provided by this Bill that upon our commitment we may have instantly recourse to the Chancery for an Habeas Corpus retornable in that Court which is alwayes open that partly upon the receipt thereof the Writ must be returned and the cause thereupon expressed If then this remedy be really the cause of commitment must partly appear which contradicts the former reason of State And in my own opinion we ought not onely to take care that the Subject should be delivered out of Prison but to prevent his imprisonment The Statute of Magna Charta and the rest of the Acts providing that no man should be imprisoned but by the Law of the Land And although the King or Councel as it hath been objected by might may commit us without cause notwithstanding any Laws we can make Yet I am sure without such an Act of Parliament such commitment can have no Legal colour and I would be loath we should make a Law to endanger our selves for which reasons I conceive that there being so many wayes to evade from this Act we shall be in worse case by it then without it providing no remedy to prevent our imprisonment without expressing the cause to be Lawfull and administers excuses for continuing us in Prison as I have before declared and thus for providing for one particuler out of reason of State which possibly may fall out in an age or two we shall spring a leak which may sinck all our Liberties and open a gap through which Magna Charta and the rest of the Statutes may issue out and vanish I therefore conclude that in my poor understanding which I submit to better Judgements I had rather depend upon our former resolutions and the Kings gracious Declarations then to pass an Act in such manner as hath been proposed The Speakers speech to his MAJESTY in the Bancketting-House 5. May 1628. Most gracious and dread Soveraign YOur Loyal and dutifull Subjects the Commons assembled in Parliament by several Messages from your Majesty especially by that your must Royal Declaration delivered by the Lord Keeper before both Houses have to their exceeding joy and comfort received many ample expressions of your Princely care and tender affection towards them with a gracious promise and assurance that your Majesty will govern according to the Laws and Statutes of this Realm and so maintain all your Subjects in the just freedom of their Persons and safety of their Estates that all their Rights and Liberties may be by them enjoyed with as much freedom and security in your time as in any age heretofore by their Ancestors under the best of your Royal Progenitors For this so great and gracious a favour enlarged by a continual intimation of your Majesties confidence in the proceeding of this House they do by me their Speaker make a full return of most humble thanks to your Majesty withall dutifull acknowledgement of your grace and goodness herein extended to them And whereas in one of these Messages delivered from your Majesty there was an expression of your desire to know whether this House would rest upon your Royal word and promise assuring them if they would it should be Royally and really performed As they again present their humble thanks for this seconding and strengthning of your former Royal expressions so in all humbleness they assure your Majesty that their greatest confidence is and ever must be in your gracious favour and goodness without which they well know nothing they can frame or desire will be of safety and value to them and therefore are all humble Suitors to your Majesty that your Royal heart would graciously accept and believe the truth of theirs which they humbly present and full of truth and confidence in your Royal word and promise as ever House of Commons reposed in any of their best Kings True it is they cannot but remember the publick trust for which they are accomptable to present and future times and their desires are that your Majesties goodness in fruit and memory be the blessing and joy of posterity They finde also that of late there hath been publick violation of your Laws and the Subjects Liberties by some of your Majesties Ministers and thence conceive that no less then a publick remedy will raise the dejected hearts of your loving Subjects to a cheerfull supply of your Majesty or make them receive content in the proceeding of this House From these considerations they must humbly beg your Majesties leave to lay hold of that gracious offer of yours which gave them assurance that if they thought fit to secure themselves in their Rights and Liberties by way of Bill or otherwise so it might be provided for with due respect to his Honour and publick good he would graciously be pleased to give way unto it Far from their intentions it is to incroach upon your Soveraignty or Prerogative nor have they the least thought of straining or inlarging the former Laws in any sort by any new interpretations or additions The bounds of their desire extend no further then to some necessary explanation of what is truely comprehended within the just sence and meaning of those Laws with some moderate provision for execution and performance as in times past upon like occasions have been used The way how to accomplish these their humble desires is now in serious consideration with them wherein they humbly assure your Majesty they will neither loose time nor seek any thing of you Majesty but what they hope may be fit for dutifull and Loyal Subjects to ask and for a gracious and a good King to grant The KINGS Answer to the House of Commons delivered by the Lord Keeper 5. May 1628. MR. Speaker and the Gentlemen of the House of Commons his Majesty hath commanded me to tell you that he expected an answer by your actions and not delay by discourse You acknowledge his trust and confidence in your proceedings but his Majesty sees not how ye requite him by your confidence of his word and actions for what need explanations if you doubt not performance of the true meaning for the explanation will hazard an incroachment upon his Prerogative and it may well be said what needs a new Law upon any old if you repose confidence in the Declaration his Majesty lately made by me to both Houses and your selves acknowledge that the greatest trust and confidence must be in his Majesties grace and goodness without which nothing that you can frame will be of
and free Customes of the Realm from your Majestie or your privy Councel And where also by the Statute called the great Charter of the Liberties of England It is declared and enacted That no Freeman may be taken nor imprisoned nor be disseised of his Freehold nor Liberties nor his free Customes nor be outlawed or exiled or in any manner destroyed but by the Lawfull judgement of his Peers or by the Law of the Land And in the 28. year of the Raign of King Edw. 3. it was declared and enacted by Authority of Parliament that no man of what Estate or condition he be shall put out of his Land or Tenement nor taken nor imprisoned nor disinherited nor put to death without being brought to answer by due process of Law Nevertheless against the Tenour of the said Statutes and other the good Laws and Statutes of your Realm to that end provided divers of your Subjects have of late been imprisoned without any cause shewed and when for their deliverance they were brought before your Justices by your Majesties Writ of Habeas Corpus there to undergo and receive as the Court should order and the Keepers commanded to certefie the causes of their detainer no cause was certified but that they were detained by your Majesties special command signified by the Lords of your privy Councel and yet were returned back to several Prisons without being charged with any thing the which they might make answer to and to Law And whereas of late great Companies of Souldiers and Marriners have been dispersed into divers Countreys of the Realm and the Inhabitants against their wills have been compelled to receive them into their houses and there to suffer them to sojourn against the Laws and Customes of this Realm and to the great grievance and vexation of the people And whereas also by Authority of Parliament in the 25. E. 3. it is declared and enacted that no man shall be fore-judged of Life or Limb against the form of the great Charter and the Law of the Land and by the said great Charter and other the Laws and Statutes of this your Realm no man ought to be adjudged to death but by the Laws established in this your Realm Nevertheless of late times divers Commissions under your Majesties great Seal have issued forth by which certain Persons have been assigned and appointed Commissioners with power and Authority to proceed within the Land according to the Justice of Martial Law against such Souldiers or Marriners or other dissolute Persons joyning with them as should commit any Murther Robbery Fellony Mutiny or other outrage or misdemeanour whatsoever and by such summary course and order as is agreeable to Martial Law and is used in Armies in time of War to proceed to the trial and condemnation of such offenders and them to cause to be executed and put to death according to the Law Martial By pretext whereof some of your Majesties Subjects have been by some of the said Commissioners put to death when and where if by the Laws and Statutes of the Land they had deserved death by the same Laws and Statutes also they might and by none other ought to have been adjudged and executed And also sundry grievous offenders by colour thereof claiming and exemption have escaped the punishment due to them by the Laws and Statutes of this your Realm By reason whereof divers of your Officers and Ministers of Justice have unjustly refused or forbore to proceed against such offenders according to the same Laws and Statutes upon pretence that the said offenders were punishable onely by Martial Law and by Authority of such Commissions as aforesaid which Commissions and all other of like nature are directly contrary to the said Laws and Statutes of this your Realm They do therefore humbly pray your most Excellent Majesty that no man hereafter be compelled to make or yield any Guift Loan Benevolence Tax or such like charge without common consent by Act of Parliament And that none be called to make answer or to take such an Oath or to give attendance or to be confined or otherwise molested or disquieted concerning the same or for refusal thereof And that no Freeman may man such manner as is before mentioned be imprisoned or detained And that your Majesty would be pleased to remove the said Souldiers and Marriners and that your people may not be so burthened in time to come And that the aforesaid Commissions for proceeding by Martial Law may be revoked annulled and that hereafter no Commissions of like nature may issue forth to any Person or Persons whatsoever to be executed as aforesaid least by colour of them any your Majesties Subjects be destroyed and put to death contrarie to the Laws and Franchises of the Land All which they most humbly pray of your most Excellent Majestie as their Rights and Liberties according to the Laws and Statutes of this Realm And that your Majestie would also vouchsafe to declare that the Awards doings and proceedings to the prejudice of your people in any the premises shall not be drawn hereafter into consequence or example And that your Majestie would be pleased gratiously for the further comfort and safety of your people to declare your Royal will and pleasure that in the things aforesaid all your Officers and Ministers shall serve you according to the Laws and Statutes of this Realm as they tender the Honour of your Majestie and the prosperity of this Kingdom S r. BENJAMIN RUDDIERDS Speech Mr. Pym I Did not think to have spoken again to this Bill because I was willing to believe that the forwardness of this Committee would have prevented me but now I hold my self bound to speak and to speak in earnest In the first year of the King and the second convention I first moved for the increase and inlarging of poor Ministers liings I shewed how necessarie it was that it had been neglected this was also commended to the House by his Majestie there were as now many accusations on foot against scandalous Ministers I was bolde to tell the House that there were scandalous livings which were much the cause of the other livings of 5. Marks of 5. l. a year that men of worth and of parts would not be musled up to such pittances that there were some places in England which were scarce in Christendom where God was little better known then amongst the Indians I exampled it in the utmost skirts of the North where the prayers of the common people are more like Spells and Charms then devotions the same blindeness and ignorance is in divers parts of Wales which many of that Countrey doth both know and lament I declared also that to plant good Ministers was the strongest and surest means to establish true Religion that it would prevail more against Papistry then the making of new Laws or executing of old that it would counterwork Court Conivence and Luke-warm accommodation that though the calling of Ministers be never
shall or will at any time hereafter commit or command to Prison or otherwise restrain the Person of any for not lending money unto us or for any other cause which in our conscience doth not concern the State the publick good and safety of us and of our people we will not be drawn to pretend any cause which in our Judgements is not or is not expressed which base thought we hope no man will imagine can fall into our royal breast that in all cases of this nature which shall hereafter happen we shall upon the humble Petition of the party or access of our Judges to us readily and really express the cause of their commitment or restraint so soon as with conveniency and safety the same is fit to be disclosed and expressed That in all causes Criminal of ordinary Jurisdiction our Judges shall proceed to the deliverance and baylment of the Prisoner according to the known and ordinary rules of the Laws of this Land and according to the Statutes of Magna Charta and those other six Statutes insisted upon which we do take knowledge stand in force and which we intend not to abrogate against the true intention thereof Thus we have thought fit to signifie unto you the rather for shortning any long delayes of this question the season of the year so far advance and our great occasions of State not lending us many dayes for long continuance of this Session of Parliament Given under our Signet at our Pallace of Westminster the 12. of May in the fourth year of our Raign The KINGS Message by the Lord Keeper 21. May 1628. HIs Majestie commanded me to signifie to your Lordships that the business concerning your part presented by the Commons to the Lords concerning the Liberty of the Subject wholly depends upon your Lordships and because his affairs are pressing and that he is very suddenly to take a Journey to Portsmouth As also because his Majesty would have the business put in a good forwardness before his going thither his Majestie desires your Lordships this day to proceed to a resolution whether you will joyn with the House of Commons in the Petition or not M r. MASONS speech concerning the Addition propounded by the Lords to be added to the Petition of Right IN our Petition of Right to the Kings Majestie we mentioned the Laws and Statutes by which it appeared that no Tax Loan or the like ought to be levied by the King but by common assent in Parliament That no Freeman ought to be imprisoned but by the Law of the Land That no Freeman ought to be compelled to suffer Souldiers in his house In the Petition we have expressed the breach of these Laws and desire that we may not suffer the like all which we pray as our Rights and Liberties The Lords have proposed an addition to this Petition in these words We humbly present this Petition to your Majestie not onely with a care of our own Liberties but with a due regard to leave intyre that Soveraign power wherewith your Majesty is intrusted for the protection safety and happiness of your people and whether we shall consent unto this addition is the Subject of this dayes discourse And because my Lord Keeper at the last conference declared their Lordships had taken the words of the Petition apart The word leave in a Petition is of the same nature as saving in a grant or Act of Parliament when a Man grants but part of a thing he saves the rest when he Petitions to be restored but to part he leaveth the rest then in the end of our Petition the word leave will imply that something is to be left of that or at least with a Reverence to what we desire The word entyre is very considerable a Conquerour is bound by no Law but hath power dare leges his will is a Law and although William the Conquerour at first to make his way to the Crown of England the more easie and the possession of it the more sure claiming it by little but afterwards when there were no powerfull pretenders to the Crown The little of Conquest to introduce that absolute power of a Conquerour was claimed and that Statute of Magna Charta and other Statutes mentioned in our Petition do principally limmit that power I hope it is as Lawfull for me to cite a Jesuite as it is for Dr. Manwaring to falsifie him Suares in his first book de legibus cap. 17. delivered his opinion in these words amplitudo restrictio potestatis Regum circa ea quae per se mala vel injusta non sunt pendet ex arbitrio hominum ex ambigua convencione vel pacto inter Reges Regnum And the further expresseth his opinion that the King of Spain was so absolute a Monarch that he might Lawfully impose tribute without consent of his people untill about 200. years since when it was concluded between him and his people that without consent of his people by proxies he should not impose any Tribute And Suares opinion is that by that agreement the Kings of Spain are bound to impose no Tribute without consent And this agreement that Author calls a restraining of that Soveraign power the Statutes then mentioned in our Petition restraining that absolute power of a Conquerour if we recite those Statutes and say we have the Soveraign power intire we do not take away that restraint which is the virtue and strength of those Statutes and set at Liberty the claim of the Soveraign power of a Conquerour which is to be limitted and restrained by no Laws this may be the danger of the word entyre The next words delivered by the Lords as observable is the particle that because it was said that all Soveraign power is not mentioned to be left but onely that with which the King is trusted for our protection safety and happiness But I conceive this to be an exception of all Soveraign power for all Soveraign power in a King is for the protection safety and happiness of his people If all Soveraign power be excepted you may easily Judge the consequence all Loans and Taxes being imposed by colour of that Soveraign power The next word is trusted which is very ambiguous whether it be meant trusted by God onely as a Conquerour or by the people also as King which are to Govern also according to Laws ex pacto In this point I will not presume to adventure further onely I like it not by reason of the doubtfull exposition it admits I have likewise considered the proposition it self and therein I have fallen upon the dilemma that this addition shall be construed either to refer unto the Petition or not If it doth refer unto the Petition it is meerly useless and unnecessary and unbefitting the Judgement of this grave and great Assembly to add to a Petition of this weight If it hath reference unto it then it destroys not onely the virtue and strength of our
That Mr. Attorney having made a rough Draught being often urged to expedition by the Bishop of Winchester he sent the same to the Bishop who inter-lined and corrected the same adding the names of Cosens Manwering and Sibthorp to the pardon That Mr. Attorney may be asked whether any of these Lords were made acquainted with the affidavit about Cosens A Messenger is sent to the Lord Keeper to know the reason wherefore he made stop of the Great Seal and by what solicitations he was prest thereunto Thursday 5. A Petition in complaint of an imposition upon Mault by the Citie of London was this day preferred to the House which is prefered to the Committee for Grievances Some differences being observed in the Articles as in the twentieth Article c. a Committee is to Compare the old and new Articles with the Records at Lambeth and consider how all those differences come in Mr. Long COmplaineth that a Prosecution hath been against him in the Star-chamber for sitting in this House the last Session he being High Sheriff of Wiltshire and chosen Burgess of Bath in Somersetshire The Preachers are to be chosen to morrow at the Committee for Religion Mr. Ogle IS called who averreth his Petition and will prove the same by witnesses It is Ordered that Cosens shall have intimation to attend to answer here if he will on Munday come fortnight to be sent for by a Serjeant at Arms and if he be not of the Convocation but if he be then to have notice by the Speakers letters and if thereupon he appear not then to proceed with him as is usuall in like Cases If Witnesses be sent for to this House in any Publick business they are to pay their own Charges Secretarie Gook SAith He hath very now received from a Noble person this Message from his Majestie That he hath appointed the eighteenth of this Moneth for the Fast for this place and the twentieth of the next Moneth for the whole kingdom Sir Robert Phillips MOveth in the behalf of the Lord Peircie that having a Cause in dispute in the Lords House and three Members of this House being of his Counsel desires they may have leave to plead his Cause Which being conceived to be a Cause that is not to receive any Judgement here it is granted Friday A Petition exhibited against one Wittington a Papist in Northumberland Ordered to be sent for by a Serjeant at Arms. Mr. Harris of St. Margarets Westminster Mr. Harris of Hanwell in Oxfordshire Mr. William Fitz-Ieofferies of Cornwall are chosen for three Preachers for the day of the Fast and for the precedence is referred to the Preachers themselves Mr. Shervill REported one Parson Scall procured the Pardon for Mountague one Bartholomew Baldwin solicited the Pardon for Manwering There is also another Pardon found to be granted to Manwering pardoning the Judgement late he had given by the High Court of Parliament and all sums due to the King thereby Sir Nathaniel Ritch THat we may do somewhat which may give content to those who sent us hither and make expedition to the business of his Majestie and the Common-wealth That therefore the business of Mr. Mountague may be expedited to the Lords that they may enter into these things as well as we The Councel of Mr. Iones the Printer are to be heard upon Munday next Sir O. Roberts REporteth from the Committee sent to Mr. Attorney that Mr. Attorney staid for the Affidavits taken by Sir Euball Thelwall That one Heath a Gentleman of Grays-Inne told Mr. Attorney that Cosens should say that the King was not supream of the Church and that he had no more to do with Religion than he that rubs his horse heels Mr. Attorney acquainted the King whereupon the King charged him to make a strict Inquisition herein but the King would not believe the same to be true Mr. Attorney sent for his Kinsman again and being examined he said so as affidavits were made thereon There was further certificate from the Dean and others at Durham so that the business was much lessened thereby but Mr. Attorney pressing the business further casually met with the Bishop of Winchester who said to Mr. Attorney that this business will come to nothing and King that made the affidavit was but a vain fellow The Affidavit of Thomas King was read which verifieth the same Mr. Selden made the rest of this Report and delivered the Warrant by which Mr. Attorney drew the Pardons for the Bishop of Winchester The effect was that what Mr. Mountague had done or writ was not out of any ill meaning such a Pardon should be drawn as Mr. Mountagues Councel should direct This Warrant was under the Lord Dorchester being the Lord Carleton Mr. Selden delivereth likewise the Copie of the Pardon interlined and razed by the Lord Bishop of Winchester Sir Iohn Elliot HEre is high Treason upon oath a Deposition upon oath an opposition is not in Law to be admitted for here is not onely an Admission but an Invitation of Certificates for defence and allowed to sway the case of so high a nature that therefore the parties that made the Affidavits and Mr. Attorney may be examined to make a better disquisition in this for I fear the intimation of the Bishop of Winchester swayed too far with Mr. Attorney Be matter true or false the neglect of the dutie of the Attorney is not to be excused I am much grieved to see his Majesties mercie run so readily to these kind of persons and his justice so readily upon others trifling occasions nay upon no occasions nay upon no occasion onely the misinformation of some Minister Mr. Attorney being by Writ to attend the Lords House cannot be injoyned to attend this House or to appear upon Warrant wherefore Mr. Littleton and Mr. Selden being of the same Inne of Court have undertaken to give notice to Mr. Attorney that there being as accusation here against him he may here answer and satisfie the House on Munday next Saturday A Bill against Spirituall Symonie and a Bill against buying or selling of places of Judicature Mr. Kirton moved That a time may be appointed to take into consideration the business of Tonnage and Poundage Sir Walter Earl secondeth his motion that all the world may know that we will give to God that which is Gods and to Cesar that which is Cesars and to our Countrey that which is theirs Sir Walter moveth That the Merchants may have their goods and that his Majestie may be moved therein It is Ordered That the House on Tuesday next in a Committee shall take into consideration the business of Tonnage Poundage and all things incident thereto Mr. Shervill is nominated to take the Chair of the Committee Sir Rober Phillips REported from the Committee for Course of Justice A Petition of Complaints was exhibited by Mr. Noell a Member of this House against Sir Ed. Moseley Attorney of the Dutchie Court and his man in point of injustice That
I conceive it plain these Customers took the goods in their own right not in the Kings In this Priviledge is plainly broken wherein it is easily determined Mr. Banks In this case there is no interposing of the Kings Right and the King this Parliament hath declared as much That the Courts at Westminster do grant 12 days priviledge to any man to inform his Councel much more the Court of Parliament are to have their Priviledge The Kings Command cannot extend to authorize any man to break the Priviledges no more than it will warrant an entrie upon any mans Land without process of Law Mr. Soliciter If the King have no Right how can he make a Lease then this pretended interest of the Customers must needs be void and therefore the goods must not be taken on their own right but in the right of the King Mr. Selden If there were any right the pretended right were in the Subject First whether Priviledge in goods Secondly whether the right were in the Customers onely Thirdly whether priviledge against the King 1. If the Lords have no priviledge in Parliaments for their goods then have they no priviledge at all for they are priviledged in their persons out of Parliament 2. For the point of interest it is plain no kind of Covenant can alter the interest and questionless had the cause in the Exchequer appeared to the Barons as it doth to us they would never have proceeded as they did 3. If our goods may be seized into the Exchequer be it right or wrong we were then as good have nothing Sir Nath. Ritch 〈…〉 recorded the last Session and citeth other presidents in this House that a servant of a Member in Parliament ought to have priviledge in his goods Mr. Noy saith that these Commissioners had neither Commission nor Command to seize Therefore without doubt we may proceed safely to the other question That the priviledge is broken by the Customers without relation to any Commission or Command of the King Secretarie Cook saith It is in the Commission to seize but the Commission being read it is not found to be there Chancellor of the Dutchie saith Mr. Dawes mentioned that he seized these goods by virtue of a Commission and other Warrants remaining in the hands of Sir Iohn Elliot that therefore these Warrants may be seen whether there be no command to seize these goods Sir Nathaniel Ritch This days debate much joyeth me specially the motion made by Mr. Noy whereby it is plain we have a way open to go to this question without relation to the Kings Commission or Command and desire it in respect there appears nothing before us to incumber the question Chancellor of the Dutchie desires again these Warrants may be look into before we go to the question Mr. Kirton In respect this Honorable Gentleman presseth this so far that it may appear with what judgement this House hath proceeded Mr. Glanveil I consent these Warrants be sent for and read but withall if any thing arise that may produce any thing of ill consequence let it be considered from whence it doth come The Privie Councellers are contented with this Motion The Warrants being sent for and read it is plain there is no Warrant to seize Mr. Kirton If now there be any thing of doubt I desire those Honorable persons may make their objections Chancellor of the Dutchie I rejoyce when I can go to the Court able to justifie your proceedings I confess I see nothing now but that we may safely proceed to the Question Mr. Secretarie Cook saith as much Mr. Hackwell argueth against Priviledge in time of Prorogation Mr. Noy saith he had no doubt but that Priviledge was in force in time of Prorogation untill he heard this Argument of Prorogation of Mr. Hackwell and saith that he hath nothing from him yet that doth alter his opinion and citeth a cause wherein the Lords House hath this verie Prorogation adjudged the Priviledge Mr. Hackwell saith he is glad to hear it is so and he is now of the same opinion Decided by Question That Mr. Rolles ought to have Priviledge of Parliament for his goods seised 30 Octob. 5 Iac. and all sithence This Committee is adjourned untill Munday and the Customers to attend The Protestation of the COMMONS in Parliament on Munday 2. Mar. 1628. 1. WHosoever shall bring in an Innovation in Religion or by favour or countenance seek to extend or introduce Poperie or Arminianisme or other Opinion differing from the true and orthodox profession of our Church shall be reputed a Capital enemie to this Kingdom and Common-wealth 2. Whosoever shall counsel or advise the taking or leavying of the Subsedies of Tonage and Poundage not being granted by Parliament or shall be an Actor or an Instrument therein shall likewise be reputed an Innovator in the Government and a Capital enemie to the Kingdom and Common-wealth 3. If any Merchant or other person whatsoever shall voluntarily yield or pay the said Subsedie of Tonnage or Poundage not being granted by Parliament he shall likewise be reputed a Betrayer of the Liberties of England and an enemie to the same THE KINGS SPEECH in the House of PARLIAMENT Mar. 10. 1628. to Dissolve it My LORDS I Never came here upon so unpleasing occasion it being for the Dissolving of a PARLIAMENT therefore many may wonder why I did not rather choose to do this by my Commission it being the general Maxim of Kings to lay harsh commands by their Ministers themselves onely executing pleasing things But considering that Justice is as well in Commanding of Virtue as Punishing of Vice I thought it necessarie to come here to day to declare to you my Lords and all the world That it was onely the disobedient carriage of the Lower House that hath caused this Dissolution at this time and that you My Lords are so far from being causers of it that I have as much comfort in your Obedience manifested by all your carriage towards me as I have cause to distaste their proceedings Yet that I may be clearly understood I must needs say they do mistake me wondrously that think I lay this fault equally on all the Lower House for I know there are many there as dutifull Loyal Subjects as any are in the world I know that it was onely some Viâ—pers among them that did cast this mist of disobedience before their eyes although there were some there that could not be infected with this Contagion insomuch that some by their speaking which indeed was the general fault on the last day of the House did shew their obedience To conclude my Lords as those ill-affected persons must look for their reward so you that are here of the Higher House may justly claim from me that protection and favour that a good King bears to his Loyal and Faithfull Subjects and Nobilitie Now my Lords execute that which I Command you Lord KEEPER MY Lords and Gentlemen of the House of Commons the KINGS Majestie