of the East Church haue been and are stil at vtter defyance with the Pope of Rome You see therefore by plaine demonstration that this reason holdeth no further then Augustines authoritie extendeth who in other places appealeth onely to the Scriptures and euen against the Manichees confesseth that the playne demonstration of the trueth which is to be founde in the holye Scriptures is to be preferred before the consent of nations authoritie of miracles succession of Bishops vniuersalitie consent name of the Catholike Church and whatsoeuer can be taught beside Contra Epist. Manich. quam vocant fundamenti Cap. 4. The thirde reason why the Church must alwayes be a known multitude is for keeping out of wolues and heretikes which must be y t they which are tryed may be made manifest which cannot bee in a secrete congregation Yes M. Stapleton very well The Church was neuer so secrete but it was knowne to the members of it which might vse the authoritie thereof for trying auoyding and excommunicating of heretikes according to the holye scriptures But euermore you do wilfully deceiue your selfe when you affirme that there was no Christians knowen in the worlde by the space of 900. yeares but Papistes You cannot denye but Brytannie Scotlande Irelande had Christians at and since the comming of Augustine which were no Papistes as by the history of Beda is manifest What should I here name so many nations of Europe Asia and Africa which yet to this day continue in profession of Christianitie neuer were subiect to the tyrannye of the Romishe byshop and from whome the Romish byshop with his sect of Papistes hath clearely departed many hundreth yeares agoe Wherefore according to Augustines sentence the Catholike church is not a particuler sect in Europe but an vniuersall gathering of y e dispersed ouer all the world where God hath his elect in all places Or if you vnderstande the Church for a visible multitude professing Christ there is no reason why the churches of the East so many so large so ancient should be excluded and the multitude of Papists holding of one citie in Italy only to be receiued CAP. XV. A number of shamelesse shiftes and seely surmises which Protestants haue inuented to establish their variable doctrine and to confounde the authoritie of the Church In deede a number of these which he rehearseth as shamelesse shiftes are shamelesse lies and impudent slaunders deuised by the diuell to bring the trueth in disdaine but yet so openly proued to be false that they neede no confutation First he sayeth that Luther condemned all councels and fathers yea al learning of Philosophy and humanitie so that bookes were burned and common schooles ceased for certein yeares in Germany with other like monstrous lyes alledging for his author that beastly Apostata Staphylus This slaunder deserueth no aunswere being raysed by one shamelesse lyer against an hundreth thousand witnesses The seconde shift is that Luther did afterwarde receiue Philosophy and bookes of humanitie yea diuines of 500. or 600. yeares and some Councels also with this perilous condition so farre as they repugned not to holy Scripture This seemeth an vnreasonable condition to Stapleton who belike would haue all gentylitie and many heresies absolutely receyed The thirde The fathers should not be admitted when they taught any thing beside the expresse scripture As worshipping of Images praying to Saints c. which they had by tradition If such things came from the Apostles why were they not written by them as well as such fathers of later time yea why did the Apostles write that which is contrary to such traditions The fourth The first 600. yeares they did admit because they knewe there was litle in them against them cleare open because fewe bookes were writen in that time and many lost that were written And yet there remaine more writen in that time then a man can well reade ouer in seuen yeares Agayne cities being stuffed with heathen Iewes and heretikes euery mystery was not opened in pulpit nor committed to writing These belike were greater mysteries then the Apostles and Euangelistes haue committed to writing But I marueile howe they were taught if neither in pulpit nor in writing belike in secrete confession but our Sauiour Christe woulde haue his mysteries preached in the house toppes Last of all for that many controuersies nowe in hand were neuer heard of in those dayes Therefore M. Iewell made his challenge of the first 600. yeres which Stapleton thinketh he was not able to abyde by and that M. Nowel suspected no lesse because he accounted it a very large scope But howe he hath abyden by it is sufficiently proued to the glory of the trueth and the confusion of Papistrie The fifth They reiect the latter 900. yeares because Paynims yelding to the faith and heretikes to the Church the mysteries of our faith were more openly published in Pulpits writings It appeareth and that in recordes of the latter 900. yeares that many old heretiks still remained in the cities beside the Iewes remaining vntil this day of which he made the fathers of the first 600 years so much afraide for vttering the mysteries a◠of Paynims and heretikes The sixt Some holde that all the Church might erre for a time None euer helde that all the Church might erre so farre as that they fell away from Christ. The seuenth Other said there was a Church all this 900 yeares but oppressed by the miscreants being priuie and vnknowen This he sayth is vaine blasphemous being against holy Scripture and good reason as he hath proued What he hath proued you haue seene and howe the Scripture must be fulfilled which prophecyeth of the comming of Antichrist and the apostasie of men from the faith which cannot be if the Church should alwayes florish in multitude externall appearing of visible glory The eyght That Protestants bookes haue beene lost The ninth Bookes of holy fathers haue beene corrupted The tenth False writings haue beene deuised and fathered vpon the first Popes of Rome All these he compteth to be but suspitions surmises which are yet so manifest truthes that euen Thomas the vnbeleeuing Apostle without the iudgement of his senses might feale them with both his hands and be satisfyed although Thomas the Apostata from God and traytour to his Prince countrey will neither see nor handle them But all these surmises he will ouerthrow with supposing one case If a man haue continued in possession and coulde bring recordes of his right from William the Conquerour and all his neighbours to say for his quiet possession without checke or nay as the Papistes can deduct the possession of their religiō from 800. yeares c. were it a good plee against such a man to say his recordes are false his euidences forged his possession iniurious c. without bringing in any affirmatiue proofes recordes euidence or witnesse c. I answere it were no good plee But firste I
from the Gospell and doctrin of saluation in setting vp a newe sacrifice in seeking iustification by workes in ouerthrowing the true and spiritual worship of God As for the two Iudges the worde and the spirite he denyeth them finding manye defectes in the worde As that it is sencelesse dombe deafe not able to prooue it selfe to be the worde of God hauing no more power to be Iudge and decide controuersies then the booke of statutes to put on my lorde chiefe Iustices robes and to come to the Kings bench and giue sentence I thinke there is no Christian man but abhorreth to reade these blasphemies But let vs see whether the booke of statutes although it put on no robes is not iudge even ouer my lorde chiefe Iustice him selfe who is a minister seruing to pronounce the lawe not a King to alter the lawe for he him selfe must be obedient to the lawe Nowe in all controuersies that be de iure either the lawe is plaine to be vnderstoode or it is obscure If it be plane as that a felone must be hanged or the sonne must inherite his father c. the Iudge pronouncing the lawe with authoritie and execution following his sentence brydleth the obstinate person that will not obey the lawe which he knoweth as well as the Iudge If the lawe be hard to be vnderstoode the Iudge must seeke the interpretation thereof according to the minde of the law-maker and not according to the his owne fantasie So that in all cases the Iudge hath no authoritie ouer the lawe but vnder the lawe so that if the giue wrong sentence both he and his sentence are to bee iudged by lawe Or else why doe you Martiall in your ciuill lawe courtes so often crye out sit liber iudex let the booke be Iudge If you will not allow the booke of Gods law to be Iudge euen ouer them which haue authoritie as Iustices haue in the common lawe to pronounce it and to declare it The Spirite he refuseth to be Iudge because it is inuisible secreate vnknowen vnable to be gone to but in the Church therefore the Church is the Iudge and neyther the worde nor the Spirite But the Spirite by his owne substance incomprehensible is by his effects in the holy Scriptures visible reuealed knowen and able to be gone vnto therefore a sufficient Iudge taking witnesse of the Scriptures and bearing witnesse vnto them For that maiestie of trueth that power of working that vniforme consent which is in all the Scriptures inspired of God maketh a wonderfull difference of them from all writings of men of all sortes But let vs see Martials arguments against the Spirite of God to be iudge of the interpretation of the Scriptures Paul and Barnabas in the controuersie of circumcision went not to the word and Spirit but to the Apostles and Elders at Ierusalem O blocke-head and shamelesse asse Paul and Barnabas doubted not of the question but sought the generally quiet of the whole Church by consent of Councell But whether went the Apostles and Elders for decision of the question but to the worde and Spirite Reade Act. 15. Againe he citeth Deuteronom 17. that the people in controuersies should resort to the priestes for iudgement but where should they fetche their iudgement but of the lawe of God as it is in the same place Againe Christ hath appointed Apostles Euangelistes c. therefore it is not a generall precept for all men to trie all men to iudge what doctrine they receiue bicause all be not Apostles Euangelistes c. Then in vaine saide Christ to all men search the scriptures in vaine the Apostles trie the spirites neither did the Boerheans well that daily sought the Scriptures to see if those things were so as the Apostles taught Martiall is to be pitied if he knowe no difference betweene authoritie of publike teaching and the triall and examination of doctrine whereof this pertaineth to all men the other to such onely as are called thereto But Martiall proceedeth to shewe that as GOD appointed one high Priest to the Iewes to avoide schismes so he appointed Peter among the Christians and for this purpose he citeth diuers sentences of the auncient Fathers which all in order almost the reader shall finde cited and satisfied in myne aunswere to Doctor Sanders booke of the rocke of the Church Cap. 5. except one place of Tertullian De pudicitia which I maruell this Popish Lawyer would alledge being so contrarie to his purpose but that the poore man vnderstoode it not Qualis es c. What art thou ouerthrowing and changing the intention of our Lorde giuing this personally to Peter Vpon thee saide he I will builde my Church If it were personally saide to Peter Syr Bacheler counsel with Baldus and Bertholdus whether it goe by succession to the Pope or no Which Tertullian denyeth to pertaine to euery Elder of the Church bicause it was spoken personally to Peter And nowe at the length beginneth he to come to the argument of his booke the signe of the crosse Which he saide was the fourth signification of the word Crosse in Scripture and calleth it the materiall and mysticall signe of the crosse which Master Calfhill denieth to be once mentioned in Scripture in that sense that Martiall taketh it Martiall repeateth that which he had saide before that Esaye cap. 49. saith I will set out myne signe on high to the people which Hierome vpon that place expoundeth to be the standard of the crosse that it may be fulfilled which is written the earth is full of his praise Et iterum c. And againe In all the earth his name is wonderfull Which wordes following immediately Martiall craftily suppresseth and falleth into a brabbling matter that preaching which Master Calfhill saide was this standard is not the onely standard or signe lifted vp by GOD for conuersion of the Gentiles but miracles and good examples of life c. Whereas the question is whether the Popish signe of the crosse be the signe spoken by Esay and Hierome And the exposition added by Hierome sheweth plainely that he meaneth not a red or blue crosse banner but the preaching of Christe crucified whereby the earth is filled with the praise of GOD and his name is wonderfull in all the earth But Martiall in the end concludeth that it hath pleased the auncient Fathers to appoint and ordeine the signe of the crosse to he one meane among many by which the praise of GOD is set foorth Where he should haue proued that the signe of the crosse as he taketh it is mentioned in the scriptures Other cauils and slaunders not more false then foolish I will clearely omit as I purposed in the beginning and followe onely such matter as is proper to the question in controuersie namely the signe of the crosse The second text to proue that the signe of the crosse is mentioned in the scripture he citeth out of Iere. 4. Lift vp a signe in Sion which
after this discourse I wil referr the reader to mine answere to D. Sand. booke against images c1 13. or 12. after y e error of his print where Calfhil thinketh it not meete y t should be restrained to that whereof there is no precept in scripture nor they them selues yeld lawful cause Marti telleth him y t he must be restrained if he will be good Christian. For there is no precept in expresse scripture to beleue three persons one God in y e blessed Trinitie y e equalitie of substance of Christ with his father in his godhead c. The pertual virginitie of Marie y e keping of y e Sunday y e sacrament receiuing fasting y e baptisme of infants c. you see what an Atheist he is y t can find no more certaintie in y e scriptures for y e blessed Trinitie then for S. Maries virginitie for the godhed of Christ then for receiuing y e Cōmunion before other meates If Papistes haue no ground to their faith out of the scriptures yet we can proue what so euer is necessarie for vs to beleeue It he dalie vpō y e word expresse scripture either he answereth not to y e same thing wherof he is demanded or else he knoweth not y t an argument rightly concluded out of holy scripture is as good as y e very words of y e scripture as when I say if Peter beleued was baptized ergo he was saued is as true as these words whosoeuer beleueth is baptized shall be saued To y e second demand whether y e ancient fathers did attribute such vertue to the wagging of a finger y t the holy Ghost could be called downe y e diuell driuen away by it Mart. answereth it is most euident that as soone as praier is duly made the signe of the crosse made the holy Ghost according to the promise of Christ commeth downe sanctifieth c. and the diuel is driuē away This is Mart. euidence other reason he bringeth If he referre the promise and comming of the holy Ghost to prayer he playeth the palterer that being demanded of the crosse answereth of praier Otherwise let him shewe what promise Christ hath made to the signe of the crosse or to prayer with the signe of the crosse more then without it If he can not you may easily see his pouertie To the thirde whether they would haue refused the Church and sacraments for want of a crosse He beleeueth verily they would not for the sacraments lacketh not the vertue if the signe of the crosse be omitted yet the fault is great when the tradition of the Apostles is wilfully reiected Whether it be like they deliuered any needlesse or vnprofitable ceremonie let wise men iudge After this followeth a long and foolish dialogisme about the interpretation of Cyprians wordes What so euer the ministers of the sacraments be what so euer the handes are that dippe those that come to baptisme what so euer the brest is out of which the holy wordes proceede the authoritie of operation giueth effect to all sacraments in the figure of the crosse and the name which is aboue all names being called vpon by dispensers of the sacraments doth all Martial so scanneth these wordes as though M. Calfhil knewe not the difference betweene the power of God and the ministerie of man in the sacraments whiche Cyprian doth plainly distinguish in these wordes But to the purpose Cyprian seemeth to make the figure of the crosse a meane by which God worketh in the sacraments But in deede hee meaneth that all sacraments take their effect of the passion of Christ as a bare signe and token whereof they vsed the figure of the crosse and not as a meane whereby God worketh seeing it is confessed by Martial that the sacraments if the signe of the crosse be omitted lacke not their vertue An other foolish brable and vsherlike construing he maketh of Cyprians words de baptismo Verborum solemnitas sacri inuocatio nominis signa attributa institutionibus Apostolicis sacerdotum ministerijs visibile sacramentum celebrant For reprouing Master Calfhil for translating signa attributa institutionibus apostolicis signes attributed to the institutions of the Apostles he teacheth him to conster signes attributed by the Apostolicall institutions through the ministerie of the priestes Wherein I maruell that such an auncient student will nowe suffer the word attributa to goe without a datiue case which I thinke he would not haue done in his pettite schoole at Winchester But if I might be bolde vnder y e correction of such a grounded grammarian to conster the lesson ouer againe I would giue the Latine this English The solemnitie of wordes and inuocation of the holy name and the signes appointed by the institutions of the Apostles for the ministerie of the priestes doth make the visible sacramēt And what be those signes By M. Martials leaue the elements as water breade and wine But then M. Grindal whom I laugh to see this wise Dialogue maker to bring in swearing once or twise in this deuised talke as though out Bishops vsed that veine as commonly as Popish prelats M. Grindal I say must send me to Saint Anthonies schoole bicause the elements of the sacraments be of Christes owne institution and not of his Apostles wherfore those signes must be other goodly ceremonies and the signe of the crosse must not be lest But if Martial euer were a scholler in that schoole or any other of any value he might haue learned long agoe that institutio signifieth not onely the first beginning of an ordinance but also a teaching or doctrine and so doth Cyprian meane that by the doctrine of the Apostles y e Priestes are appointed to vse those signes which if Martials Vshership will not admit Cyprian in telling what maketh y e visible sacramēt hath left out the principal part thereof namely the element and that which in deede in it is onely visible for the solemnitie of wordes and inuocation are audible rather then visible But in this foolish Dialogue is cited Iustinus Apol. 2. to proue that the olde Fathers vsed the signe of the crosse in all sacraments Iustinus Martyr saith he in the place of M. Grindal talking of the crosse biddeth vs viewe in our mindes and consider with reason all thinges that are in the worlde and see whether sine haec figura administrentur they may be done without this signe How like it is that M. G. shold say Iustinus biddeth vs when he biddeth y e Gentiles I leaue to speake of But that he speaketh of our sacramentes how will Martiall prooue When both he speaketh to the Heathen and of Heathenishe customes and ceremonies or els ciuill and naturall matters As of sayling plowing digging and all handie craftes whose tooles had some figure of the crosse in which the Gentiles did so fondely abhorre and despise Christ for it Whereas it was to be found euen in the shape of man in the trophees and standerdes
fathers is of the third kind but as it is vsed of you Papists for a blessing sanctifying of y e second kind If it be tolde him y t the fathers builded some strawe wood as wel as gold siluer he saith those wordes were meant of maners not of doctrine wherin he sheweth himself a profound student in S. Pauls Epistles Yet if y e fathers haue any priuate opinions or y t some bastarde bookes be intituled to them yet wil he follow y e rule of S. Basil Hom. con Sabel Dominus c. Our Lord hath so taught the Apostlâ—â— haue preached the fathers haue obserued the martirs haue confirmed It shall suffice to say I haue beene so taught I would he would or could follow this councel but he leaueth out al y e rest taketh but the taile We haue been so taught But if he will haue vs to allowe blessing with y e crosse let him begin with the head and shewe where our Lorde hath taught it the Apostles preached it and so forth continue his gradation to the end But hitherto he hath beene hammering of tags to his two taglesse pointes as M. Calfhil nameth them and now he commeth to worke vpon his third point that a crosse was set vp in euery place And firste he goeth to worke with the authoritie of Martialis one of the seuentie two disciples of Christ which was as surely a disciple of Christ as a kinsman of his Of whose credite I haue spoken before therefore wil not here repeate it Wheras he is accused of falsifying of Athanasius he coloureth the matter by following two or three corrupt prints wilfully refusing the true edition best reformed according to y e moste auncient written coppies His leauing out of words material which he cannot excuse by the print he defendeth by his written coppie and layeth the fault on the printer Better a badd excuse then none at all lawyers haue manye such shiftes But the place is Quaestion 16. ad Antioch Quare credentes omnes ad crucis imaginem cruces facimus lanceae verò sanctae aut arundinis aut spongiae figuras nullas conficimus cum tamen haec tam sint sancta quà m ipsa crux Responsio Figuram quidem Crucis ex duobus lignis compingentes conficimus vt si quis infidelium id in nobis reprehendat quod veneremur lignum possimus duobus inter se disiunctis lignis crucis dirempta forma ea tanquam inâ—ilia ligna reputare infideli persuadere quod non colamus lignum sed quòd crucis typum veneremur in lancea verò aut spongia vel arundine nec facere hoc nec ostendere possumus Why do all wee beleeuers make crosses after the image of the crosse but we make no figures of the holy speare or of the reede or of the sponge whereas yet these are as holy as the crosse it selfe The answere Wee make in deede the figure of the crosse by putting two pieces of wood together that if any of the infidels reprehende that in vs that wee worship wood wee may by seperating the two pieces of wood and breaking the forme of the crosse accompt them as vnprofitable pieces of wood and persuade the infidell that wee worship not wood but that wee worship the type of the crosse but in the speare or sponge or reede we can neither do not shewe this Here Martiall obserueth that all Christian men made crosses yet can he not proue that they did set these crosses in the church but that they vsed them in other places it appeareth by that they were made so as the infidels seeing them they might be taken asunder But I will obserue that seeing they made no images of the reede sponge speare c. they made no images of Christes passion which the Papistes accompt so profitable Secondly Martiall vrgeth that they worshipped the type of the crosse which Master Calfhill sayeth is not the figure but the thing represented by y e crosse And verily the Gentyles should haue as great cause to reprehend them for worshipping the shape of a creature as for worshipping the creature it selfe Wherefore except Martiall will saye the Christians made a fonde excuse let him not play the foole so magnifically in cauilling vppon Master Calfhils interpretation when he cannot otherwise reasonably defende the authors meaning Finally let Martiall remember that the speare sponge reede be as holy as the crosse it self therfore in respect of no holynesse thereof the crosse was made rather then the rest but because the fourme thereof being easily broken in two stickes the Gentyles might acknowledge that the Christians made y e crosse neither for the wood nor for y e fashion but for a remeÌ„braÌ„ce of Christ crucified whoÌ„ they worshiped From the crosse he digresâ—eth a while to y e marriage of vowed priests complaining that Innocentius Siricius popes of Rome are slandered where they are saide to take marriage for a satisfying of lustes of the flesh where they speake only of the marriage of Priestes that had vowed to liue vnmarried which is false for they speake of Priestes that were married lying with their owne wiues Plurimos enim sacerdotes atque Leuitas post longa consecrationis suae tempora tam de coniugibus proprijs quà m etiam de â—urpi coitu sobolem didicimus procreasse For we haue learned that many Priestes of Christe and Leuites long time after their consecration haue begotten children as well of their owne wiues as of filthie copulation Thus do they account both faultes alike Againe the reasons they bring are such as concerne marriage generally That they which be in the flesh can not please God c. reade the Epistle of Syricius ad HimeriuÌ„ Tarraconen Innocentius ad Victricium which are all one word for word concerning this matter But where Martiall taketh vpon him to charge vs with a statute in force against the marriage of Priests in EnglaÌ„d vnrepealed he is miscoÌ„ceiued For we haue a clause of a statute in force that all marriages lawfull by the lawes of God shall be accounted lawfull by the lawes of the realme So long therefore as the marriage of Priestes may be approued by the lawe of God there is no daunger in the lawe of the realme Concerning the filthie liues of the Popish Cleargie it is needlesse to speake being so well knowne in the world yet it is not their wicked life that separateth vs from their Synagogue but their hereticall doctrine But returning againe to the crosse he burdeneth M. Calfhil with a lye bicause he saide that Martial hauing named houses markets wildernesses highwayes seas ships Garments parlors walles windowes armor c. where the crosse should be nameth not the Church whereas a little before he cited out of Chrysostome that it was vsed in the holy table at y e holy mysteries But Chrysostome saith not that the crosse was erected and set vp or painted in any Church although he
to kneele before an image And againe Protestants kneele before images in glasse windowes and holde vp their handes at Paules crosse therefore they defile their bodies with sacrilege And if they excuse themselues by their good intent the same will serue the Papistes which adore the image for that it representeth Christ or his saintes But protestants adore no images with any intent thou foolish aduocate of Idolaters no more then Martiall doth reuerence to a dogg when he putteth of his cap or maketh curtesie in any house where a dogge is before him And verily he sayeth a man may as well be suspected for idolatrie if he bowe before any visible creature as if he kneele before an image But not so probably as Martiall may be suspected to be out of his wits when he maketh such comparisons The Iewes were not onely suspected but also affirmed by the Gentyles to worship the clowdes the power of heauen because in prayer they looked vp to heauen Qui puras nubes Coeli â—â—men adorant sayeth the Poet of them Wherefore by Martials comparison they might as wel haue prayed before images And where he sayeth that Protestants condemne outward things except hattes beardes barrell breeches c. he sheweth his vanitie Our iudgement concerning outwarde things that serue for order and comlinesse being not defyled with idolatrie and superstition is sufficiently knowen What wee teach of fasting praying vowing c. it were superfluous here to repeate when publike testimonies of our doctrine are daily giuen both in preaching and writing And surely I am to blame y â— vouchsaue such vaine calumniating of any mention That not to bowe their knee to Baal is not a peculiar note of Gods seruants because other things are required in Gods seruants then to be free from idolatrie it is a foolish and more then childish quarrell For in the days of Elyas that was a peculiar note to discern them from idolaters whom God had preserued both from yelding to idolatrie in hart also from dâ—ssembling with outwarde gesture But Martiall would learne whether M. Calfhill kneeling downe before his father to aske him blessing did not commit idolatrie How often shall I tell him he is an Asse that cannot make a difference betweene ciuill honour and religious worship And once againe he must be answered why the people are suffered to sweare vpoÌ„ a book with their cappes in their hands rather then to kneele before the crosse in doing of their adoration to God If he will be answered I will tell him againe partly because it is against ciuil honestie that the people should stande couered before the Iudge partly because they sweare by the name of God whome they ought to reuerence But kneeling before a crosse to worship it is manifest idolatrie and expressely forbidden by the lawe of God Thou shâ—lt not bowe downe to them nor worship them The people are not allowed to put off their cappes to the booke neither yet to sweare by the booke When Martiall can proue that it is lawfull for Christians to worship images then we will graunt it is vncharitable to iudge them idolaters that kneele before them But he will not graunt the crosse to be nothing in that sense that Saint Paul sayeth an Idoll is nothing because it is a representation of a thing that was by this reason the image of Iupiter Hercules Romulus which were men sometime were no idols The image of the Sunne of an Oxe an Ape a Catt c. worshipped of the Egyptians were no Idols neither was the worshipping of them idolatrie The questions to be propounded in the Chauncery I leaue to Martiall to propounde him selfe But where he sayeth that no euidence of any idolatrous fact in worshipping the crosse can be shewed in true Christians I agree with him but in Papistes if he meane them great euidence Who went a Pilgrimage to the roodes of Bostone Douercourt and Chester were they not Papistes who made the roodes to sweate to bleede and to smell sweete as D. Reade did with his roode of Becclys were they not Papistes Finally who sayeth singeth to the Crucifix Aue rex noster c. All haile our King All haile O crosse our onely hope c. I doubt not but the countrey of Christian men wil iudge this as good euidence for pulling downe the crosse as Ezechias had for destroying the brazen Serpent It is Martials poore iudgement when you see men praying they be Christian men therefore they serue God in spirite and truth but afterward he restrayneth it to men that were baptised in Christ. Yet may they be heretikes and therfore no true worshippers of God But y â— which he spake in way of humilitie he will now say stoutly Sir when you see men that is to say men that are baptised men that beleeue in God praying yea before an image and holding vp their handes and knocking their breastes it is a good consequent to say they be Christian men Ergo they serue God in spirite and trueth and we may not iudge the contrary This argument holdeth of the place of stoutnesse For other consequence there is none in it nor yet wittie conueyance For first when I see men I must say they be men that are baptised and beleeue in God Whereas by sight I can not perceiue that they are baptised yet if I know that they be baptised I can not tell whether they beleeue in God as Christians or as heretikes or whether they be hipocrites without faith How shal I then iudge them to be Christian men Finally when I see them do an open acte contrary to Christian profession yet by Martials diuinitie I may not iudge but that they be good Christians and worship God in spirite and truth Euen as by his Canon law I am taught that if I see a prieste embrasing of a woman I must iudge he doeth it for no harme but to blesse her To be shorte Martials good consequent wil make him confesse that al the protestantes that holde vp their hands at Paules crosse and say Amen when the preacher her sayeth God confound the Papistes whereat he scoffeth be Christian men and worship God in spirite and trueth As for their adoration of the crosse he saith standeth as well with the glorie of God as our kneeling at the communion putting off our cappes to the cloth of estate to the Princes letters bowing to the Princes person kissing of the booke c. So that with him thinges by God expressely forbidden stande as well with his glorie as things by him commanded and permitted In the end complayning that Maister Calfhill hath not answered him to thirtie places out of the auncient writers whereof let the Readers when they haue compared iudge he glorieth that his rayling slanderous conclusion is not dealt withall but by silence which silence he taketh for a confession but in deede it is a sufficient confutation of such lies and slaunders as haue no colour of trueth in them Our Sauiour Christ being called a Samaritan made none answer to it Socrates an Heathen man kept silence when a varlet railed on him wherfore silence in such case as this is neither a confession nor a conuiction To conclude I will not altogether refuse as Maister Calfhil doth to deale with So â—ewde an aduersarie as Martiall is but I would wishe that the Papistes for their credites sake would henceforward set forth a better champion for their causes or else helpe him with better weapons to fight in their quarrel For in this reply he doth nothing in a maner but either conster like an Vsher or quarrell like a dogbolt Lawier FINIS Gal. Mon. Vz. Whitby in Yorkshire Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Es. 49. Matth. 5. Es. 61. Es. 52. Es. 52. Stapleton Fulke Cont. Faust. li. 13. Ca. 13. Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke ☜ Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Cap. 2. Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Stapleton Fulke Fulke 2. Th. 2. Luk. 10. 1. Io. 4. Mat. 18. Exâ— 10. Ioel. 1. Eph. 4. Tert. li. 4. cont Mart. Math. 15. Iames 5. 1. Iohn 4. Actes 17. Lib. 4. cap. 26. De verâ— sap Martial Fulke In Mark. H 14. adver Mar. li. 30. Martial Fulke Pro Clu. Pro Cel. In Ant. Martial Fulke Martiall Fulke Eph. 6. Mar. 1. Iohn 1. Martial Fulke Martial Fulke Deut. 12. Martial Fulke Marke 6. Martiall Fulke Rom. 3. 〈◊〉 28. Act. 15. v. 9 Martiall Fulke De obis Theod. Heb. 1.