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A84425 An end to the controversie between the Church of England, and dissenters In which all their pleas for separation from the Church of England are proved to be insufficient, from the writings of the most eminent among the dissenters themselves. And their separation condemn'd by the reformed churches. 1697 (1697) Wing E725B; ESTC R224499 64,815 158

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fairly in his Answer to a certain Letter p. 18. where he says he has seldom heard any but very good and well studied Sermons in our Churches and on the other side complains publickly of the weakness and injudiciousness and self-conceitedness of too many of the Non-conformist Preachers in his Sacral Desert p. 86. yet they will tell us they deceive the People and keep them all in ignorance for their own Interests least they should lose their Church Preferments This is a very severe Censure to say that so many Thousand godly Ministers as have been of the Church of England since the Reformation and who have many of them died Martyrs for the sake of it should be such Villains as to deceive the People and damn their own Souls for the sake of their Church Preferments But how can self-interest oblige the Clergy to defend the Church of England as now establish'd if they thought it not agreeable to the Word of God It must be either Pride or Covetousness that must move them to it If it were Pride doubtless the Presbyterian or Independant way would answer that end much better for whereas now the Parsons Vicars and Curates of all the Parishes in England are subject to their respective Bishops c. and can do nothing as to matters of Discipline or Government c. not even in their own Parishes without the consent of the Diocesan Bishop Were the Constitution of the Church changed to that of the Presbyterian or Independant way every Pastor would become an absolute Bishop and accountable to none for what he did If it were Covetousness that moved them to it I suppose that were all the Parsons of every Parish in England made the Pastor of that Church or Parish according to the Presbyterian or Independant Notion of a Pastor and all the Diocesan and Metropolitan Bishopricks and their Deans and Chapters dissolved and their Revenue super-added to the present in-come of every Parish Minister or Pastor their Church Livings would be no less but more valuable than now they are Why do they not then set about this change of Church Government as fast as they can if they think in their Consciences 'twere more agreeable to God's will so to do 't is plain 't would better answer their Covetousness and Ambition to pull down Episcopacy than to live in this poor subjection that now they do Here they will tell us the reason is plain because the Bishops who are the Governours of the Church will not let them they know the sweet of a fat Bishoprick too well to part with it I warrant them But the Thousandth part of the Clergy of England are not Bishops nor perhaps never think to be so Every one of these have a Vote in the Convocation and doubtless may carry it against so small a number of Bishops as 27. were they not perswaded in their Consciences that the Church of England as now establish'd is as agreeable to the Will of God as any other whatsoever Therefore since the Divines of the Church of England are more Numerous and generally more Learned and can have no design upon the account of Self-interest to deceive the People 't is safer sure in a doubtful case to take their words and trust to their judgments than to those among the Dissenters whose Interest it is to deceive the People and make the breach between us as wide as they can many of them being Men of no Fortune and such as have no other way to get a Living and Men who must needs be losers by an Union between us be the Conformity of which side it will whether they Conform to us or we to them for be the Government of the Church of England either Episcopal or Presbyterian or Independant 't is but reasonable that the Ministers who are lawfully put into the Cures should continue therein still as Pastors of their own Churches so that the greatest part of the Non-conformist Preachers must be laid aside for 't were not reasonable that others who are as deserving as they and lawfully settled in their Cures should be turn'd out to make room for them nor that Parishes should be divided all over the Kingdom to furnish them with Churches 'T is likely that some of the Non-conformist Ministers who are better qualified than ordinary might be provided for should it please God that there were an Union between us But many of them I doubt could not so that 't is evident their Interest obliges the most of them to deceive the People and keep open the breach as wide as they can And that they really do so is plain by their making the Differences between us seem greater than really they are and than they themselves have own'd them to be in their Writings as I have all along shewed And also by their pretending to quote Authority for what they say and either not mentioning the Chapter or Page where the Words are to be found or else altering the very Words and Sence of the Author to serve their turn If any one think I do them wrong let them look into Dr. Maurice his Defence of Diocesan Episc p. 237. 335. 353. 377. 396. 442. 444. how Mr. Clarkson to prove Episcopacy in the Primitive Church to be agreeable to the congregational or Independant way has misrepresented the very Words and Sence of his Authors You may find more Instances of this kind in the Preface to Dr. Comber's Defence of Liturgies 1st part And see how falsly Mr. Baxter has translated Theodoret's Epistle to serve his Hypothesis Dr. Stillingfleet his Mischiefs of Separation p. 261. And how he has misrepresented the Doctor 's own words ib. 131. 132 and 126. Many more Instances of this kind may be given were it necessary but what has been said is sufficient to show that in Matters of Religion where the case seems doubtful and all the Divines of the Church of England agree on one side and the Non-conformists only on the other 't is much safer to take the Opinion of those of the Church of England than of the others because they are more numerous and generally more learned and seem to have less reason to deceive us To all that has been said I shall only add this That I have taken all the pains that possibly I could to inform my self truly of the Matters in Controversy between the Church of England and the Dissenters and did really believe the things Scrupled to be of much greater moment than I now find them to be And tho' I for my own part am satisfied in my Conscience that there is nothing at all injoin'd by the Church of England but what is agreeable to God's Word and the Opinion of the wisest Men of the Church in all Ages and what the most tender Consciences may satisfie themselves in if they would but make use of the proper means yet I could heartily wish that many things were laid aside if that would purchase an Union between us If things which are allow'd to be in themselves indifferent as Postures and Ceremonies and such like were neither impos'd nor abolish'd but left to the Discretion of every Christian to use or not to use as he thinks best and as the Ceremony of Bowing towards the Altar is and some other alterations made such as you may see in the Proposals offer'd to the Parliament for the Uniting of Protestant Dissenters by Dr. S. Dean of St. Pauls there could then be no reasonable Pretence left for Separation But if nothing else must purchase our Peace but the overthrowing the whole Constitution of this Church 't is too dear a purchase till we have found another to exchange for more agreeable to God's Word and more consistent with the Peace and Tranquility of this Nation but that we have not found yet I am sure as is sufficiently evident by a plain experimental Proof which these Nations lately had 't is very well known that in the late unhappy times when the Church of England Liturgy c. was taken away the Presbyterians Independants and other Parties pray'd one against the other and against establishing that way of Government which others of them pray'd for divers Persons made their own Passions singular Opinions and Errors great part of their Prayers others rejected all Confessions of sins as no part of their Devotions in many places of England the Sacrament of the Lord's Supper was laid aside for 12 or 15 Years together so was Infant Baptism some would Pray for the King one way some another others not at all And in that time that the Church of England way of Worship was laid aside there were more Errors Sects Heresies and Blasphemies broach'd and vented than ever before or since This is acknowledged by the Dissenters themselves see a Book call'd Gangrena part 1st p. 175. writ about the Year 1646. where many of them do acknowledge That we say they in these four last Years for so long had Presbytery been uppermost have overpassed the Deeds of the Prelates in whose time never so great nor so many Errors were heard of much less such Blasphemies and Confusions we have worse things among us more corrupt Doctrines and Practices than in 80. Years before c. So that if nothing must purchase Peace between us but the parting with our Religion and overthrowing our whole Constitution to set up another which Experience has taught us is neither so consistent with God's Glory nor the Peace of these Nations they must excuse us Besides let me tell them Their late Carriage in Scotland has given us great reason to fear that the Religion they so much boast of and with so much Zeal endeavour to set up in this Nation in the place of that which by God's good Providence is now Establish'd is not the true Religion of Christ for that never taught any to Affront and Revile his lawful Ministers and to burn the Holy Scriptures as they have done now more than once I pray God open their Eyes and soften their Hearts and give them Grace to Repent FINIS
I will referr you to Dr. Comber's Defence of Liturgies II. Part pag. 325. and will go on to shew the Opinion of some of the most Eminent of our own Dissenters concerning our Common-Prayer Mr. Baxter in his Poor Man's Family Book pag. 336. says Do not peevishly pick quarrels with the Prayers of the Church nor come to them with humoursome prejudice c. And in his Preface to the same Book he says he mightily approves of Forms of Prayer See Dr. Owen to the same purpose his Evangelical Love pag. 54. And Mr. Baxter in his Dispute of Liturgies Prop. 10. says farther That the constant disuse of Forms is apt to breed a giddiness in Religion and may make Men Hypocrites who delude themselves with conceits that they delight in God when 't is but in those Novelties and variety of Expressions that they are delighted See also Gifford a Non-Conformist his Answer to Greenwood he writ a whole Treatise proving the lawfulness of read Prayer And now I have shew'd that Praying by Forms has been used by the Saints in the Old Testament enjoyned by Christ in the New practised by all the Holy Fathers and Devout Christians who lived ever since the first setling of the Church and is now allowed and practised in all the regular Protestant Churches and approved by some of the most Eminent of our own Dissenters Let any Man now in his right Reason judge whether praying by Forms be so wicked and abominable a thing as most of our Dissenters make it One of the Non-Conformist Ministers in a Book which he Publish'd not many Years since speaking of Forms of Prayer calls it That pitiful contemptible thing called Vniformity in Words and Syllables and Phrases which was never desired of God nor ever entered into his or his Son's heart Let the World judge now whether using Forms of Prayer c. be this pitiful contemptible thing they are pleased to make it or the Books that contain them deserve no better usage from Christians than to be burnt in the Streets by the Common Hangman In the days of Julian there was never any thing done more wicked than to burn the Holy Bible But even to that height are those who call themselves Christians arrived already in our Neighbouring Kingdom if these things be suffered what must we think will follow But the main Text of Scripture which our Dissenters rely on for to defend their Extempore Prayers is Rom. viij 26. where St. Paul says The Spirit helpeth your Infirmities and therefore they conclude they ought to use no outward helps But I have shew'd before That outward helps are to be used as Kneeling lifting up the Hands and Eyes c. So that 't is plain they mistake this Text of Scripture And 't is evident they do so for that all the Fathers and the most Eminent Men of the Church as Calvin Luther c. whenever they recommended the use of Liturgies they gave this Reason for it among others To prevent the inconveniences which some Mens folly would betray them to in their using rash and unpremeditated Prayers Now if the Spirit helpeth our Infirmities in the sence that our Dissenters will have it How come all these learned Men yea and Mr. Baxter himself c. to recommend Forms as necessary for the helping of our Infirmities and so make the Holy Spirit insufficient Shall we believe that all these learned Men did not understand the meaning of that Text so well as some of our Dissenters do 'T is very likely that St. Augustine and St. Chrysostom who liv'd nearer the Apostles days by above Twelve Hundred Years than any of our Non-conformists might have understood the Apostles meaning better than any of them Now let us hear what their sence was of these words of St. Paul We know not what to pray for as we ought but the Spirit helpeth our Infirmities St. Aug. ad Prob. Ep. 121. p. 129. will not grant that any Christians wanted the Spirit to help them with words and expressions For he says It is not credible that the Apostle or they to whom he wrote were ignorant of the Lord's Prayer And therefore they must necessarily have known what to have pyra'd for therefore these words The Spirit helpeth our Infirmities he tells us must be expounded of the Spirit 's giving us patience not to pray absolutely to be delivered out of our afflictions but in God's due time And St. Chrysostom in his Hom. 14. in 8. Rom. p. 120. says That there was a miraculous gift of Prayer in the Apostles days to which St. Paul alluded in those words The Spirit helpeth our Infirmities But he tells us there that 't was ceas'd long since that is before his days tho' he liv'd in the fourth Century so that whatever the Apostles meaning was then it can no ways be taken in the sence our Dissenters would have it nor does it condemn prescribed Forms now that that miraculous gift of Prayer is ceased But were there no other Argument against the use of extempore Prayers in publick Assemblies than the inconveniency of them 't were sufficient to reject them 'T is impossible that Order or Unity can be preserv'd in any Church where every Congregation hath liberty to Worship God in a different way from all the rest one Minister praying for one thing and another perhaps for the quite contrary at the same time according to their different judgments and interests as was usual in the late times when that extempore way was us'd Besides in great Congregations 't is impossible that all the People should keep their attention so well fixt on an extempore Prayer to which they are utter strangers as on a Prayer to which they have been accustom'd For how can they join with the Minister in every Petition as they ought to do till they have reflected a little upon what it was he said for when the Minister is left to his own Fancy in his Prayer 't is very like he may either through mistake or wilfully come out with some Petition that all his hearers cannot join with him in So that 't is necessary for every one of the Congregation to watch every expression and reflect a little on it before he consent to it In the mean time the eloquent Pastor to shew his extraordinary Gift of Prayer runs away with the business as if his Tongue was indeed the Pen of a ready writer Thus the poor People must either be left behind or join with him at random Another inconveniency which attends extempore Prayer is That 't is impossible for a Man who trusts to his own Memory to retain all his wants and the wants and necessities of the People so in his Mind but that something or other will very oft be forgotten which may be avoided by using of a well compos'd Form But again Can we reasonably imagine that God Almighty can be pleas'd with vain repetitions and with bald and unproper and too often nonsensical expressions such
Examination by all the Fellows of the College to which they belong in the publick Hall for six days together if they be found qualified they commence Batchelors of Arts if not they are laid aside till the next Year After they have taken their Batchelors Degree they begin to apply themselves more particularly to the Study of Divinity but are still obliged to publick Lectures for Hebrew Greek and other parts of Learning necessary for that Study and to publick Disputations And thus they spend three Years more and then after a strict and publick Examination as before if they be found qualified they commence Masters of Arts or Doctors of Philosophy And here observe That no Man can hope to take his Degrees in any of the Universities unless he be throughly qualified for it No such thing as Favour in the case because the Examinations are publick before all the Fellows and the President of the College And besides that every Man that is to take any Degree in any of the Colleges is obliged by the Laws of the College to ask the Consent of every Man particularly who has ever taken the Degree of Master of Arts in that College if they be at that time any where in or about the Town and any one of these if he can shew Reason for it as that he is a Man of a scandalous Life and Conversation or of not sufficient Learning or such like may stop him of his Degree After they have taken their Master of Arts Degree then is the time they usually enter into Holy Orders Some few there are who are admitted into Deacons Orders after they have commenced Batchelors of Arts but these are few and are look'd upon but as young raw Fellows so that generally those who are admitted to the Office of the Ministry in the Church of England are Men who have spent at least seven Years in the Study of University Learning in one of the two most Famous Universities in the World with all the Helps and Advantages that are necessary for the perfecting of them in their Studies For besides those aforesaid they have the constant Conversation of so many Learned Ingenious Men the use of Great and Noble Libraries Famous all over the World besides the particular Libraries belonging to each College In which are to be found many Pieces of Antiquity and Ancient Manuscripts c. not to be met with any where else and which give great Light into Antiquity And in each University they have Divinity Professors who are chosen out of the most Eminent Divines they have whose business it is to hear Divinity Lectures read and Points of Divinity disputed on in the publick Divinity-Schools to which all those who design for that Study are after some few Years obliged to attend Neither do these Learned Men trust only to their own Knowledge but they have carefully settled a Correspondence with all the most Eminent Men beyond Seas These and many more are the Advantages of Education which the Divines of the Church of England have above those of the Non-conformists who are generally bred after this manner A Non-conformist Minister perhaps or some such Person who lives obscurely in some remote part of the Country gets 30 or 40 Boys together and there he teaches them common School-Learning till they come to be towards 20 years of age and then instead of entring them into the University he enters 'em in another Chamber perhaps 5 or 6 at a time and there he teaches them University Learning as they call it for 2 or 3 years it may be without the help of any Libraries but the good Man's Closet or any Conversation more than with one another and with the Master if he will honour them so far and his assistant if he chance to have one And so after 2 or 3 years Study at this rate they are qualified for the Office of a Minister among them and are thought fit to be intrusted with the Care of Souls and Government of a Church I own there are some few among them who have had better Education than this is but these are the general Methods taken for breeding up of Divines on both sides which is so well known that none will have the Confidence to deny it And now let any Man of reason judge whether in Matters that depend so much upon Antiquity and the Practice and Judgment of the Primitive Church as the Controversies between us and the Dissenters do whether I say are more likely to be mistaken all the Divines of the Church of England or those of the Dissenters It is not so likely says Mr. Baxter in his Poor Man's Family Book p. 222. that God should reveal his Mind to a few good Men and those of the rawer injudicious sort and such as are most infected with proud overvaluing their own Wisdom and Godliness and such as have had least Time and Study and means to come to great Vnderstanding and such who shew themselves the proudest Censurers of others and least tender of the Church's Peace and such as are apt to break all to pieces among themselves I say 'T is not so likely that these are in the right as the main Body of agreeing humble godly peaceable studious Ministers who have had longer time and better means to know the Truth And the Body of Christians even the Church hath more promises from Christ than particular dividing Persons have See all this and more to the same purpose in this Book aforesaid writ by Mr. Baxter himself So that had we no other Authority on our side than that of the Church of England 't were much safer to rely upon their judgments in this Matter than on the judgment of the Non-conformists but it appears before that we have the Opinion of all the Reformed Churches in the World on our side and if that won't turn the Scales God Almighty must work a Miracle for their Conversion as he did for St. Paul's 'T is so evident that the Ministers of the Church of England have much the Advantage of those among the Dissenters as to Learning and Knowledge that they have no way left to obviate this but by down right disclaiming at the University Learning and calling them Sophistical Divines who are bred up in vain and curious Arts. * His Book of the life and manners of Christians note all the Brownists say the same So did the Donatists in St. Augustine's time con●em● human Learning but St. ●●●ustine condemns their 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in his ●st Book 〈◊〉 Cresconius ch 14. See Brown in his Preface to his Book And Mr. Baxter in his Defence of his Cure p. 124. tells us of a Church in New England that separated from a Church on the account of their Preachers having human Learning But perhaps some of our Dissenters will own that our Divines of the Church of England are generally more learned than those among them one of the most competent judges among them Mr. Baxter has own'd it