all know which secretly worketh to bring forth his own plant hâ—s seed his elect from the ends of the earth and from the bondage of corruption which the creatures groan under but the redemption and deliverance of the creatures is to be waited for that the glorious liberty may be witnessed which is free from corruption and this the daughters and sons of the living God is to waiâ— for abiding in the word of his grace there is nothing hid whicâ—â—hall not be made manifest nor nothing promised but shall be fulfilled to the seed in whom all the promises of God is Yea and Amen for ever Your dear brother in that which from the world is hid Richard Hubberthorn Prisoner in Norwich Castle Written the 19. day of the second Month 1655. Some Queries for you to answer who hold forth this testimony to the people That Christ is a Creaâ—ure against those that wâ—â—ness him to be the Son of God by which the World was made perfect God and Man not created but begotten according to the Scriptures 1. What knowledge of Christ that is without a man and how may a man do to lay his foundation thereon without having him revealed in spirit within seeing that was held forth by some of you 2. When was that Christ created which you say must as a Creature judge the World and if in Maries time who was judge of the World till then or did he judge the World as God till then and as a Creature ever since 3. Whether was not that Christ which you call a Creature sent out of Heaven from the Father and did he send a Creature to redeem the Creation and judge it 4. Is there any son of man as a Redeemer but he that came down from Heaven who filleth heaven and earth and was not he in heaven when he was in the flesh with his Disciples and do not the Saints partake of his flesh now upon earth 5. Whether all they which did see that body which to the world appeared in similitude of sinful flesh did see the shape and hear the voice of the Son of God or know the Man Christ Jesus 6. And if Christ was in that body which he appeared to the World before the World was as was asserted by Joshua Sprigge and he a creature as you say and the World made by a creature whether is not this to make the word of God of none effect 7. Was not the person of Christ Jesus before the World was his nature and glory the same that is now with the Father in heaven or in what is it changed and when had the man Christ Jesus his beginning if you can declare it 8 Did the Son of man take upon him the nature of the first Adam as he is in the fall when he took part of flesh and blood or do any know his nature who are in the fall and is not the flesh of Christ a mysterie to all mankinde till he be revealed in spirit 9 What that eating of the flesh of the Son of Man is seeing none can have eternal life in them but who eat it is the eating of it the eating of a creature and doth not all as they eat thereof become one flesh and spirit with him in his life and knowledge and if you have eat that flesh drunk that blood how is it you have the knowledge of God which is life eternal yet to seek seeing he that eats and drinks thereof can never thirst more but shall have the spring of life within or can the eating of that flesh which is of the nature of the first Adam give life eternal 10 How is Christ the only begotten Son of God if he be a creature or how can God beget a creature and if the whole person of Christ was not the before the earthly Adam how was the Creation made by him or how can he be of the nature of fallen Adam and not earthly and defiled or can God dwell in that nature but as it is purified and brought to the beginning seeing the fulness of the God-head dwelt bodily in him and is â—he flesh of Christ heavenly or earthly or is he Christ without his flesh 11 Whose obedience and righteousness and works is that which is not Christs and how is it that Christ makes any obedience or righteousness accepted with the Father which is not his own and of his own working this being one thing affirmed by you 12 How is it that a man can be in the spirit of God and in the spirit of Satan both at one instant and doth not the obeying the one deny the other and are not these the two Masters that no man can serve which you seem to affirm the contrary 13 Whether did God create man with any thing of the Devil in him and if not whether any can witness perfect redemption so long as the Devil hath any thing in them seeing some of you could not receive this testimony Now seeing we did answer many of your queries and you would answer none to us so now answer these things in writing that it may be manifest what testimony it is you bear of Christ Jesus for of our testimony of Christ Jesus we are not ashamed before men A lover of your souls and eternal good R. H. The innocency of the righteous seen of God cleared from all slanderous tongues and false accusers IN answer to a printed paper set forth by Frederick Woodall wherein he goes about to render the truth of God odious and by a cloak of maliciousness to cover those lies which he hath formerly published but in the light of God I do him see and comprehend and in it he is made manifest to all the children of light to be no Minister of Christ and to the light of Christ in all consciences I speak that in it they may read these things which from the light is declared that so occasion may be cut off from all who seek occasion against the truth that so peoples minds may not be incensed against the truth of God by his refuge of lyes set forth in his paper called Natural and Spiritual light distinguished But in the light of Christ which is but one which is not natural but spiritual is he seen to be natural and his distinction to be natural and so in the light the natural man with his natural doctrine and natural distinction is denied and Christ Jesus we do witness who is the true light which lighteth every one that cometh into the world Joh. 1.9 I am come a light into the world that whosoever believeth in me should not abide in darkness Joh. 12.46 and this is the condemnation of the world that light is come into the world and men loved darkness rather then light because their deeds were evil Joh. 3.19 20 21. Now all you who are enlightned by Christ Jesus and can read in the light and with understanding to you there is no occasion of stumbling but all
Except ye eat my flesh and drink my blood ye have no life in you And this is his Supper in eating of which the creature hath life in himself Therefore fly from idolatry I speak unto wise men judge what I say the cup of blessing which we bless is the Communion of the blood of Christ and the bread which we break is the Communion of the body of Christ For we being many are one bread and one body for we are all partakers of that one bread 1 Cor. 10.14 15 16 17. For the bread of God is he that came down from Heaven and giveth life unto the World John 6.33 Then said they unto him Lord evermore give us this bread and Jesus said unto them I am the bread of life he that cometh to me shall never hunger and he that believeth on me shall never thirst John 6.34 35. I am the living bread which came down from heaven if any man eat of this bread he shall live for ever and the bread that I will give is my flesh which I will give for the life of the world v. 51. But the Jews could not belive this neither can this Priest but saith we own feâ—ding on Christs flesh but deny his Supper and so as blind as they But by the life which we receive in eating of his flesh and drinking of his bloud are we manifest to be of those that feed at his Table and cannot have communion at the Table of Devils as the Church of God could not 1 Cor. 10.21 Again He saith that we own baptism with the spirit but deny baptism with water I answer Who come to the baptism with the spirit into one body they are come to the one baptism which the Saints witnessed not laying again the doctrine of baptism which waâ— several but witnessing the one the substance of the other which was necessary to salvation so all those things in which the substance was signified whether circumcision or water is not denied in their time and place when the obedience in them was from the command of the spirit and not from tradition but people now in the ignorance of God and his ways take up things by tradition being both out of the command and out of the substance and such deny the substance where it is witnessed as for this Priest Clapham he hath never ministred water baptism as it was ministred when it was a doctrine from heaven for there is not one in all his Congregation that had first received the holy Ghost nor believed in Christ before he baptised them with water and so both the substance and the figure is denied in him so that in that in which he would accuse another without ground is he upon good ground found guilty And as for denying to give thanks that is false for we are bound in spirit to give thanks always to the Father who hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the Saints in light and whether we eat or eat not we give God thanks and this we are come to witness to pray without ceasing and in all things give thanks for so is the will of God concerning us and in us is it fulfilled and we sing with the Spirit and with understanding also but such take Davids conditions which waâ— made manifest unto him in the sure mercies of the Lord to him and sing his deliverances whose soul is yet in the pit and sing his prophesies who never knew the spirit of prophesie in themselves and say they have roared all the day long by reason of their sins when as they have roared all the day long in fulfilling their sins and iniquities and for the scorners to say they have no scornful eye and for the proud to say they are not puft in mind such singing we deny which is without the Spirit and without understanding also For light is sown for the righteous and joy for the upright in heart so to the light with which Christ hath enlightned every one that cometh into the world I speak which tends to uprightness of heart and unto holiness without which no man can see the Lord those things which are reprovable are made manifest in the Liâ—ht and that which doth make manifâ—st is light which all who be out of it is in darkness and know not whether they go nor what they profit as many now in these days being kept from the light and gate of truth by the doctrines of men and so never come to read in the Lambs book of life which first all must come to know the vials poured forth upon the earth upon the Beast and his works and his sear which is found standing in all them who be from the light they be enlightned withal But the hour is coming and now is when all they that be upon the face of the earth may see the appearance of the Son of God and may receive his power in the measure which his Father hath given them to receive him in therefore every one who comes to see with the light of the Son of God enter into thaâ— which you see to be of him and out of that which you see to be of the World that so the everlasting righteousness and peace you may possess in your obedience to what is made manifest that you may come to see and favour the things of God from those things that be of the World and as every one walks in the light you will be as a sweet smelling sacrâ—fice unto the Lord and knowing and feeling the power of â—he Lord with it the everlasting door vvill be opened and the vvell-springs of life to the feeding of the plants of God with the uncorruptible food which is every word which proceedeth out of the mouth of the Lord vvhich vvill be received as that of God in every particular is kept single Again The Priest in his 3 4 5. Section saith That we deny the doctrine of the Trinity and that we hold equality with God and the soul be â—ne being with God and corrupt the doctrine of justification Answ. For a Trinity of persons there is no such docâ—â—â—ne in the Scriptures neither the vvord three Persons nor Trinity and so three distinct one from another eternally as he hath held forth saying Christ is the eternal Son of God distinct from the Father eternally and the Spirit is distinguished from the Father and the Son eternally This is a Tradition of men taught for a doctrine but no doctrine and in denying of that vve do but deny Claphams tradition but as for the Father Word and Spirit which bear record in heaven these three are one and vvas never separated eternally for Christ in the days of his flesh vvhen he vvas in the vvorld said I and my Father are one and said I in them and they in me that they may be one as we are one John 17.11 22. and so this doctrine of the unity of the Father Word and Spirit
vanity and men of high degree are a lye and the heart of man is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things Hear this ye wise men and foolish The more ye strive against the Lord the more is your wound made incurable and the higher you rise in envy always the deeper is your fall in confusion And now Christian Reader whose heart God hath opened to see and behold the things that be eternal and can truly discern of different causes and between the good and the evil and between the light and the darkness This Book is sent forth in the pursuit and after a Book called Hosâ—nna to the Son of David c. by a nameless Author whose work indeed was hardly worthy of an honest mans Name though very subtilly and craftily he prosecutes his purpose and traverses his steps full cunningly as this worlds wisdom could guide him in which wisdom he cannot know or receive the things of God and therefore it cannot be expected that the things of God should be received from that wisdom and though he hath confounded in his words his description of the Light of Christ sometimes speaking well of it aâ—d sometimes otherwise and not knowing hardly whereof he hath affirmed his words are so confounded and mixed in his corrupt reason in giving forth his knowledge of the things of God which he seems to be ignorant of but only as he hath the knowledge of them from the Letter by which no man can come to the knowledge of God nor of the things of his Kingdom without the revelation of the Spirit of Jesus and the operation of the same Spiriâ— But Friends the Testimony of God stands sure for ever though men would confound it in their own reason And this is the Testimony That Christ lighteth every man that cometh into the world which Light is sufficient to lead every man to God or else to condemn every man from God and this Testimony is true notwithstanding all the opposition against it and it shall abide sure for ever though men strive never so much in the gain-saying of it And this is the Testimony which we have born and shall bear to the end and who believes it and who believes it not this is the hand of the Lord according to his pleasure and to him we leave it and so we do and must clear our consciences from time to time while the Lord gives us a being And herein we are a good savour to God and our reward is with him whether Israel be gathered or no Isa. 49. And also this nameless Author which is supposed to be one John Jackson known in this City hath taken some seeming occasion against us by searching our Books and as he saith hath found some contradictions in them which may appear to be so to his dark mind yet in the sight of the spirit of the Lord that is truth which he sees to be no other than error However this is sent forth for the true information of peoples minds that they may know that truth is bold and confident and that it is Armour which defendeth from all Enemies and giveth strength to answer the craftiness of men And this same John Jackson hath shewed himself now to be one with the common Priests of the world for as they have done so hath he opposed the way and people of God and with the very same arguments shewing that he is of the very same spirit with them his discourse and arguments being of the same nature as theirs are yea he hath shewed himself to be of the very same spiâ—it with all the open prophane wretches which doth revile and scorn and abuse in every Town and Countrey the Lords people and as they do so so hath he written with subtile Arguments to the very same end as they reproach and scorn to wit in a derision and despising the way and servants of the Lord so that his self-separation is now seen what it is to be a very cheat and hypocrisie who while he professeth a separation frâ—m the World doth practice the very same wickedness and is not changed from them in nature though he be in appearance But what a poor work hath he brought forth in two years time which he saith his work hath been as Embers raked up in ashes yet a work that gains no praise of God nor very little of the praise of any man It seems he hath hatched mischief upon his bed and brought it forth in the morning Who would have thought but a wise man in that time would have brought forth a larger piece and more to purpose I am sure he might have made better use of his time in another exercise than to have writ against the servants of the Lord It had been more honest for him to have set his pen to paper and studyed to have given his testimony against the Pridâ— and Drunkenness and Oppression and Whoredoms and Wickedness in this great City I say it had been more honest and liker a Saint to have sought the reforming of prophaneness and wickedness that greatly abounds in this City than to have studyed two years to bring forth his invented stuff against a harmless and innocent people which he nor any can justly charge with evil but as he hath digged deep by his imaginations in recollecting a seeming-contradiction out of our writings which is no contradiction no more then Christs words are who saith Except ye eat my flesh and drink my blood ye have no life in you And yet in the same discourse saith The flesh profits nothing And for Isaiah to go with the Word of the Lord to Hezekiah to tell him he should dye and not live yet in the same instant of time told him he should live and not dye Would not John Jackson have counted these contradictions But what he hath done in this in sending forth a Book against the Quakers he hath been so far from beating down sin drunkards and rude scorners and abusive men that he hath fully strengthened their hands and the wickedst people in this Nation are very glad of his work he hath given them matter to oppose truth withall but his reward and theirs shall be both with one hand and he shall drink his portion in the same Lake with such whose hands he hath strengthened and let him know and them all God hath established us upon a sure Mountain which the Gates of Hell and Death cannot prevail against So his work is counted of us and cast by as our spoiled prey of Babylons treasure onely this is sent abroad after it in the pursuit of it which is not done with multitudes of words of mans wisdom but in the plain nakedness of innocent truth which is more strength than all his arguments of guile whereby he would deceive the people but he can deceive none but such as are deceived already for all that are in the Light and in the Truth sees beyond all that he can say and are established
vve ovvn and vvitness and as for our equality or unity vvith God vve that believe in him are one vvith him as the Scripture saith and as Christ prayed for us that believe John 17.21 that we might be one in him and in the Father and unity vve must confess for that is a doctrine â—ffirmed by the Apostles of Christ that as he is so are vve in the vvorld and he that sanctifieth and they that are sanctified are both one and so vve deny no doctrine but vvhatsoever is a doctrine vve vvitness it And to say that vve corrupt the doctrine of justification that is false for vve are freely justified by his grace and so do vvitness the doctrine of justification and vvho are true vvitnesses of it do not corrupt it but if vvhile vve seek to be justified by Christ vve our selves be found sinners is Christ therefore the Minister of sin God forbid Gal. 2.17 but herein doth the Priests of the World corrupt the doctrine of Justification professing to be justified by Christ while they themselves are found sinners and say that God doth account them righteous in Christ but unrighteous in themselves and so would make Christ the minister of sin and to justifie or save his people in their sins and not from them and so by them the doctrine of justification is corrupted and the Scripture perverted and the grace of God by which the Saints are freely justified is turned into wantonness and so by their faigned words in hypocrisie they cast thick clouds and vails of darkness over the peoples mindes to keep them in ignorance of the redemption of their immortal souls which is to be redeeâ—â—d by the blood of the Lamb they saying that the soul came indeed from God but is not of the being of God and yet in the 51. page tels of turning the whole frame of the soul to center in him again if it must centre in him again then it was in him before and so let thy confusion stop thy mouth Now let all consider in the light which comes from the immortal God whether Gods being is not in life and immortality and whether there is an immortal life but from the same being For God breathed into man the breath of life and through the breath of life he became a living soul Now the breath of life came from the life in which the being is and so to the people I say you have a light which comes from the same life in which the soul lived unto God in the beginning before death passed over which light is made manifest to lead out of death into the life from whence it came and to witness again a living soul and the breath of life and so to be wiser then all your teachers and to know him who hath all souls in his hand who breathed into man the breath of life and he so became a living soul and when he doth the evil the anguish is upon it and to feed atop those mountains which you have wandred after in the forgetfulness of God having forgotten God days without number Rom. 2.9 But now the light is come and knowledge begins to increase and shine in the hearts of the children of light to give them the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ and these things live in us Therefore we are his witnesses who is the light and life of men and did only for the seed sake let forth our knowledge of the mystery of God that they may be gathered into the fold among the Lambs of Christ for the day of scattering hath been long but now is the day of gathering begun wherein all they shall rejoyce that fear the Lord. 2 Cor. 4.6 And whereas many other accusations are charged upon us falsly for the name of Christ by the Priest yet seeing Christ the true Prophet hath said it should be so because they know not the Father nor him who hath enlightned every one that commeth into the World therefore can we bear all things being manifest unto God and to all men to be witnesses of those things which he saith we deny His accusations are these That we deny the Resurrection of the body the last Judgment Heaven and Hell Are enemies to all the Ordinances of Christ are not true mortified persons and our doctrine tendeth not to destroy sin That we are the common sink of all Heresies and enemies to civility and good manners Ans. Our doctrine is the same as is testified of in the Scripture of truth and where it is received remission of sins is received it being the same that our Example the first-born amongst many brethren the first begotten from the dead preached vvhich Gospel vve preach to every creature vvhich Gospel is the povver of God and where it is received doth both destroy sin and sanctifie them throughout in body soul and spirit and by it is the members vvhich are upon the earth mortified for this is the povver that raised up Jesus from the dead and doth also quicken out mortal bodies by his Spirit that dvvelleth in us in vvhich the Scripture is vvitnessed which was a Treatise of those things which was knovvn and surely believed amongst the Saints and vvhich saith they that are asleep in the dust of the earth shall rise some to everlasting life and some to everlasting shame and contempt and from â—he true foundation vvitnessing these doctrines vvhich the Apostles did not lay again the foundation of Repentance from dead vvorks and faith tovvards God of the doctrine of baptisms and laying on of hands and of the Resurrection from the dead and of eternal â—udgment Heb. 6.12 for vve having learned vvhat it is to be baptised for the dead deny such as say there is no â—esurrection of the dead the first fruiâ—s of this Resurrection is Christ 1 Cor. 15.22 of which â—hey tâ—at are of Christ are witnesses of these things and they come to know each seed in the light through the figures and through the parables Now in the parables I say to you that seed which you sow in the earth whether it be Wheat or other grain you sow not that body which shall be but God giveth it a body as pleaseth him If it be so in the earthly parable then learn to know the seeds and the nature of them which God giveth to each of them it s own body there is heavenly bodies and earthly bodies â—he glory of the heavenly is one and the glory of the earthly is another and so all being turned to the light which you are enlightned withal you in it will know the things that differ both the seeds the bodies and the glories and so let every one be a witness of what they profess of the things of God for by the Spirit of the Lord have we received the knowledge and so are made witnesses of these thingâ— which our brethren the Prophets and Apostles of Jesus Christ hath testified in the
he hath affiâ—med And again consider that Heaven is God's Throne and the place of his rest And whether God can dwell in the Heavens and have no unity with them with his own Throne and with the place of his rest And consider whether there was ever such a doctrine preached or believed among the sons of men from Abel unto this day there is no record of such a Doctrine neither in the Scriptures Histories Heathens Pagans nor others therefore it is now fit to be recorded or put in Chronicle that all may see what a doctrine is crept into the World and that all may see that Night is come upon all such Prophets that they have no vision nor knowledge of God nor his wayes And this is the man that hath set himself to oppose and gainsay the truth and is a daily reproacher of those that walk in it yet professeth himself to be a Minister of Christ and those whose hearts are upright towards God is he reviling comparing them to Papists Hereticks Scribes and Pharises Indians and such like but to none of those in these things before-mentioned neither to Scribe Pharisee Pope Turk Indian or Alcaron can he be compared for they have been all restrained by something of God in them from writing so blasphemously against God and Christ and the Holy Ghost the Soul Heaven and Union and the Saints as he hath done And so this is another Gospel than that which was preached by Christ and his Apostles and so by the Spirit of God to be accursed for ever And whereas he saith That the union between God and believers cannot be comprehended by the Saints here he charges a lye upon the Saints and speaks contrary to the Scriptures 1 Joh. 1.7 1 Joh. 4.15 1 Joh. 5.20 for the Saints did witnesse union with God here for he that sanctified and they that are sanctified were one they said they were of God and the whole World lyeth in wickedness as he is so are we in this present World they comprehend with all Saints the heighth and length and the breadth of the love of God while they are in the world Now whoever would have believed it that the teachers in England had been so blind or durst have spoken so contrary to the Scriptures they professing them so much to be their rule and learning so long and studying so much to get the Letter of them but now is found both out of the Letter and Life but now the day of God is risen in his peoples hearts and they are seen to be such before their books come forth and now that which they were judged to be before they published themselves in print comes forth that all the world may see that the judgment of God is true from his servants upon them and that all the Rulers of the Nation may see that such are not fit to be held up but be cried against and if any should by a Law give such the tenth parts of mens estates they may expect that by the righteous Law of God ten parts of theirs may be taken away and given to strangers so if any people maintain this doctrine they maintain that which the curse of God comes upon and if they come not out from it will be partakers of the plague And again as concerning Hell Clapham saith that men are not in Hell while they are upon earth And here is another lye Answ. The Prophet said while he was upon earth thou hast redeemed my soul out of hell and Jonah said Out of the belly of hell cryed I unto thee and so the believers doctrine was contrary to Claphams for they knew both heaven and hell while they were upon earth and a redeeming out of the one into the other by Jesus Christ. Again he accuseth Peter saying that he speaks of the divine Nature being communicated to the Saints but understands divine graces Answ. The Apostle doth not speak one thing and understand another as the Priests do for he speaks with the Spirit and with understanding and knows how to divide the word of God aright who spoke unto them that had escaped the corruption which is in the world through lust and knew what it was to be partakers of the divine nature but herein the wickedness of this Priest is manifest who would keep people from being made partakers of the divine Nature and would shut up the kingdom of heaven from men while they are upon earth Again he accuseth the Corinthians in the 33. page of his book to be the ancient Hereticks who were baptized for the dead Ans. Those who were baptized for the dead was no Hereticks neither did they deny the resurrection of the dead though Paul said How say some among you that there is no Resurrection of the dead yet he did not call those that were baptised for the dead Hereticks for those that were baptised for the dead and stood in jeopardy every hour did believe the resurrection of the dead and did wait for it and did not deny it as Clapham saith who hath proceeded on in his book with many of the like false accusations against us also but it is a small matter for us to be judged by such a one for herein is but Christs words fulfilled As they have done unto me so shall they do unto you for neither Christ nor the Apostles nor the Church of God hath escaped his accusation for Luk. 6.26 Wo unto you saith Christ when all men speak well of you for so did they of the false Prophets but blessed are you when men shall speak all manner of evil against you falsly for my names sake for great shall your reward be in heaven now though against us all manner of evil be spoken falsly in the Book before mentioned yet in truth do we stand out of it all and over it all and our accuser is found in the evil and vve clear And as for the 13. Sect. wherein he hath wearied himself for very vanity hath he proved nothing against us but against himself in which he hath said that we are enemies to the holy Scriptures and deny Christ come in the flesh also his death and resurrection and that we have said that Christs flesh perished and that we own not the man Christ in the Heavens as pag. 11. and chargeth us to say that he did not ascend into heaven is not at the right hand of God shall not come to judge the world pag. 12. Again Whereas Clapham saith we deny prayer the Lords Supper and Water-baptism and giving of thanks at meals and singing of Psalms Ans. This is false as his own writing and confession will witness against him which in a former Letter said that I prayed three times at one Meeting and now in this book saith we deny prayer Here confusion is grown into impudency and lyes are made his proofs Again he saith we deny the â—ords Supper yet confesseth we own eding on Christs flesh Now Christ saith