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ID Title Author Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication) STC Words Pages
A01615 A discourse vpon the meanes of vvel governing and maintaining in good peace, a kingdome, or other principalitie Divided into three parts, namely, the counsell, the religion, and the policie, vvhich a prince ought to hold and follow. Against Nicholas Machiavell the Florentine. Translated into English by Simon Patericke.; Discours, sur les moyens de bien gouverner et maintenir en bonne paix un royaume ou autre principauté. English Gentillet, Innocent, ca. 1535-ca. 1595.; Patrick, Simon, d. 1613. 1602 (1602) STC 11743; ESTC S121098 481,653 391

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knowledge in them But I doe not doubt but some will here make a question in this time wherein wee are The Catholicke religion and the Reformed are all one that is What Religion ought to be accounted Christian whether the Catholicke or reformed Hereunto I answere That we ought not to make two of them and that it is but one same Religion and as the names Catholicke and Evangelicke and Reformed are all one name so is the thing it selfe for the one and the other acknowledgeth Christ which is the foundation and hold the articles of the faith of the Apostles Symbole approve the Trinitie and the Sacraments of Baptisme and the holy Supper although there be some diversitie in the intelligence of certain points we may not for that make them two divers Religions For in breefe the one and the other is Christian seeing they take Christ for the foundation But for this purpose I will here recite a discourse of a learned man in my opinion which I lately heard at my lodging in my iourney from Paris to Basle By which discourse this good person although he was Evangelike maintained That the Catholikes and Evangelikes do agree not only in name but also in doctrin although Sophisters will persuade the contrary This proposition at the first seemed unto me a very Paradox but when I heard and understood the reasons of that good man his saying seemed very true unto me There was in the companie a gentleman Catholike none of these great talkers and bablers but a man very gentle and affable who tooke great pleasure to heare this discourse asked many questions of this good man whom I cannot name for I never saw him before He was no man of great shew neither was there any great estimation made of him at the beginning before we heard him speake but at the end of our Table whē we had given thanks upon certain talke we had of Religion he put forth the said proposition All the company prayed him to cleare and illuminate that point and to speake his full opinion therein for there was neither Catholike nor Evangelike which desired not greatly to understand that point He begun then in this manner after he had prayed all the company to take in good part what he should say and humanely to excuse his faults if any escaped Masters saith he I see well that all this company casteth their eies upon me attending to heare of me the proofe of the proposition which I uttered To satisfie then your desires although I have not premeditated all the reasons which might be spoken to maintain that I say yet I will alledge some which I hope you will not iudge impertinent I will then here repeat my proposition that is That the Catholikes hold the same points of Christian Religion that we of the Reformed or Evangelike do True it is that the sophisters wil needs persuade the Catholikes that we hold another doctrine than they doe especially touching the Sacrament of the Altar or the Supper for all is one and touching good works and certaine other points and in veritie the doctrine of our Religion differeth farre from that of the Sophisters yea in principall points as is seene by the conference of our confession of Faith with their articles But I say and will maintaine That the most part of the Catholikes understand not the articles of the Sophisters neither can they comprehend them because they consist in certaine subtile distinctions and sophisticall tearmes The schoole doctors knowing that their doctrine cannot be comprehended by the simple sence and common iudgement of men make the people beleeve that it makes no matter though they understand nothing if so be they beleeve generally that the articles of their faith bee true And this they cal an implicit wrapped or entangled faith that is to say it is so covert and hid that the people understand nothing But I meane not to speake of the Sophists doctrine but of such points of Religion whereof the Catholikes have some knowledge by the apprehension of sence and common iudgement For I maintaine it is true That in these points or in the most part and especially in the cheefe things they agree with us although the Sophisters make them beleeve the contrary And by the way to make it appeare let us a little discourse upon the principall articles of our Christian Religion as of the Sacraments of Iustification of Workes and certaine other points and we shall see plainely that the Catholikes agree with us First if you aske of a good Catholike if when he receives the Sacrament on Easter day he crusheth and bruseth with his teeth the very flesh and bones of our Lord Iesus Christ he will answere you hee beleeves it not and that hee detesteth and abhorreth that talke of crushing and brusing with the teeth the flesh and bones of our Savior If you demand of him if he do not beleeve that when he receiveth the Sacrament he receiveth spiritually the body and bloud of our Lord Iesus Christ he will answer yea that he beleeves so If you yet aske him if when he receives the sacrament of the Host he beleeve that he receiveth and drinketh by the same meanes the sacrament of the blood by Concomitance and that the cup which is given him to drinke in is not but for him to rince his mouth withal he will say he beleeves not this and that eating is not drinking and that hee knoweth not what that Cōcomitance is that he beleeveth that receiving the Host he eateth the Sacrament of the body and that drinking on the cup he drinketh the Sacrament of the blood If you demand of him if he beleeve not that in the holy sacrament there is made a Transubstantiatiō he wil answer you that he beleeves it not because he knows not what Transubstantiation is nor what they meane by that long and prodigious word that he thinketh it is some obscure word invented by the Sophisters to hide from simple people holy things and to darken cleare things And truly it is a strange thing and abhorring from common sence and from all humanitie and Christianitie to bruse and burst the humane flesh bones of our Savior Christ betwixt our teeth And the Sophisters would so persuade the good Catholikes if they could and that they found this goodly doctrine upon a Canon which beginneth Ego Beringarius Where there is this in proper tearms I Beringer unworthy Ego Ber. de Conse d●st 2. deacon of the church of S. Maurice of Angiers knowing the true Catholicke and Apostolicke faith detest and anathematize all heresie and even that whereof I have ben before diffamed Therefore I confesse with hart and mouth that the bread and the wine which are set on the altar after the consecration are not only the Sacrament but are chāged into the body and blood of our Lord Iesus Christ and that the priest toucheth not only sensually the Sacrament but that