last by Gods mercifull prouidence wée gate a sight of them and had them translated into such languages as wee our selues doo vnderstand But this was full sore against your willes as by Hystories it dooth appeere Wee haue therefore no cause to thanke you for them but wée doo giue most heartie continuall thanks to our heauenly father that hath prouided them for vs and hath giuen the vse of them to vs. Yea and finding in the first chapter of S. Iames Epistle Iacob 1. that if any man lack wisdome hee must aske it of God who giueth to all men indifferently and dooth not vpbrayde any man with his giftes wée haue and doo still begge of God his holy Spirite to direct vs both in the discerning of the Bookes of the Scriptures and in the finding out of the true sense of the same And wee doo finde the saying of our Sauiour Christ written by Saint Luke chapter 11. very true Luc 11. Si vos cum sitis mali nostis c. If you being euill doo know how to giue good giftes to your children how much more shall your heauenly Father giue the holy Spirite to them that craue it of him wee haue craued that holy spirite and doo still craue it of our heauenly Father Wee haue receyued it and doo still receiue it in some measure Wée are thereby made able to iudge the spirits and according to the counsell of S. Iohns first Epistle 1 Iohn 4. and fourth chapter Wée belieue not euery spirite but wée doo trie the spirites And finding that the holy spirite of God did mooue them that first wrote the bookes of the Bible to write as they did write therefore wée doo thankfully receiue those bookes as holy scripture and doo reuerendly vse them as a Lanterne to our feete and a light vnto our pathes After this maner did the Catholique men that haue liued before vs endeuor to know the canonicall Scriptures from such as are pro haue And as S. Augustine writeth vpon the last Psalme August in Psalm 150. Tom 5. Tom. 8. Sunt etiam qui vniuersas omnino scripturas canonicas vnum librum vocent quod valde mirabili diuina vnitate concordent There bée some men also saith S. Augustine that doo name all the canonicall scriptures but one booke bicause they doo agree in a very merueilous and heauenly vnity S. Augustine in his second booke of christian Doctrine August de doct Christ lib. 2. Ca. 5. writeth thus Cap. 8. Totus autem canon scripturarum in quo istam considerationem versandam dicimus his libris continetur In déede the whole canon of the Scriptures wherein wee doo affirme this consideration is to bee vsed is conteined in these bookes And then hée maketh rehersall of those 44. bookes which are contained in that booke which both you and wée doo call the holy Bible concluding thus His quadraginta quatuor libris veteris testamenti terminatur authoritas In these foure and forty bookes is the authority of the olde testament ended Then hée maketh rehersall of the bookes called the New testament which are in number 27. and they are the same that wee haue in our bookes called the New testaments both in gréeke in latine Of al these bookes togither which are in number 71. S. Austen writeth thus In his omnibus libris timentes Deum pietate mansueti quaerunt volūtatem Dei In all these bookes they that feare God are by godlines made modest doo séeke for the will pleasure of God And in the beginning of this 8. chap. of this second booke of christian Doctrine S. Austen dooth instruct euery christian after this maner Erit igitur diuinarum scripturarum solertissimus indagator qui primo totas legerit notasque habuerit si non dum intellectu iam tamen lectione duntaxat eas quae appellantur canonicae He therefore shal be the wisest searcher of the holy scriptures which will first read them through and will haue a perfect knowledge of them although not in vnderstanding as yet but yet already in reading those scriptures onely which are called Canonicall And going forward in this instruction hée saith thus Jn Canonicis autem scripturis Ecclesiarum catholicarum quam plurimum authoritatem sequatur inter quas sane illae sunt quae Apostolicas sedes habere Epistolas accipere meruerunt Let him as much as may bée follow the authority of the Catholike churches in the canonicall scriptures amōgst which churches vndoubtedly those churches are which haue deserued to haue Apostolical seates to receiue Epistles By these woords of S. Augustine it appeareth what was ment in S. Augustins time by these words the Catholique church the canicall scriptures The scriptures were called canonicall that doo containe the rule of faith of maners And the churches were planted by the preaching of the doctrine amongst which those were accounted for the chiefe that had bin planted by the Apostles them selues had had some one of the Apostles resiant amongst them for a time and therefore the places were called Apostolicall seates And these were the congregations that the Apostle Paule did direct his Epistles vnto And heere I doo by the way note that as Rome was Sedes Apostolicae an Apostolike seate so was Corinth Galatia Ephessus Colossa Philippos Thessalonica Wherefore these later were of like authority with the first S. Austen therefore addeth further and saith thus Tenebit igitur hunc modum in scripturis canonicis vt eas quae ab omnibus accipiuntur Ecclesijs catholicis praeponat eis quas quaedā non accipiunt Let him therfore that is a searcher of the scriptures kéepe this meesure in the canonicall Scriptures that hee prefer those scriptures that be receiued of al Catholike churches before those scriptures which certaine Catholike churches doo not receiue By all these words of S. Austen written in the 8. chap. of his second booke De christiana doctrina it appeareth manifestly that the church of Rome although it were then Catholique accounted so to be yet it was not as now you doo account it to be the onely Catholique church of Christ For the other Churches which had bin Apostolike seates had receiued Epistles were Catholique as well as the church of Rome was yea and that all those churches were but particuler churches and none of them vniuersall but members of that vniuersall Church which consisteth of all the particuler churches that are haue bin or shal be vpon earth Yea and it appeareth that some of those Catholique churches did not receiue as canonicall all those bookes that are contained in the Bible although they did in some sorte account them canonicall as containing rules necessary for maners though not for faith In Tom. 4. Tom. 4. of S. Hieroms works it appeareth the Ruffinus a learned Priest and such a one as S. Hierome liked well of liuing about 400. yéeres after Christes ascention did not alow for
canonicall mo bookes then these In the olde testament saith hée the fiue bookes of Moses that is Genesis Exodus Leuiticus Numbers Deuteronomium After these Iesus Naue of the Iudges togither with Ruth After these foure bookes of the raignes of kings which the Hebrews doo account but two Paralipomenon which is called the booke of dayes and two of Esdras which they doo receaue each by it selfe and the booke of Hester And of the Prophets Esaie Ieremie Ezechiell Daniell bisides these one booke of the xii Prophets Iob also and the Psalmes of Dauid are each of them one booke Salomon also hath giuen vnto the churches thrée bookes the Prouerbs Ecclesiastes and Cantica canticorum In these bookes haue the fathers shut vp the number of the bookes of the old testamēt And of the New testament there are foure Gospelles of Mathew Marke Luke and Iohn The Acts of the Apostles which Luke dooth describe Fouretéene Epistles of Paule the Apostle of Peter the Apostle two of Iames the brother of the Lord an Apostle one Epistle of Iudas one of Iohn thrée and the Apocalyps of Iohn These bée the volumes which the fathers haue shut vp within the canon whereof the father would that the assertions of our faith should consist Notwithstanding it is néedefull to bée knowne that there be other bookes also which are not canonicall but our auncestors haue called them Ecclesiastical That is to say wisdome which is said to bée Salomons And another Wisdome which is said to bée of the sonne of Sirach which is by the Latinists named by the same generall name Ecclesiasticus By which name not the author of the booke but the qualitie of the scripture is named And of the same Order is the booke of Tobias Iudith and the bookes of Machabies Thus far Ruffinus in his creede or confession of beliefe set foorth by saint Hierome And not many liues after this hée writeth thus These volumes haue the fathers deliuered vnto vs which as I haue said it hath séemed to mée méete to note out for the instruction of such as doo take vpon them the first rudimēts of the church of faith that they may know out of what fountaines the cups of the woord of God must bée drawne Now M. Offerer I pray you confer these words of Ruffinus with that decrée that was made by your fathers of the Tridentine councel in their 4. Session wherein they allow for canonicall all those bookes that haue bin are cōtained in that booke which is cōmonly called the Bible With them the bookes of Tobias Hester Iudith Wisdome Ecclesiasticus the two bookes of the Machabies are of as great authoritie as the rest and they doo denounce accursed all such as doo not or shall not receiue for canonicall all those books and euery part of them making no diffrence betwixt these and the other which Ruffinus hath said the fathers haue deliuered vnto vs as fountaines out of which the cups of the word of God must be drawn Let your fathers therfore denounce accursed this Ruffinus and those fathers that he speaketh of for they be of one minde with vs. Let them accursse S. Hierome that hath set foorth this Créede of Ruffinus as a sound confession of the Christian faith Let them excōmunicate S. Gregorie Grego Morali in 29. lib. Cap. 19. Hiero. in praefacio prou that in the 19. of his morall exposition of the 29. Chapter of Iob dooth confesse that the first booke of the Machabies is not canonicall Yea let them accursse S. Hierome as black as a pot for that in his preface to the prouerbes of Salomon he saith thus The church dooth read the bookes of Iudith Tobie the Machabies for th'edification of the people but not to confirme the authority of the doctrines of the Church This Hierome such other were the fathers the Ruffinus saith haue deliuered to vs the other bookes of the Bible not these to bee fountaines for vs to draw the cups of Gods word out of them And with these would wée rather bée accursed then blessed with your popish Catholique fathers in your Tridentine counsell You frame an argument after this maner If the Catholique church had the true spirite of God in discerning iudging the true scriptures of God from the rest not scriptures why should not we belieue the same Catholike church gouerned led by the same spirit in giuing the true sence meaning vnderstanding of the scriptures To this I answere That the romish Catholique church which now is hath continued for the space almost of a thousand yéeres is not neither hath bin led by the true spirit of God either in discerning or iudging the true scriptures of God from the rest c. Nor yet in giuing the true sence c but it hath bin and is still led by the spirite of Antichrist And that neuer more apparantly then at the Tridentyne counsell as by the canons of the same counsell dooth most manifestly appéere to as many as with indifferent iudgement can and will reade them Thus haue I shewed you sufficient reasons whereby you might bée mooued to yeelde and ioyne with vs in religion and no longer to depend vpon the iudgement of that Antichristian church which you call Catholique for that you may sée if you bee not altogither blinded that it is not the true spirite of God that hath and dooth leade your Catholique church but in déede the false spirite of Antichrist The fourth Offer Offerer Fourth Let the Protestants make sufficient proofe by auncient writers of the Ecclesiastiall histories what church it is that al these fifteene hundreth yeeres past hath continued through out firme and stedfast while all other conuenticles and cōgregations as well of Arians as of the Nestorian Maniches Nouatians Vigilians Iouinians and the rest of Heretikes of all sortes haue decayed bin conuinced and ouerthrowne and that by any other Church then by the common knowne Catholique church of Christ and I shall then yeelde and recant and not before Crowley It is very true that the knowne Catholike church hath bin and still is as for these fiftéene hundreth yéeres last past it hath bin the meane that God hath vsed in the conuinsing ouerthrowing of Arians Nestorians and the rest of the Heretikes that you speake of It is most true also that the same Catholike church hath all this time continued firme and stedfast but how can you prooue that your popish Catholike church is that knowne Catholike church of Christ that you speake of Héerein lieth the difficulty It is not enough for you to say that your romish church is the Catholike church but you must prooue it Your antiquity your vniuersality your vnity with your continuall succession of Bishops will not serue your turne Your antiquity is not so auncient as ours by 4600. yéeres almost For ours began in Adam hath continued euer since yours began to florish in the daies of Phocas the
God to giue his Church libertie to make publique profession of fayth and religion as now for the space of 29. yéeres togeather he hath doone in this realme of England such as be members of the true Catholique Church doo and haue doone by the permission and commaundement of our Prince whom God hath appointed to gouerne vs as it becommeth Catholike Christians to doo in open praier preaching and administration of Sacramentes And to the ende that all thinges may bée doon orderly and as it beseemeth we haue bishops al other necessary ministers orderly elected admitted to minister vnto vs the word and to exercise publique prayer necessarie discipline suche as the higher powers vnder whome we liue doo thinke méete to be exercised As for the vniformity of your solemne Ceremonies that had not had so long continuance for the space of fiftéene hundreth yéeres nor yet for the space of fifty yéeres For by the confession of your holy father Pope Pius quintus the difference of ceremonies vsed euen in your holy Masse was such before the tyme of your last generall Councell which began at Trident. Anno. 1545. that it was thought méete by them to take order for the reformation thereof But though it had béene as auncient as you would haue it what great matter is there in it to prooue thereby that your Church is the true Church of Christ sith it is an easie matter for any sorte of men to agrée in outward and solemne Ceremonies although the same bee neuer so superstitious vaine and foolish But here is a matter of greater waight that is the vnity of fayth that your Church hath had these 1500 yéeres last past continually I haue already prooued that your Antichristian Church hath not had continuance so long by 600. yeres almost And it shal be an easie matter to prooue that the fayth of your Church hath in the time that it hath had continuance varied very often in some poyntes of greatest wayght as you doo account of them The generall councell of Basill beléeued that theyr authority was aboue the authority of the Pope and that they might depose hym and therefore they dyd depose Eugenius that then was Pope and choose an other in his place And the same Eugenius bolding a Councell at Farrary beléeued that he had authority to excommucate the generall councell And this article was long doubted of Whether the Pope or the generall counsell should haue the supreme authoritie And about the wordes of consecration I thinke your Church is not yet agréede whether the vertue â—hat turneth the substaunce doo lye in the verbe Est or in the sillable vm And whether the substance of breade and wyne bée turned into the substaunce of the body and bloode of Christ or whether that substaunce departing and giuing place the body and blood of Christ doo occupie the place thereof vnder the qualities of bread and wine And whether the mouse that eateth the consecrated rake doo eate the bodie of Christ or no. In these high poyntes of religion and in dyuers other of lyke sorte the vnitie of your fayth hath béene and styll is sore shaken But I perceyue that which followeth in thys conclusion of thys offer that the fayth whych you speake of is that fayth or beleefe that you haue in that Church of yours which you call Catholique You neuer trouble your selfe with the waighting and examining of matters of beléefe for you confesse that you must of necessitie beléeue the Church So that your determination is to beléeue whatsoeuer that Church hath or shall determine and commaund you to beléeue although you knowe not what that Church either hath or shall determine Thus your late prosilite Frier Iohn Frauncis of Nigeon in Fraunce dyd in his letters that he wrote to his mother instruct her to beléeue But here riseth a doubte whether this Church be the general councell the colledge of Cardinalles or the Popes holines alone If it bee the generall councell what shifte would you haue made when two generall councelles were holden at one tyme and decréede contrarie the one to the other the one holden at Basill and the other at Farrarie If it be the colledge of Cardinalles which way would you haue turned your selfe when there were thrée Popes at one tyme and each Pope had his colledge of Cardinalles If it bée the Pope him selfe then tell mée vpon whome you would haue hanged your fayth when there was no Pope for the space of two yéeres togeather and when there were three Popes at one tyme and when haueing but one Pope the same was an Arrian or Saddusey or had giuen hym selfe to the Deuill that hee myght bée made Pope I leaue this to your discretion or to the discretion of some one of your sorte that shall take in hand to replye to this aunswer that I make to these your offers You saye that your Church hath in her selfe all holie functions of the spirite as workinge of miracles remission of sinnes and the true sence and interpretation of Gods worde A straunge manner of ennumeration of partes All the holie functions of the spyrite are innumerable and therefore they are commonlie sayd to bée seuen by which number béeing a perfecte number an infinite multitude is commonly signified But you set downe thrée for all The working of miracles is one of those holye functions that you speake of You meane I am sure of those miracles that haue béene and are wrought in your places of Pilgrimage and by the rotten reliques of your Sayntes whereof I haue heard great boast and some experience I haue séene in England The holy mayd of Kent with her confederates wrought manie myracles in the dayes of King Henrie the eyght as in our Chronicles is to bée séene but in the ende she was founde to bée an arrante Whore and so was the holie made of Lemster that was nothing inferiour to the other in working of myracles The holy Roode of Bostone the holie Roode of Boxley the holie Roode of Chester the holie Roode of Northamton and the holie Roode at the North doore of Paules Church with the holy Roode in Roode Lane in London were not behinde the rest in working miracles by the helpe of knaues that had the kéeping of them I might speake of the holy blood at Hailes which was sayd to bee a portion of the bloode of Christ Saint Thomas of Canterburie S. Thomas of Hereford S. William of Mawuerne S. Ioseph of Shaftesburie and holy King Henrie of Windsore King Kenelme of Cowbadge S. Hugh of Lincolne and S. Robert of Naseborowe and a number of blessed Ladies to many to bée rehearsed by name The knauerie that was practized in these places is so well knowen in England that your miracles can haue no credite amongst such English men as haue not Roomish hartes Yea and our sauiour Christ hath forewarned vs Math 24. Math 24 That in these latter dayes many false Christs and false prophets shal arise shal
eyther admit any to be of the fellewship of Christians or by excommunication cut of any man from that body of Christ but onely that knowen Catholique church of Christ which is builed vpon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets Iesus Christ being the head cornerstone You doo therefore offer vs great iniurie in that you require vs to prooue that which we dyd neuer affirme But I sée what stone it is that the Offerer dooth so often stumble at He is perswaded that there can be no knowen Catholique Church of Christ but that Romishe Church whereof he himselfe is a member which is now manifestly knowen to be an Antichristian congregation and not the knowen Catholique Church of Christ as the Offerer and hys fellowes would beare vs in hand that it is The knowen Catholique Church of Christ hath alwayes vsed to execute ecclesiasticall censures vpon such as haue béene offensiue in lyfe and manners and vpon such as haue béene disturbers of the common peace of the Church and so doo we at this day without respect of any mans person so farre foorth as in dutifull obedience to such as God hath made our gouernour we may But to excommunicate and depose Princes we haue not learned of S. Paule nor of the Fathers that lyued in the first sixe hundered yéeres after the ascention of our Sauiour Christ Your bragge of 1500. yéeres continuance in the executing of your discipline must bee cut shorter by 600. yéeres for your Catholique Antichristian Church hath not floryshed in her pride full one thousand yéeres as yet neither haue you executed your tirannous discipline in such sorte as you would séeme to haue doone in that tyme of your tirannous raigne But whensoeuer you tooke in hand to execute any discipline you had and so yée haue still a speciall regarde to your owne ease and commoditie and to the aduanceing and vpholding of your owne honour and dignity Your owne Histories are full of the reportes of your corrupt and partiall dealinges in that behalfe It is God himselfe that hath prescribed an order of discipline and hath in all tymes and ages committed the execution thereof to hys Church which hath had continaunce euen from the beginning of the world This discipline was first engrauen in the hartes of men and after that in tables of stone and last of all in bookes that by those outwarde meanes the discipline grauen in the hart might be daily refreshed but euen the best men that haue béene in Authority in the Church and haue had the execution of thys discipline haue béene to slacke in that he halfe as by histories it appeareth No maruaile therfore though to great slacknes in the execution of this discipline be found in that Church which you and your sorte doo account to be Schismaticall but is in déede Catholique and that knowen Catholique Church from which your Antechristian Church is fallen That discipline that you make so great a reckoning of is your cannon lawe I am sure which your Popes haue patched together since they gate the vpper hand and enforced Princes to doo them seruice and to kysse their féete That discipline you execute with Precipimus firmiter iniungendo mandamus Wee charge you say you and with firme iniūction we commaund you And what is it that you doo thus commaund to be doone That such a man or such a woman as hath not appeared in your courte or hath refused to pay such fées as your officers requyre or that hath failed in dooing some acte that by that lawe they are bound to doo be denounced excommunicated sub pena iuris Vnder payne of hauing the penalty of the Lawe executed vppon that minister that wyll not denounce such a one excommunicated But if a whore or a whoremonger a drunkarde or a blasphemer of God an Vsurer or a simmoniacke or any other wicked person shal be conuented before your ecclesiasticall iudge if hys pursse be waightie and his hande readie to reache out money in paying double fées and in giuing to such vses as you cal Godly so that you may haue the disposing therof then this party must be receiued as a communicant amongest Christians although it doo appeare manyfestly that there is neyther amendment of lyfe nor hope of repentaunce shewed any way And would God that our execution of discipline were more frée from this corruption then it is But that wyll not be so long as so many of your minde may be suffered to bée in offyce vnder them that haue the execution of discipline I thinke you doo now sée that the right dscipline hath not béene prouided and made by men neither of your sorte nor of ours but by God himselfe And that there hath béen and is still as great yea greater corruption vsed in the executing of discipline amongst you as is or hath béene amongst vs. Yea and that your Church which is Antichristian hath not had the continuance of 1500. yéeres in that glory that now it dooth claime vnto it selfe Wherfore I doo require you now to recant according to promise although you would not before The seauenth Offer Offerer Seauenth Let me knowe of the Protestantes what Church hath brought forth for the space of these fifteene hundered yeeres past as Children begotten of her owne wombe so many thousandes of blessed Martyrs of stoute and bolde confessers of pure and innocent virgins and of other holy Saintes of all sortes and so acknowledged by eyther party And if it shal in fine fall out that any one of them was of the Protestantes congregation fayth or beleefe whiles they liued heere and not of the common knowen fayth and religion of the Catholique Church of Christ or that they were approoued and canonized for Saintes when they were dead by the Protestantes congregation not onely by the Catholique Church of Christ I shall then submit and recant and not before Crowley It séemeth that M. Offerer hath conceiued a wrong opinion of vs Protestantes He séemeth to be perswaded that none of vs haue seene the Histories of the Church Otherwise he had béene too too madde to make this large Offer For any Protestant that hath reade any thing of the Ecclesiasticall Histories may easily enforce him eyther to flie from his promisse or else to submitte himselfe and recant If any one sayth hée amongst the thousandes of the blessed Martyrs c. Shal be found to haue béene of the Protestantes fayth and religion c. Then he wyll submit hymselfe and recant I am sure of it that amongst the thousands that suffered Martirdome within the space of the first six hundereth yeres after Christs ascention he can not name one that was not whiles he liued of the same faith religion that we be of now Al we do beleue al the articles of the common tréed so did they we do beléeue that as there is but one God so there is but one mediatour betwixt God man and that the same is the man Christ Iesus
they preach except they be sent Had no such meaning as this Offerer dooth beare the world in hand that hée had That is that no preachers can be thought to be sent of God but such only as are allowed of by some popish Prelate S. Augustine in his Dialogue of 65. August in Dialog 65. questionū questions if that booke may bée called his hath this question in the later end of that booke Quot genera sunt Apostolatus vel quale nomen sit Apostolus volo cognoscere I am willing to know saith Orosius how many sorts of Apostleships there bée or what maner name this name Apostle is The answere that saint Augustine is supposed to make is thus This name Apostle is interpreted to signifie sent Of Apostles or messēgers there be foure sorts or kings One sort are sent from God not by men another sort are sent from God but yet by mē a third sort are sent by men onely and the fourth sort are sent of them selues From God only was Moses sent from God by man was Iosua sent by man onely are such sent as by the fauor of the cōmon people are aduaunced to the office of priesthoode as in our daies many are Of themselues are sent such as be false prophets then Orosius asketh another question which is the last question of that booke Quomodo possumus scire qui mittatur a Deo How may wée know saith hee who it is that is sent of God Augustine answereth Illum cognosce missum a Deo quem non paucorum hominū laudatio vel potius adulatio eligit sed illum quem vita mores optimi apostolicorum actio commendat sacerdotum vel etiam qui vniuersorum populorum iuditio comprobatur qui non appetit praeesse qui nec pecuniam dat vt Episcopatus honorem acquirat Nam qui praeesse festinat quidam patrum eliganter expressit dicens sciat se non esse Episcopum qui praeesse cupit non prodesse In english thus Know this that not the man whom the commendation or rather the flatterie of a few men dooth choose but he whom both life and maners of the best sort the action of Apostolike priestes dooth commend is sent of God or els that man that is allowed of by the iudgment of all people such a one as desireth not to beare rule that doth not giue money that he may obtaine the honor of a bishop For he that is hasty to beare rule is by one of the Fathers finely painted out in this saying let that man that coueteth to beare rule and not to doo good know that hée is no bishop In these woords of S. Augustine it appéereth that in his iudgment it is not the ordinarie calling and externall vnction that wee should looke vnto when wée bee desirous to know what preachers be sent of God but it is their good life the good liking that good men haue of them yea and the good opinion that all men are enforced to haue in them bicause they sée in them no signe of ambition or desire of honor but contrariwise that they are desirous to be occupied in doing good By these signes saith S. Augustine yee shall know that they are sent of God So that as Chrysosostome saith that they are knowne by the maner of their preaching so S. Augustine doth say that they are knowne by their life But now the Offerer or some of his friends will say that S. Augustine is against vs in these woords Et apostolicorum actio commendat sacerdotum In english thus And such a one as the action of the Apostolike priests dooth commend These Apostolike priests must néedes be popish Catholiques in the iudgment of this Offerer his fellows for with them onely Peter is the Apostle and Rome the Apostolike seate bicause as they imagine Peter was byshop there 25. yéere left his powre authority there with his immediate successor But who was that successor they are not yet agréed for some of them say it was Clement some say it was Limus But this is their conclusion that whosoeuer is bishop of Rome must néedes haue Peters authority by succession in that seate although hee bée in life doctrine neuer so vnlike or cōtrary to Peter And none may be accounted Apostolike but such as be of or vnder the obedience of that Apostolike succession but by the circumstance of S. Augustines woords it appéereth that hee taketh them for Apostolike priests that are most like vnto the Apostles in life and in doctrine and in painefull trauell and in continuall care to doo good in the Church of Christ Such are not the popish Catholiques for all their care is as in the Decrées of their generall Counselles it dooth appéere to aduance them selues in degrée aboue all other sortes of men and to maintaine them selues in that high estate And they are euen the same men that are spoken vnto in those last woords that I haue cyted out of S. Augustine sciat se non esse Episcopum qui praeesse cupit non prodesse Let that man which coueteth to beare rule and not to doo good knowe that hee is no bishop But let vs nowe see what this Offerer hath cited out of the fift Chapter to the Hebrewes Heb. 5. Nec quisquam sibi sumit honorem nisi qui vocatur a Deo quemadmodum Aaron No man taketh honor vnto him selfe except hee bée called of God as Aaron was First I must note that this Offerer hath not dealt simply in that he hath translated these wroodes thus let no man take vnto him selfe c. For by this translation it séemeth to bée a commaundement giuen or a rule set downe by the Apostle which rule must néedes bee kept in the admitting of all such as shal be ministers in the church of Christ So that who soeuer is not admitted according to that rule may not bée taken for a Catholique minister nor his ministration allowed of But let vs sée in what meaning the Apostle did write the woords The circumstance of the text dooth make it plaine that the Apostles purpose was to prooue that Aarons priesthoode was at an ende and that the high priestes that had bin made after the Order of Aaron were farre inferiour vnto Christ that is our high Priest not after the Order of Aaron but of Melchizedech And yet our Sauiour Christ was no vsurper for hée was called of God as Aaron was And herein hée was like vnto Aaron But in that Aaron and such as were made high Priests after his Order did offer Sacrifice for their owne sinnes Christ was nothing like them for hee neded not to offer for any sinnes of his owne sith there was no sinne in him But how maketh this for our Offerers purpose The Apostles meaning was to prooue that Aarons Priesthoode was now come to an ende and must now giue place to the Priesthoode of Christ which shoulde neuer haue
that hee will neuer remember them anie more 1 Iohn 2 and that therefore there is no more sacrifice for sin And in the second chapter of S. Iohns first Epistle wee are assured that Christ Iesus the righteous is the propitiation for our sinnes Your opinion therefore concerning a Sacrifice propitiatorie to bée offered in your Masse is blasphemous and dooth derogate from the glorie of Christ who is our onely mediator whose mediation is sufficient and néedeth no helpe of your massing Préesthoode Your penaunce also is in some part blasphemous as in that you teache your ghostly children to satisfie to God for theyr sinnes by suche workes as you enioyne them to doo And the fruites thereof which you call worthy as fasting watchinge praying and all straightnes of lyfe are supersticious and Hipocriticall and therefore we speake against them Your vowes your inuocation of Saints and your prayers for the soules departed are superfluous and in your meaning superstitious in very déed very wicked blasphemous For what néede hath a Christian to adde any vowe to that which is made in baptisme sith no man can truely say that eyther he hath or could performe that vow so but that God might iustly charge him with the lacke of performaunce thereof That vowe is to forsake the deuill and all his works and pompes the vanities of the wicked world and all the sinfull lustes of the fleshe To beléeue all the articles of the Christian fayth and to kéepe all the commaundementes of God all the dayes of our lyfe If this vowe bee so straight that not one amongst thousandes can bée sound that dooth not fayle in performing of it then is it more then superfluous to adde any other which may séeme to bée more straight and hard to be performed then this is or séeme to bée Your praying vnto Saintes also is superfluous For God himselfe that is all sufficient and able to doo for vs all that we doo or can desire yea and much more then wee can deuise to craue of him hath commaunded vs to call vpon hym yea and he hath promised to heare vs and to giue vs cause to glorifie him for our deliueraunce In the 50. Psal Psalme 50. the prophet Dauid saith thus in the person of God himself Jnuoca me in die tribulationis eruaÌ„ te honorificabis me Call vpon me in the day of thy trouble I wil deliuer thée thou shalt honor me And in the Psalm 81 Open thy mouth wide Psal 81 145. and I wil fil it And in the Psa 145. The Lord is hard at hand with euery one that calleth vpon him which eueryone the calleth vpoÌ„ him faithfully Esay the Prophet cha 63. Esay 63 Made his praier vnto God not to AbrahaÌ„ not to Isacke not to Iacob The apostle Paule bowed his knées that is to say hee prayed to the father of our Lord Iesus Christ that is the diuine maiestie not to the Saintes or holy Angels Ephe 3. Ephes 3 Our Sauiour Christ teaching his schollers how they should pray sayth thus When thou wilt pray enter into thy chamber and when thou hast shut thy doore pray vnto thy father in secrete and thy father which séeth in secret shall giue vnto thée And againe he sayth On this wise therefore shall you pray Our father which art in heauen c. Math 6. Math 6. By these places of Scripture and many other we are encouraged to make our prayers vnto God and to be assured that he dooth heare vs and that he will graunt our peticions For hée is both able and ready to helpe vs as a most mighty and mercifull father It is therefore a thing altogeather vayne and superfluous and vnnecessarie to make any prayers to any other In lyke manner it is a thing altogeather vnnecessary to make prayers for the soules departed For if they be departed in the Lord they be happie and blessed as wee are certified by that voyce which came from Heauen Apo 14. Apoc â—â— And on the contrary if they departed not in the Lord then are they most vnhappie and cursed so that thereis no saluation for them Nothing that we can doo can profit them So that in the one case they doo not stand in néede of our prayers and in the other our prayers can doo them no good Your prayer therefore for the dead is altogether superfluous and vnnecessary Your opinion in this poynt is grounded vpon no Canonicall Scripture but vpon an imagination that you haue conceiued concerning the meaning of Iudas Machabaeus 2. Mach 12 2 Mach 12. Of what authoritie the booke is may appeare in that which Saint Hierome hath written in hys preface vpon the bookes of Salmon Hierom praef in pruden Salomon Thus hath Saint Hierome written there Sicut ergo Iudith Tobiae Machabeorum libros legit quidem Ecclesia sed eos inter canonicas scriptura non recipit sic haec duo volumina c. In English thus Euen as the Church dooth in déede reade the bookes of Iudeth and Tobias and of the Machabies but doth not receiue them amongst the cannocall Scriptures euen so she may reade these two bookes meaning the Booke of wisedome and Ecclesiasticus to the edifying of the people but not for the confirming of Ecclesiasticall doctrine By this it appeareth that the foundation of your imagination is verie weake and not sufficient to beare that waightie buildinge that you doo lay vpon it Which is as weighty as an article of our fayth The authoritie of that booke may bée séene also euen in the last lines of the booke wherein the authour dooth shewe himselfe to stand in doubt whether he had doon so well as he wished to doo and in case he had not he craueth pardon at the handes of his readers And he vseth a similitude to mooue his readers to pardon him Which is not found in any of the writers of the Canonicall Sriptures And in the latter part of the 14. Chapter of that second booke of the Machabies 2 Macha 14 theris great commendation giuen to one Razias for that he dyd murder himselfe whych can not make for the credite of the author of the booke neither of the matter contained in the booke But let the booke bée of as great authority as this Offerer wold with it to be what hath Iudas Machabaeus doone that may mooue vs to thinke that he had any such meaning as this Offerer and his fellowes doo imagine the he had The Historian sayth that afâ—er the Armie of Gorgias was by the mightie power of God put to flight Iudas hauing gathered his armie togeather came to the Cittie Odolla And when the seauenth day was come and they were purified 2 Mach Chap 12. according to the custome they did in the same place spende the time of the Saboth And the next day following Iudas came with his company to take vp the deade bodies of them that were slaine and