Selected quad for the lemma: authority_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
authority_n	bind_v	church_n	law_n	2,400	5	5.0344	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A70057	Logos autopistos, or, Scriptures self-evidence to prove its existence, authority, certainty in it [sic] self, and sufficiency (in its kind) to ascertain others that it is inspir'd of God to be the only rule of faith : published as a plea for Protestants in the defence of their profession and intended only for the use and instruction of the vulgar sort.	Ford, Thomas, 1598-1674.	1667 (1667)	Wing F1514; Wing L2842; ESTC R13905	71,286	202

it much rather then a●…y thing else Hence it is that we care so little sor Tradition because it is the testimony of men For we have no faith to save us but faith in God and know not how we can have faith in God but by receiving the Testimony which he himself hath given When Papists attribute so much to Tradition for ascertaining Scripture we cannot yield to them in it because we believe that God so speaks to men as they may know that it is he that speaks If he do not it is because he will not or because he cannot That he cannot no man can say without blasphemy To say he will not is little better For he hath not spoken in secret but openly and plainly so as they to whom he hath spoken have known certainly it was the Lord that spake to them And this is indeed the Spirit of Prophecy not only to decl●…re the will and minde of God but to ascertain those unto whom it was declared that it was so And such is Scripture vz. a Revelation of Gods will so made as men may know that God hath spoken Wherefore though Papists say of Scripture as the Jews said of our Saviour Thou bearest record of thy self thy record is not true We answer as Christ answered for himself Though it bear record of it self yet its record is true For as it was the will of God that men should understand his mind so he spake in such a manner as they might know it was God that spake and not man or any creature For what can be said or thought more unworthy of God then that he hath spoken to men but in such a manner as he cannot be understood unless there be some other to ascertain them it is he that speaks we can speak to one another either by word or writing so as to know who speaks as well as what is spoken But God it seems to Papists must have some others to pass their word for him before he can have any credit with men And what is it that must ascertain us beyond all further question that Scripture is the very Word of God Only Tradition or the Testimony of the Church in all ages successively conveying down the faith once delivered by Christ and his Apostles For the satisfaction of those who need or desire it we shall inlarge in our answer yet not to exceed the bounds of our intended breviy 1. We acknowledge That the Church is bound to give testimony to Scripture as the Word of God and that the true Church hath so done in all ages we Protestants do believe But we say withall that the Church is only an outward instrument or means in giving this testimony and hath no authority such as Papists plead for or dominion over our faith We are so far from making it the Rule of faith as we stand to affirm we do not be●…ieve the Scripture because the Church saith it is the Word of God but we believe it such for its own and the Spirits testimony though no men bear witness to it For what is the Church make the best of it but a company of men more or less that believe the doctrine of Christ And where had these men this doctrine Or how came then by it Had they it not in Scripture Christ indeed delivered it by word of mouth and by his Spirit to his Apostles and they preached this doctrine But I hope Papists will not say That the new Testament was not penned by the Evangelists and Apostles or that the next Church received any doctrine other then is therein recorded so we are come to the very foundation of the Church such as is mentioned Ephes. 2. 20. The Church is founded upon Scripture and not Scripture upon the Church Indeed a Church is nothing but a company of men that believe Scripture and make it the ground work of their Faith And so is it distinguished from all other societies The Church did not make or frame the Scripture but received it made ready to their hands God had his Secretaries who wrote his wills and commands and to the obedience of these men have been called and such as submitted and came in have been the Church in all ages Hence the Church we say hath more need of Scriptures testimony then Scripture hath of the Churches and accordingly Protestants judge of the Church by Scripture and not of Scripture by the Church Questionless when God shall judge all by the Man whom he hath appointed he will try all Churches and men by his own Laws And where those Laws are we leave Papists to enquire For we know none but such as we find in Scripture They tell us a very fair tale of the infallibility of Tradition How impossible it is that the first Church which received the doctrine of Christ from the Apostles could be so unnatural as wittingly to hide it from posterity and deliver over to the next generation such lyes as would unavoidably damn them Now we suppose as well as they that all Parents and Progenitors have so much natural affection as not to procure willingly or wittingly the damnation of their Children But this will not prove say we Tradition to be so infallible as they would have it For Tradition or delivering any matter from hand to hand by word of mouth is and must be uncertain yea and soon fail if there be not some Records whereupon to bottom it And for this we desire them to consider That though in the first ages God was pleased to let his will be made known from Father to Son after he had once declared and revealed it yet God did not leave all to Tradition but ever and anon renewed the Revelations of his will as occasion required And this he did when those Patriarchs lived ten times so long as any have ordinarily lived for very many ages And when afterwards Abrahams seed was grown into a multitude it seemed good to the wisdom of God to have the lively Oracles enrolled and committed to writing Hence we think it rational to conclude that God thought his will written to be more infallible and certain then as delivered by word of mouth from hand to hand Once we are sure That whiles the mind of God was delivered without writing it all the world was corrupted so as all flesh had perverted their way in the times of Noah They had all of them at first the doctrine which God revealed to Adam and how came they to be corrupted as they were if Tradition cannot possibly fail Or how came the world after the Flood to be filled with Idols so as Abraham must be called out from the posterity of Shem whose posterity had the true Religion delivered to them If Tradition be so faithfull in the delivery of what is committed to it we wonder how true Religion should fail so soon and that not among a few but all the world over When it is said That some Hereticks have risen

shall we be sure of this or that Translation Sol. We grant that some have erred and any may unless there were an infallible Spirit to a●…st What is this to us who maintain not this or that Translation but the Scriptures well and faithfully translated to be the Rule of Faith True our Translations have been altered but this alteration hath been in words more then matter And one and the same sence may be expressed divers wayes So we may have different Translations without any error in the matter and Doctrine Nay further what if one Translation should differ from another in sence we are not therefore bound to quit our English Bibles unless it did appear that we have not in them the matter and substance of all Ch●…istian Doctrine And here we require it be shewed and proved that our various Translations do not all agree exactly so far as we have in them all the Articles of Christian Faith which are necessary to be known and believed in order to our happiness The differences in all our Translations are not such or so many as that we should need the Churches authority to assure and settle us For God openeth the hearts of his people to know his voice from others whiles the light of Divine truth gives testimony to it self and receives authority from no other as the Sun is seen by its own light and as we discern sweet from sowre by its own tast However as a learned man hath said we deny not that there are divers means whereby our consciences may be assured Some private as skill in tongues learning labour prayer conference c. Some publick as the ministry which act of the Church is not authority to secure but ministry to shew us that which shall secure us which ministry is founded on the Scripture it self in that from thence it fetcheth the Reasons that may p●…rswade us and sh●…weth the light that doth infallibly assure us And the difference between these two is this That the Spirit is an inward means the teaching of the Church an outward The Spirit Secureth us by kis own authority the Church directeth us by her ministry The Spirit hath light in it self the Church borroweth hers from the Scripture For certain God never since his people had his Laws written to them hath left them without a ministry and this is the great work of that ministry to cause the people to understand the Laws of God And how this can be done amongst our vulgar unless by translating the Scripture let them shew that can for we cannot Whereas our Adversaries take occasion hence to quarrel Scripture as no competent Rule of faith because the unlearned vulgar want a Rule and can have no other then a Bible translated which is liable to many and great mistakes we may justly question them about their Translations For they know there is a Latine Translation not the Original for certain which is with them commended as authentical to say no more Only we desire them first to answer for themselves However we may justly marvel that they send us to Tradition for our assurance about Translations seeing our present English Translations are of no such antient date as we need to enquire much what our Fathers thought of them They are best known and discerned by those who best understand the Originals and have the most helps and means which God hath allowed for such a work as Translating the Scriptures And for these we may without ostentation say that we have as good and as many as they have and the Translations we have are approved of by our Church though not by theirs If the Papists would or could prove that the Scriptures ought not to be translated at all or else help us to a Translation absolutely answerable to the Originals and give us good security for it they should do both us and themselves a good piece of service But there is an absolute necessity of Translations unless we knew of any extraordinary and miraculous way of bringing our people to understand the will of God in his written Word And what then is to be done or what can we do in order to the salvation of poor souls There are some perhaps who can resolve this otherwise then we dare and say Let them alone to be as ignorant as may be and believe only as the Church believes right or wrong But for our part we are of the mind that our people will never grope out the way to Heaven while they are blindfolded nor can we be perswaded that ignorance is the mother of devotion though we know it is the mother of superstition God 〈◊〉 m●…n from darkness u●…to light when he turns them from the power of Satan 〈◊〉 himself Act. 26. 18 and why came our Saviour a ligh●… into the world if we may go to Heaven as blind as we are born what have we to do while we are here ●…pon earth more then to get grace and knowledge and grow in it more and more Heaven is called the inheritance of the Saints in light and Hell is called utter darkness To say no more of this we have the Scriptures translated into English because the greatest number of our people whose souls are as precious as others cannot otherwise understand them without a miracle And we use the best means we have left us to make our people know Gods mind and will in 〈◊〉 written Word And for Tradition we know no use of it unless i●… be fi●…st resolved beyond all exception that we must believe as the Church believes whatever the Scripture saith What hath been said already in answer to the former Queries may serve in part for the 〈◊〉 hand last Q●…ery about the sence and interpretation of Scripture However we shall say what we th●…nk about the letter of Scripture not senc'd and to be senc'd Now the sence of 〈◊〉 that Scripture hath words and 〈◊〉 is the Rule of faith and they read it as any m●…n reads his friends or correspondents letters to know his mind in them or as Factou●…s beyond sea come to know their Merchants orders given them in and by their letters Sometimes a difference arises amongst these and ●…hen what can a Factour do to clear himself more then to produce his Merchants le●…ters and say Here is the order you gave me and I have followed it so do we when we are questioned about our faith we know no other answer but this that we have orders given us in Scripture to believe so and so and not otherwise We cannot in this case abstract the le●…ter from the sence Scholars indeed in their contemplations may make such abstractions But what have we to do with them in practical use or about moral actions for in such cases we must as all sober men do take words and sence together Words and letters as far as we ever learnt serve only to signifi●… mens sence and meaning And so doth the letter of Scripture signifie Gods mind