Selected quad for the lemma: authority_n

Word A	Word B	Word C	Word D	Occurrence	Frequency Band	MI	MI Band	Prominent
authority_n	believe_v	church_n	deny_v	2,096	5	7.0166	4	false

Text snippets containing the quad

ID	Title	Author	Corrected Date of Publication (TCP Date of Publication)	STC	Words	Pages
A41335	Weighty questions discussed I. Whether imposition of hands in separating a person to the work of the ministry be necessry?, II. Whether it be essential to the right constitution of a particular church, that the teaching elders and the members meet alwayes in one place? : whereunto is added a prediction of Mr. Daniel Rogers, minister in Essex, long before the beheading King Charles I and Arch-Bishop Laud, foretelling that they should not dye a natural death / by Giles Firmin ...	Firmin, Giles, 1614-1697.; D. R. (Daniel Rogers), 1573-1652.	1692 (1692)	Wing F969; ESTC R31512	41,078	37

but ordinary Ministers God blesseth their Preaching The Indians some of them are converted gathered into a Church Were they a Church before these Ministers And were they the first Subjects of the Power of the Keys before these Ministers preached to them Let the Scriptures in the Languages that the Spirit of God inspired his Pen-men to write them be sent to a People who never saw them nor heard of them Let this People understand them believe them embrace them give themselves up to them without any Ministry to translate to interpret and to help them to understand and believe I will allow this People to be the Subjectum Primum Secundum Tertium of all the Power of the Keys but rot else Secondly There are others who lay claim to this and impropriate it to themselves as belonging to them only i. e. Bishops as being of a Superior Order above Teaching Elders Thus Bishop Gawden told me it was out of Courtesie that the Bishop admitted Presbyters to impose Hands with them in Ordination Thanks to this Courteous Bishop I thought they had followed the fourth Council of Cartbage But if Presbyters do impose Hands with the Bishop then the Superiority of the Bishop above the Presbyter in Ordination is gone For Imposition of Hands is the Principal thing in Ordination as I will prove anon because one prays at the Imposition that argues no Superiority of Power in him All Bishops were not of this Bishop Gawden's mind not that Bishop of Peterborough who when he ordained many at one time but then take notice That he did ordain them as Presbyter He spoke not without Reason for no Ministerial Acts in the Church are valid but such Acts as are performed by Ministers of Christ's Institution They who are Officers in the Church by Civil or Ecclesiastical Constitution all their Acts as such signifie nothing But his being a Bishop and so superior to a Presbyter was by no Institution of Christ had only jus Humanum to Warrant his Authority and therefore he did not ordain as such a Bishop but as Presbyter Two I know Mr. Statham as I heard and Mr. Samuel Smith who were then Ordained Mr. Smith spake of it often what the Bishop said to them and ●●d them take notice of it Had Mr. Smith lived till now he had been about 78 years of Age suppose him to be Ordained about 25 years of Age some by this may guess what the Name of that Bishop was about 58 years past I have often thought of this the meanest Officers in the Common-Wealth be they Rum-bailiffs Ale-Founders yet they must have Law for their Office to Warrant their Actings But that in the House of God there should be such as look upon themselves as the Chiefest Officers in the Church and yet can shew no Law from the Lord of the House to Warrant their Office this is strange what hath jus Humanum to do in the House of God Is not the Wisdom of the Great God Sufficient to know what Officers to appoint in his House but sinful Man must set up Officers and supream Officers too without him Thus Bishop Gawden told me The Bishop is the Supream Officer He should have said the Arch-Bishop in the Church you Presbyters are but the Pipe-staves the Bishop is the Hoop that holds you together An excellent similitude I desired him to tell me who should be the Cooper to knock on this Hoop I doubt I told him the Pope would swear by his Keys that he must and will be the Cooper And Bellarmin will maintain it by his Argument a Simili c. De Romano Pontif. mibi 204. He told me moreover you Presbyters are no more able to manage the Government of the Church of England than David was able to wield ' Saul's Armour The Government of the Church of England is a hard word there needs an Interpreter We poor Presbyters look only to the Government of our particular Flocks whom we feed with the Word and Sacraments over whom God hath made us Bishops Acts 20.17 28. If all the particular Congregations in England supposing them to be visible Saints were so govern'd then by an Induction of particulars it might be so call'd We do not indeed in our Government use Writs de Excommunicato Capiendo Prisons Fines Cutting off Ears these are Saul's Armour but none of Paul's spiritual Weapons 2 Cor. 10.4 with which we are content If it be well examined it will be found that the Zeal of his Government hath been carried out against Consciencious Men who for Doctrin Worship Discipline stick close to the Word of God without admitting any Humane Inventions to justle with him I say the Zeal has been carried out against those far more than against Whore-mongers Drunkards prophane Swearers Dam'mees c. I can but take notice of Dr. Lightfoot 1 Vol. p. 787 788. that learned Man and Son of the Church of England living in the times of our Persecution who denys Bishops to be Successors to the Apostles And that it is an improbable and unconstant Inference that because there was Subordination between the Apostles and Philip. in Acts 8. that therefore the like is to be reputed betwixt Bishops and other Ministers I have done with this I only aimed at this Teaching Elders may Ordain and we have Divine Authority for it in the Texts before mentioned These we are sure are Officers in the Church by Christs Institution The Lutherans have Bishops yet they deny any inequality jure Divino between Bishops and Presbyters quoad Potestatem Jurisdictionis Therefore Gerrard answering Bellarmin appropriating Ordination to Bishops saith De Minist Eccles p. 261. there is not one tittle in all God's Book that Ordination by Bishops should be valid but by Presbyters should be Null The next thing is it must be performed with Imposition of Hands I named five Scriptures for this before What Dr. Owen saith Ordination of Ministers is one thing Imposition of hands is another differing as the whole and the part I yield it by this whole he must mean totum integrale it cannot be totum universale but we say in Logick suolata qualibet parte tollitur perfectio Integri sed sublata parte principali tollitur integrum Then I say where there is not Imposition of hands there is no Ordination for this Imposition is the principal part and so tollitur Integrum That it is the principal part I prove and this shall be my first Argument 1st The Spirit in the Apostles sets forth the whole Ordinance of Ordination only by Imposition of Hands but never by Fasting and Prayer 1 Tim. 4.14 the laying on of the Hands of the Presbytery 1 Tim. 5.22 Lay Hands on no Man suddenly That in those Texts Ordination is meant and not Confirmation nor reception of Penitents nor the Sick I have proved in another Tract so that I insist not upon them Heb. 6.2 This my Brother with whom I now deal denyes to be Ordination but it is meant

Hands It lyes upon you to shew where that Precept or President is I know no such Texts you acted did you act in Faith that you acted according to God and were well-pleasing to God in your ordaining without Imposition of Hands Then shew us that Divine Testimony upon which your Faith for so acting is grounded You never gave me one as yet and if you cannot do it your Faith in this Act is but vain If there be any thing I do in the House of God for which I cannot give either Precept President necessary Consequence from Scripture or light of Nature I will lay by that Act I will not trouble the Peace of the Church nor hinder Union with my Brethren by keeping up such Practices Thirdly The Apostles did not constitute Churches as you do with one single Pastor c. In Nine Churches we find several Teachers but not one with a single Teacher In a Young Church at Antioch Act. 13.2 3. There were three Teachers to separate Paul and Barnabas There is an Errour then in your Constitution and that does not justifie your Error in Ordination Fourthly Give me a President where the Pastor of one Church did so much as preach or pray in another Church if you cannot then we must not so much as preach or pray in another Church But you have called me and others to preach in your Church To this you answered me You could well do that from Matth. 28.19 go teach all Nations if so then in other Churches Answ First Set by Presidents then it seems you can find none Secondly I may deny your Co●seq●ence at ●●ast according to some Independent Principles unless I preach as a gifted Brother To preach to the Nations who were Heathens and to preach in an Independ●nt Church differ I may preach to Heathen as a Minister of Christ but in an Independent Church as a gi●ted Brother I wish we knew the first Author of this Distinction that we might scratch his Cranium for so witty an Invention What your judgment is as to this distinction Lib. 2. p. 101. I cannot tell But I am of Dr. Owens mind If I did not think my self bo●nd saith he to Preach as a Minister and as a Minister Authorized in all places and on all occasions whe● I am called thereunto I think I should never preach much more in this world Fisthly If that Text will warrant me to preach in another Church it will warrant me to Baptize in another Church if there be need and I am called to it They are joined together and if I may put forth two Acts of Authority I may also put forth a third If there wants a Pastor and I am called to join with others to separate him to his Office we will do it according to the Word with Fasting Prayer and Imposition of Hands without which 't is not Ordination We do not give him the Deficition Sixthly Since then we are come to consequence from Scripture I gave you a Scripture 1 Cor. 12.12 The Body is one and hath many Members c. He does not mean that particular Church of Corinth is that one Body he adds so is Christ v. 13. Jews and Gentiles make up that one Body v. 25. The Members of this one Body must have the same care one of another Does the Apostle tye up his Discourse to the Church of Corinth that the Members of that Church should have care one of another and if one of their Members did ●●●●er v. 26. all the rest of the Members of Corinth suffer with them but for other Churches take no care of them If they suffer you need not suffer with them Certainly this was not the Apostles meaning I look upon all particular Churches to be Members of that one Body It is such a Church in which Christ hath set Apostles Prophets c. v. 28. It is such a Church where some are as Eyes others as Ears some as Feet some as Hands verses 15 16. Therefore he speaks of the Visible Church If every particular Church were the Body of Christ how many Bodies should Christ have But he hath but one Body as the 12th verse and Ephes 4.4 12. tell us Since th●n all particular Churches are but Members of that one Body and the Lord hath commanded the Members to have care one of another Surely the Lord hath not confined the Ministerial Power of a Pastor to his own particular Church so that if a Neighbour-Church have no Pastor that the Pastors near to this Church may not help that Church to a Pastor and in that way which his Word hath declared Your Practice testifieth it for you would make the Person to be ordained and others believe you ordain in another Church and this is an Act of Authority but not as you perform it nor according to God's Word and so it is no Ordination There is a difference between a Ministers helping another Church destitute of an Officer in seeding them with the Word and Sacraments a joyning with others in the Ordination of a Pastor to them and exercising Discipline in that Church in case of Scandal The Church hath some Power to help it self in this Case tho no Pastor For instance a Pastor of a Church not far from us in the time of Persecution leaves England goes beyond-Sea many miles this Church had none to seed them they desired help of their Neighbour Ministers who accordingly did afford them help some preached some baptized their Infants and others Administred the Lord's Supper to them One of the Church fell very foully being seduced by another Professor the Scandal very great so that the Hearts of good People very sad but our Enemies rejoyced it made such a noise in the Country many miles about us that the like I believe have not been known in these Parts I was desired to preach there when I had done my Sermon a Writing was delivered to me wherein the Church desired me to declare to the Congregation which was then very great being no Sermon in the publick place their ab●orrency of such Acts and withal desired me to inform them what was their Duty what they ought to do in such a Case as this I gave them my thoughts thus You are but a Homogeneal Body and so have no power to Excommunicate that being an Act of Authority nor have I any power to call the person to an account and excommunicate But yet this you may do since the person was admitted into Church-Fellowship and Communion with your consent she having fallen so foully dishonoured God so greatly and opened the mouths of Men against Godliness you should first meet together and humble your Souls before God that there should be such Dishonour brought to his Name by one of your Church Then First You have the Lord's Supper Administred sometimes amongst you there you may deny Communion with her Secondly You have times when your Church only meet together for Prayer mutual Conference c. You

not to a Deacon Whom We may appoint over this B●sitess Acts 6.3 say the Apostles It was not their Election that did Constitute them Deacons but the Apostles Authoritatively kppointing them over this Busin●●s We appoint not Y●● appoint As Pharaoh appointed Joseph Governour over Egypt Acts 7.10 the same Word the Act of Authority 3. A Man whom God hath qualified may be Ordained to the Work of the Ministry tho' there he no People to Elect him As if one having gotten the Language of some Heathens he may go and Preach among them and if God bless his Ministry he may Baptize them if there be lent one or two at one time as Philip did the Eunuch and as the Aposles Paul and Bounabas who were Ordained before they were sent sorth to the Gentiles of which we see no need as I said before they carrying their Credentials with them the Power of Miracles but that Man cannot Baptize unless he be Ordained he is not in Authority before he be Ordained So that true Qualisication and Fitness for the Ministry and Authoritative Separation to the Ministry makes A Minister Election of the People makes him their Minister 4. Tho' I deny Election to give the Essence yet suppose Election to be an Ingredient into it where two things meet together to the Constitution of an Officer Subjection and Authority certainly Authority gives the Essence more than Sabmission thus Dr. Owen the People Electing Sabmit themselves and Dr. Ames * Bellar. enera to 2. p. 87. before him answering Bellarmin who made it strange that Sheep should choose their Shepherd Yes saith Dr. Ames rational Sheep may choose their Shepherd not by Jurisdiction but by Sabjection 5. The Scriptures which are for Ordination by Imposition of Hands are more in number and far more clear than those for Election the first Text which they bring for Election Acts 1.15 this differs much from curs for our Election is with Subjection to him whom the People Elect But this was not so Did Peter the Pope will be angry if you tell him so and the other Apostles sabject themselves to him whom they Chose 2ly It was choosing one of their own Order not one above them so does not Popular Election 3ly Tho' Peter did speak to all present yet it does not appear that all present did choose but the Apostles for they could tell best who had accompanied them all the time the Lord Jesus went in and out among them V. 21 22. Surely all that were present could not tell who those were as the Apostles 4ly They gave forth their Lotts V. 26. 5ly They Prayed to the Lord to shew whether of these two Thou hast chosen 24. Is this Text clear for Popular Election The 6 Acts 3. is the clearest for Election but not of a Pastor The 14 Acts 23. is much Controverted and these are all I meet with for Popular Election But for the other we have First God's own Institution Secondly We have five Scriptures more in the New Testament which are plain for it which makes me wonder how it came about that any Men of Learning should put so much upon Election that it should give the Essence to a Minister 6. The Peoples Election gives the Essence to a Minister What without his Ac●●ptation No sure If ten Churches choose a Man he may resuse them every one he may have Reasons for it Where then is the Essence their Election gives my Acceptation is every whit as essential to my being a Minister as their Election why then is the Causality given to their Election To be a Minister to them that they may demand of me and I be bound to administer all Ordinances to them by way of Office I grant here their Election and my Acceptation are essential But to be A Minister hath other Causes where Popular Election hath no Cansality That a People must subject themselves to a Minister and persorm all the Duties the Word of Go I require to a Minister and yet not choose him is Tyranny fit for Rome not for the Church of Christ This Notion of Popular Election giving the Essence to a Minister is the ground of that Witty Distinction of a Minister's Preaching if he Preach to his People that Chose him then he Preaches as a Minisler but if in another Church then as a Cisted Brother And hence they must not Administer the Sacraments in another Church tho' there be need and the Church desire he must not Act as a Minister beyond them who gave him the Essence of a Minister And this they would prove or illustrate from a Mayor of a Corporation who out of his Corporation hath no Power Ans 1. In a Kingdom or Corporation 't is sufficient there be a People first of whom neither the King nor the Mayor are Causes in the least in the Church 't is not sufficient there be a People but such a People viz. Visible Saints of whom God hath Ordained the Ministry to be in his Hand the Instrument to make them such So that the Ministry is first and an Instrumental Cause to make them a People as such 2. The Work of a Mayor is to Govern only A Minister hath other Work to feed with Word and Sacraments which they may do when called to it where they cannot Govern as I shew'd before 3. The Catholick visible Church made up of particular visible Churches is called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Ephes 4.4 1 Cor. 12.12 and we are all Members of that one Body and the Members are bound to help one another else 't is contrary to the Light of Nature 1 Cor. 12.25 But where do you read that all Corporations and Kingdoms make one Body of Christ 4. I think Pastors and Teachers are Ministers the Apostle calls himself and others so Ministers 1 Cor. 3.5 The Apostles were Catholick Pastors to the Catholick Church * 2 Cor. 11.28 The Care of all the Churches Actu primo secundo depended upon the Call of no Church to Act in that Church al. Acts of Power yet Ministers Hence we say the Ministry † 1 Tim. 1.12 2 Tim. 4.5 Col. 4.17 not ●he Pastorship I then a Man be a Pastor of such a Church both Actu primo secundo yet he is a Minister and doth habitually actu primo bear a respect to the Catholick Church and may perform the Acts of a Minister to another Church that is in want and cannot at present help themselves and call upon him to help for as he is a Minister that Church which Called him was no Cause of that What disserence is there between the Acts of a Pastor and a Minister because I read one saying He may Preath as a Minister which is better than a Gisted Brother but not as a Pastor This giving the Keye to the Fraternity as the first Subject of them hath brought in that Sin which Mr. Whan that Emitrent Servant of Christ and my former Pastor calls Koraism * See