against perverters of souls have juridical power if therefore these men had done the contrary and had refused to hear the Church or Churches convened and should teach these decrees came not from the holy Ghost were they not to us as Publicans and Heathens Yea and whâ—â— more could the Church of Pergamus and that of Thyatira Independent 〈◊〉 say our Brethren do in making acts against such as hâ—ld the Doctrine of Balaam of the Nicholaâ—… against Iezabel Rev. 2. 14 15. 20. If they should after prctice and practice such impure doctrine but declare them perverters of souls and charge others to keep no fellowship with them and shall all be but a rebuke such a counsel as one private man giveth to heathen and sure Pauls rebuke of these at Athens Act. 17. though it made not up the rebuke of a Church yet Paul rebuked them not as a private man or as a godly woman may rebuke Idolaters but formally as a Pastor And Paul and Barnabas as Pastors removed the Caadlestick and turned to the Gentiles Act. 13. and unchurched the Jews which no private men could do So the prophesies of Isaiah Ieremiah Ezekiel against Babylon Persians Tyrus c. as they made not the people to be Churches so they came not from private men but from the immediatly inspired Prophets and such Prophets of Divine authority these are proved to be from these Prophesies So the juridical Church-authority of the Synod by Whitaker Calvin Beza and hosts of learned Divines is concluded from Act. 15. Not is it my mind that the Jews did excommunicate the Samaritans so formally as a single delinquent is excommunicate nor do I defend the superstition by Mr. Io-Weemes and Jewish Doctors in the manner of excommunicating them It s sure the Jewes the true Church deservedly renounced Church-communion with them Origen Iosephus Carâ—lus Sigonius and others tell us they were most corrupt in their Religion 2 King 17. and though Augustine say the Jewes so abhorred them that they would not drink water out of any vessel of the Samaritans and Christ refutes that seeking water to drink from the Woman of Samaria Yet since Christ saith Ioh. 4. 22. Ye worship ye know not what we know what we worship for salvation is of the Iews he evidently as Mr. R. said justifieth the substance of the excommunication which is all I intend let their fooleries pass Mr. R. granteth one Church hath not power over another Ans. True but one associate with many hath power Mr. H. A man may separate totally from a Church and from an assembly of Turks but for one man to excommunicate were a prâ—fanation of the Lords Ordinance Ans. A single person could not separate from the Church of the Jewes though they had not a few corruptions Mat. 23. 1 2 3. Mat. 8. 4. no single person can lawfully be a member of a Turkish Church how can he then separate from such 3. The Church of the Jewes and salvation was of the Jews Ioh. 4 2â— was not one man therefore their excommunicating of the Samaritans is not hence concluded to be null 4. But when the sounder part though fewer separateth from the major part and the major part makes manifest defection from the truth and professed cause and covenant And 2 carry along with them the body of Atheists and malignant opposers of pure Religion and wicked men 3. And that the fewer and sounder part have the collective part of the godly and generality of such as make conscience of their ways with them And 4. That major part is again and again warned and 〈◊〉 go on to hold out and cast out as far as they can all not of their sinful way though in their conscience they in other things judge and prosess them to be sound and godly in that case I judge the fewer part the Church and their censures valid for the promise is made to such as meet in the name of Christ Mat. 18. Mr. H. If all common affairs that concern many congregations saith Mr. R. were managed not by one congregation but by the suffcages 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Act. 15. 25. Apostles Elders and select Brethren then Synods and their Church-power most be lawful but the former is true in the chusing of Matthias Act. 1. and the treasury of the Churches and callâ—ng of their Deacons Act. 4. 6. are disposed by a Synod of Apostles with consent of the Churches Paul instructeth a Synod or meeting of 〈◊〉 at Ephesuâ— in their duty of feeding Act. 20. Act 11. Peter gives an account of his going in to the Gentiles to a meeting of Apostles and Breâ—… 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 4. It s true in the chusing of Matthias something extraordinary there was that the Apostles could not do as Pastors but as Apostles as Apostles they appoint two v. 23. God only could limit the call to two certain men all the Pastors and Churches on earth could not do that and as Apostles v. 24. they pray for the directing of the loâ—… and Act. 6. as Apostles by the immediately inspiring authority by which they writ Scripture they appoint a new office of Deacons which was not in the Church before but they do most of the rest by the Churches going along Mr. H. There is no Synod in these 1. There be no delegate Commissioners 2. No gathering of members by common consent 3. No disputing 4. No common determination Ans. Neither the first nor the second are essential to Synods if they be persons in publick authority they have a material delegation a formal commission is a matter of order nor were the last two wanting not to say where the matter is plain shall it lose the nature of a Synod because it wants doubtsome â—…diations But Mr. H. and Mr. Cotton are obliged to give an instance scriptural beside the question we have Act. 15. a meeting of Apostles Elders Brethren exercising by the grant of Mr. Cotton and the 7. dissenting Brethren some specifick Churchâ—â—cts of synodical pastoral authoritative teaching and commanding of more congregations then one Ergo they have power to exercise juridical acts for if Peter may exercise one specifick act of a man let us suppose to play the Musician the Astronomer to number things numerable to admire to laugh no man can deny but Peter then must be a man and hath power to discourse and argue So if a Synod as a Synod can exercise one specifick act of a Church being convened in the name of Christ a reason must be given why a Synod hath not the essence of a Church to exercise all the specifick acts of a Church A Synod is not a congregational Church Ergo it s no Church est incons à negatione species c. Mr. H. Peter gives an account of his fact Act. 11. to the Iews who doubt of the lawfulness of his conversing with the Gentiles but here is no Synod Ans. Yea the Jewes 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Syrus Chrysostom
congregation Yea I adde A member of the visible Church whereas he was no better then a heathen before and the Churches of New England say with me Though Mr. H. say That never one of them said any such thing And sure this is one Church-covenant by which persons are made fixed members of a congregation Ergo they are by this covenant made members of the visible Church whereas they were as pagans before But there is another Church-covenant by which pastor and people are married and every member so married as they cannot act as Church-members without their own congregation and he cannot act as a pastor toward any but toward his own flock Hence a new Quaere Whether there be two different Church-covenants 3. It s without question that the family of Abraham was Gods covenanted people before circumcision was instituted Gen. 17. nor is there any ground for a formal Church-covenanting among themselves And it speaks against all Scripture to say there was a Church covenant in Egypt and in the Wilderness Exod. 19. 1 5. for they were not made Church-members for members they were before by these covenantings with God And this is Mr. H. his own consequence They are members before they chose their Pastors Ergo. So I retort Mr. H. If this covenant difference the visible Church from the invisible as the formal cause then there have been no visible Churches since the Apostles times till now Now the Churches saith Mr. H. in England Holland c. have the implicit covenant at their practice evidenceth Ans. Yet it must fâ—…ow since presbyterian Churches believe and practice juridical power without the bonds of a single Independent Church in divers associate Congregations 2. And do not contend for but are against really supposed Saints as only constituent members of the visible Church and in the causes internal and external And 3. are so contradictorious to Independency there have been no Church according to the rule of the word since the Apostles dayes 2. If an implicit covenant suffice we shall find popish Churches to have much of that Mr. H. Though many unwarrantable wayet convey this covenant yet it self may be warrantable Ans. If by ways Mr. R. mean as he doth wayes inseparable causes pillars means and undeniable consequences the covenant must be the more unhappy as the unlawful wayes of the Mass the lifting up of the bready God and Idolatrous Ceremonies inseparably conveying it render it unlucky Mr. H. It is a dream to say that when the Apostles came to plant Churches that private men not the Apostles converted them Where is the man of ours that will affirm that all All are converted by private Christians Ans. The reply auswers not a whit to the Charge of Mr. R. now when the Apostles are not 2. The Apostles by our Brethrens way are not Pastors so much as extraordinary nor publick men for extraordinariness destroys not the nature of Pastors and to our Brethren Pastor and flock are relatives but the heathen are no fed stock nor these who now teach the Gospel to the heathen Apostles nor Pastors 3. These who teach that now Apostles ceasing Pastors as Pastors convert none according to the revealed command of Christ but pre suppose all are converted before they be admitted members they convert not as Pastors Ergo they must convert them as no Pastors Ergo they convert them as private men except there be a middle preacher between a preaching officer and a private man but this every where is taught by our brethren now this middle uncalled man must be the ordinary converser of all 2. Mr. H. teacheth that the Church homogeneal in ordinary now when there are no Apostles is before Baptism and Ministry now this Church is all the visible sovieties of confederate converts on earth Let Mr. H. tell us who converted them not Pastors for they are a framed Church in esse and operari the Fathers and sole Creators of all Officers Mr. H. It is unwarrantable to say Pastors now convert not Indians and Heathens saith Mr R. It is warrantable enough saith M. H. Answ. Enough is a feast Converters of Heathen now are either Apostles Evangelists or Ordinary Officers and Pastors or of some middle new Officers this latter cannot without Scripture be said not the former for they want the gift of tongues and miracles nor are they ordinary Pastors For Pastor and flock saith Mr. H. Shepherd called and Church chusing Husband and Wife are Relatives But Indians are no chusing Church Mr. H. Men must be satisfied in conscience of the conversion one of another saith Mr. R. Ans. To reasonable charity they should saith Mr. H. and no doubt it was in Ananias Saphira Ans. But their long conversing together for this satisfaction Mr. H. bringeth down to two poor experienced Witnesses Magus and Iudas for every one must witness of another and that witnesses were called and judicially deponed that all the 3000. Act. 2. and all Iudea and all round about who were baptized Matth. 3. 3 4. Mark 1. 5. Luk. 4. 21. were real converts who can believe except you believe for so saith Mr. H. Mr. H. What is all this to overthrow the covenant Ans. Very much for it destroyes the Ministry for though some private Christians may convert some yet no man can shew me by our brethrens way that pastors now do convert any at all contrary to Mat. 28. 19 20 Rom. 10. 14 15. Eph. 4. 11 12 13. 1 Cor. 3. 5. 2 Cor. 5. 20. Act. 26. 16 17 18. or if they convert any they do it not as pastors M. H. They which have no Church-power can put forth no Church power but such as Churches to other Churches Ans. The proposition is weak they put forth an act of love of counsel of approbation of conjunction as well as power Mr. R. grants one single Congregation to have no power over another many Churches sent to Parliament to declare their judgement may approve of their determinations if holy if not may confute them yet they have no Church-power over the Parliament Ans. 1. My argument is mistaken many Churches suppose mine have not power by this way to receive in one Church nor Iames Cephas and Iohn power to receive authoritatively Paul as they do say Calvin Pelicanus Pareus Piscator Diodati Beza yea Ierom also before them Mr. H. If Mr. R. constâ—ue a token of consent consensionis to be a Symbole of authority it is beyond my understanding Ans. Mr. R. never understands private consent or private counsel such as one private man or woman may give to another private person of their own or of another congregation to be publick authority but I acknowledge a publick authoritative and Aopstolick consent to be in Iames Cephas Iohn and their meaning was Brother Paul our counsel as Brethren is and our consent you be a Preacher but we have no Apostolick authority from the Lord to own you as an Apostle
counselling Mr. Cotton for command and use of the Keys yields also so the question shall not be of the subject but of the power and of the bounds where acts of free choice of rectified reason for civil ends also have place But the Conclusion is naught So That which is not in the Word saith he is a device of man I assume the frame of the meeting-house for congregational Worship the number names trades callings of members the quantity of water in Baptism the quantity of Bread that every one eats aâ— the Lords Supper are no more in Scripture than the Territories or bounds of Presbyteries yet are they not for that humane devices Mr. H. It is doubtful that all our singular actions as Mr. R. saith are mixed for eating and drinking must be for Gods glory and Omnis actio in individuo est moraliter bona vel mala Ans. If Mr. H. doubt of this Ames Didoclavius can speak to it There is such a thing as an action indifferent as Augustine saith or rather Ierome that is neither good nor evil but it is not a humane action properly as to spit or purge the nose But see all the Schoolmen Scotus Thomas Lombard and all that writ upon them and you shall never reade this new Axiome Omnis actio in individuo est moraliter bona vâ—l mala Durandus indeed and the Schoolmen say that every act individual which followeth deliberate reason is necessarily either morally good or evil See Greg. de Valentia 2. For the mixture of our actions its cleare there is something physical in eating at the Lords Supper as the word hath not set a rule concerning the physical quantity of Bread and Wins so there be not too much for it is not to feed the body nor too little for it must work upon the senses And there is in praying preaching the tone the accent of the organs of the voice and their motion so that we eat and drink for God and soberly and seasonably is moral and squared by the word but a man sins not in eating quickly or lently in the house or in the garden or sometime in his bed sometime at midnight upon necessity Mr. Hooker errs not a little in calling the acts of the Synod Act. 15. Councels such as godly men and women who are not Apostles and Elders may give to others for counsels are not burdens laid upon the people and Churches by the wisedom and authority of the Holy Ghost 2. By Apostles and Elders who sharply rebuke the pressers of circumcision as subverters of the soules of people 3. Neither are they indifferent advices â—hich they might reject but these they could not reject without despising God and the Holy Ghost the very thing that the Lord saith he that dispiseth you dispiseth me which cannot be said of a counsel of the Heathen man to a Christian. It is saith Mr. Cotton an act of the binding power of the Keys to bind burthens as Acts 15. 27. 4. The Decrees of no properly so called Church on earth are called 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 the Decrees of Apostles and Elders Mr. H. calls them only Advices and Counsels is it not safer to believe Luke Act. 16. 4. then Mr. H But a Synod is never called a Church say they this is but to contend for names for the word Church 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 is three times Act. 19. 32 39 40. given to a civil meeting and Mr. H. will not have it given to bodies meeting for the affairs of the Church of Christ. Mr. H. Where there is no delegation of messengers by mutual consent there is no right of jurisdiction decrees onely bind the Churches who send them Ans. Antioch Act. 15. 2. and Ierusalem sent messengers therefore two Churches at least were sent and were bound as for delegation we shall speak hereafter of it 2. If they ought to send and stand in need of light and peace and send not they are the same way tyed that some hundreds absent when Iezabel is sentenced and excommunicate are obliged to withdraw from communion from her though they were not present to consent to the sentence Mr. H. It s no prejudice to the care and wisedom of our Saviour that the punishing of the congregational Throne be reserved to God only Ans. When scandals between congregation and congregation and members of divers Churches are greater in number and offence and necessity of edifying and scandalizing greater his wisedom must provide for the more rather then the less Mr. H. If when a Church offends I must tell a higher then must I at length tell an Oecumenick or General Councel Ans. General Councels being more abstracted from infecting scandals of conversation are rather doctrinal Remedies nor are censures the ordinary possible adequate way of removing of Scandal The Word and Censures exercised in the Catholick integral visible Church in parts integral is the adequate cause Mr. H. If every man be allowed his appeal to an higher then also to a General Councel then for many hundred years while the appeal be discussed pendente appellatione the appealer cannot be censured Ans. We allow only just appeals in case of oppression to relieve the oppressed 2. In difficult cases Deut. 17. which rarely are such as call for a general Councel in case of general defection in point of Doctrine such may be and the inferiour Churches that truth suffer not are to declare for the truth 2. We allow only what men jure may do 3. The argument supposeth that we approve a towering up of appeals even to a General Councel as a liberty of every member whatever unjust prejudice be in it and that every such appeal may stop the actings of Christs visible Kingdom and called Pastors Christ hath given no power to sin Mr. H. It s a wonder that because Churches may rebuke yea Christians may rebuke Heathens though not in a Church way that therefore the Synod hath a power of jurisdiction Paul rebuked the Athenians Acts 17. A 〈◊〉 these acts of Church communion Ans. My argument is not à genere ad speciem sed specie ad genus These convened in the name of Christ by the Holy Ghost who 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 with one consent by way of suffrage and judgement 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Act. 15. 9. 21. 25. rebuke perverters of souls Act. 24. 28. and lay on burdens and commands 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to observe Act. 21. 25. and keep such things and 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to abstain from such things Act. 15. 29. and give Decrees by which the Churches were established in peace and truth Act. 16. 4 5. these have power to excommunicate the refusers of such acts according to Matth. 18. for Paul and Barnabas were scandalized and complained to the Church of Antioch Act. 1. who sent them to complain to a Synod at Ierusalem Act. 15. 2 3 6. and these who in a Church-way determine
pastoral care of Apostles for vacant Charges for planting of new Churches relief of the poor removing divisions c. Act. 1. 6 4. 35. 11. 1 2. 15 22 23 24 c. 1 Cor. 11. 28. Act. 8. 14. 21. 18. 20. 38. 13. 1 2 3. were temporary and Apostolick stirringâ— not pastoral duties now but such as died with the Apostles which is contrary to the wisdome of Christ. Mr. H. If government by Independent congregations be insufficient because it authorizeth not persons to be pastors over pagans government by Synods is sick of the same disease Ans. We judge the essence of a pastor not to stand in the call and choice of those to whom they are pastors for it makes Paul Barnabas and the Apostles to be no pastors to the Gentiles and to the heathen to whom they preach and maketh the Apostles as Apostles to be no pastors 2. Synods from Act. 15. and Act. 13. may lend men authorized with pastoral power to heathens to spread the Gospel and private men as no pastors but as private men are intruders authorized by Mr. H. for they have no promise such as pastors have by Mat. 28. 19 20. Mark 16. 15 17. Ier. 1. 6 17 18. to plant Churches among the heathens nor is there a warrant to say that Evangelists are ordinary officers left by Christ to plant Churches If Richard Hooker have any ground from Eusebius or Scripture for Evangelists now or in Trajans time he must shew that they have the gift of Tongues for how could Evangelists be fellow-helpers to preach the Gospel to the Churches planted by the Apostles if they were not an extraordinary office onely See those Divines in the margin and my learned and dear Brother M. George Gillespy Miscel. quest c. 7. If the Church should send any to the heathen any way ripâ— for the Gospel these could be no other than ordinary pastors to them I omitted that of Mr. H. There is nothing Act. 1. but any one might have done Ans. If he mean that any one private man might have chosen Apostles he speaks wonders if he mean Peter might have called Matthias to be an Apostle 1. It s without practise that Apostles could call Apostles 2. It follows not therefore it was not a Synod Paul did more in writing Scripture than if alone he had penned the decrees Acts 15. 16. 4. But Mr. Cotton and all his Brethren will deny M. H. his Consequence Ergo there is no Synod at all Act. 15. Mr. H. If the Apostles by extraordinary power cared for the poor Acts 4. Ergo there was a Synod Ans. The Antecedent is not mine but false 2. There was no doubt but ordinary pastors might oversee the Poors goods of many Churches CHAP. XI Of the National Church and the lawfulness of a National Covenant MR. H. The greater authority of the politick whole body saith Mr. R. should help the weaker parts 1 Cor. 12. 23 26. Ans. It s true but there is no National Church under the New Testament to help the congregational Church nor are Churches Christian now in Worse â—ase than the Church of the Iews for they had a High-priest and a National Worship at which they were to meet three times in the year Ans. That there is an integral Church Catholick which is more than National is proved 2. Our Brethren allow the association of many Churches for help of counsel and the Proposition that is granted by M. H. is as true for Church help as is said associated Churches could not yield for union in peace and truth except they made one visible body united Natura conjugatorum hoc â—vincit 3. Visible and professed covenanting with God makes a visible Church Gen 17. 7. Deut. 7. 6. For thou art a holy people unto the Lord thy God Deut. 10 15. Onely the Lord had a delight in thy fathers Abraham Isaac as a covenanted seed and Church Gen. 12 1 2 3. 17 6 7 8 9. to love them and their seed after them Now the seed of Abraham visible covenanted by M. H. his confession was a visible Church before they had an High-priest or a Temple or a National Worship in Abrahams house Ergo the High Priesthood and National Worship was accidental to the visible Jewish Church If it be said Yeâ— but they were in Abrahams time a congregational Church It s answered Yet then Priesthood Temple and National Worship differenced not the Church of the Jews from the Church of the Gentiles Our Brethrens Argument in this is of the same stamp with that of the Murtherers of Steven Acts 7. Steven all along in his Apologie refutes them and â—aith the Jews were a true Church in Egypt when they had no Temple no Ceremonies no National Worship but by faith onely rested upon the promises So Calvin Gualther Bullinger Brentius Marloratus Beza contend that Steven his Apologie had been impertinent if this had not been his scope 2. They were a visible Church in Egypt multiplied above an hundred congregations Exod. 1. 9 11 15. more in number than the Egyptians and the Lords covenanted Church Exod. 3. 6 7 8. 6. 7. 8. obliged to sacrifice to God Exod. 8. 29. and did eat the Passover and were circumcised in Egypt Exod. 4. 24 25 26 12. 1 2 3 c. when as yet Aaron was not consecrated High-priest and there was no Temple nor any National Temple-worship thrice a year at that time in the world 3. When Priesthood Temple-National-worship thrice a year sacrificing are removed Iudah remained in the Babylonish captivity the visibly covenanted people of God obliged to pray to him with their faces toward the Temple 1 King 8. 35. Dan. 6 10 11. and this is no more one National worship than the hearing of the Word and receiving the Seals of the N T. are one National worship to all the Protestant Church-members in Scotland 4. That which is common to Gods people of the Jews and to Egypt and Assyria and the people of God in the Gentiles is no distinguishing character differencing the Jewish Church as National from the Christian Church as not National Quae sunt communia â—a non distingunnt But to profess say and swear by the Lord and give him publick Church-worship agree to Egypt and Assyria and to Kingdoms and Nations of the New Testament as to the Jewish Nation as Isa. 2. 2. It shall come to pass in the last dayes under the New Testament v. 3. that many people shall go and say Come ye and let us go up to the Mountain of the Lord to the house of the God of Iacob and he will teach us of â—ù wayes c. So Isa. 19. 25. God shall bless thus saying Blessed be Egypt my people and Assyria the work of my hand and Israel my inheritance Which the seventh Angel declares to be fulfilled in the New Testament Rev. 11. 15. The Kingdoms of this
the power intrinsecal of a congregation to rule the associated Churches if they were Page 126. The adding of associated Churches to a Wilderness-church doth strengthen perfect and not nullifie the intrinsecal power of the Wilderness-church Pag. 117. When scandals fall out far off or near hand how association of Churches removeth them The limiting of Church-edifying and Church-comforting to one onely congretien whereof the man onely is a sworne member is an unwarrantable and comfortless way The Way of Churches of N. E. c. 1. sec. 1. p. 1. c. 4. sec. 3. sec. 4. p 70 71. Mr. H. Survey pa. 3. c. 2. p. 10. M. Cotton keys of the kingd c. 7. p. 39 40 4â— Mr. H. par 1. c. 9. p. 127 128. sec. 4. 3 ground One and the same nature agrees to the congregational presbyterial Church c. Pag. 127. 128. The congregational Presbyterial National Oecumenick Churches are species specialissimae How a congregation is an intire church Tertul. in Apolog Though the Churches of believers men and women be before the Apostles Evangelists Pastors Presbyteries Synods yet it follows not therefore must Apostles Pastors Synods have their calling and authority from those Churches Sect. 4. p. 128. Mr. Hooker acknowledges that divers meetings and Church conventions may may be all under one Presbyterial government only he will not call them Churches Way of the Church c. 1. sect par 1. Survey par 1. c. 9. p. 110 111 c. Mr. H. must be forced by his own principles to grant there is one visible Church which cannot meet conveniently 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in the same place and yet under the same Eldership Mr. H. yeilds to us a Presbyterian Church at Ierusalem Page 51. Fixedness or no fixedness of the Elders of Ierusalem to their own proper congregations is altogether accidental to the Church presbyterial The Apostles fixed feeding at Rome at Corinth is not opposite unto but of that same nature with his feeding pastorall all the world over All the incongruities that are the onely arguments of Mr. H. against a Presbyterial church are militant against the presbyterial Church which Mr. H. grants was at Ierusalem Mr. H. well near also yieldeth that there was a Presbyterian Church at Antioch Ephesus Rome There are the like reasons that the multitudes of Believers at Rome Antioch Ephesus Corinth Samaria Thessalonica could not meet in one place and so there must be in these huge Cities many Congregations under one Presbyterial Government as for the multitudes at Ierusalem What is meant by Church Act. 2. were added to the Church Mr. H. inclines to expâ—… the word Câ—…h of the â—â—â—thful Saul made havock of the Câ—… Eâ—… there is 〈◊〉 Presbyteriâ— a church How watery is this Lâ—gick Par. 1. c. 10. p. 130. Mr. R. argument Mat. 18. from allusion unto the Jewish Sanhedrim abused not answered M R. is not for all appeals whatsoever justor unjust but for such as are edifying and necessary and relieves from tyrannicall oppression the plaintiff Pag. 131. The removing of scandals Mat. 18. cannot be of onely scandals between brother and brother of the same congregation except I must not owne as brethren to be gained those of another Church beside me Christ willeth every little congregation to exercise discipline upon an offender Ergo there is no discipline to be exercised in a greater Church So Mr. H. But the contrary rather strongly followeth The Sanhedrim was not mixed by institution Pauls Presbyt c 8. p. 88. The Church Mat. 18. is to be obeyed in the Lord by the people but the Church of the people is not to be obeyed in the Lord by the people Women are as essential parts of the believing Church as men and womâ—n must no more blindly believe what the Church believes than men nor must their faith in discerning the voice of Christ in this pastor not in this be blindly included in the males discerning and so women must be a part of the binding and loosing Church Mat. 18. Survey par 1. c. 10. p. 133. The Church principally meant Mat. 18. must be the binding and loosing brethren which are the Church fiâ—stâ—y the officers are onely separable adjuncts thereof saith M. H. Par. 1. c. 11. p. 198. When all the officeâ—s turne wolves the people must complain to the people when the people turn Familists Socinians c. to whom sâ—aâ—l the officers complain accoâ—ding to M. H. minde The officers cannot binde potestate officii since the Keys were given to the Male-church before the officers had being as M H saith We cannot tell the church of Jerusalem or Galatia by M. H. Women have no less a tacit consent a faith of practise in eschewing the society of the excommunicated in admitting of him again and of all members in election of officers than men and in other duties recommended to Church-members Let M. H. shew how women are all excluded from Church duties in their way more than men So Cypr. Juban Epist. 73. pag. 22. Nam Petro primum Dominus super quem adificavit Ecclesiam Mat. 16. Istaem potestatem clavium dedit post resurrectionem sicut me misit pater c. Firmilian ad Cypr. Epist. 75. Cypr. pag. 239. n. 14. Hinc intelligi potest quod soli Petro Christus dixerit quemcunque ligaveritis Matth. 16 c. Quando in solos Apostolos insufflavit Christus dicens accipite Spiritum Sanctum c. The word Church can signifie no other but the ruling Church Mat. 18. and the notation of the word Church in our brethrenssense is neither Mat. 18. nor elsewhere See how Bilson Perpetual G ve n. c. 4. mistakes in this Though women children of age and servants be excluded from governing yet the question now is a farre other thing Whether the word Church Mat. 18. if it be the Church of Redeemed ones meeting to and for publick ordinances in the same place include not women c. The word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Church is ever taken in Scripture according to the subject matter and scope of the place and so must the binding and loosing or excommunicating Church Matth. 18. be taken and cannot note a company of redeemed ones Men Women Servants Children of riper age come together in one to partake of Word Seals Censures the onely acception of the Word Church that our brethren can give us from Scripture The Church Matth. 18. 1 Cor. 5. includes all who meet for the publick worship Elders Men Women Servants aged Children every one according to their place according as Paul rebukes comforts teaching in his Epistle 1 Cor. 1. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Rom. 16. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 The women in their daily practice are concerned in conscience to censent unto or dissent from the sentence of excommunication or forgiving and re-admiting again and that upon rules of the Gospel as well as men Caelv Inst. l. 3. c. 4. sec. 12. Instit l. 4. c. 1. sec. 2. Instit. l. 4. c. 12.
blood and yet if the matter was too hard the same man was a Judge and a Member of the Sanhedrim Deut. 17. Mr. H. his last difference The Iudicature of Classis and Congregations do not differ formally saith Mr. R. but onely in more or lesse extension of power Ans. Then there are no specifical acts that the one puts forth but the other can put forth as occasion shall require gradus non variant speciem then they can ordain officers and excommunicate in the Congregation He said before if there be the same office there is the same definition and the same causes to wit of election and choice of the Classical and of the Congregational Elders Ans. The difference is only of more or less as of a River and the whole Element though divers learned men judge the Congregation to be no governing Church at all but only their Elders the delegates of the Presbyterial Church which consisting of divers Congregations is the first governing Church 2. There are no sâ—â—cifick acts which the Elders collectively taken may not exercise in both the one and the other but then shall it not follow thâ—â— a single congâ—â—gational Eldership may ordain and exâ—â—mmunicate in one 〈◊〉 Congregation there alone divided from the body for congrâ—…nal Elders cannot teach oâ—derly and he is the God of ordâ—r 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in his Church in all the Congregations without a calâ— Nor 2. Exercise the power of a Synod in them all 3. I 〈◊〉 this argument Archippâ—â— hath the same office to the whole Congregation and to the single mâ—mbers who chused him and whom he feeds or then he hath so many officer as there be chusing and fed members â—â—ught by the word and ruled which is absurd Eâ—go as the single voâ—â— of one member made him a Pastor to one and of a second made him a Pastor to a second and so forth So the â—otes of the whole made him a Pastor to the whole for that is the same officâ— thâ—â— hath the same causes and the same choice and election saith M◠〈◊〉 Ergo where the same causes are not the same office cannot be but one single electing vote and the electing votâ—â— of the whole Church by Mr. H. his way cannot be the same causes for one vote makes him not a Pastor 2. If Archippuâ— hath the same office to the whole congregation and to every single member then as he 〈◊〉 pastoral acts of teaching and ruling to the whole so to the parts and single members but this latter is denied by Mr. H page 104 who saith That a Pastor cannot put forth Pastoral acts but in the Church assembly A strange imagination Mr. H. By the same official power saith Mr. R. that a Pastor teacheth his own fleck viva voce he teacheth others by writing Ans This is a new invention that I never heard of before 1. The official power by which he preacheth he receiveth by election and he may be rejected from it by the people in case of delinquency 2. By his official power he may require them to hear but may not require all Churches to read his writings and if they offensively refuse to read he cannot censure them as he may censure them that refuse to hear the word 3. If this power of writing of Books to edifie the Churches proceed from his office all Ministers by their office should write Books 4. That which another may do with as much authority and more authority of truth as being more able yet being out of office that cannot belong to the officer but to write books is such Ans. 1 Official power is not from election but from the saying on of the hands of the Elders 1 Tim. 3. 1 2. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2 2. Tit. 1. 5. 2. It is true that a Pastor cannot require by his office those of another Congregation to hear him preach and receive the seals from him nor censure them if they refuse but it is a bad consequence of Logick therefore he doth not exercise these pastoral acts to them by his office as the Brethren grant 2. A Minister by his office may require his hearers to give much alms pray much read and confer much both these of his own and other flocks yet he cannot censure them for not coming up to the highest pitch of these affirmative duties except he may rebuke them and so may he do all who are remiss in reading edifying writings and the Church may censure unsound books Acts 15. 24. 3. Neither Mr. R. nor any judicious man can teach that either a gift to write Books or of eminent preaching praying exhorting proceeds out of a power of office it is a sanctified gift which the Church seeth and judgeth to be in any before they call him to office and any gift is by order of nature and time before the office and so proceeds not from the office and therefore it is not required that every Pastor should have a gift of writing books but if the Lord have given it to any they exercise it as such gifted officers as the Prophets and Apostles as such Prophets so gifted did write Canonick Scriptures so are Pastors if gifted to write and preach in their way and both to write and preach by their office Nor is it good Logick that all in office should write books because some by vertue of their office writ books for a Minister gifted with four Talents is obliged to gain with these four Talents and that as a Minister by vertue of his office but it is weak Logick to infer Ergo all Ministers by vertue of their office are obliged to gain with four Talents for many are obliged by vertue of their office to gain with only two to their Lord and with only one 4. It was needless to Mr. H. to prove writing of books doth not belong to the power of office because a learned man out of office may do it with more authority for Mr. R. had no such intention For sure if such a thing agreed to the office-power as the office-power then all Officers Pastors Elders were obliged to write books and yet Mr. H. does not very happily prove it because many learned men unofficed may with more authority of truth write books then officed men It is only some officed men he must mean or it is not true And then I retort it thus many officed men may write books with more authority both of truth and of office and two are better then one then some unofficed men less learned Ergo some gifted Pastors do not as Pastors so gifted and by vertue of their office relating both to the presbyterian Church and their own Congregation edifie all the Churches about by writing books It follows not Mr. H. We are told that Elders are ruling in all Churches collectively taken and they are teachers 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 in some reserved acts not constant teachers he that rules teacheth but always the
people left to my pastoral care then as a Christian over these of another Province whom I am occasionally only to gain and whose faces I never saw Ans. Mr. H. leaves out the words in point of conscience to answer for them to God Which I have Otherwise in regard of using of more means he is obliged to more constant feeding by word seals dayly watching over the single flock then over all Christians on the other side of the Sea and some thousand miles distant from him But if the foundation of governing classical Churches be the love and union of the members of one body of Christ then there is much care onerousness and labour which is required in brotherly consociation to help as the care onerousness which is required in officership Mr. H. Ans. The proposition hath no truth because I love all consociated in one Synod whom I never saw and with whom I could never meet to do good or receive good But if I should be bound to put forth the like onerous and laborious care for their spiritual good as for these to whom by way of office I am bound in the same Congregation Then officers must either do too little or be bound to do too much Ans. This is neither my Argument nor my words my words are Par. 1 pag. 332. Now if we distinguish ONEROUSNESS CARE and LABOUR by way of jurisdiction the former is as GREAT IN FORO DEI in the Court of conscience as the latter These words are left out by Mr. H. qua fide let the Reader judge for the toil care onerousness and labour in point of conscience in the kind and sphere I urge in both by necessity of a divine command but the like care onerousness and labour in quantity in the use of more means in constant preaching personal comforting to all the Christians on earth as to the single congregation I utterly deny But can Mr. H. deny but the Apostles and Brethren Act. 15. did ow as much care onerousness and labour in a binding conscientious way in laying on synodical burdens which bind not onely saith Mr. Cotton materially for the weight of the matter imposed by divine precept but also formally from the authority of the Synod upon the Churches of Ierusalem Antioch Syria Cilicia as any pastor ows to his single flock and that because these Churches are all one consociated body and yet Elders of the Synod were never to see the faces of all these members of the Churches And I put this quere to the Brethren what warrant of Christ is there that a member of an Independent Church ow Church-care to watch teach admonish rebuke comfort as Col. 3. 16. Heb. 3. 13. 1 Thes. 5 14. to a fellow member of the same congregation only and ow no Church-care to another brother dwelling in the same house with him having with him the same faith the same baptism the same Lord the same covenant of Grace the same Saviour only because he is a member of another Independent Church Mr. H. Arg. 5. If they be Pastors over all the Congregations of the circuit then they were new chosen by the Congregations or not c. Ans. This is a repeated blast of an old horn there is this required that Churches about by their silence approve him as Pastor to one single Congregation but that all Congregations make a special election of him to be their fixed Pastor is no more required then that the Churches of Antioch and Ierusalem chose the Apostles and Elders who yet Act. 15. exercise pastoral and official acts over them by the grant of Mr. Cotton and our Brethren They are Elders of Ephesus i. e. of enery Congregation of the combination as all the Kings if they were met in one royal Court to govern the Nations in things of common concernment to all yet are called the Kings of the Nations These are words saith Mr. H. to darken the Elders met here have a new power distinct from the power over their several Congregations a Commission i. e. a new Creature The Kings if so convened have a joynt power of confederate Princes to act in things of common concernment and if that power were distinct from the particular power that they have over their own territories the comparison were parallel Ans. We may suppose such a convention of Kings the Commissioners or Mâ—ssengers of the Churches have no new office but only are met to determin of such a thing as disturbs the Churches Act. 15 5. they differ as Elders and such Elders sent and nominate by the Church and act as Elders by the same official power common to Elders that are not sent and are called by the Church Apostles and Elders Act. 15. 23. 16. 4. 21. 18 25. then sending and commissionating is a condition of order appointed by the God of order no devise of men and the Churches submit to them as to no new office But 1. as to the messengers of the Church and gracious and sound Elders 2. If they speak according to the Law and the testimony not otherwise and the answer is as much against Act. 15. and against Mr. Cotton and all that are for Synods either juridical or consultative as against Mr. R. for they go to Synods who so go by a new power of order not by a new office Mr. H. This course nullifies the power of Elders and proplâ—â—f a Congregation and their proceeding in a righteous way for the Classis may judge a member to be excommunicated whom the Congregation judgeth and that truely not worthy of that censure here the power of Elders and people which act in a way of Christ is wholly hindered Ans. This weak Argument is fully answered by me before That Government which of its own nature hinders and nullifies the righteous proceeding of the Congregation is not a power from Christ. True but now the assumption is false for the presbyterial power added to the just power of a Congregation does strengthen and not nullifie the power of the Congregation That Government which by accidâ—nt and abuse of their power in over voting two Elders who proceed according to the rule of Christ hinders and nullifies right proceeding in onâ— single act is not from Christ is most false For because an abused power and abused government is not from Christ it follows not that the power and government it self is not from God I added an answer to this in my Book which Mr. H. passeth over in silence Suppose the Congregation and Synod agree in the truth as they do Act. 15. Will you say that Peter Paul and Iames their power is nullified and their three votes are swallowed up in that greater convention because to their power is added in this dogmatical determination the power and voices of the rest of the Apostles and Elders yea and some say of the whole Church Act. 15. 2 6 25. 16. 4. 21. 18 25. So say
in any sense they are not but Churches in nature different If these were species then every one of the threescore must be that one onely Church for genus praedicatur de specie But it is sure that the innumerable Virgins that is believers members of the Church who with chaste love adhere to their onely Husband Christ Cant. 1 3. that is such as are chosen and called of God saith Ainsworth on the place and faithful whether whole Churches as 2 Cor. 11. 2. or particular persons cannot be every one of them that one onely Church Catholick for then every single Church should be the onely one Spouse of Christ ver 8 9. 3. To that Church I mean for their salvation and good hath Christ given the Keys which is the complete Spouse of Christ and to which Christ bears the adequate and full relation of the love of Redemption Eph. 5. 25. Ioh. 3. 16. 1 Ioh. 2. 1 2. Iob. 10 11. of love of justifying and washing Rev. 1. 5. 5. 4 c. But neither the congregation this or that nor the congregation that exists ut genus in specie a◠most illogically Mr. H. says is the complete Spouse of Christ nor doth Christ bear the full and adequate relation of the love of Redemption of Justification Sanctification to the congregation in any sense For. 1. This object of love takes not in the visible Saints sojourners dismembers as said is to whom Christ bears a love as to chaste virgins 2. Nor is the love of God in choosing effectual calling justifying the ungodly carrying them on to persevere to the end terminated upon societies visible as visible congregations for so he should love all the Reprobates Iudas Magus who are all visible Church-members But its certain Christ loves none of these with that adequate love of Redemption nor with marriage-love as he doth his beloved Spouse Cant. 4. 7 8 9 10. 6 4 9 10. 3. Not is that love of Redemption terminated upon persons onely upon the bare relation of Church-members for Christ takes them not into the Kings Chambers Cant. 1. 4. to his banqueting house Cant. 2. 4. nor draws he them after him by his powerful grace Cant. 1. 4. Ioh. 6 44. nor blesses he or imbraces them his left hand being under their head and his right hand imbracing them Cant. 2. 6. nor doth God teach them Ioh. 6. 45. nor ingrave his Law in their heart or give a heart of flesh and a new heart Ier. 31. 33. Ezek. 11. 19. 36 26 27. onely in the capacity of visible Church-members for he bestows this love upon the Jaylor upon Saul upon the Eunuch and upon many thousands before they profess as members yea and upon thousands in the bosom of the Church of Rome who out of weakness though that be their sin dare not profess the Gospel Then it must be false that the nature of the Church and of those spiritual priviledges that belong to the congregation in general or in this or this congregation and that the relation of Christ as Husband King Head Seeker of the lost Good Shepherd and of his Redeeming love is broader than a visible congregation in any sense Mr. Hooker shall take it and is no ways commensurate thereunto And so not one of my Arguments but stand in force CHAP. III. Some further Considerations of the place Matth. 16. ANy sense according to Mr. Hooker can hardly be put upon that Upon this Rock will I build my Church For 1. The question is Whether they do any thing to inchurch themselves upon the Rock for sure they are active in professing 2. In suiting membership 3. In covenanting Then must Magus and Iudas by acting the part of hypocrites build themselves upon the Rock Wilde Divinity again 2. Christs act of building is either absolute or conditional if absolute then saith Christ I inchurch you upon the Rock whether ye believe or believe not but Scripture never tells us of Peter or any built upon the Rock Christ but by real sincere faith If Peters act of faith be conditional the condition must be either sincere faith or meer profession if the former we stand strong Mr. H. is at a loss for there is no promise of real union with the Rock and perseverance but to such as are living members in Christ Ioh. 15. if the latter then saith Christ I I promise to you Judas Magus real union with the Rock or Upon this faith saith Chrysostom so Hilary so Augustine so you play the hypocrites egregiously and seem to believe Now this shall be non sense 3. It cannot be said I promise to build all in a Church-way so they believe sincerely For 1. The ports of Hell and Satan should not prevail against persons to strip them of Church-membership contrary to experience 2. The promise is made to persons that confess as Peter but many real believers and visible professors have been put to death and are never made Church-members this way and many real believers in the Church of Rome never profess and many Church-members and Churches of visible Saints are dissolved through persecution Again there is a name and room promised in the House of God Isa. 56. but not upon condition of hypocritical but real believing Obj. Iudas was not made an Apostle upon condition of faith Ans. True a man may be made an officer and his acts valid and yet the man no sound believer Q. Should a man be admitted a Church-officer who is not judged a real convert Ans. The Scripture is sparing in submitting conversion or regeneration to the authoritative determination of men yet the equivalent of this is said 1. If Timothy must commit the Word 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 to faithful men who are able to teach others as 2 Tim. 2. 2. And if 2. The Elders and Pastors which Titus is to admit must be to his discerning beside negatives not self-willed not soon angry c. also lovers of good men sober just holy temperate holding fast the faithful word c. Tit. 1. 5. compared with v. 7 8 9 10. Then must the real holiness of officers be known to Timothy and to Titus 3. If the Apostle will have Timothy to try Bishops and Deacons also and that experiencedly that they be vigilant sober patient grave no novices humble holy c. the way that mettals are tried in the fite 1 Tim. 2. 1 2 3 c. so the word is Luke 14. 19. Iam. 1. 12. 2 Cor. 13. 5. and will have him lay hands suddenly on no man but deliberately 1 Tim. 5. 21 22. Then surely the Apostle supposes that they may be known to be such 4. If the Apostles do charge the multitude who had no judicial authority to look out from among them seven men of honest report full of the holy Ghost and of wisdome Acts 6. 5. to be Deacons then Luke supposes that that might be answered We cannot know whether men have the holy Ghost or
essentials to Officers 2. The method and order of Ordination and Election 3. The place 1 Tim. 4. 14. touching the laying on of hands of the Presbytery is opened 4. The necessity of laying on of hands 5. Designation to a certain flock is not essential to a Pastor MR. H. Ordination according to the minde of Mr. R. and his method as preceding the Election of the people doth not give the essentials to the outward call of a Minister Ans. Ordo causandi non tollit ipsam câ—â—salitatem If Plate say the soul was created before the body this will not prove but body and soul are essential causes of man So because Ordination administred Mr. R. his way and method gives not the essentials to a Minister this by no Logick can cashier Ordination from an essential cause thereof Mr. H. Luke saith Acts 6. first they chose Steven ver 5. then the Apostles laid on hands ver 6. if not any but those who are elected by the people should be ordained and all such who were so chosen could not be refused then to ordain before choice is neither to make application of the Rule or a communicating of the Right in an orderly manner But the first is plain the Apostles would not take that soveraignty in ordaining Elders therefore they would not allow their Scholars to arrogate to call so Acts 14. 23. When they had created them Elders in every Church the Geneva When they had ordained Elders by election of the people and prayed and fasted they commended them to God c. then the officers had a full call and a full night to the execution of their office before laying on of hands which is not necessary and must not the setting in order things amiss be done by Titus i. e. the Officers and the Church also Tit. 1. 5. Ans. 1. Luke saith not they were elect called officers with a full call and full right before the Apostles laid on hands for Mr. R. saith they were chosen that is nominated as godly men before the Apostles laid on hands as David and Saul were both chosen set apart by God before unction and choice of the people but they were not formally chosen Kings having full royalty while as yet the people knew them not from other men but the seven men were not formally and completely chosen as officers before ordination and so had neither right nor official full right to be their Deacons while the Apostles ordained them for this Rite say Beza Bullinger Calvin Gualther Diodati English Divines used in Sacrifices was used in creating of officers 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ver 3. to choose is a far lower word as Cyprian saith it noteth Plâ—bis approbationem Leo con sensum plebis Calvin the approbation of the people What then is the Apostles and officers part Authority official there must be laying on of hands saith Mr. H. was not of necessity required yea but its safer to believe the holy Ghost it was done then it was no unnecessary complement the cup was given to the people by the Apostles 1 Cor. 11. True say Papists as Mr. H. it was not of necessity required 2. Though there be a wide difference in the matter if none should be ordained but those onely that are first chosen as formally and completely as their fixed 〈◊〉 then election goes before ordination Mr. R. denies the connexion and desires Mr. H. to prove it yea the contrary followâ— Ergo the people cannot appropriate the man to be their fixed officer nor consent he be theirs only and this to me is only formal election until he first be ordained an officer The sick man cannot choose A. B. to be his Physician until he first be a Physician nor can a Scholar choose C. D. to be his Teacher of Philosophy until C. D. he first a Philosopher 3. The Assumption is false But all such who are so chosen could not be refused then must the Elders be necessitated to lay hands on Nicolaus though they know him to be the head of that unclean Sect of which Epiphâ—nius Irâ—…s Dâ—rothâ—â—s Tâ—rtullian judge him to be leader Why the people have chosen him then the Elders must lay on hands suddenly on an heretical Teacher a Wolf Why they cannot refuse him saith Mr. H. for The people hath chosen him What tyranny of conscience is here 4. This calling of the Deacons and consequently of all other officers if we suppose that the office was instituted as now it was by Mr. H. his way might well have been without either presence or acting of either Apostles or officers for saith Mr. H. there was no necessity of laying on of hands by the onely multitude and I require one Scripture for the calling of one officer without the concurrent acting of Apostles and officers by the sole people and can shew warrants for the presence and acting of Apostles and officers in the calling of officers especially those Acts 1. 15 23. 6. 6. 14. 23. Tit. 1. 5 6 7 c. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim. 2. 1 2 3 10. Revel 2. 2. ver 20. Acts 20. 28 29 30. 13. 1 2 3 4. 5. Be it as the Geneva reading saith as it is not yet as Mr. Seaman well observes and Calvin saith it also with Beza the officers had their official votes and are said 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 as Stephanus Mr. Leigh Theodor. Balsamo Zonaras and Bellarmine grants it and it proves that the onely people created not officers Ergo by neither this place nor by any other Scripture could they give them full right to their office See Amesius and Calvin Hence if the officers by these places have suffrages and votes in ordaining of officers as why should the holy Ghost bid prophets separate Paul and Barnabas for such a ministry and command Timothy to lay hands suddenly on no man 1 Tim. 5. 22. but on faithful men that are able to teach others 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5 7 8. if officers have no official work in creating officers but only to choose them which any brother or woman may do then it is not needless that officers concur to create officers and if it be not required of necessity that they concur it must be idle work both here and in the cited places that they concur but because they did concur I have as good reason that the peoples concurring in choosing was needless though they did choose as Mr. H. hath cause to say the officers concurrence is needless in ordaining though in truth the Word of God require both as necessary Lastly For the setting in order things since these must be things of jurisdiction also we say juridical acts by no Scripture are ascribed to the whole Church except by the Church be understood the Church of Rulers the rest only consenting which is our mind Mr. H. Arg. 2. That place 1 Tim. 4. 14. favours not Mr. R. for
sec. 2. l. 4. 9. 2. Pet. Martyr 1 Cor. 8. Dav. Parens in explic catech q. 85. Art 4. Obj. 1. p. 480 484. Com. â—n Mat. 18 Gul. Bucâ—n loc com de potest Eccles. Syno lo. 43. q. 25. Dan. Tilenus Synt. dis 30. de Concil Th. 4. 9◠〈◊〉 23. Profess Leyd Synop. purio Theolo diso 49. thes 10. pag. 779. Ioan. Pisc. com in Maâ—th â—8 15 d Eccles. lo. 23. thes 73. Willet Syn. Papis con 3. Gen. Conc. 4. 7. pag. 140 141. Bâ—za in â—n Mat. c. 18. Trem. lius in vers Syr. Mat. 16. 19 20. Iunius dis 47. De Discip. Eccles th 〈◊〉 th 6. Ioan. Comerio Tract in quo Eccles. Roman pâ—ae exam c. 17. pag. 567. Anton. Walaeus To. 1. defunct Eccles. pag. 467. Wendeâ—â—n Theol. l. 1. c. 28. fig. VII q. 1. pag. 622 623. What is ment by the Angel of the Church Rev. 2. Mr. H. his conceit removed Rob Parker de Politia Eccles. l. 3. c. 15. n. 1. Ex his qui eluctari capit nobiscum sentire necesse est Ecclesiam fidelium à Christo intellectam esse Mat. 18. non quia simpliciter consideratur sed quia disciplinam exercet juxta temperamentum Aristocraticum in Presbyterio Ecclesiam quippe primo loco dic Ecclesiae praecise partem Aristocraticam id est Presbyterium existimamus quae vero posteriore his verbis Si Ecclesiam non audietit c. sic excommunicantem propter contemptum Ecclesiam includit non decernentem tantum examinantem tum partem Ecclesiae Democraticam continet quâ populi consensus ad excommunicationem necessarius est The place Act. 18. 22. Paul saluted the church is wronged by M. H. The word Church is not in scripture as our brethren take it Nor is there a place in Old or New Testament or in any Divines imaginable for the sole male-Church It cannot be denied but all in their owne respective ways officers men women servants 2 Cor. 2. did rebuke and censure and also forgive the incestuous Corinthian The way of the Church c. 1. sect 1. p. 1 2. Women by our brethrens way servants and children of age who meet to partake of the ordinances word and seals as our brethren say must be parts of the Church Matth. 18. Cotton Keyes par 16. Burroughs Iren If as many doe excommunicate as Paul writes unto 1 Cor. 5. and as Paul rebukes for not mourning and were a part of the lump in danger to be leavened and were to keep the feast and eschew the company of the scandalous that is the whole redeemed Church as Mr. H. argues then sure Women must excommunicate 1. Cor. 5. as well as men See Mr. H. par 1. c. 10. p. 138. Mr. Hookers Survey par 〈◊〉 cap. 11. p. 185 186. Mr. H. his fit persons the first subject of the Keyes â—â—amined is found light Sect. 2. p. 192. Unlettered brethren are not fit persons to judge of sound and of heretical doctrine as M. H. Survey paâ—… 1. c. 11. propos 4. p. 203. Consent is in the people but no judicial authority as antiquity and our Divines prove Calvin Com. In 1 Cor. 5. In horum primorum confessu prima erit cognitio inde res ad populum sed jam praejudicata deferebatur P. Martyr in 1 Cor. 5. De Excom quaest Pareus in 1 Cor. 〈◊〉 Cyprianus ad Cornelium Episcopum Romanum scribit se multum apud plebem laborare ut pax daretur lapsis quam si per se dare potuisset noÌ„ erat cur in plebe persuadenda se fatigaret Cyprian Epist. 3. Examinabuntur singula praesentibus judicantibus vobis Cyprian Epist. 16. 11. 5. Quando à primordio Episcopatus mei statutum nihil sine consilio vestro presbyter is diaconis fratribus scribit sine consensu plebis meae privatâ sententiâ gerere Cyprian Epist. 38. Vehementer contristatus sum J. C. acceptis â—â—eris vestris cum mihi propositum semper votum sit universam fraternitatem vestram incolumem continere gregem illibatum c. Bucer in Mat. 16. Ut Romae olim ita hic potest as populi authoritas senatus calv Instit. l. 4. c. 11. num 6. Cyprianus sic clerum in excommunicatione praefuisse ut plebs interim à cognitione non excluderet Bucan de disciplina Eccl. l. 44. quaest 13. Jus excommunicandi penes presbyterium sed tamen consciâ approbante tota Ecclesiâ Tilen Disp. 28. Thes. 12. Quamvis scripta sit epistola ad toâ—…m Ecclesiam Corinthiacam non tamen omnia quae in ea continentur ad singulos pertinent ut ex elequentiae scientiae encomiis patet Pareus in catech Ursin. quaest 85. 4. 4. pag. 477. Beza de gradibus minist cap. 23. Viretus dialo 20 21. Zwingl Cor. 31. Profess Loyd Syâ—… disp 48. th 24. Synedrii authoritas popuâ—i consensus Ursinus ad Fredâ—… 3. Elect. 9. 85. Iunius Eccles. 3. 1. Cypr. cod vetust Epist. 68. Coram omni Synâ—goga jubet Deus constitui sacerdotem â—stendit ordinationes sacerdotales non nisi sub populi assistentis consciâ—nt â si ri oportere ut plebe praesente vel detegantur malorum crimina vel bonorum merita praedicentur sit ordinatio justa legitima quae omnium suffragio judicio fuerit examinâ—ta nec hoc in Episcoporum tantum sacerdotum sed in diaconorum ordination bus observasse apostolos animadvertimus Origen contr cels lib. 3. Senatum Ecclesiasticum qui est Athenis Corinthi invenies 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 M. H. and his Brethren following Papists prove their Male-Church from civil corporations The example of the people both creating and choosing their Major and Rulers brought by Mr. H. to prove that the people ordain and call their officers it Popish and is no rule to us and the differences are waste The place 〈◊〉 5. aâ— submit one to another is mistakâ—n by Mr. H. it speakâ—th nothing of Chuâ—ch-subjection Zâ—…us in loc 〈◊〉 uxâ—â—es liberoâ— maritis paâ—â—ntibus Bâ—…s 〈◊〉 in familia Republica Calvia Ubicunque regnat charitas ibâ— mutuâ— est servitâ—â— Bâ—za mutua reverentia Hiâ—ronymus Baines on Ephes. 3. Câ—jetan in â—ocum Tâ—…llian in Apolo Praesident probati quâ—que Seniores honorem istam non preâ—io sed testimonio adepti Theophylact. in Mat. 18. Non solum quae solvunt Sacerdotes sâ—nt soluta sed quaecunque nos injuria affecit vel ligamus vel solvimus ipsa 〈◊〉 ligata soluta 〈◊〉 oâ— in 1 Tim. 5. Synagoga posteri Ecclesia Seniores habuit sine qâ—oâ—um consilio niâ—â—â— agebatur in Ecclesiâ quod qua negligentià obâ—…t nescio â—â—si forte doctorum desidâ—â— magis superbâ—â— Rebuking Mat 18. is wildly mistaken by Mr. Hooâ—â—r Mr. H. his division of power of 1. rebuking 2. of judging a narrow and a weak Dichotomy By Mr. H. his way the flock are over the shepherds the flock feed and watch for the soul of